Refugees Begin Hunger Strike

[141]

The people live in shantie towns in india and south america are in dire need. Do you see them moving? No

i try to understand what you say here ... i work in the humanitarian field so i know some of the things that are going on . i have seen many things so devastating and horrible i have seen death ... often its the problem of the government . but when it comes to people in need we should all stick together doesnt matter what country , i am glad there will always be people with a passionate heart to go out of their ways to help those in need .

[Dark_Grey]

i feel extremely sad reading some of these post and how some people talk about other peoples misery . Just for the record for some to understand why there are mostly '' MEN'' well in the arab world the man is responsible for the family . unfortunately there wasnt enough money for all the family members to go so the men go . How many of you have actually seen one of those camps ??? i was there in turkey by the syrian border when it all began . what i found amazing is that we as muslim along side with jews and christians worked so well together hand in hand . when the military stepped in it started to be horrible . we saw how they rationed food how they moved slow in all and everything how hospitals had certain orders ( treating them differently ) i saw mothers with their babies sick and no help . imagine you are trying to help your child and you cant . food was spoiling but people went hungry . i used to work for the military and i know how things work . what you see on tv or read about isn't always reality you only see a small portion of whats going on . put yourselves in their position walk a mile in their shoes . these people are in a extreme situation ! where is humanity those are living people. someone said they had cellphones so what they had cell phones its not that they didnt have a live before ... humble yourselves a bit it could happen to us all ....

A few contradictions there. They are so starved they have to leave their kids but they have cell phones? Makes sense, since you have to call your family from Europe to let them know you made it.

Here a starving migrant describes his perilous journey;

“We hit a stone and we flow around it,” said Arazak Dubal, 28, a computer programmer from Damascus, who had been on the road for 18 days.

He and his three companions reached Belgrade only to discover on Facebook and WhatsApp that the Hungarian border was closed to refugees.

“So I went to Google Maps, and here we are,” said Dubal, huffing in the hot afternoon as he trudged across the farm fields.

I bet a lot of those refugees are thankful for Google maps - Europe is a long way from Syria..

[stevewinn]

they dont want to be in Hungary anyway, they want to get to Germany obviously. And since I dont believe in the construct of nations anyway; your argumant is invalid, a nation isnt a house it is a social construct and land doesnt belong to anyone so they shoud be free to go where they want to.

Even if I believed in nationalism I still would let them in, since most of syrian refugees are highly educated and a good addition to the workforce, since I am not an antisocial *******, also since there are enough private persons who want to help them with their own money, since I prefer them over a lot of citizens whith who I have to deal everyday, since most of the wars were created or at least fueled by western powers...etc

I've said this before, If these Syrian "refugees" are all highly educated and a good addition to the work force. Im quite happy for every single one of them to go to Germany. Let Germany have the benefit of such great people. - In fact why does Germany insist the refugees have to walk hundreds of miles through various EU countries to reach Germany?

German policy is making all these refugees, i mean Doctors, nurses, engineers, scientists, professional types having to continually risk their lives, by paying human traffickers. Why doesn't Germany cut out the middle man, IE: the traffickers and rent out one or two ocean liners, cruise ships. like the one Greece uses, Dock these ships in Greece and pick these refugees up from there or better still pick them up from Turkey itself and then sail directly to Germany. - We are hearing stories of "refugees" paying thousands of dollars to get where they are, well if German done direct sailings, Germany could charge a small fee for the Boat trip.

This would stop the "problem" it would stop thousands of illegal migrants walking through european countries such as Hungary, it would also control the flow of refugees to a manageable size for processing in Germany. a minimum of five days sailing gives the German authorities on board the ship to complete the registration of 1,500 "passengers" before they dock in Germany. once they offload the "new German citizens" the ship sails back to pick up the next load. all controlled and all managed.

i feel extremely sad reading some of these post and how some people talk about other peoples misery . Just for the record for some to understand why there are mostly '' MEN'' well in the arab world the man is responsible for the family . unfortunately there wasnt enough money for all the family members to go so the men go . How many of you have actually seen one of those camps ??? i was there in turkey by the syrian border when it all began . what i found amazing is that we as muslim along side with jews and christians worked so well together hand in hand . when the military stepped in it started to be horrible . we saw how they rationed food how they moved slow in all and everything how hospitals had certain orders ( treating them differently ) i saw mothers with their babies sick and no help . imagine you are trying to help your child and you cant . food was spoiling but people went hungry . i used to work for the military and i know how things work . what you see on tv or read about isn't always reality you only see a small portion of whats going on . put yourselves in their position walk a mile in their shoes . these people are in a extreme situation ! where is humanity those are living people. someone said they had cellphones so what they had cell phones its not that they didnt have a live before ... humble yourselves a bit it could happen to us all ....

In the Arab world the men are responsible for the family, its the bloody same here in the civilised Western world. But the difference is most Western men would make sure their wives and children were sent to safety first. IE women and children first.

As for there isn't enough money to send the whole family! why are these refugees fare paying passengers now? oh you mean paying human traffickers, and they've been encouraged by Germany to continue to risk their lives in the hands of such people. very responsible for Germany.

Your life experience cannot be to great if you was "amazed" how Christians Jews & Moslems worked so well together, - wake up call, people who follow such religions have been working together for hundreds of years in the western world, this might amaze you, so hold on to your seat, today yes, today, companies, factories up and down the land have mixed work forces of the religions you mentioned and guess what their all working together, every day of the week years on end. wow holy crap. i know, amazing whatever next.

Where is Humanity, good question, where is the help from the Arabs? the Arab league? Saudi, Oman, Kuwait, ect.. oh that's right no help forthcoming, So lets all have a guilt trip, the West and when i say the West im talking of the UK & USA only between us we are financing over half (74%) the UNHCR budget for the refugee camps. Where the hell is the rest of the World never mind Europe.

Get your pictures posted on here of the time you spent visiting the UNcamp and once and for all we can have a unbiased source, this is excellent im glad you posted we can now show people on here the difference between genuine refugees and those we see travelling through Europe.

Edited September 17, 2015 by stevewinn

[bmk1245]

i try to understand what you say here ... i work in the humanitarian field so i know some of the things that are going on . i have seen many things so devastating and horrible i have seen death ... often its the problem of the government . but when it comes to people in need we should all stick together doesnt matter what country , i am glad there will always be people with a passionate heart to go out of their ways to help those in need .

And there always be many those who will fool "passionate heart". How do Iranians, Pakistanis, Egyptians, (or, for example, Syrians living for years in Egypt), pretending to be Syrians from war torn Syria, fit the picture of war refugees? Why do you think many were so furious, and declined to register?

[141]

I've said this before, If these Syrian "refugees" are all highly educated and a good addition to the work force. Im quite happy for every single one of them to go to Germany. Let Germany have the benefit of such great people. - In fact why does Germany insist the refugees have to walk hundreds of miles through various EU countries to reach Germany, making all these refugees, i mean Doctors, nurses, engineers, scientists, professional types risking their lives and paying human traffickers along the way. Why doesn't Germany cut out the middle man, IE: the traffickers and rent out one or two ocean liners, cruise ships. like the one Greece uses, Dock these ships in Greece and pick these refugees up from there or better still pick them up from Turkey itself and then sail directly to Germany. - We are hearing stories of "refugees" paying thousands of dollars to get where they are, well if German done direct sailings, Germany could charge a small fee for the Boat trip.

you know nothing about politics do you ....

This would stop the "problem" it would stop thousands of illegal migrants walking through european countries such as Hungary, it would also control the flow of refugees to a manageable size for processing in Germany. five days sailing gives the German authorities on board the ship to complete the registration of 1,500 "passengers" before they dock in Germany. once they offload the "new German citizens" the ship sails back to pick up the next load. all controlled and all managed.

all i say '' only the brave make it '' make of it what you will ... none of them care for what happens to those who are lost along the way ....

In the Arab world the men are responsible for the family, its the bloody same here in the civilised Western world. But the difference is most Western men would make sure their wives and children were sent to safety first. IE women and children first.

that's the risk that they must take, you need to understand arab mentality

As for there isn't enough money to send the whole family! why are these refugees fare paying passengers now? oh you mean paying human traffickers, and they've been encouraged by Germany to continue to risk their lives in the hands of such people. very responsible for Germany.

i am not from germany so i cant speak for them but clearly they really come through mostly ... as for the money ...people have money but imagine in a war what is your money worth ??? you may have money but cant use it so they try to get out and risk their lives ....

Your life experience cannot be to great if you was "amazed" how Christians Jews & Moslems worked so well together, - wake up call, people who follow such religions have been working together for hundreds of years in the western world, this might amaze you, so hold on to your seat, today yes, today, companies, factories up and down the land have mixed work forces of the religions you mentioned and guess what their all working together, every day of the week years on end. wow holy crap. i know, amazing whatever next.

how you come across ???? i think you didnt get my point about people working together

Where is Humanity, good question, where is the help from the Arabs? the Arab league? Saudi, Oman, Kuwait, ect.. oh that's right no help forthcoming, So lets all have a guilt trip, the West and when i say the West im talking of the UK & USA only between us we are financing over half (74%) the UNHCR budget for the refugee camps. Where the hell is the rest of the World never mind Europe.

that i agree but then you need to look at who their alliances are .... bingo !!!!!! nuff said

Get your pictures posted on here of the time you spent visiting the UNcamp and once and for all we can have a unbiased source, this is excellent im glad you posted we can now show people on here the difference between genuine refugees and those we see travelling through Europe.

i dont really know what to say to this ...you want i enclose my bank account too ??? this is very ignorant ... if you post a picture of yourself helping one of them in need, i post my face ... you dont know what i have seen, its not like we go around and take selfies ...

Edited September 17, 2015 by YA AMAR

[Deleted]

I dont know why people whine anyway, Europe harbours 0.11 percent refugees while developing countries harbour millions of them for example 25 % of Lebanon population are refugees according to Juncker and those countries really don`t have any money but still they dont let them die.

Personally the only thing I am surprised about is that not more refugees are coming to Europe considering the state most countries are in. Dunno, millions of people are fighting for survival everyday, I am surprised that they dont flood into Europe and the USA.

Edited September 17, 2015 by hellwyr

[Mikko-kun]

i feel extremely sad reading some of these post and how some people talk about other peoples misery . Just for the record for some to understand why there are mostly '' MEN'' well in the arab world the man is responsible for the family . unfortunately there wasnt enough money for all the family members to go so the men go . How many of you have actually seen one of those camps ??? i was there in turkey by the syrian border when it all began . what i found amazing is that we as muslim along side with jews and christians worked so well together hand in hand . when the military stepped in it started to be horrible . we saw how they rationed food how they moved slow in all and everything how hospitals had certain orders ( treating them differently ) i saw mothers with their babies sick and no help . imagine you are trying to help your child and you cant . food was spoiling but people went hungry . i used to work for the military and i know how things work . what you see on tv or read about isn't always reality you only see a small portion of whats going on . put yourselves in their position walk a mile in their shoes . these people are in a extreme situation ! where is humanity those are living people. someone said they had cellphones so what they had cell phones its not that they didnt have a live before ... humble yourselves a bit it could happen to us all ....

I dont have to imagine any of that, because I'm living it. Up here in the welfare state where refugees wanna come now. Homeless, trying to help a sick friend studying with my small salary but it's not always enough. Here a lot of food is thrown away but there's still maybe 1% of population, or more, lining for crappy free food because they can't afford any! Some of us give little alms even though we could afford a whole lotta more, others give everything and it's not enough. It is happening here too, sooner or later, when war comes, then you'll see you'd had been safer in Kongo.

You know the solution isn't to take them here, but to fix the problem in the country where they come from. W H A T E V E R it takes. The problem in the country doesn't go away like this.

We had a civil war in Finland almost 100 years ago. Lots of people died on both sides, more on the loser side. Lots of people suffered extreme hunger and poor prisoner conditions, like badly treated cattle. But we still fought between ourselves and neither side fled.

When there's an internal conflict, you need to avoid making the country a playground for big world powers to push their rulers, on both sides. That's all. And maybe try ease the suffering of civilians and CIVILIANS ONLY, and try prevent torture camps and such from emerging. And perhaps prevent needless mass slaughter too, when it's not a war but a slaughter.

Beyond that, you need to work it between yourselves, accept the outcome and stick in your country, or petition foreign nations to CONQUER AND TAKE OVER your country, if that's better than living under the rule you don't wanna live under. Lets say a foreign nation or a bunch of foreign nations conquers your country and holds it for, say 50-100 years or something, and then gives it back to your indigenous people when you calm down and got some sense in your head.

If I was a millionnaire, I'd help a lot of nature and some people, but I ain't. Likewise my country, and all european countries, have their limits how much they can help before they start to suffer. Despite your greater need you need to respect that and work a problem that's inherently yours or let others take over if you can't handle it.

[141]

And there always be many those who will fool "passionate heart". How do Iranians, Pakistanis, Egyptians, (or, for example, Syrians living for years in Egypt), pretending to be Syrians from war torn Syria, fit the picture of war refugees? Why do you think many were so furious, and declined to register?

i can agree to that , there will always be opportunists, these people are everywhere . in any country . Makes it bad for those who really need help .

[Helen of Annoy]

Hungary has obviously had enough of the immigrants using their country as a pathway, so this is pretty much what is going to happen. I think I read the new route some are taking is through Croatia.

Yes. They are already coming in. At first it went really well, with registering and no hysteria but today there was the first stampede. It calmed down again. They're boarding trains and buses after crossing the border at the official crossings, though police has to pick some of them from the corn fields because the refugees (and migrants and what will you) apparently don't believe they'll be let through Croatia. They will be let through. Complete with shelter, food, water and medical assistance. And registering too.

We must do our best to help, also because just 20 years ago we had our own refugees.

I'm not saying we will successfully manage this, I'm saying we simply must try.

What will happen after, I don't know. I guess a lot of people will be grateful, others won't. But I firmly believe first you have to make sure someone is ungrateful, before you turn against them. You can't retaliate in advance, for god's sakes.

There's a lot of women and children in these waves, they are all exhausted.

[kartikg]

This is a matter of Hungary national interest, a timemight come wwhen the kindest person here would refuse to help a refugee and wouldn't even feel any guilt. There is something amazing about left or liberals ( I don't the right term) who are hell bent on forcing refugees on others is that they are ignoring that more people are stuck in middle east who cannot afford the trip they are in worst situation . These refugees are well educated and have money and contacts and it's so pathetic excuse to say that lets take them so that we can "use" them ( no humanity there just economics). What about millions who are stuck there why won't bring all the millions here I mean just send a big ship and ask who all want to enter Europe and bring them in.

[Deleted]

Just read on CNN Hungary uses teargas on children ... wtf what crappy country,

[Dark_Grey]

Just read on CNN Hungary uses teargas on children ... wtf what crappy country,

The migrants held a hungry strike for one day then started tearing down the fences and throwing concrete blocks at the Police. That wasn't going well so they started launching their kids over the fence (two had to be taken to hospital).

"A group of very aggressive migrants is persistently attacking Hungarian police with rocks and pieces of concrete," Szijjarto said. "This attack is coming from Serbian territory. Therefore, I firmly asked my Serbian colleague to call on Serbian authorities to act immediately against this aggressive group of migrants."

This isn't like fat cops pepper-spraying peaceful Occupy protesters - check out the ground footage coming in from Hungary and your sympathies might change. I know mine did..

[Deleted]

my sympathy FOR Hungary was gone when they built that fence. Do you know how money apartments and houses are empty and unused. Do you know how many jobs arent done because nobody wants to. There are enough possibilities to give them temporary housing and maybe an opertunity to start a new life.

Generally I am fed up reading news since;

nations failed to combat the economic crisis 2008, instead they put up measures which lengthened the crisis and which will lead to a very bad climax

they failed Syria, Ukraine, Iraq, Afghanistan, Lybia... actually they fueled the conflicts there and propapbly instigated them

they failed internationally rebooting a new cold war (congrats)

they failed to protect the environment, instead the many environmental crisises seem to worsen

and now they are failing the refugee crisis

So actually I dont feel sympathy for any country since those are the consequences for their failures and of course who must suffer always the people not the individuals who make decisions.

Edited September 17, 2015 by hellwyr

[141]

Sky News' Colin Brazier described the scene at the Roszke-Horgos border crossing as clashes broke out around him.

"It's very fractious," he said. "There are young men who are really angry. It's a determined hard core of maybe a score - and behind them children and mothers.

"The imagery of this is being beamed around the world - people are going to look at this in other European capitals and be concerned."

Brazier said refugees had been left at the fence without food, water and information.

how sad really ...

http://news.sky.com/story/1553706/children-injured-as-tear-gas-fired-at-refugees

Edited September 17, 2015 by YA AMAR

[bmk1245]

Just read on CNN Hungary uses teargas on children ... wtf what crappy country,

Rrright... "Drag kid into the fire, and then complain about kid getting burns"...

[Dark_Grey]

Clearly, the position anyone takes on this entirely depends on how they view the migrants. Either they are poor, starving families from war-torn Syria, or they are able-bodied young men coming to take advantage of the social programs and generosity of European nations. To break it down even further, it could depend entirely on who's feeding you the story

[bmk1245]

Here is one bit from Sweden, Dalarna (in Swedish, punch it in google translate, and you'll get idea what it is about). In short, refugees refused to leave the bus, because they've heard that there is lack of services there...

[+and-then]

Death camps are death camps. People are dying in them of starvation and disease. It doesn't make any difference what religion they are. They're still human beings...and I thought you were pro-life. And what you're not acknowledging is that these people are fleeing militant extremists. Obviously, they aren't of them if they have to run for their lives.

I don't know what offenses you're talking about. I didn't compare any sort of militant aspect...although every religion has such an aspect. I compared religions which are under the same Abrahamic umbrella and share a lot of the same beliefs. That's simply a fact. Muslims and Christians have a lot in common.

You seem to think Islam is just a suicide cult when there are Muslims all over the world who are not blowing themselves up. It's obviously a minority of extremists who are doing the bad stuff. All of these people fleeing for their lives are leaving an area that is just being completely destroyed. They're all in danger. And when they flee they have nothing. Then they get to these camps where conditions are so deplorable, that they're still in peril of death. Of course they want to leave the camps...because the goal is to live. It's not about a "better job." Their country is blown up. They're in tent camps where they don't have clean water, sanitation, or enough food, and no medicine...and winter is coming. Any one of us put in this situation would try to keep our families alive.

Jesus wouldn't approve of people fleeing from war and trying to keep their families alive? That just doesn't make any sense.

If you do not believe that most of them are fleeing for a better life, not for survival, then look at a map and track the distance. Croatia and Slovenia are now having to introduce border controls because of the tide coming that they cannot handle. If I were fleeing for my survival I wouldn't be so picky. AND... these people are nearly uniformly Muslim and all historical indications are that they will remain so. They will not assimilate, they will grow and will to DOMINATE. It's what Islam DOES. IMO the Hungarian president got it right: https://kutv.com/news/nation-world/hungary-declares-emergency-seals-border-detains-migrants

Christian charity and forbearance will doom these countries to a state where Christians become first the minority, then a target. There is ample proof of this in the M.E. already and Sweden and France are soon to follow. This is a clash of civilizations and Islam is winning. Any aid the US can afford to help Europe should be sent but it's up to Europeans to decide if they want to completely change the demographic of their nations by one mass migration of people whose culture is quite alien to the existing one.

[Helen of Annoy]

Clearly, the position anyone takes on this entirely depends on how they view the migrants. Either they are poor, starving families from war-torn Syria, or they are able-bodied young men coming to take advantage of the social programs and generosity of European nations. To break it down even further, it could depend entirely on who's feeding you the story

Clearly, you didn't notice a number of us, who are not falling into your 'anybody' category. Probably because we don't act hysteric enough.

If it was easy to comb that many people and separate the genuine refugees from economic migrants (and from freeloaders and from actual terrorists and from who knows who else)... it would be done by now. But it's not easy, it takes time.

I do not approve of letting kids drop dead while waiting to see who hails from which hellhole.

[stevewinn]

Clearly, the position anyone takes on this entirely depends on how they view the migrants. Either they are poor, starving families from war-torn Syria, or they are able-bodied young men coming to take advantage of the social programs and generosity of European nations. To break it down even further, it could depend entirely on who's feeding you the story

exactly right, I watched the BBC's live coverage of the Serbia-Hungarian border trouble Yesterday. The Hungarian police were behind two fences, the police were there to prevent a violation of Hungarian Laws. for well over two hours the police stood there and done nothing. When it became apparent the border was not going to be opened a number of "refugees" started to attack the first set of two fences/gates, in a bid to force their way into Hungary from this point it all went down hill. a group of young men started to attack the Hungarian police by throw whatever they could get their hands on.

What about the man with the red rucksack with the megaphone at the border yesterday, a ring leader. any woman or child caught up in th tear gas and water cannon was a result of their own stupidity, you could see the tension was rising, and groups of young refugees where going to kick off trouble, any one with a child would have read the change in the mood and situation and moved away, but then again. woman and children caught up in it all add to the effect.

Police have not used any force whatsoever, including tear gas or Water cannon at this stage. It this early part of the footage which would be edited out of later News Bulletins in all Media here in the United Kingdom.

All is peaceful earlier in the day. Boo those bad Hungarian police.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RJVEp2tGcl0

Oh dear, the peaceful loving refugees, sorry i mean, the doctors, scientist, enginers professional types have had enough, and they've found the courage to attack the Hungarian police, courage they seemed to lack in the face of ISIS back in their homeland. the bloody cowards.

Its appalling that ALL the British media edited out the start of the trouble and reasons for using water cannon and tear gas.

[kartikg]

From now on the western nations will think twice before bombing any country.

[stevewinn]

From now on the western nations will think twice before bombing any country.

I've altered your quote below.

From now on the western nations will think twice before bombing offering welfare benefits greater than any country.

Its clear they are all heading to the wealthier members of the EU, in seek of not refuge but financial incentive. Germany hasn't bombed Syria, Sweden hasn't.

[Wickian]

From now on the western nations will think twice before bombing any country.

How many countries in a state of peace did they have to walk through to reach the "safety" of Germany and other high-benefit nations?

[Ashotep]

From now on the western nations will think twice before bombing any country.

Biggest mistake we ever made was going into Iraq. But we didn't invade Syria.

[Occult1]

Clearly, the position anyone takes on this entirely depends on how they view the migrants. Either they are poor, starving families from war-torn Syria, or they are able-bodied young men coming to take advantage of the social programs and generosity of European nations. To break it down even further, it could depend entirely on who's feeding you the story

It doesn't matter if they are only poor families or not. Why should it make a difference? Most of Syria is a pile of rubble and under ISIS control either way.

If there are able-bodied young man in the lot I say so much the better for us. They will have no problem finding general labor jobs eventually.

What is a refugee?

''A refugee is someone who has been forced to flee his or her country because of persecution, war, or violence. A refugee has a well-founded fear of persecution for reasons of race, religion, nationality, political opinion or membership in a particular social group. Most likely, they cannot return home or are afraid to do so. War and ethnic, tribal and religious violence are leading causes of refugees fleeing their countries.''

Source: http://www.unrefugee...t-is-a-refugee/

Edited September 17, 2015 by Phenix20