everything you wanted to know about evp

[Bogeyman]

This subject is fascinating...i cant understand why it's not all over the news every day.........it's all verifiable and has tons of scientific backing and proof,vheck it out

Taken from kamaza.com

credit to Mark Macy...world itc.org

Electronic Voice

Phenomena

by Tim Haigh

Reprinted with permission of the Noah's Ark Society

Mounting evidence suggests that communication between this world and the next may one day be achieved at the flick of a switch, as a growing number of researchers worldwide are seemingly receiving spirit world messages and pictures through radios, TVs and computers. The breakthrough is called Instrumental Transcommunication - ITC for short - and is the collective term for conversing with the Other Side using electronic instrumentation.

I looked back through Spiritualist archives in search of some sign that communication with the so-called dead would some day evolve to fit in with the modern age, and it was in the works of Theosophist Alice Bailey that I found what I was looking for. Bailey was not a Spiritualist - I think she would have shuddered at that description - but nevertheless her writings offer the student of spiritual science a great deal.

Bailey faithfully transcribed the words of her great teacher, the Tibetan Master DK, for more than 20 years. In 1936 DK dictated these words: "Within the next few years the fact of the eternity of existence will have advanced from the realm of questioning into the realm of certainty. Through the use of the radio by those who have passed over will communication be set up and reduced to a true science."

Was this a prophecy based entirely upon inner plane insights? Students of EVP might think so because it was not until 1959 that Swedish film producer Friedrich Juergenson famously captured voices on audiotape while taping bird songs. (More on this later). If we crawl back through psychic history to the beginning of this century, however, we find reference to a little known American anthropologist named Waldemar Bogoras. It was he who conducted the first known experiment in which voices of "conjured spirits" were recorded on an electrical recording device.

Bogoras was on a trip to Siberia to visit a shaman of the Tchoutchi tribe when his experience took place. In a darkened room, he observed a spirit conjuring ritual that entailed the shaman beating a drum more and more rapidly while entering a trance state. Startled, Bogoras heard strange voices filling the room. The voices seemed to come from all corners and spoke English and Russian. After the session, Bogoras wrote: "I set up my equipment so I could record without the light. The shaman sat in the furthest corner of the room, approximately 20 feet away from me. When the light was extinguished, the spirits appeared after some hesitation and, following the wishes of the shaman, spoke into the horn of the phonograph. The recording showed a clear difference between the speech of the shaman, audible in the background, and the spirit voices which seemed to have been located directly at the mouth of the horn. All along the shaman's ceaseless drumbeats could be heard as if to prove that he remained in the same spot."

It was 25 years, however, before there was to be any attempt to record spirit voices in the West. At the forefront of research was the eminent scientist Thomas Alva Edison, inventor of the electric light, who together with his assistant Dr. Miller Hutchinson was busily at work in his laboratory building a machine to achieve spirit communication. In his diary Hutchinson wrote: "Edison and I are convinced that in the fields of psychic research will yet be discovered facts that will prove of greater significance to the thinking of the human race than all the inventions we have ever made in the field of electricity."

Yet Edison was to pass into spirit before achieving his goal. As he lay dying, however, he said to his doctor, "It is very beautiful over there." A remark from a man of science that he would only have uttered if he'd seen reality with his own eyes, perhaps? (Edison was to return nearly 70 years later as an integral part of the ITC team on earth. His image and that of film maker George Cukor, who died in 1983, appeared on a computer in Luxembourg in 1991).

It was in the 1950s that the baton was picked up, albeit unintentionally, in Italy by two Catholic priests, Father Ernetti and Father Gemilli. However, you will not find their names in any history of EVP written before 1990, because the results of their "experiment" were not published until then. The priests were collaborating on a musical research project; Ernetti as an internationally respected scientist, physicist, philosopher and music lover, and Gemilli was President of the Papal Academy. On September 15, 1952, while the men were recording a Gregorian chant, a wire in their equipment kept breaking. Exasperated, Gemilli looked up and asked his dead father for help. To his amazement his father's voice was heard saying: "Of course I shall help you. I'm always with you." They repeated the experiment, and the voice, even clearer than before, said, "But Zucchini, it is clear, don't you know it is I?"

Gemilli was astounded. No one knew the nickname his father had teased him with when he was a boy. It must be my father, he thought, suddenly afraid, for as a Catholic priest he had no right to speak with the dead. Troubled, the two men eventually sought an audience with Pope Pius XII in Rome. Gemilli told the Pontiff of his experience, and was to his very great surprise immediately reassured. According to the 1990 translated text of his meeting, Pope Pius told Gemilli: "You really need not worry about this. The existence of this voice is strictly a scientific fact and has nothing whatsoever to do with spiritism. The recorder is totally objective. It receives and records sound waves from wherever they come. This experiment may perhaps become the cornerstone for a building for scientific studies which will strengthen people's faith in a hereafter."

Even this papal reassurance was not enough to convince Catholicism that the phenomenon merited further attention, however. There the matter lay until the spirit world turned its attention to the man widely regarded as the founding father of EVP, Friedrich Juergenson (a slightly unfair epithet as it was two men from California, the medium Attila von Szalay and paranormal researcher Raymond Bayless who really initiated the modern EVP era. In 1956, they recorded, quite by chance, a series of paranormal voices on magnetic tape, voices that should not logically have been there. Though Bayless reported their experiments in the Journal of the American Society for Psychical Research, not a single person contacted the society or the researchers to inquire about their work).

Juergenson was a film producer in Sweden who, in 1959 while making a documentary, had decided to tape bird songs. As he began recording, little did he realize that what was to follow would change the course of not only his earthly life but of that he would lead in the world beyond after his death. When he played the tape back he was startled to hear, in among the tweeting and chirping, his mother's voice say in German, "Friedrich, you are being watched. Friedel, my little Friedel, can you hear me?"

In later years, Juergenson said that when he heard his mother's voice, he was convinced he had made "an important discovery -" an understatement if ever there was one. Since then, EVP, as it became known, has been investigated by many psychical researchers, including most notably Dr Konstantin Raudive from Latvia, the USA's Sarah Estep, and in the UK Raymond Cass and George Bonner.

Raudive was a Latvian psychologist who had read Juergenson's book, Radio Contact with the Dead, with a great deal of skepticism when it was translated into German in 1967. Nevertheless, he was intrigued and over several years carried out hundreds of experiments under laboratory conditions. Perhaps the most memorable from a scientific perspective was that conducted at the German headquarters of Pye Records in 1971.

The engineers at Pye invited Raudive to do a controlled experiment in the special sound lab that blocked out all external radio and television signals. They taped his voice speaking into a microphone for eighteen minutes and heard no other sounds, but when they played the tape back, they were amazed to find over two hundred voices on it.

In the years that followed, Juergenson and Raudive blazed a trail that many others attempted to follow. Constant criticism that the EVP was nothing more than ambient sounds processed by the mind into a semblance of speech or snatches of police radio dampened enthusiasm for research in Europe, however. During the 1970s and early 80s in the United States, by contrast, it continued to evolve with much of the work spearheaded by a retired engineer, George Meek.

Opening a small laboratory with a friend in Philadelphia in 1971 after a lifetime's interest in the paranormal, he became immersed in EVP and soon realized its limitations. Meek was convinced that for electronic communication with the dead to really make its mark, apparatus more sophisticated than he had found on his travels in Europe would be necessary. The way to go about building this, he decided, was to contact someone who had passed on and work with him and his team in achieving two-way communication. Meek wrote to the now defunct American magazine The Psychic Observer, which put him in touch with Bill O'Neil, an electronics engineer who was also a very gifted clairaudient and clairvoyant. Through him, Meek's team, later to form themselves into the Metascience Foundation, made contact with a man who had been dead for five years and who was a medical doctor while on earth.

"Doc Nick," as he became known, suggested to O'Neil that the team use certain audio frequencies instead of the white noise traditionally used by EVP researchers. This, he said, would serve as an energy source against which the sounds produced by his vocal cords could be played. It worked. Soon after, a spirit being calling himself Dr George Jeffries Mueller was recruited to the team, or rather he announced he had come to join them after materializing one afternoon in O'Neil's living room.

Mueller was a dead university professor and NASA scientist. He told Meek and O'Neil he had died in 1967 and gave them numerous facts with which to verify his identity including his security number, the place where his death certificate could be found and intimate details of his life and scholastic achievements. All of them checked out.

He began communicating regularly, helping to design a new piece of electromagnetic equipment that would convert spirit voices to audible voices. On October 27, 1977, his first words were recorded on the new system Meek called 'Spiricom.' Tapes of the Mueller conversations were released to the public and make fascinating listening. You can plainly hear Mueller joking with Meek and O'Neil and discussing topics from his favorite foods to the view of time from the spirit world. He gives unlisted telephone numbers asking them to make calls to confirm the identity (which they did successfully) of the people at the other end (usually top-level government personnel), and he gives O'Neil precise directions with which to help build experimental video equipment.

The clarity of the communications is quite astounding and sometimes amusing. In one conversation, Mueller identifies a problem with a particular device and impatiently barks at O'Neil, "The fault lies in an impedance mismatch which can be corrected by using a 150 ohm half-watt resistor in parallel with a 0.0047 microfad ceramic capacitor." Mueller eventually broke contact after telling Meek and O'Neil that natural law meant he could "not be here forever." (He did in fact return once more to a group of ITC researchers working in Rivenick, Germany, led by Adolph Homes. In 1991 they received on a TV screen an image which was unmistakably that of Dr Mueller).

Meek concluded that Mueller's consciousness had expanded to such a point that Spiricom could not be used for communication, so exposing one of its flaws. It had become clear that the most limiting aspect of the device was the fact that it depended almost entirely on the operator possessing mediumistic or psychic abilities, like O'Neil.

George Meek fully accepted this and never patented Spiricom in the hope that science would carry on his work and take it to the next step, going beyond what he and O'Neil were able to accomplish. In 1982 he held a press conference in Washington, USA, and revealed Spiricom's secrets. The conference made little impact on a largely skeptical world; in fact a large section of the media even refused to attend, so the device went largely unreported except by the tabloids who naturally poked fun.

Since then, the focus of attention in terms of results has switched to Europe. Nine months after Meek went public, on January 15, 1982, electronics engineer Hans-Otto Koenig helped the now defunct Radio Luxembourg broadcast live what was claimed to be a two-way conversation with a dead person. Koenig had invented an ultrasound device after closely following Meek's work which, he claimed, could replicate the Spiricom and Mueller/O'Neil dialogues. The equipment was set up under the watchful eye of the Radio Luxembourg engineers. The device, nicknamed "Koenig's Generator" by program presenter Rainer Holbe, was connected to a set of speakers and switched on.

An engineer asked if voices came through on request. Within seconds, a clear voice was heard. It said quite simply, "Otto Koenig makes wireless with the dead." Understandably, pandemonium broke out. Another question was asked and seconds later a voice replied, "We hear your voice." Rainer Holbe affirmed live on air there had been no trickery and later the station issued a statement stating that its engineers had found no natural explanation for what had happened. Soon after, the device was demonstrated to members of the German EVP Association in Frankfurt where Konstantin Raudive, who had died in 1974, confirmed his presence. On the strength of this, one of Koenig's associates, Dr Ernst Senkowski, a physics lecturer, electronics expert and veteran EVP researcher, persuaded George Meek to fly to Germany.

After a demonstration of the Koenig's Generator, Meek flew back convinced it was genuine and set about raising money to fund future work, but a year later in 1985, the mantle was picked up not by Hans-Otto Koenig, but by a Swiss electronics expert, Klaus Schreiber. As a result of studying Meek's Spiricom designs, Schreiber had invented an apparatus he called "Vidicom." It consisted of a specially adapted TV switched on but not attached to an aerial, with a video camera in front of it to capture images that appeared on the screen. One of the first pictures he received was a blurred, fleeting image of a figure. Over the next few years until his death in 1988, faces of deceased relatives also appeared. Some of the images were sharp, some not. Schreiber's friend Martin Wenzel continued his work with some success, but as with Spiricom, the Schreiber method, to work effectively, needed to be used by someone with the sensitivity of a psychic and strong inner plane links.

Author's Note: I would like to acknowledge Mark Macy of Continuing Life Research (CLR) for his help in compiling these series of articles. To receive his triannual report Contact!, which focuses on the work of INIT or various books, videos and audio cassettes published by CLR, Mark can be contacted at the following address: Continuing Life Research, PO Box 11036, Boulder CO 80301, USA, or by email at initus@worlditc.org. INIT also has a web site at http://www.worlditc.org.

[Phenomenon]

Nice article!

I'll sit and wait for the "skeptics" to come in and explain the phenomenon and then we MUST accept their explanation because they say it is so!

Edited December 9, 2004 by phenomenon

[Saru]

Lets not turn this into another skeptics vs believers debate, the subject here is Electronic Voice Phenomena.

I've no doubt that EVP is something that certainly warrants more study. I have noticed though that some of the recordings of 'voices' could be interpreted in other ways, I have heard examples of EVP which only sound like words once i've read what words someone else has decided they are. Once someone tells you a sample of EVP is a voice saying "hello" for example, it's difficult to interpret that sound in any other way.

I tend to wonder whether there is another explanation for the sounds than ghosts and spirits. Could voices in some way be "imprinted" in a location, perhaps later being picked up in this manner on tape ? Could the voices even be radio transmissions that are somehow being picked up ? Are they really voices at all ?

There a lot more questions than answers when it comes to this particular phenomenon.

[Bogeyman]

Nice article!

I'll sit and wait for the "skeptics" to come in and explain the phenomenon and then we MUST accept their explanation because they say it is so!

394261[/snapback]

Well I've been reading up on this subject for months now and there is very little sceptical debunking on it....the fact is that the voices are there ...where they come from is the only thing at issue.If it was random interference they wouldn't answer specific questios or identify themselves as deceased people ..giving proof of identity would they ?.

On the world itc site there are even photo's of Edison and others sent from the "afterlife" .It's a fascinating site and when you study the credentials and motives of the people carrying out this work it's plain to see it's not any kind of gimmick or money making racket.

I have become obseesed with it i have to say and if it is ever successfuly debunked ...i for one will be the most dissapointed guy on the planet.

It's also significant that even the Vatican does not deny the fact that the voices are real......many many people have spoken to dead relatives using it...i would reccomend for any serious researcher or anyone with a genuine interest in the afterlife to check it out.....as i stated above i cant understand why the mainstream media is not screaming about this...but they give the reasons for this on the site also

[Bogeyman]

Lets not turn this into another skeptics vs believers debate, the subject here is Electronic Voice Phenomena.

I've no doubt that EVP is something that certainly warrants more study. I have noticed though that some of the recordings of 'voices' could be interpreted in other ways, I have heard examples of EVP which only sound like words once i've read what words someone else has decided they are. Once someone tells you a sample of EVP is a voice saying "hello" for example, it's difficult to interpret that sound in any other way.

I tend to wonder whether there is another explanation for the sounds than ghosts and spirits. Could voices in some way be "imprinted" in a location, perhaps later being picked up in this manner on tape ? Could the voices even be radio transmissions that are somehow being picked up ? Are they really voices at all ?

There a lot more questions than answers when it comes to this particular phenomenon.

394296[/snapback]

SRM

Spend an hour on the worlditc.org website and please come back with what you think then.I started off exactly like you and i've asked the hard questions on that site.........Your specific doubts mentioned here can be brushed off in a minute.

For example

Specific questions are answered during the best contacts.

People can easily identify voices of dead friends and family..(even if the recording is taking place thousands of miles from where they died) so no left over residue here.

On the hour of his burial one of the pioneers Friedrich Jurgensen appeared on the tv set of another researcher ....in luxembourg.

there are many free books here i've read most of them and i am convinced of the genuine honesty of all the researchers involved.

Read Sara Esteps book and Friedrich Jurgensens book which are both available freely on the site......see what you think.I couldn't stop reading once i started.

Join the Forum there and two of the worlds top current researchers will answer your questions directly.....it's not pushing any religion or creed by the way.

[Saru]

Ok thanks, i'll check out the site.

[cyberdoll]

Very useful information, I'm so glad you posted it , and now I'm off to the website!

[Bogeyman]

Follow this link to see images from the afterlife......amazing

http://www.worlditc.org/h_08_schreiber.htm

[Bogeyman]

Another excellent link with good information.

http://www.anttci.hpg.ig.com.br/dalenglish.htm

[regmanabq]

they do have some of the best EVP and info available. The recording are amazing.

I too wonder about the lack of press coverage and debunking going on. Could it be skeptics are scared to approach EVP because it is not as simple to disprove as say an orb photo might be? Easy to say someone never saw their aunt's ghost, very different if she records a conversation with her!

I'm also amazed that more serious study is not underway. Seems to me like most EVP researchers are doing it more for fun rather than to prove the cause.

I think EVP has the best chance of being the first proven paranormal phenomenon.

[Shai_Hulud]

I too wonder about the lack of press coverage and debunking going on. Could it be skeptics are scared to approach EVP because it is not as simple to disprove as say an orb photo might be? Easy to say someone never saw their aunt's ghost, very different if she records a conversation with her!

I wouldn't mind taking up the challenge. I would like to say I have not heard of this phenomenon before coming to ths board. I went through the site that was linked and wish to come up to a few points with EVP. Firstly it does not list the frequency where EVP is usually recieved. What kind of radio is used, wether it is am or fm radio, is the radio encrypted and other pertinent information. Secondly I will like to bring attention to the worlds largest radio phenomena research group Seti, they wouldn't call themselves that of course but they by far recieve and process most of the electronic frequencies and signals in the world. If there is an anomalous signal such as EVP they would have detected it.

One of the htings that I don't like about this theory is that you have to be mediumistic or psychic to 'recieve" the voices. Those this tell anyone about the credibility? ANother one is about the scientific spin as given by Dr Augusto Beresawkas’ from University of San Paulo. Now being a Physicist myself and somewhat of a mathematician his explaination of physics is bullshiite. His take on reverse voice is also bull****e, guys what he meant is that you can't take multiple voices and combine them togethere and have them recognisable as seperate voices. Hell yeah you can't do it with standard signal processing but 2 people can speak and be instantly recognised as seperate voices! What he is trying to do is misintepret this information. Frankly the theory stinks.

Edited December 31, 2004 by Shai_Hulud

[Jesus_Freak]

I think the "voices" on the tapes are just demons. They get peoples hopes up, thinking "HOLY CRAP! I just heard my wife/g-ma/g-pa/husband/child/whatever!" Then they go and try to record more, and they get so engulfed in it that they're pretty much searching for demons!

[seeking]

you dont have to be a medium to recieve EVPS, i didnt go through the websites, but i know you dont have to be because ive seen it done by average joes, to say they caught anything is of coarse is up in the air, i believe in EVP's but for the other side of the argument, it is quite possible that SOME not ALL of the recorded evps infact are lingering voices, as you speak a word the waves travel out your mouth and go on untill they disipate, our human ears can only hear so low, perhaps when an evp is caught it is actually someone that has spoken from a distance and there voice has traveled to you disipating on the way and at a level low enough you cant hear it but the recorder can, just an idea

[Shai_Hulud]

The problem is so many conflicting information about this EVP, some says it is just an electronic recording of sound, some of radio frequency or other frequency, some claims you have to be psychic and some claims that you have to enable some ambient noise to attract ghosts!

[regmanabq]

The problem is so many conflicting information about this EVP, some says it is just an electronic recording of sound, some of radio frequency or other frequency, some claims you have to be psychic and some claims that you have to enable some ambient noise to attract ghosts!

434387[/snapback]

That's the problem. So many different theories, but it seems no one is actively debating or looking into it. Most people just ignore EVP and jump to "it's impossible, too many other explanations".

I hope that changes. My Webpage is a place people can exchange info. I hope it helps, even if just a little.

EVP is facinating and something is causing it. We can find out, but it's going to take some work. Heck, 50 years into the study and we still don't have many answers!

[Fluffybunny]

Thanks for posting the itc site, it was good. I find EVP/ITC very interesting, there is definately something there, but I am not sure what. There is a possibility that folks are receiving messages from the dead or photos from the dead; no one really knows what happens after we die so it is as good an idea as any.

I have seen and heard EVP from several websites and while some of it is an "auditory Rorschach test", some of them are quite clear and easy to understand.

For some reason, I have a hard time trusting the worlditc site though. I was reading through the material on the site and just got the feeling that I was dealing with a charletan. I can't put my finger on it, but something just doesn't seem right. When I read the paragraph below my "snake oil salesman" system went on high alert...

From the site:

The luminator is a tower-shaped device about four feet high (1.3 meters), which radically alters the environment in an area that extends about 100 feet (30 meters) in all directions from the device. It has two internal fans which move air over a series of liquid-filled rings. As the air molecules go tumbling through the rings, unusual things happen to them, according to inventor Patrick Richards, including a reverse spin of electrons. (To get the inventor's own perspective on the luminator, its effects, and its use in non-ITC applications, please see www.biolumanetics.net.)

Reverse spin of electrons? okeedokee...so I went to the bioluminetics site to see what he had to say on the subject. I have to say that from the writing on the website I doubt if the person is qualified to be able to know if a electron reversed its' spin or not. How would he know?

Well after reading through both of the websites I have not changed my opinion of EVP/ITC; there is something there that needs more study. It really could be something incredible if it were to be studied by folks that have objectivity and a more scientific background. I do not trust either of the sites though, there is just something not quite right...

[Bogeyman]

Thanks for posting the itc site, it was good. I find EVP/ITC very interesting, there is definately something there, but I am not sure what. There is a possibility that folks are receiving messages from the dead or photos from the dead; no one really knows what happens after we die so it is as good an idea as any.

I have seen and heard EVP from several websites and while some of it is an "auditory Rorschach test", some of them are quite clear and easy to understand.

For some reason, I have a hard time trusting the worlditc site though. I was reading through the material on the site and just got the feeling that I was dealing with a charletan. I can't put my finger on it, but something just doesn't seem right. When I read the paragraph below my "snake oil salesman" system went on high alert...

From the site:

The luminator is a tower-shaped device about four feet high (1.3 meters), which radically alters the environment in an area that extends about 100 feet (30 meters) in all directions from the device. It has two internal fans which move air over a series of liquid-filled rings. As the air molecules go tumbling through the rings, unusual things happen to them, according to inventor Patrick Richards, including a reverse spin of electrons. (To get the inventor's own perspective on the luminator, its effects, and its use in non-ITC applications, please see www.biolumanetics.net.)

Reverse spin of electrons? okeedokee...so I went to the bioluminetics site to see what he had to say on the subject. I have to say that from the writing on the website I doubt if the person is qualified to be able to know if a electron reversed its' spin or not. How would he know?

Well after reading through both of the websites I have not changed my opinion of EVP/ITC; there is something there that needs more study. It really could be something incredible if it were to be studied by folks that have objectivity and a more scientific background. I do not trust either of the sites though, there is just something not quite right...

434580[/snapback]

I dont blame you FB.....One should always be sceptical about things like this.On the plus side i have spoken with MM several times by e-mail and he comes across as a most genuine guy to me ...he does not appear to be in this for the money and only got into EVP/ITC after being diagnosed with cancer some years back.When you raise questions on that site you will be told ....dont take our word for it ...try it yourself....something i admit i havent had the balls to do yet.

Did you read any of the books ?you will find that most of the research has been done by people wanting to get in touch with their own dead relatives and taking it from there.....to me none seem to be in the "snakeoil"business ...nevertheless scepticism is a healthy thing.

[regmanabq]

Thanks for posting the itc site, it was good. I find EVP/ITC very interesting, there is definately something there, but I am not sure what. There is a possibility that folks are receiving messages from the dead or photos from the dead; no one really knows what happens after we die so it is as good an idea as any.

some reason, I have a hard time trusting the worlditc site though. I was reading through the material on the site and just got the feeling that I was dealing with a charletan.

435931[/snapback]

I think it's more their style that makes you think Charlatan. The site does look like some internet scams out there, but mostly due to the design and some of the writing. But I do say that they are great! Lot's of info at the WorldITC and if they are making money, I sure don't know where.

I'm actually impressed with the whole EVP ITC world as far as that goes. No one makes any money off this, even the authors of the books don't make much or use what they do to fund their research and travel expenses. No one is going to get rich doing EVP, even with a hit movie. The World ITC even believes to do so will harm you in the afterlife. All their books are free and even some you can still buy in stores are available online because someone took the time to type them all in! That's dedication when there is no money in it.

I don't think that's the way to run a scam! So I know they are not in in for the money.

IT seems that most of the people studying this are very intelligent and follow scientific procedures whenever possible. Even the hard core believers don't come near to what you might see with the alien folks, psychics or even far right or left religious or political groups;They are all open to other possibilities and explanations and never have I heard " it's this or that and that's the way it is, even if I can't prove it."

They might believe one theory is true (ghosts usually), just like regular scientists believe their theories are correct until proven otherwise, but all actually seem bent on proving it and not just charging money to talk to ghosts no one else can see or hear, like some people I won't mention who have large telephone networks and millions of followers.

I'd love to see someone prove this. I'm willing to help out if I can. I'm tired of people like JesusFreak just spamming every board they can find with the same post saying "it's demons" or others with a personal interest saying "you have to be a medium" (oh, like you, yes...$50, oh I see). OK, I say, prove it either way.

The fact is no one knows for sure where these are coming from or how it's actually done. There are many competing theories as people learn more. Lot's of scientific research has happened in the past, but when mainstream science is unable to prove it impossible right away, they tend to cancel their studies and abandon all research. See my articleDo you hear voices in the white noise? to learn more about what's already been done to prove EVP. It's facinating to learn what has been done and to wonder why more never was.

My advice to everyone would be look at all there is available and make up your own mind. Every theory is exciting and has a chance of being true. I still think EVP has the best chance of anything to actually prove ghosts exist. Something is going on and it doesn't seem to be radio waves causing it. Amazing.

[Bogeyman]

Regmanabg

you have articulated my thoughts exactly on the ITC/EVP phenomenen.

Of all the claims and counter claims out there this to me seems the most genuine.

The net is littered with people who were sceptical of this and tried it themselves only to become more convinced than any.

Havent tried it myself yet but i hope to.

[Shai_Hulud]

Reverse spin of electrons?  okeedokee...so I went to the bioluminetics site to see what he had to say on the subject. I have to say that from the writing on the website I doubt if the person is qualified to be able to know if a electron reversed its' spin or not. How would he know? 

Merely a principle in physics, an electron, a fermion has a half integer spin. However the additional of spin of the electrons in the atom is a whole number. Well you can't tell if the spins of the electrons are reversed since each electron are identical and indistinguisable. If you measured the energy of the atom passing through the "rings" they would come out equal even if you had reverse the spin.

[regmanabq]

Regmanabg

you have articulated my thoughts exactly on the ITC/EVP phenomenen.

Of all the claims and counter claims out there this to me seems the most genuine.

The net is littered with people who were sceptical of this and tried it themselves only to become more convinced than any.

Havent tried it myself yet but i hope to.

437464[/snapback]

Yep. Even the people running the AAEVP, Tom and Lisa Butler didn't believe at first. Now they run the whole show! There is just too many testimonials from skeptics who tried it and were baffled. There is no scam here.