Jump to content
Join the Unexplained Mysteries community today! It's free and setting up an account only takes a moment.
- Sign In or Create Account -
Thanato

When was America Great?

327 posts in this topic

Recommended Posts

pbarosso
1 minute ago, Thanato said:

The Vast majority of the Population of the United States sits between two crazy sides (the Far Right and the Far Left). For every example of crazyness and violence you show of the far left, an equally repulsive example can be found on the far right.

Explain how to raise a family 'right'? and how to raise a family 'wrong'?

with morality. christianity....and im no evangelical. im catholic. there is a wrong way and a right way.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
pallidin

So, Trump, NEVER, EVER, admits anything wrong with what he says.

When confronted, he either "spins-it" or claims "sarcasm"

I wasn't born yesterday, but Trump seriously seems to have been.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cookie Monster
7 hours ago, Thanato said:

Trumps slogan... To make America Great Again? When was it greater then it is right now? In terms of equality, never. In terms of human rights, never. In terms of economic strength, never. In terms of Military strength, never.

 

yes there are problems with your nation, but those problems will not be decided through violent divisiveness.

can anyone explain to me how Trump is even an attractive political leader?

The 50s although thats because you had loads of British gold to spend.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
pbarosso
Just now, Thanato said:

Both sides use emotion. From what I have seen that is Trumps Entire platform is using emotion. The emotion of fear.

fear. really. you must not know what fear is. the democrats are the kings of fear....."those republicans want to take away a womans rights, make women slaves again, take away your social security, ban religions, hate minorities, etc ad nauseum)

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
pbarosso
2 minutes ago, pallidin said:

So, Trump, NEVER, EVER, admits anything wrong with what he says.

When confronted, he either "spins-it" or claims "sarcasm"

I wasn't born yesterday, but Trump seriously seems to have been.

wait you said "spins it?" have you heard wasserman talk? or allen colmbs? or any democrat?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
pallidin
1 minute ago, pbarosso said:

fear. really. you must not know what fear is. the democrats are the kings of fear....."those republicans want to take away a womans rights, make women slaves again, take away your social security, ban religions, hate minorities, etc ad nauseum)

What? Trumps platform is entirely based on "Fear, and I can fix it"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
pbarosso

see you just avoided the comment i made. just like a democrat

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Michelle
11 minutes ago, Thanato said:

You should probably use a fictional example that best suits the targetted audiance (Left Liberals). The example you gave would be better suited towards hypercapitolist right side conservatives who believe in the dollar above all else. But hey that is just me.

What about us kids who kept our grades up and wanted to work? I remember it well. You call it slave labor or exploitation, we call it opportunity and initiative. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Thanato
Just now, pbarosso said:

with morality. christianity....and im no evangelical. im catholic. there is a wrong way and a right way.

Am I raising my family wrong by raising my kids, ethiclly, morally, with good maners and no religious input what so ever?

 

Just now, pbarosso said:

fear. really. you must not know what fear is. the democrats are the kings of fear....."those republicans want to take away a womans rights, make women slaves again, take away your social security, ban religions, hate minorities, etc ad nauseum)

I know what fear is, not knowing if you are going to coem home to see your family. Driving down what seemed to be endless roads which could errupt in a fireball beneath you at any moment. That is fear. 

Trump is using a classical 'boogyman' approach to politics. X is the reason for Y and X will do Y if we dont impliment Z... ect. 

Trump will be the worst thing to happen to American Politics since America was founded. Is hillary any better? no she should be in prison for storing Classified Information on an Unclassified server. However given every account we have of Mr. Trump from people who have worked for and with him... well frankly I am terrified about what that man will do when faced with an International Crisis, high level diplomocy, or just the general never ending mocking of the press. He is not someone I want in charge of the most powerful arsenal on the planet. Given the two choices that you have, because both those parties will do there best to keep any third or fourth party out of any presidential debates... really this is choosing which death you want. A slow slide down a pike... or to cut bit by bit until you bleed to death or die of infection.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
pallidin
1 minute ago, pbarosso said:

see you just avoided the comment i made. just like a democrat

 

I'm completely non-partisan, and have actually VOTED in many elections.

I just care about who is more mature. Trump? Uh, definitely not. He is a child.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
simplybill
11 minutes ago, Thanato said:



Trump has shown time and time again in his past that he is willing to hire people and then screw them out of their hard earned money. He is great at making money, but is a terrible businessman. 

Did you mean 'immoral' businessman? 

I think you'd have a hard time convincing people that he's a terrible businessman. If the earlier link is accurate (and if I'm reading it right) he is named as CEO of 515 businesses. Only four of his businesses have ever gone into bankruptcy (or 6, depending on who you believe). That's a really good track record. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
pbarosso
13 minutes ago, Thanato said:
4 minutes ago, pallidin said:

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Thanato
3 minutes ago, simplybill said:

Did you mean 'immoral' businessman? 

I think you'd have a hard time convincing people that he's a terrible businessman. If the earlier link is accurate (and if I'm reading it right) he is named as CEO of 515 businesses. Only four of his businesses have ever gone into bankruptcy (or 6, depending on who you believe). That's a really good track record. 

I guess yours would be a more accuarte statement. He strong arms himself into better positions after he has agreed to pay people far more then he actually ends up paying them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
pbarosso

above: i have no idea how to delete that crap. when quoting..

6 minutes ago, Thanato said:

Am I raising my family wrong by raising my kids, ethiclly, morally, with good maners and no religious input what so ever?

 

I know what fear is, not knowing if you are going to coem home to see your family. Driving down what seemed to be endless roads which could errupt in a fireball beneath you at any moment. That is fear. 

Trump is using a classical 'boogyman' approach to politics. X is the reason for Y and X will do Y if we dont impliment Z... ect. 

Trump will be the worst thing to happen to American Politics since America was founded. Is hillary any better? no she should be in prison for storing Classified Information on an Unclassified server. However given every account we have of Mr. Trump from people who have worked for and with him... well frankly I am terrified about what that man will do when faced with an International Crisis, high level diplomocy, or just the general never ending mocking of the press. He is not someone I want in charge of the most powerful arsenal on the planet. Given the two choices that you have, because both those parties will do there best to keep any third or fourth party out of any presidential debates... really this is choosing which death you want. A slow slide down a pike... or to cut bit by bit until you bleed to death or die of infection.

no third party stands a chance in a presidential election without first having many seats in the house and senate......or both houses would make the president a lame duck.

 boogyman? and hillary does not?

trump will be the worst thing for politics; politics as we know it, corrupt as hell.....clinton foundation anyone? 

we need america to have balls. that is what the world is looking for. it is that simple. we are nothing more than animals living in a universe that revolves around the idea that might makes right. call me crazy but i think we need a marcus sulla for the USA.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
pbarosso
3 minutes ago, Thanato said:

I guess yours would be a more accuarte statement. He strong arms himself into better positions after he has agreed to pay people far more then he actually ends up paying them.

as he said he knows how the system works.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Thanato
Just now, pbarosso said:

above: i have no idea how to delete that crap. when quoting..

no third party stands a chance in a presidential election without first having many seats in the house and senate......or both houses would make the president a lame duck.

 boogyman? and hillary does not?

trump will be the worst thing for politics; politics as we know it, corrupt as hell.....clinton foundation anyone? 

we need america to have balls. that is what the world is looking for. it is that simple. we are nothing more than animals living in a universe that revolves around the idea that might makes right. call me crazy but i think we need a marcus sulla for the USA.

What type of balls should the United States have?

I never said she isn't (missed the part I said that she belongs in prison?)

Trump is an unknown eliment in the political system, that is true. The problem is he is doesnt know what he is doing... at all.

 

1 minute ago, pbarosso said:

as he said he knows how the system works.

So if you sign an agreement that states you will be paid $50 for your work and then he threatens you and you end up getting $5? That's ok?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
pbarosso
3 minutes ago, Thanato said:

What type of balls should the United States have?

I never said she isn't (missed the part I said that she belongs in prison?)

Trump is an unknown eliment in the political system, that is true. The problem is he is doesnt know what he is doing... at all.

 

So if you sign an agreement that states you will be paid $50 for your work and then he threatens you and you end up getting $5? That's ok?

if its legal then yes. its like the housing bust. no one forced stupid people to sign mortgage papers they couldnt afford. they were just stupid. and you cant force people to be smart or legislate it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
rashore
1 hour ago, Jarocal said:

So what policy ideas would you like to see implemented to upgrade our infrastructure issues and return a robust industry sector to the economy?

Gosh, that could mean a lot of things...

What am I doing? Getting involved with my community. Investing time with programs that help my local waterways. Running for office as a trustee to help implement and administer a sound parks plan (wish me luck on August 2nd, next Tuesday). The parks system is also linked to the roads and zoning commissions. This in turn with implementation and hopefully my careful administration will boost the local economy by making the area more desirable and properly zoned for businesses that are interested in moving into the area.

And always voting. An amazing amount of monies for things like roads, schools, waterways, parks, historical societies and libraries, streetlights, and so on are actually decided on with millage voting. Or are otherwise decided on with town hall action, and yes, I'm involved with that too.

However, I live in an area that is heavy on seasonal tourists, agriculture, and small sector industry with a few major players in the area, so my local action is customized to that. And for sure not everywhere is like that, so what I do locally can have positive impact, but probably would be moot in some other areas.

 

What would I like to see on county and state levels? That gets way more expansive. And since I realize how much implementation relies on local participation.. It's a bit of a quandary. Even if a president waved their magic want and say fix the roads, or build industry.. there is a hell of a lot more than that to get even a small community to get on that, let alone a city, or state, let alone a whole country. It's a huge entanglement. And significant consequences when a pres waves the wand.

 

But I guess a really fundamental thing if I could wave my magic wand would be.. everybody votes, every time. Yes, I know we can't force people to vote, and yes, it would be morally wrong to do so. But hey, magic wand. Get everyone to vote every time for everything that comes up... make people aware of and appreciate what a huge process everything is, and how much control they actually have over it. If they chose to get off their butts and be interested more than once every couple or four years. Get folks to use and defend their 15th, 19th, 23rd, 24th, and 26th amendment rights just as rabidly and carelessly do their 1st and 2nd amendment rights.
People get all riled up about President every 4 years... but then utterly ignore all the rest of the voting and participation system in place, and leave it to the 10-20% who actually care to show up to implement it. Till some wise advertiser for president X comes up with a catchphrase to stir everyone up and remind them to gripe about how sucktacular things are, and if only they voted for President right.. all will be fixed.

 

And back round to the OP.. Something America has had great this whole time is the system to use, and how stridently we have fought for it for everyone to use. Something great is how we passed FIVE amendments to support that. Something sucktacular is the utter derth of use of that system, coupled with a overflowing bucket of p***ing, moaning, and griping about how the results of not using the system as it was constructed results in breakdowns.


 

 

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Tatetopa
5 hours ago, simplybill said:

As a 35-year Union member, I'm hoping 'Mr. Trump the Businessman' will concentrate on returning manufacturing jobs to America. It will take an enormous amount of negotiating to draw Unions and Management back into a successful balance, but I believe Mr. Trump might have enough business savvy to do so.  

Yes, I know he's moved his garment manufacturing overseas, but that wouldn't necessarily be a permanent situation if labor relations and tax reform issues can be ironed out here.

I personally would be happier if the past 8 years had been under a Romney administration. As an American worker, I prefer a knowledgeable businessperson over a social reformer. True equality flourishes more in the workplace than in academics and community organizations.

Then how about a real knowledgeable business person like Bill Gates or Warren Buffett to name two. Neither one of them started with a parent's fortune.  Neither has bankrupted once, let alone several times and left creditors and employees in the lurch.  Or how about somebody like Henry Rowan?   He was the engineer who started Inductotherm, a commercial furnace builder for the metals industry.   You probably haven't heard of him, he did not seek a lot of publicity.  He started a company in his garage and built it into a multinational, multi-billion dollar company that actually makes things.  Being an engineer myself I am prejudiced toward products that are useful.  A casting furnace or a computer or even software are useful items that increase the value of our society and provide not only a lot of jobs, but increase our technology.  Flipping real estate and starting casinos make some jobs but doesn't create lasting value.  America was not great nor ever will be again based on jobs in real estate, casinos, and fast food restaurants.  It was manufacturing that made us a powerhouse of the world economy.

 I've worked with several unions in the last 40 years.  I've seen both contention and cooperation.  It is reminiscent of the armed forces in the sense that there are enlisted men and officers.  Salaried people and hourly people always were divided at every plant I have worked at in the defense industry, and commercial manufacturing.  I didn't think of it as being very equal.  More to your point, the two things you mentioned; labor relations and tax reform seem like pretty big roadblocks.   Would you be willing to work for $3 per hour and no benefits?  Would you keep your mouth shut about work place hazards?  Would you turn a blind eye as your company dumped hazardous waste into a river or landfill, or smoked it up the stack?  That is what the workers do in Pakistan, Indonesia, China, and India are forced to do to keep the Nikes and Adidas coming out.   Tax reform?  Should we eliminate taxes and environmental regulations  for business?  Then who will have the total burden for the electrical grid, roads, bridges, and ports?

No leader can legislate competitiveness. The future is a lot more complicated than the hot air and platitudes coming from both sides would lead us to believe.  I say both sides. because neither seems to have a firm grip on reality.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Thanato
22 minutes ago, pbarosso said:

if its legal then yes. its like the housing bust. no one forced stupid people to sign mortgage papers they couldnt afford. they were just stupid. and you cant force people to be smart or legislate it.

So you sign a contract that states if you do X you will get $50. Upon completing X the person who commissioned it said that he couldnt pay you $50 but could give you $25. So you reluctantly agree... a little while later their assistant comes up and says here is the $10 promised. You then go to the person who commissioned it and they offer you $5. They then threaten that if you take them to court it will cost you $100 to get the $50 so the $5 is just enough. Is that the kind of person you want leading the United States of America?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
simplybill

Tatetopa- I would be ecstatic if Henry Rowan was running for president. Just the fact that he's not interested in self-promotion is an indication of good character. 

You have to understand, this will be a gut-wrenching decision for me. I'm terrified of what could happen if Mr. Trump is our next president, but I may sink into utter despair for our country's future if Ms. Clinton is elected. I'm not just being hyperbolic; I really am concerned that we're on the brink of disaster. 

I believe we missed the boat by not electing Mitt Romney, and then again with Carly Fiorina. We desperately need someone with business sense to get us out of this financial quagmire we're in. If we continue passing up talented people, we'll go bankrupt. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Jarocal
1 hour ago, rashore said:

Gosh, that could mean a lot of things...

What am I doing? Getting involved with my community. Investing time with programs that help my local waterways. Running for office as a trustee to help implement and administer a sound parks plan (wish me luck on August 2nd, next Tuesday). The parks system is also linked to the roads and zoning commissions. This in turn with implementation and hopefully my careful administration will boost the local economy by making the area more desirable and properly zoned for businesses that are interested in moving into the area.

And always voting. An amazing amount of monies for things like roads, schools, waterways, parks, historical societies and libraries, streetlights, and so on are actually decided on with millage voting. Or are otherwise decided on with town hall action, and yes, I'm involved with that too.

However, I live in an area that is heavy on seasonal tourists, agriculture, and small sector industry with a few major players in the area, so my local action is customized to that. And for sure not everywhere is like that, so what I do locally can have positive impact, but probably would be moot in some other areas.

 

What would I like to see on county and state levels? That gets way more expansive. And since I realize how much implementation relies on local participation.. It's a bit of a quandary. Even if a president waved their magic want and say fix the roads, or build industry.. there is a hell of a lot more than that to get even a small community to get on that, let alone a city, or state, let alone a whole country. It's a huge entanglement. And significant consequences when a pres waves the wand.

 

But I guess a really fundamental thing if I could wave my magic wand would be.. everybody votes, every time. Yes, I know we can't force people to vote, and yes, it would be morally wrong to do so. But hey, magic wand. Get everyone to vote every time for everything that comes up... make people aware of and appreciate what a huge process everything is, and how much control they actually have over it. If they chose to get off their butts and be interested more than once every couple or four years. Get folks to use and defend their 15th, 19th, 23rd, 24th, and 26th amendment rights just as rabidly and carelessly do their 1st and 2nd amendment rights.
People get all riled up about President every 4 years... but then utterly ignore all the rest of the voting and participation system in place, and leave it to the 10-20% who actually care to show up to implement it. Till some wise advertiser for president X comes up with a catchphrase to stir everyone up and remind them to gripe about how sucktacular things are, and if only they voted for President right.. all will be fixed.

 

And back round to the OP.. Something America has had great this whole time is the system to use, and how stridently we have fought for it for everyone to use. Something great is how we passed FIVE amendments to support that. Something sucktacular is the utter derth of use of that system, coupled with a overflowing bucket of p***ing, moaning, and griping about how the results of not using the system as it was constructed results in breakdowns.


 

 

 

Community level action is where I firmly believe the necessary changes will need to occur. For me that means a Federal policy of less interference and returning more policy decisions back onto the State and municipal level where solutions can be better tailored to suit specific needs. And I agree citizens need to become more involved. Municipal meetings are generally devoid of participation from its citizenry unless some issue that causes a local uproar occurs. If more people spent time attending those meetings and voicing their concerns on a regular basis I believe less issues would crop up in the long run.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Paranormal Panther
6 hours ago, Thanato said:

Ok. Thank you for your opinion. But I consider my self in the Center (but I guess a Hard Core Canadian Conservative would still be an American Democrate). But there is violence from both Sides of the political spectrum in the United States. 

It's a shame about Canadians. In any event, the Left is much more violent than the "Right", although you wouldn't know that from anti-conservative propaganda in the guise of fair journalism.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Likely Guy
6 hours ago, pbarosso said:

with morality. christianity....and im no evangelical. im catholic. there is a wrong way and a right way.

So it's "my way or the highway"?

Your sense of self righteousness needs some addressing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Paranormal Panther
11 hours ago, supervike said:

I dunno....Maybe we were great Sept 10, 2001.

Your post seems connected to Shadowsot's post. You both raise valid points. He mentions that the past often has a rose hue, which I think stems from getting older and getting sadder. That's life. I really do think that things were better and greater before 9/11. It was a heavy blow to our sense of optimism, and the years that followed were so horrid that they stopped our healing process. Salt was poured into our wounds. It's likely that we yearn for a return to that much missed (to a painful extent) common feeling of optimism.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.