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Anomalocaris

New Evidence Of Converging Black Holes

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Anomalocaris

New Support For Converging Black Holes

Earlier this year, astronomers discovered what appeared to be a pair of supermassive black holes circling toward a collision so powerful it would send a burst of gravitational waves surging through the fabric of space-time itself.

Now, in a new study in the journal Nature, astronomers at Columbia University provide additional evidence that a pair of closely orbiting black holes is causing the rhythmic flashes of light coming from quasar PG 1302-102...

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Edited by Anomalocaris
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Four Winds

"Based on calculations of the pair’s mass—together, and relative to each other—the researchers go on to predict a smashup 100,000 years from now, an impossibly long time to humans but the blink of an eye to a star or black hole.Spiraling together 3.5 billion light-years away"

If the black holes are 3.5 billion light-years away, then the smashup already happened 3.5 billion years ago minus 100,000 years or am I missing something?

Sure we may have to wait 100,000 years to observe it, but the event happened a long time ago.

Edited by Razer
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Waspie_Dwarf

Sure we may have to wait 100,000 years to observe it, but the event happened a long time ago.[/font][/color]

Yes, but that is entirely irrelevant

Everything we see has happened in the past, just in most cases it's a tiny fraction of a second in the past.

From our perspective this event has not yet happened. Since we can only observe the event from our perspective any other perspective is not relevant to us.

This being the case it is entirely correct to think of this as an event which will occur 100,000 years in the future.

If every astronomical article had to add a footnote pointing this out just to keep a few overly pedantic people happy it would become very tiresome very quickly.

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Four Winds

This being the case it is entirely correct to think of this as an event which will occur 100,000 years in the future.

Frame it as you will, the event happened a long time ago, if you want to pretend it is going to happen in the future based on our perspective, go for it, reality doesn't care. It already happened 3.5 billion years ago.

As far as the article, they should have mentioned it already happened.

If they include this in the article, clearly they are dealing with an audience that might not know the event already happened.

"At the center of most giant galaxies, including our own Milky Way, lies a supermassive black hole so dense that not even light can escape. Over time, black holes grow bigger—millions to billions times more massive than the sun--by gobbling up stars, galaxies and even other black holes."

So the audience is not people that would know the event already happened. If they are going to explain black holes in a simple way and not make that a footnote, then go ahead and use that opportunity to explain this event happened a long time ago, at least not to cause a panic about the future.

Edited by Saru
Edited to remove derrogatory personal remarks - keep it civil please

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lightly

snapback.pngWaspie_Dwarf, on 18 September 2015 - 06:53 AM, said:

This being the case it is entirely correct to think of this as an event which will occur 100,000 years in the our future.

ok .. that should do it? :innocent:

*

Edited by lightly
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Grandpa Greenman

Quite true, for most of us, it is irrelevant from the perspective of science that the event has already happen. On an astrology page the posts can be priceless. :P

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highdesert50

The evidence mounts for an impeding collision and subsequent demise of that galaxy. Of interest would be the ramifications of detecting gravitational waves of previous comparable events. Certainly fodder for a budding SF writer.

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Four Winds

The evidence mounts for an impeding collision and subsequent demise of that galaxy. Of interest would be the ramifications of detecting gravitational waves of previous comparable events. Certainly fodder for a budding SF writer.

Are gravitational waves proven?

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Calibeliever

Are gravitational waves proven?

As I understand it they are widely accepted as 'very probable' but not proven yet.. A lot of evidence points to it...

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/gravity-waves-cmb-b-mode-polarization/

One question I have is: do they obey the speed limit of light? If this happened 3.5 billion years ago maybe the effects have come and gone through this part of the universe?

Edited by Calibeliever

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Four Winds

As I understand it they are widely accepted as 'very probable' but not proven yet.. A lot of evidence points to it...

http://www.scientifi...e-polarization/

One question I have is: do they obey the speed limit of light? If this happened 3.5 billion years ago maybe the effects have come and gone through this part of the universe?

That is the thing I wonder about. Gravity and the speed of light,

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BeastieRunner

What would be the effect of a gravitational wave on us?

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Rhino666

Once again we're let down....our life has produce very little to observe and feel.

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Infernal Gnu

So the Silver Surfer may have ridden this monster gravitational wave through our solar system eons ago?

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FTWind

Im afraid a ripple in time would not effect us much. Meaning, time is a thing of perception and if everything around us, including our brain, were to be hit by this ripple in time, we would still percieve the time at the same rate, for everything would still be going at the same rate in time.

Edited by FTWind

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Frank Merton

I'm not sure we have much evidence for the existence of gravity waves (the only thing I know is the observation of the decay of orbiting pulsars happens as we would expect if the energy were being carried off by such waves). What we do have is strong theoretical reason dating from Einstein that they should exist. The demonstration that they do exist would be another feather in Einstein's cap.

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smokeycat

One question I have is: do they obey the speed limit of light? If this happened 3.5 billion years ago maybe the effects have come and gone through this part of the universe?

That is the thing I wonder about. Gravity and the speed of light,

The speed of gravity was measured a few years back.

The experiment showed that it travels at the speed of light. ;)

https://www.newscien...ement-revealed/

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djfxw

If the wave does ripple through the universe, then the gravity wells of all planets could be disrupted and cause the planets to 'bob' and most likely cause the planets to tilt or completey roll over. The USA could become the new Antartic.

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cerberusxp

Everything that produces gravity creates a space time dimple in the fabric of space time, just as Einstein predicted. In the case where two black holes collide, well waves produced from such a collision would be beyond comprehension. The earth for example has it's own dimple in space time, that is time as we perceive it flows differently from time say on Mars or other planets. The following link is our gravity "dimple". I contend that the Earth already has spacial time anomalies that happen around the globe naturally at times. I point to the Bermuda triangle and all the others around the planet. Furthermore our entire solar system has it's own "dimple" in space time as well as our whole galaxy. IE created by the super massive black hole at the center of OUR Galaxy.

http://science.nasa....011/04may_epic/

Edited by cerberusxp

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cerberusxp

Also as an after thought might this collision cause a minor Big Bang? Creating more Galaxies? Who knows how many Galaxies these two already gobbled up.

If this has already happened before why haven't we seen the results of black hole collisions?

Edited by cerberusxp

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jerhiko

- If this has already happened before why haven't we seen the results of black hole collisions?

That was my thought

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sepulchrave

If this has already happened before why haven't we seen the results of black hole collisions?

Probably because space is big, large and identifiable black holes aren't that common, and possibly we don't exactly know what the post-collision wreckage will look like.

Consider that this potential collision was only identified now, although the pair of black holes has probably been in basically the same state for all of human history.

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Mr Supertypo

The speed of gravity was measured a few years back.

The experiment showed that it travels at the speed of light. ;)

https://www.newscien...ement-revealed/

If you go faster, you leave this universe....

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