LV-426 Posted October 31, 2015 #126 Share Posted October 31, 2015 she is embolden by irresponsible people who make excuses for her behavior and make the issue about a cop who has apparently the respect of most of these kids. Honestly, if that's the kind of role model kids have respect for, there's a much larger issue here. I understand and accept the notion of discipline in the classroom. I'm even prepared to accept Farmer77's concept of 'soft racism.' I don't live in South Carolina. I don't know what the local tensions are, and that's an issue that needs addressing elsewhere. I absolutely cannot accept that any thinking person can treat this kind of violence against a sulky teenage girl - of any race. - as a secondary concern though. It just beggars belief. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbrn30000 Posted October 31, 2015 #127 Share Posted October 31, 2015 Behaviour does indeed matter. "big **** of hers" "little thug" "little witch" "jail is going to be her way of life" "ghetto worshipping" To be honest I'm a whole lot more concerned about your attitude than the girls... I am concerned about the excuse making and passes given to clearly unruly, uncivilized, criminal behaving people the media make out to be angels. I guess you are one of those that find angels in these stories. She is a thug. there is no other word for her. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbrn30000 Posted October 31, 2015 #128 Share Posted October 31, 2015 Honestly, if that's the kind of role model kids have respect for, there's a much larger issue here. I understand and accept the notion of discipline in the classroom. I'm even prepared to accept Farmer77's concept of 'soft racism.' I don't live in South Carolina. I don't know what the local tensions are, and that's an issue that needs addressing elsewhere. I absolutely cannot accept that any thinking person can treat this kind of violence against a sulky teenage girl - of any race. - as a secondary concern though. It just beggars belief. violence? not really. She will see real violence more likely in the prison she ends up in thanks to the liars who tell her keep up the good work. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawken Posted October 31, 2015 Author #129 Share Posted October 31, 2015 (edited) Well gee Hawks - I'm from Oz - as you know - and we still get your news here. Infact I have good friends and some relatives living in the US - it's also become a smaller world since the interwebz... We also get - and have had corrupt and extreme bully cops here - they are also dealt with - in accordance to the law. So you are certainly not exclusive or unique in regards to this type of police brutality - where surely - people from other places can occassionally comment on such matters ? Personally however - I mostly keep out of your politics - and gun law yada yada - - if that is any consolation Astra, everyone in the world is welcome to share their comments on this topic. I was just making a point to Toast about his lame comment on Pearl Harbor. Edited October 31, 2015 by Hawkin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted October 31, 2015 #130 Share Posted October 31, 2015 I am concerned about the excuse making and passes given to clearly unruly, uncivilized, criminal behaving people the media make out to be angels. I guess you are one of those that find angels in these stories. She is a thug. there is no other word for her. So you are saying the officer's actions were justified? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LV-426 Posted October 31, 2015 #131 Share Posted October 31, 2015 I am concerned about the excuse making and passes given to clearly unruly, uncivilized, criminal behaving people the media make out to be angels. I guess you are one of those that find angels in these stories. She is a thug. there is no other word for her. I don't think there's any point continuing this conversation. Being as respectful as I can, you clearly have your own agenda here, and you'll continue to push that agenda regardless of any valid or invalid arguments you may have concerning school discipline. I've clearly stated that the girl was out of line, but if you believe that level of violence against a child for chewing gum, using a mobile and being stubborn is proportionate and excusable, I can't take your views seriously. I'm sure there is a better word than 'thug' too. It suggests 'rough' and 'violent', which the girl clearly wasn't. I think she struck that officer and should be charged with a crime for both disrupting the peace of that class and for assaulting the officer. I need some staples for my sides... I think they actually split with laughter at that one 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawken Posted October 31, 2015 Author #132 Share Posted October 31, 2015 No it was just the teacher that got hurt not the student. So people can't go on about the poor innocent student which often isn't the case. Though this video doesn't involve a cop, it has similarities to the incident at South Carolina. A Black student using his cellphone and the White teacher feels he shouldn't be using it in class. Only the student got rough with the 62 year old teacher when he took it away. I still say these incidents are racially motivated by the media when the Black person is the victim. In these incidents, the media always brings up Black or White in the headlines and article. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbrn30000 Posted October 31, 2015 #133 Share Posted October 31, 2015 So you are saying the officer's actions were justified? I have said the cop should never have been called into this situation, but she was asked by her teacher and the administrator several times to go out of the room after being asked several times to put up her phone. The cop also asked her at least four times to leave the room with the administrator. when you call a cop to do a job they have to win. He should have requested a supervisor, then cleared the room of the other students. but when he touched her, she struck him and the fight was on. I really don't have any sympathy for her. As I said, when I was her age, she would have been marched out, and struck across her butt with a wooden paddle and probably suspended. But I never remember any kid in my day acting as she did. I can't imagine what would have happened. The students are supporting the cop because they know exactly what happened and what a trouble maker this girl is. She needs to be kicked out and the cop needs to be left alone. She should be charged with every crime they can think of. She is a nuisance to good order. She set this whole thing up. If it were up to me I would put her in a reform school for the rest of the school year. when she is 18 let her go fend for herself. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbrn30000 Posted October 31, 2015 #134 Share Posted October 31, 2015 (edited) I don't think there's any point continuing this conversation. Being as respectful as I can, you clearly have your own agenda here, and you'll continue to push that agenda regardless of any valid or invalid arguments you may have concerning school discipline. I've clearly stated that the girl was out of line, but if you believe that level of violence against a child for chewing gum, using a mobile and being stubborn is proportionate and excusable, I can't take your views seriously. I'm sure there is a better word than 'thug' too. It suggests 'rough' and 'violent', which the girl clearly wasn't. I need some staples for my sides... I think they actually split with laughter at that one go ahead and laugh, and one day you will read about this child's early death or imprisonment because she was never taught how to behave. she is a thug now and there is nothing happening to her to change her path. laugh all you want. why don't you take a drive over to your local prison or jail and count how many young black people are there. I guess you will bust another gut then. Edited October 31, 2015 by mbrn30000 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbrn30000 Posted October 31, 2015 #135 Share Posted October 31, 2015 I don't think there's any point continuing this conversation. Being as respectful as I can, you clearly have your own agenda here, and you'll continue to push that agenda regardless of any valid or invalid arguments you may have concerning school discipline. I've clearly stated that the girl was out of line, but if you believe that level of violence against a child for chewing gum, using a mobile and being stubborn is proportionate and excusable, I can't take your views seriously. I'm sure there is a better word than 'thug' too. It suggests 'rough' and 'violent', which the girl clearly wasn't. I need some staples for my sides... I think they actually split with laughter at that one she was not removed because she chewed gum or used a phone. she refused to take any direction and told her buddies to film what she was about to do. if you cannot get that then you are as smart as she is. teachers should not have to ask her more than once to do anything. children do not run the classroom, but now days the students are being victimized by thugs who are only there to see how much trouble they can cause. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted October 31, 2015 #136 Share Posted October 31, 2015 I have said the cop should never have been called into this situation, but she was asked by her teacher and the administrator several times to go out of the room after being asked several times to put up her phone. The cop also asked her at least four times to leave the room with the administrator. when you call a cop to do a job they have to win. He should have requested a supervisor, then cleared the room of the other students. but when he touched her, she struck him and the fight was on. I really don't have any sympathy for her. As I said, when I was her age, she would have been marched out, and struck across her butt with a wooden paddle and probably suspended. But I never remember any kid in my day acting as she did. I can't imagine what would have happened. The students are supporting the cop because they know exactly what happened and what a trouble maker this girl is. She needs to be kicked out and the cop needs to be left alone. She should be charged with every crime they can think of. She is a nuisance to good order. She set this whole thing up. If it were up to me I would put her in a reform school for the rest of the school year. when she is 18 let her go fend for herself. So you DO feel the officer was justified? Terrifying, simply terrifying. Without using a weapon that girl was in no way a threat to the officer. Physical violence should ONLY be used in self defense. To justify slamming a child, or any human being, to the ground like that because you don't like their culture, attitude or words is a very very slippery slope. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LV-426 Posted October 31, 2015 #137 Share Posted October 31, 2015 go ahead and laugh, and one day you will read about this child's early death or imprisonment because she was never taught how to behave. she is a thug now and there is nothing happening to her to change her path. laugh all you want. why don't you take a drive over to your local prison or jail and count how many young black people are there. I guess you will bust another gut then. Like I say, I don't have any problem with the idea of discipline. I just think we have VERY different views on what discipline is. Your views seem somewhat akin to beating someone to try and instil pacifism into them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawbone Posted October 31, 2015 #138 Share Posted October 31, 2015 (edited) She did flail her arm after he initiated contact. What terrifies me about our society is that for many this seems to be enough justification for a grown man to smash a 16 year old girl into the floor. You claim to not condone her behavior early on in the thread but minimize her actions later. No one is stamping the officer's actions as justified, but punching (flailing) at a police officer just re-enforces the premise that this student was intent on defying anyone who challenged her. First the teacher, then the principal, then the resource officer......just vehement defiance. These students, especially those of color have been empowered to such a degree they feel above reproach. You and those like you feed this empowerment. Edited October 31, 2015 by Rawbone 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashotep Posted October 31, 2015 #139 Share Posted October 31, 2015 Though this video doesn't involve a cop, it has similarities to the incident at South Carolina. A Black student using his cellphone and the White teacher feels he shouldn't be using it in class. Only the student got rough with the 62 year old teacher when he took it away. I still say these incidents are racially motivated by the media when the Black person is the victim. In these incidents, the media always brings up Black or White in the headlines and article. Teachers aren't allowed to touch a student anymore they have no choice but to call the cops. Even if the teacher was younger and could have he would be in trouble if he beat the kids butt. Some of these kids are violent and are larger than the teachers. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted October 31, 2015 #140 Share Posted October 31, 2015 You claim to not condone her behavior early on in the thread but minimize her actions later. No one is stamping the officer's actions as justified, but punching (flailing) at a police officer just re-enforces the premise that this student was intent on defying anyone who challenged her. First the teacher, then the principal, then the resource officer......just vehement defiance. These students, especially those of color have been empowered to such a degree they feel above reproach. Defiance against authority does not equate to giving authority figures the right to physically harm anyone. Its really that simple. The officer was in no danger therefore should not have used violence. Regardless of whether she insulted his mom, wife and faith and disobeyed 15 direct orders, violence was not appropriate. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashotep Posted October 31, 2015 #141 Share Posted October 31, 2015 To be fair, race does play a part in some of this. Black children are often brought up to defy authority. Many black children learn from their parents to use their color in a way to defy authority. I don't know that it was the case here. That's true it is a big part of the problem when it comes to cops reacting with blacks but sometimes they cause no problems and they still get kicked around or killed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHaYap Posted October 31, 2015 #142 Share Posted October 31, 2015 It was a bad situation with worse consequences ... and the implications are getting graver by the day ... ~ its not about the cop or the man... it is not about the kid or the student ... it is about how in the world did the world come to this ... ~ 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawbone Posted October 31, 2015 #143 Share Posted October 31, 2015 Defiance against authority does not equate to giving authority figures the right to physically harm anyone. Its really that simple. The officer was in no danger therefore should not have used violence. Regardless of whether she insulted his mom, wife and faith and disobeyed 15 direct orders, violence was not appropriate. Force is sometimes a necessary element that I believe you discount too obtusely. In your mind, there was no justification whatsoever for any type of force at all. That's obtuse. The student punched at the officer, and had defied multiple authority figures, and was just basically refusing to comply under any circumstance. I'm guessing you would have brought in the school counselor, or some others pacification approach. Perhaps we are just too different to come to any middle ground on this. I think the officer got a little carried away with the measure of force applied, but I believe force was necessary to some degree. I also believe that never applying force in these situations only emboldens those that have already been given too much power as individuals in the student collective. Other students have rights too, and to give carte blanche to one segment of the student population is wrongheaded. It was a bad situation with worse consequences ... and the implications are getting graver by the day ... ~ its not about the cop or the man... it is not about the kid or the student ... it is about how in the world did the world come to this ... ~ Wha? Just silly... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LV-426 Posted October 31, 2015 #144 Share Posted October 31, 2015 (edited) You claim to not condone her behavior early on in the thread but minimize her actions later. No one is stamping the officer's actions as justified, but punching (flailing) at a police officer just re-enforces the premise that this student was intent on defying anyone who challenged her. First the teacher, then the principal, then the resource officer......just vehement defiance. These students, especially those of color have been empowered to such a degree they feel above reproach. You and those like you feed this empowerment. Well, I guess at least we can drop the 'soft' part of 'soft racism' in your case. Maybe you didn't notice, but there were also a whole bunch of other "colored" kids in the classroom that weren't causing any trouble? Jesus, did I just warp back a few decades? Edited October 31, 2015 by LV-426 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawbone Posted October 31, 2015 #145 Share Posted October 31, 2015 (edited) Well, I guess at least we can drop the 'soft' part of 'soft racism' in your case. Maybe you didn't notice, but there were also a whole bunch of other "colored" kids in the classroom that weren't causing any trouble? Jesus, did I just warp back a few decades? So I'm a racist now, is that it? I enjoy discussion, you obviously do not. I said, "Those of color." I didn't say colored. But that doesn't really matter does it. You take one word from every post on this thread of mine, and label me. I think you are the one with bias. Edited October 31, 2015 by Rawbone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted October 31, 2015 #146 Share Posted October 31, 2015 Force is sometimes a necessary element that I believe you discount too obtusely. In your mind, there was no justification whatsoever for any type of force at all. That's obtuse. The student punched at the officer, and had defied multiple authority figures, and was just basically refusing to comply under any circumstance. I'm guessing you would have brought in the school counselor, or some others pacification approach. Perhaps we are just too different to come to any middle ground on this. I think the officer got a little carried away with the measure of force applied, but I believe force was necessary to some degree. I also believe that never applying force in these situations only emboldens those that have already been given too much power as individuals in the student collective. Other students have rights too, and to give carte blanche to one segment of the student population is wrongheaded. Wha? Just silly... Force and violence are too COMPLETELY different things. Thats part of what makes this so disturbing. The officer had the strength and size to use force (as i keep saying picking her and the desk up and removing them from the room) without using violence. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbrn30000 Posted October 31, 2015 #147 Share Posted October 31, 2015 So you DO feel the officer was justified? Terrifying, simply terrifying. Without using a weapon that girl was in no way a threat to the officer. Physical violence should ONLY be used in self defense. To justify slamming a child, or any human being, to the ground like that because you don't like their culture, attitude or words is a very very slippery slope. she was not terrified. she wanted it to go down that way. she refused to stand up entangling on purpose her legs in the desk to make it harder for the cop to lift her. She fell as the desk fell over. She got what she deserved. Believe me, my father hit me a lot harder than the cop so called slammed her. She better get use to is. She is going to get a lot of slamming by cops in the years to come if she keeps playing that game. She needs to wake up but all I hear from you is, keep doing it to the man baby. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted October 31, 2015 #148 Share Posted October 31, 2015 (edited) she was not terrified. she wanted it to go down that way. she refused to stand up entangling on purpose her legs in the desk to make it harder for the cop to lift her. She fell as the desk fell over. She got what she deserved. Believe me, my father hit me a lot harder than the cop so called slammed her. She better get use to is. She is going to get a lot of slamming by cops in the years to come if she keeps playing that game. She needs to wake up but all I hear from you is, keep doing it to the man baby. You misunderstood. The fact that people are justifying this officers actions is what is terrifying. We have decayed as a society to the point that it is obey the state or be crushed and people are flocking to defend the status quo. THAT is what is terrifying. To be clear , once again I am not defending her actions. Just the constitution and freedom. This assault is a symptom of a much larger problem in this country Edited October 31, 2015 by Farmer77 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted October 31, 2015 #149 Share Posted October 31, 2015 This is what im talking about. Police violence against the citizenry is an epidemic which needs to be addressed. This isnt an attack on police it is a fact based on evidence. I could post videos like the following every single day. http://keyetv.com/news/local/incident-between-round-rock-pd-officer-and-student-caught-on-camera Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LV-426 Posted October 31, 2015 #150 Share Posted October 31, 2015 She got what she deserved. At least we're crystal clear on what you believe now. Believe me, my father hit me a lot harder than the cop so called slammed her. That explains a lot. I'm reporting the thread for locking. It's already way out of hand. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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