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EU referendum: 23 June date set for UK vote


Still Waters

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10 minutes ago, Finity said:

The UK is Fords biggest market in Europe. Moving to Spain after the UK leaves the EU (assuming no free trade) will loose them more than staying.

And that is why all investments are on hold. Nobody knows whether the UK will stay in, will be in pretending to be out (i.e. Norway model) or will be out.

Once that is decided the effects will come... except maybe for Sterling. The hedge funds are getting their artillery in position.

Edited by questionmark
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in related news:

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EU referendum: Reports of hate crime increase 57% following Brexit vote

Reports of hate crime have risen 57 per cent in the aftermath of the EU referendum vote, according to the National Police Chiefs’ Council.

There were 85 reports of hate crimes to True Vision, a police-funded reporting website, between Thursday and Sunday compared with 54 reports over the same period four weeks ago.

Mark Hamilton, Assistant Chief Constable for the National Police Chiefs’ Council Lead for Hate Crime, confirmed it is “monitoring the situation closely”.

Read more on The Independent

 

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53 minutes ago, RabidMongoose said:

People, in or out of the EU we still need food to eat, cars to drive, computers to play games on, mobile phones to call each other and banks to store our money at.

Life will continue on as normal.

 

The UK can at least feed itself, and many electrical goods come from Oriental countries,or non EU countries anyway.....I say as I write on a Fujitsu laptop, with a Sony TV on in the background....

Which is next to my AIWA hifi and Sony DVD player, and my mobile phone is a Samsung

I learned to drive in a Datsun.......and when I bought my first boat the engine was a Honda,,,

 

 

 

Edited by seeder
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Soros Wagered Deutsche Bank Would Drop in Brexit Turmoil

June 28, 2016 — 2:51 PM HKT Updated on June 28, 2016 — 4:32 PM HKT

Soros Fund Management took a short position in Deutsche Bank AG of about 7 million shares as turmoil from the U.K.’s decision to leave the European Union sent bank stocks lower.

The position taken on Friday was equivalent to 0.51 percent of Deutsche Bank’s share capital, according to a German filing published on Monday. The document doesn’t show at which price the fund took the position.

 

 

 

Little Soros knows his bets he does ...

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2 minutes ago, third_eye said:

 

 

 

Little Soros knows his bets he does ...

Well, you win some, you loose something. He was (to my delight) long on Pounds. He was wrong about the referendum outcome.

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Just now, questionmark said:

Well, you win some, you loose something. He was (to my delight) long on Pounds. He was wrong about the referendum outcome.

Win Win ;) In other words ...

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Just heard on BBC news......OVER A million UK PEOPLE (incl migrants already here).... ARE ALREADY WAITING TO BE HOUSED .... in council homes or social housing...

And the EU would have us take MORE? We cant evn house all those on the lists already....a MINIMUM of a year waiting list for housing...

 

 

.

 

Edited by seeder
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1 hour ago, Thorvir Hrothgaard said:

Well, I guess that's the stupidest thing you've ever claimed and posted.  So, what's your next trick?  But, why even bother posting anything else, I doubt you could top this.

Don't count anything out. hellwyr hasn't compared a Brexit vote to Nazism yet, though I suspect on evidence in previous threads, it's only a matter of time...

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1 hour ago, seeder said:

The UK can at least feed itself, and many electrical goods come from Oriental countries,or non EU countries anyway.....I say as I write on a Fujitsu laptop, with a Sony TV on in the background....

Which is next to my AIWA hifi and Sony DVD player, and my mobile phone is a Samsung

I learned to drive in a Datsun.......and when I bought my first boat the engine was a Honda,,,

Its actually the food which is the only thing we cannot produce enough of ourselves.

We lack enough farmland for ordinary crop growing and our country refuses to use GM seeds.

Edited by RabidMongoose
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53 minutes ago, RabidMongoose said:

Its actually the food which is the only thing we cannot produce enough of ourselves.

We lack enough farmland for ordinary crop growing and our country refuses to use GM seeds.

Well, not at the moment, but some calculations were done that showed that if we all became vegetarian  (after a big feast to rid the land of all those pesky cows and sheep!) the country does have enough agricultural land to feed the whole population. From what I recall those calculations were done while ago, for a slightly lower population, but there was plenty of leftovers. I seem to recall that the diet would get a bit more monotonous though.   And we would still be able to have bacon butties occasionally, and there would be plenty of beer.   So not ideal...but I think I could put up with it if we needed to.

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4 hours ago, seeder said:

 

We have ENTIRE towns that are Indian/Asian/Pakistani.....black/ afro Caribbean, and an entire borough in London that is ONLY Jewish and thats even growing larger by the year.

.

No we don't. Even London and Birmingham barely scrape a 50/50 split between native British and all the other ethnicities combined.

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9 hours ago, Leto_loves_melange said:

Never fear the Americans are here. 

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jun/29/john-kerry-brexit-could-be-walked-back-david-cameron

it seems that Cameron is enlisting the good ol US of A to undo the mess that is Brexit. The U.K. just might get outta this...

Fingers crossed.

How is that the US coming to the rescue?  All Kerry did was point out exactly what Ive been saying for the last few days ! He's probably been reading my posts. Nobody campaigning to leave had a plan, and nobody has stepped forward to invoke article 50 or even voiced an intention of doing so if they get the chance- the referendum isn't binding.  All the Uk has to do to not leave the EU is nothing at all...

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2 minutes ago, Torchwood said:

No we don't. Even London and Birmingham barely scrape a 50/50 split between native British and all the other ethnicities combined.

 

If youre of foreign descent and are born here you can say youre English/British and be COUNTED as such

Ever been Leicester? Luton? Golders Green?  New Cross, Lewisham, Peckham?


 

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London is one of the most ethnically diverse cities on Earth. In 2007 there were over 300 languages spoken in it and more than 50 non-indigenous communities with a population of more than 10,000

At the 2011 census London had a population of 8,173,941. Of this number, 44.9% were White British  (seeder: 44.9% is LESS than half). 37% of the population were born outside the UK, including 24.5% born outside of Europe.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_groups_in_London

 


 

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Lists of UK locations with large ethnic minority populations
This article lists United Kingdom locations with large and/or significant ethnic minority communities, as defined by official ethnicity statistics. The overwhelming majority of ethnic minority individuals in the UK reside in the larger cities, most specifically London and Birmingham. The British capital is home to 50 non-indigenous communities which have a population of more than 10,000 (therefore laying claim to being the most diverse city in the world).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lists_of_UK_locations_with_large_ethnic_minority_populations

 

 

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PROOF of what Im saying? Do watch as the white English girl goes to HER HOME TOWN.....Luton....and just see/hear the crap going on....pls watch! If only 15 mins.

If you DONT watch, dont ever criticise me again

 

 

 

 

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Nearly a week since the Remainers lost the Referendum, and their still prophesying doom and gloom. not just the economy falling apart which hasn't materialised, So they are moving from one story to the next, from one extreme to the other trying to paint a bleak picture. - shame.

They forecast the UK markets would implode on day one, truth is they have performed better than the European markets. Sterling is no worse than this time last year and nowhere near the 2009 level, the FTSE actually closed today higher than before the Referendum. £1 to Dollar $1.36 see what's in our favour is the 2008 credit crisis, Its still fresh in the mind, - We as a nation have seen how fickle the markets are, basing their forecasts on a whim and just how expert the experts where. - A lot of companies heeded the expert advice stopped investment moved money, and lost money in the process, and all because of the fear spread by the "experts", But having lived through it and coming out on the other side they now have the personal knowledge, the greater understanding of how their individual companies can weather financial storms. what works and what doesn't.Any company worth their salt will seize the opportunity. 

It was good to hear on the News channel France 24, ( On Scotland/Nicola Sturgeon) French president Francois Hollande insisting exit talks will only be held with the UK Government. He said: "The negotiations will be conducted with the UK, not with a part of the UK.” Hot on Hollande's heels and next to give comment was the The Spanish Prime Minister the Spanish PM said, "I want to be very clear Scotland does not have the competence to negotiate with the European Union, I have to make it very clear Spain opposes any negotiation by anyone other than the government of United Kingdom.”  "I am extremely against it, the treaties are extremely against it and everyone is extremely against it. If the United Kingdom leaves... Scotland leaves.” 

Article 50, so far so good the markets are responding well, stable, proving holding off triggering Article 50 is the correct decision. like it always was, the instant triggering would've had the markets scrambling, Now we have a rough time scale, it quells fears for markets, investors etc, they can plan in a carefully and measured way, a hell of a lot lost money in the credit crisis many don't have much left to lose or don't want to be to hasty with what they have generated in the last few years.

exchange rate. at a level about where it should, even dropping lower would help balance our economy. help exports and generate growth.

£1.00 - $1.34 USD..

£1.00 - $1.49 AUD.

£1.00 - $1.44 CAD.

£1.00 - $1.88 NZD.

£1.00 - €1.20 EUR.

Its worth Remembering the Official forecast was for Growth in the UK economy regardless of in or out from 2015 to 2030

Britain Remains. +41% growth.

Free Trade Agreement Scenario. +39%

World Trade Organisation Scenario +36% 

In Monetary terms from 41% to 36%. £4.2Billion. in perspective if our contributions today were to remain the same our EU membership contribution to the EU would be £150Billion. (NET) £270Billion (Gross) over the same 15 year period.

 

 

 

 

 

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9 hours ago, RabidMongoose said:

Following the leave vote the delusional reasoning by some politicians has started to explain away what caused it.

Cameron was almost spot on yesterday in the EU Parliament when he told them it was the British rejecting immigration and the free movement of people. Those were major causes but the leave vote was also down to the suppressed nationalism of the English and Welsh peoples bubbling to the surface. Why should we give our countries up? I reject in its entirety the assertions left politicians make where if you don't give up your nation, or accept mass immigration, or accept the free movement of people, then you're somehow an extremist. We want our independence and border controls back.

Now those same politicians are trying to re-interrupt why the majority of people voted leave allowing them to reach the delusional conclusion we somehow didn't mean it. Good luck with that!

The U.K. had every right to vote in the way they did, RabidMongoose. That's a sign of a perfectly healthy democracy. Unfortunately it wasn't a clear mandate to make such a unilateral move as leaving the EU in my opinion. Nor do I think that the referendum was conducted clearly and an informative manner...and the amount of regret among leave voters after the result is proof enough. 

The UK voted to leave but everyone is stumped as to how to do it and where to start and that's why those same politicians are starting to see the referendum for what it really is, a mistake that needs to be rectified. 

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1 hour ago, Torchwood said:

How is that the US coming to the rescue?  All Kerry did was point out exactly what Ive been saying for the last few days ! He's probably been reading my posts. Nobody campaigning to leave had a plan, and nobody has stepped forward to invoke article 50 or even voiced an intention of doing so if they get the chance- the referendum isn't binding.  All the Uk has to do to not leave the EU is nothing at all...

Hi Torchwood, yes I can imagine the U.S. state department and the EU hanging off our every posts trying to work out what went wrong what to do next. :)

...and I agree with you that cool heads must prevail and time is needed to corner Merkel and Hollande into allowing the UK an opportunity to fix the mess that those opportunistic idiots Boris and Nigel created.

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2 hours ago, stevewinn said:

They forecast the UK markets would implode on day one, truth is they have performed better than the European markets. Sterling is no worse than this time last year and nowhere near the 2009 level, the FTSE actually closed today higher than before the Referendum.

Its worth Remembering the Official forecast was for Growth in the UK economy regardless of in or out from 2015 to 2030

Britain Remains. +41% growth.

Free Trade Agreement Scenario. +39%

World Trade Organisation Scenario +36% 

In Monetary terms from 41% to 36%. £4.2Billion. in perspective if our contributions today were to remain the same our EU membership contribution to the EU would be £150Billion. (NET) £270Billion (Gross) over the same 15 year period.

 

 

 

 

 

It's worth noting that, although the FTSE 100 has recovered somewhat, the FTSE 250 (apparently a better indicator of the UK economy) is still well down.

I'm curious where your £4.2 billion figure comes from. The difference between the remain and WTO scenarios is 5%. The UK economy is currently ~£3 trillion. 5% of that is £150 billion. The amount sent to the EU (assuming no major change) would be a little under £130 billion (net). I must admit, I expected the amount to be bigger but it does seem WTO is more of a loss than remaining. It's late so I could be way off though.

If we can arrange a free trade agreement without paying into the EU, we come up £90 billion better off. Then again, if they agree to that, I can always move to Mars on my flying pig...

 

 

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I saw a graph of declining UK real wages in recent years that probably has as much explanatory value as anything else, in accounting for the referendum result.

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1 hour ago, Leto_loves_melange said:

The U.K. had every right to vote in the way they did, RabidMongoose. That's a sign of a perfectly healthy democracy. Unfortunately it wasn't a clear mandate to make such a unilateral move as leaving the EU in my opinion. Nor do I think that the referendum was conducted clearly and an informative manner...and the amount of regret among leave voters after the result is proof enough. 

The UK voted to leave but everyone is stumped as to how to do it and where to start and that's why those same politicians are starting to see the referendum for what it really is, a mistake that needs to be rectified. 

That regret you speak of is a huge part of the problem.  Do you think it represents regret due any instantaneous losses or hardships?  Of course not.  The regret stems from the huge guilt trip the remainers have laid on the consience of those who voted Brexit.  Catylysed by a national media run from London and in receipt of massive EU subsidies.

while the political institutions have crumbled on all sides, exposing the massive need for reform, this has simply brought to light what we all knew deep down anyway, that we haven't had strong leadership since thatcher, regardless of what you thought of her.

the biggest hurdle and cause for uncertainty lies in two simple facts, that this has not been done before.  And that EU leadership, despite being aware of the impending refurendum since Cameron first promised it as part of his election campaign, in their complete and total arrogance never even thought to themselves, what if they vote out?

you say that the UK had every right to vote the way they did.  Well it's about time people started respecting that vote and the people who made an intelligent and calculated decision.

i keep hearing that this was a true example of democracy.  It is becoming plainly clear that those that continue to belittle and label Brexit voters wouldn't know democracy if it was debated and voted to hit them in the face with it.

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42 minutes ago, Grey Area said:

That regret you speak of is a huge part of the problem.  Do you think it represents regret due any instantaneous losses or hardships?  Of course not.  The regret stems from the huge guilt trip the remainers have laid on the consience of those who voted Brexit.  Catylysed by a national media run from London and in receipt of massive EU subsidies.

while the political institutions have crumbled on all sides, exposing the massive need for reform, this has simply brought to light what we all knew deep down anyway, that we haven't had strong leadership since thatcher, regardless of what you thought of her.

the biggest hurdle and cause for uncertainty lies in two simple facts, that this has not been done before.  And that EU leadership, despite being aware of the impending refurendum since Cameron first promised it as part of his election campaign, in their complete and total arrogance never even thought to themselves, what if they vote out?

you say that the UK had every right to vote the way they did.  Well it's about time people started respecting that vote and the people who made an intelligent and calculated decision.

i keep hearing that this was a true example of democracy.  It is becoming plainly clear that those that continue to belittle and label Brexit voters wouldn't know democracy if it was debated and voted to hit them in the face with it.

No I don't believe that there was a loss of some sort that led to a substantial regrexit, rather a realisation that poor leadership was to blame...and I'm looking directly at Cameron, Corbyn, Boris and Nigel for not allowing the Brexit debate to discuss the facts and difficulty in leaving the EU economic and political union. 

There is no guilt trip responsible for this rather the exposing of the lies and misdirection that the leave campaign used. It was all about immigration. No one complained about trade or Britains right to have their citizens travel freely in Europe. No one complained about London being the financial capital of Europe or the massive amount of trade between Britain and its EU partners. It was a selfish and greedy argument that won the day. The real question in the referendum should have been are you prepared to sacrifice all the positives in the EU to stop immigration. 

Leaving the EU was never going to be easy yet hearing the leave advocates say it you would think it was. Example...why hasn't Boris and Nigel called for the referendum to be respected and article 50 triggered yet? That would be democratic right?Why won't Cameron? Answer, it will ruin their political careers or maybe what's left of them. It can't be done without irreversible harm to the British economy.

Even though the referendum was democratic the result was a product influenced by the political ambitions of a few selfish manipulators. Comparing the Brexit result to democracy is like saying that Trump is the best thing for the U.S. and the world cause he's tough on immigration and popular. Or that Putin is a Statesman cause the Russian's can't elect anyone better. 

 

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19 hours ago, Leto_loves_melange said:

Never fear the Americans are here. 

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jun/29/john-kerry-brexit-could-be-walked-back-david-cameron

it seems that Cameron is enlisting the good ol US of A to undo the mess that is Brexit. The U.K. just might get outta this...

Fingers crossed.

You really would be happy to see democracy subverted by the Good 'Ol' US of A (or anyone else), just because, for whatever reason, you seem utterly obsessed with tirelessly pointing out to everyone at every single opportunity you get that you don't think this should have been the result? You'd be quite happy to see some discredited American politician over-rule democracy in a country he's got nothing to do with? Come to that, why are you so eager to see democracy over-ruled in a country that's not yours? 

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The U.K. had every right to vote in the way they did, RabidMongoose. That's a sign of a perfectly healthy democracy. Unfortunately it wasn't a clear mandate to make such a unilateral move as leaving the EU in my opinion. Nor do I think that the referendum was conducted clearly and an informative manner...and the amount of regret among leave voters after the result is proof enough. 

the "regret" was from Millennials and the Twitterati, the great majority of them in London, who were sour and bitter than their little liberal metropolitan bubble was no longer able to impose its will on the rest of the country. That's what the regret was about. Do you think that the Twitterati should be allowed to over-rule democracy? 

Edited by Otto von Pickelhaube
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5 hours ago, Leto_loves_melange said:

No I don't believe that there was a loss of some sort that led to a substantial regrexit,  

 

And please stop ****in' saying Regrexit. I expect you aren't bothered how smug, clever and self-satisfied it is, but it is to everyone else, believe me.

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