+DieChecker Posted January 14, 2016 #76 Share Posted January 14, 2016 I don't care what happens after death, I'm doing my best to enjoy this crazy ride called life. I think too many focus on after-life and not life. For all we know it's just like falling asleep. Nothing more or less. Who knows, who cares, live everyday as if it's your first and party like it's your last. I feel it's best to be an awesome person in the here and now, worry about death when your dead. Just as a thought exercise... If doing something illegal or immoral would make your life feel more fun, exciting, entertaining... would you do it? Would it depend on how criminal/immoral it was? Otherwise if this life is just a amusement park ride, why not do immoral stuff if you know you will get away with it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DieChecker Posted January 14, 2016 #77 Share Posted January 14, 2016 (edited) Science does, that is exactly it's purpose, to demystify the Universe. Yet, the universe is not 100% demystified, is it? What percentage of the knowledge we can gain about the universe do you think we currently possess? 10% Maybe? 50% Maybe? 95%?? But you do eliminate the possibility of a divine being as being at 0%? Edited January 14, 2016 by DieChecker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rlyeh Posted January 14, 2016 #78 Share Posted January 14, 2016 i will be conscious all the time and feel sorry for those who aren't You've never been unconscious? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Smoke aLot Posted January 14, 2016 #79 Share Posted January 14, 2016 Making fertile land for future generations, that's for sure. Well, if you don't get cremated that is 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
141 Posted January 14, 2016 #80 Share Posted January 14, 2016 (edited) Well you know my views on all this, but you are absolutely right, people have a right to believe, they have a right to "hope", a right to "wish" and a right to = "have that right". I do not feel sorry for you at all, you are not a fundamentalist, you are not a fanatic, you are just a believer in something which people have been wanting to know about for centuries. I respect your beliefs.....as long as they do not turn into preaching and insisting there is life after death, then crack on. I actually like the idea that the question is still being asked, it keeps the debates nicely burning round the fire. i respect what you say but i want to understand correctly and keep in mind my first language is not english . i just dont want to misunderstand ... you said : '' as long as they do not turn into preaching and insisting there is life after death, then crack on '' does that mean that i can not voice my opinion that i believe in an afterlife ? Because that is what the thread was about . And i do believe in an afterlife . i never push my believes on anyone that is why i dont always go to deep into the subject on religion because all it does is turn into very heavy debates a lot . i respect anyone's view and many use very abusive ways to express themselves , yet i never attack anyone . if '' us '' who believe in the afterlife stop talking about it what will be with those that agree that there is no afterlife ? at some point the conversation would die and turn into something like this : i like respectful conversations without name calling or belittling people that is not what a debate should be People will believe what they want ...it's a matter of the heart and mind i will never convince anyone that doesnt believe in life after deat that there is , because that is what they wish to believe . And same for me or those who do believe dont try to convince me that there isn't that would be the same thing as you have mentioned '' PREACHiNG ''... Now let's all '' CRACK ON '' i hope i used that in the right context lol Edited January 14, 2016 by YA AMAR 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ellapenella Posted January 14, 2016 #81 Share Posted January 14, 2016 Now let's all '' CRACK ON '' i hope i used that in the right context lol No. I think people get your point though. It's: get crakin.. I don't talk like that though.Maybe just being silly and playing around like you're using it. get it crakin girl... lol 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
141 Posted January 14, 2016 #82 Share Posted January 14, 2016 Because we have some crazy nuts out there who believe there is an after life and if they blow themselves up and take a load of innocent people with them, they will go to paradise. Cults from all walks have decided they wanted to get to the afterlife earlier.....this is the danger believing can conjure up among some. Those crazy nuts ... i agree ... but i doubt that they believe and behave in the best interest for themselves and others ( according to god ) that they take along with them . They will never go to paradise ! Unless, they consider Hell to be their paradise . They killed others and they killed themselves so i doubt they end up in a decent place . Even if you take all peoples believes away ...there will be no difference . There will always be people who are crazy ...look at James Holmes and so many others that took innocent peoples lives ...was he Muslim ? where all the others Muslim ? No...they were crazy deeply ...deeply crazy .... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ellapenella Posted January 14, 2016 #83 Share Posted January 14, 2016 Can I share of video here about Christ Consciousness? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
141 Posted January 14, 2016 #84 Share Posted January 14, 2016 You've never been unconscious? all the time .... ....all the time ....... *joking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
141 Posted January 14, 2016 #85 Share Posted January 14, 2016 Hi Lovely Lady salute ... Mister Charming How's the pot plant hat going? I told you they would take off........... since i have the green thumb you should see those plants growing out of my head hhhhhhhhhhh my head get so big i need to re- pot pretty soon If you read my reply to Barbco, you can see that what is put forward as this belief catches on - and for the same reasons you embrace it, false promises of something EVEN BETTER. It also enables idiots like the creationists trying to teach in schools that the earth is 6,000 years old. ( i agree ) Really, they ought to be tarred and feathered. It impoverishes our society to have this man made blight attack logic common sense, and gathered data. To me, that is not fair. Religious people get this forced on them from birth, it becomes part of who we are. I feel we have the right to freedom from this tyranny. to some extend i do agree , it should not be forced on anyone from birth, it should be a free will ... I feel we have the right to understand the wonders of this Universe, and I feel we have the right to enjoy them, and pass the knowledge we gather on, in fact, I see that as a duty. I feel we should be allowed to learn in peace, to relish in these wonders, not be threatened to live your life a certain way for the next life. Absolutely .... We have seen the Church oppress this way of life, and discourages following nature instead of man because the Church needs to hide these greater understandings to survive. Again agree to a certain point ... We know God did not make the Universe. We have evidence that no supernatural entity is required to do so. We know God did not make Man, the fossil record is concrete evidence of this. We know God did not say "Let there be light" when the Universe was born, it actually took the Universe about 400,000 years to produce light. As our understanding grows, Gods place and importance diminishes. Many refuse to accept this, but look at how Man re-writes the Bible to suit modern times. This shows me deep down, people do know this to be true. i kindly disagree here ... Just like how we once thought that Zeus threw Lightning Bolts to make Lightning, and Thor hit his mighty hammer to make thunder. People believed this, because well man can throw a spear, and it looked a bit the same shape as a lighting bolt, and you can bang a hammer on a rock, and imagine a really big hammer might make a great thunder sound. As we understood lightning and thunder, those Gods were no longer needed, they were false representations of the real science. This is happening right here and now with the Universe too, and the current Abrahamic Gods who currently tend to dominate the globe. It is our birthright to share the knowledge. It is my responsibility to my community to know they have real and sound information. As mentioned to Barbco, some are easily influenced and will take the easy way out, they might not be the sharpest knives in the drawer, but they still deserve the truth. i have my own views on this of course ... but i never tell people that they are wrong to believe what they wish to believe . So do you my Moroccan friend, you deserve to live life for the here and now, and enjoy it May you please explain enjoyment ? Not hold yourself back for some man made God who does not even exist. If you do not wish to follow that path, then that is your choice, and more power to you, but that is a personal pursuit that you are unable to verify, as such, the verification ought to be left up to the people who follow the evidence and are happy to explain and share that observation. That is why faith must remain personal, it is a choice, not something that actually can be quantified. i fully agree with you as faith is personal it is a choice it should be believed in and practiced my ones own free will . We have a right to discuss it with others but never oppress people with our believes ... regardless of whatever it may be that you believe in ( as long as you dont hurt others ) ! Science, observation and discovery can be, and thusly is. Science is important no doubt but for me there is a way , way beyond science ... Hope that helps with your question. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LV-426 Posted January 14, 2016 #86 Share Posted January 14, 2016 Just as a thought exercise... If doing something illegal or immoral would make your life feel more fun, exciting, entertaining... would you do it? Would it depend on how criminal/immoral it was? Otherwise if this life is just a amusement park ride, why not do immoral stuff if you know you will get away with it? As a free-thinking individual, you have the opportunity to put yourself in someone else's shoes and ask if your actions are detrimental to them, and if so how would you feel if you were on the receiving end. People don't need religion to make them accountable, they just need common sense. It's not like belief in an afterlife has a flawless record for ethical behaviour either... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DingoLingo Posted January 14, 2016 #87 Share Posted January 14, 2016 Why should or could we have a soul or spirit? I know many love the idea, but that is all it is. Reality seems to be rather different. well I believe in a kind of afterlife (not the Christian heaven etc.. ) so tell ya what Psyche.. went we both drop off the mortal perch.. and if there is some kind of afterlife.. lets all meet up at the pub.. or something and if there isn't.. then our atoms may bump into each other one day and go 'hey' 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DingoLingo Posted January 14, 2016 #88 Share Posted January 14, 2016 i respect what you say but i want to understand correctly and keep in mind my first language is not english . i just dont want to misunderstand ... you said : '' as long as they do not turn into preaching and insisting there is life after death, then crack on '' does that mean that i can not voice my opinion that i believe in an afterlife ? Because that is what the thread was about . And i do believe in an afterlife . i never push my believes on anyone that is why i dont always go to deep into the subject on religion because all it does is turn into very heavy debates a lot . i respect anyone's view and many use very abusive ways to express themselves , yet i never attack anyone . if '' us '' who believe in the afterlife stop talking about it what will be with those that agree that there is no afterlife ? at some point the conversation would die and turn into something like this : i like respectful conversations without name calling or belittling people that is not what a debate should be People will believe what they want ...it's a matter of the heart and mind i will never convince anyone that doesnt believe in life after deat that there is , because that is what they wish to believe . And same for me or those who do believe dont try to convince me that there isn't that would be the same thing as you have mentioned '' PREACHiNG ''... Now let's all '' CRACK ON '' i hope i used that in the right context lol You used crack on in the right context We'll teach you proper English.. the aussie way 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
141 Posted January 14, 2016 #89 Share Posted January 14, 2016 (edited) You used crack on in the right context We'll teach you proper English.. the aussie way hhhhhhh i only repeated what freetoroam said .... lol shall anyone see me with a white nose ...i'd blame freetoroam ( joking with ya ftr ) Edited January 14, 2016 by YA AMAR 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freetoroam Posted January 14, 2016 #90 Share Posted January 14, 2016 i respect what you say but i want to understand correctly and keep in mind my first language is not english . i just dont want to misunderstand ... you said : '' as long as they do not turn into preaching and insisting there is life after death, then crack on '' does that mean that i can not voice my opinion that i believe in an afterlife ? Because that is what the thread was about . And i do believe in an afterlife . i never push my believes on anyone that is why i dont always go to deep into the subject on religion because all it does is turn into very heavy debates a lot . i respect anyone's view and many use very abusive ways to express themselves , yet i never attack anyone . if '' us '' who believe in the afterlife stop talking about it what will be with those that agree that there is no afterlife ? at some point the conversation would die and turn into something like this : i like respectful conversations without name calling or belittling people that is not what a debate should be People will believe what they want ...it's a matter of the heart and mind i will never convince anyone that doesnt believe in life after deat that there is , because that is what they wish to believe . And same for me or those who do believe dont try to convince me that there isn't that would be the same thing as you have mentioned '' PREACHiNG ''... Now let's all '' CRACK ON '' i hope i used that in the right context lol Its my South London accent coming out again....it means carry on, alls good. As for the bold, I have never seen you preach and to be quote honest, there have been a couple who have tried to go down that route and the mods (bless their cotton socks) have been right on them. so preaching does not last long on here. I really am interested in others beliefs, not because I actually believe them myself, but because many of the beliefs of today are from or were the same beliefs of yester years....this fascinates me. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DingoLingo Posted January 14, 2016 #91 Share Posted January 14, 2016 It does interest me as well.. where we go after we die.. as a pagan.. it is what is called the summer lands these days.. for a break until its time to do it all again.. I think the most wonderful idea for heaven/hell was done in Robbin Williams 'What dreams may come' that puts a whole new slant on the afterlife.. love that movie.. only movie ever that makes me grab a tissue when watching it.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barbco196 Posted January 14, 2016 #92 Share Posted January 14, 2016 It does interest me as well.. where we go after we die.. as a pagan.. it is what is called the summer lands these days.. for a break until its time to do it all again.. I think the most wonderful idea for heaven/hell was done in Robbin Williams 'What dreams may come' that puts a whole new slant on the afterlife.. love that movie.. only movie ever that makes me grab a tissue when watching it.. For those of us that have never seen the movie, what was the idea? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DingoLingo Posted January 14, 2016 #93 Share Posted January 14, 2016 For those of us that have never seen the movie, what was the idea? ahh if you have not seen it .. it is very worthwhile watching it.. Heaven is your own reality.. it can be yours or shared with others in the afterlife.. Hell is not a place of judgement.. but a nightmare you create from your pain.. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/What_Dreams_May_Come_(film) 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spud the mackem Posted January 14, 2016 #94 Share Posted January 14, 2016 An elderly person once told me that when you die, you're dead and you cease to exist as a person, but ...and its a BIG but, if you wake up again its a bonus, you must realise that all has changed you are no longer a person, and you cannot return, so go forward and see what happens next. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imaginarynumber1 Posted January 14, 2016 #95 Share Posted January 14, 2016 I think the most wonderful idea for heaven/hell was done in Robbin Williams 'What dreams may come' First time I saw that movie I may or may not have been on mushrooms. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psyche101 Posted January 15, 2016 #96 Share Posted January 15, 2016 I'm not sure why you think my faith in knowing about God and an afterlife has anything to do with ego, unless you're strictly referring to 'self'. Although, I don't think you are. I just know. I don't have to prove my faith or disprove your lack there of. You have a choice. As far as religion is concerned, I don't subscribe to it. I believe in God. I believe Jesus is his son and came here to teach us how to treat one another. Science has transcended The Bible?! Examples? Ego because its all about me. If I do the right thing I will get to go to heaven, and the creator of everything listens to me therefore I am very important. Anyone who does not think like I do will burn in hell. That's a false superiority complex right there. Between listening to prayers, checking up on our sex lives and worrying about whose side to take in a war, it seems God already has his hands quite full. The choice you have is whether to believe in the tall tale handed down from your parents, enforced by the Church, or to follow the evidence, which negates any reason for a God to exist and his so called creation. Examples? Of things God did not do? Crate Man, Create The Universe, Let There be light, Energy. All the important stuff that we always were told were created by God. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psyche101 Posted January 15, 2016 #97 Share Posted January 15, 2016 When we die, we go to another dimension, where life is a spiritual progression. Before we die, we retire to Eastbourne. (That's a joke for the Brits) A person's "spirit" is the sum of their life experiences. One might be meek, or one might be aggressive. When you are dead, that's all over. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psyche101 Posted January 15, 2016 #98 Share Posted January 15, 2016 Yet, the universe is not 100% demystified, is it? What percentage of the knowledge we can gain about the universe do you think we currently possess? 10% Maybe? 50% Maybe? 95%?? But you do eliminate the possibility of a divine being as being at 0%? Yes, unless further information comes along to support theism, which current observations and data indicate is not going to happen. Gid is are likely as the Tooth Fairy is. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psyche101 Posted January 15, 2016 #99 Share Posted January 15, 2016 salute ... Mister Charming My pleasure since i have the green thumb you should see those plants growing out of my head hhhhhhhhhhh my head get so big i need to re- pot pretty soon Must be that Moroccan sunshine QUote a green thumb myself, I love gardening, I find it therapeutic. to some extend i do agree , it should not be forced on anyone from birth, it should be a free will ... But you can see this is not the case, babies are forced into relgion before they can speak. Absolutely .... Do you not feel how relgion has always held back science that it is an indicator there is something wrong here? Again agree to a certain point ... Even today, evolution is suppressed by religious groups despite mountains of evidence supporting it. i kindly disagree here ... That Vatican allows Gay people to come to Church, it stated it allows for evolution - with the disclaimer that they still claim it to be an act of God. That is man re-writing God's work, and while it is your pergative to disagree, I can provide as much evidence as is required to prove that God did not make Man, or the Universe (Heavens and the earth) That is religion in a nutshell, if one does not know of the sciences that explain the Universe around us, one may take the easy path and decide that god did it all. That choice is there for individuals to make, but as data and observations refute it, it is our duty to allow others to understand that data and realise that something else happened, this marvellous place is a conglomeration of billions of years of development, not some omnipotent beings wish. i have my own views on this of course ... but i never tell people that they are wrong to believe what they wish to believe . That is the doing of the Church as well. That Belief is valid, observation and data prove otherwise. May you please explain enjoyment ? To be happy in the here and now, and being able to appreciate nature in all it's glory with a sense of fulfillment. The Church robs people of this and sets higher expectations which are all fabrications. i fully agree with you as faith is personal it is a choice it should be believed in and practiced my ones own free will . We have a right to discuss it with others but never oppress people with our believes ... regardless of whatever it may be that you believe in ( as long as you dont hurt others ) ! Oppression is a bad way to handle things, that is why science is the best way to see the real truth. The Church has a long history of oppressing science, mainly because the Church knows science can explain the strange stories the Bible tells that do not fit in with out observations. That is why even though I would like to see relgion gone tomorrow, I would rather see it preserved as historical record, wiping it from our systems would be a mistake and just drive it underground creating even greater misunderstandings. Science is important no doubt but for me there is a way , way beyond science ... That is your choice, not supported data and observations. It is like me telling you 2+2=4 but you wish to believe it is 3, even if I demonstrate with 4 objects. I cannot change that, and will not, but it would be remiss of me to dismiss the fabrications and not correct them. Others want the real answer, and will benefit from the gentle push in the direction of data and observation. Asd you say, each to their own, but that extends to the academic community as well as the religious one. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psyche101 Posted January 15, 2016 #100 Share Posted January 15, 2016 well I believe in a kind of afterlife (not the Christian heaven etc.. ) so tell ya what Psyche.. went we both drop off the mortal perch.. and if there is some kind of afterlife.. lets all meet up at the pub.. or something and if there isn't.. then our atoms may bump into each other one day and go 'hey' Gidday Mate I cannot get onboard with an afterlife. When my Father passed away, I did look into it quite extensively and came away rather disappointed. As always, I have to run with the evidence over an unsupported claim. I reckon out atoms have a much better chance of being THE beer than enjoying one Much as I would love to know what an afterlife beer would be like - heavenly I suspect! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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