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susieice

Bill Garretson Interview About Tate Murders

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susieice

This is a radio interview with Bill Garretson, who was the caretaker of the Polanski/Tate residence on the night of the murders. He has a strange story to tell. He talks about what he heard and saw that night. He also claims two men came to the guesthouse looking to use the phone, carrying a baby. One in casual clothes and one in a suit. One holds a gun on him and one gives him the baby to hold. When they find out the phone is dead, they leave, refusing to take Garretson with them. This takes place some time before the arrival of the police.

This is just part two of a four part recording. At about 5:30 he starts to tell about the events from the time Steven Parent arrives at the guesthouse and the recording ends after his arrest.

Really would like to hear some opinions on this.

Edit: Just saw all the podcasts are listed. You want to listen to the second one of four interview recordings at the bottom of the second column. #38 At the beginning of #39, he talks a little more about the 2 men with the baby. Is it possible 2 men went to the Tate house between the time the Family left and the time the police were called? Could Sharon Tate have spontaneously given birth after her death? She was only 2 weeks from delivery. This totally freaked me out. Sounds like it belongs in the Conspiracy Forum!

https://archive.org/details/TheTateLabiancaRadioProgramPodcastPage

The letters he says he wrote were found on his desk on Saturday morning when the police arrived and took photos. He claims now that they have disappeared.

http://cielodrive.com/photo-archive/william-garretson-letters.php

Edited by susieice
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susieice

At the end of the podcast #39, Garretson explains who this Rosie is that he keeps talking about. He says a young woman got in contact with him just before 2000 who claimed she was Sharon Tate's baby and her name was Rosie Polanski. Could this have been the baby the 2 men took to the guesthouse the night of the murders? The podcast is mostly about the time he spent in custody.

*cues theme from The Twilight Zone*

Wow, this is really weird.

Podcast #40 is the story of Rosie.

Edited by susieice

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susieice

Tried to find something where Roman Polanski may have made some comment on Garretson's interviews. He also did one for E!. You can't access the actual interview online, but there is confirmation that it took place. All I could find was an interview Larry King did with Sharon's sister Debra after Polanski was charged with statutory rape and fled the US. He asked her if Polanski had anything to do with the murders.

https://dankprofessor.wordpress.com/2010/01/09/larry-king-polanski-murdered-sharon-tate/

It's odd no one has ever contradicted Garretson's claims. Not even Polanski, although Garretson has been public about his claims. This woman also claims her name is Rosie and Rosemary's Baby was a hit movie for Polanski right before Sharon's murder. I wonder how all of this ties in.

Edited by susieice

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susieice

It seems Garretson isn't the only person this Rosie has messed with. She interacted with Sharon's family also. Especially her youngest sister Patti.

http://murdersofaugust69.freeforums.net/thread/964/rosie-tate-polanski

I knew quite a while ago that Garretson had finally talked about what he heard and saw that night, but the story about the men and the baby is pretty off the wall. I don't really blame him. I doubt anyone who went through an experience like that will ever get over it. But this woman was able to convince him that she was Tate's baby, so I have to wonder about his mental state that night and if he did see those men or if this woman was able to influence him enough to think he did.

He says in #39 that when police were questioning him, they asked about Sharon's Ferrari, which they said was missing. He says he thought Sharon had the baby and couldn't figure out how she could kill all these people and take off after just doing that. He told police he only saw 3 bodies. They asked him if he was sure there wasn't 5. He said only 3. Abigail by the pool ( about 50' from his door) He admits hearing her last moments talking to Tex Watson. He saw Voytek Frykowski by the front door (he says he looked out a window and saw a man straddling another man and two women standing nearby, probably Susan Atkins and Linda Kasabian) and he saw a body in a car, which he did not realize was Steven Parent. He had heard the shots that killed him, but thought Parent was shooting off firecrackers, which made him mad. He had just left the guesthouse. They never took him into the house so he didn't know there were 2 more inside.

I kind of think Garretson still hasn't said everything he knows about what happened that night. I'm sure it was a horrible experience and don't doubt he may still suffer from PTS because of it.

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timewarrior

Spontaneously given birth?  I don't think that's possible. .. if they cut the baby out it might have survived. . .but that wasn't their intent. . .these people were monsters and there is a reason why they haven't been granted parole. . .even for mercy reasons. . .

 

As for Garretson, for a while he was considered the main suspect, so I'm sure he has plenty PTSD from both the incident itself and the police interrogation tactics. . .cause let's face it. . .if an entire house gets massacred and your in the shack next door, you better get killed too else your proximity automatically make you culpable. . .

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susieice

In all the crime scene photos, Tate is clearly pregnant. I really think this Rosie planted ideas into Garretson's head and he so badly wanted to believe someone other than him survived. He's very lucky those dogs barked and Krenwinkel didn't go into the guesthouse. It is possible, and this is purely speculation, that she thought Steven Parent was the caretaker. They had caught him leaving before he reached the gate and he was already dead. 

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timewarrior
1 hour ago, susieice said:

In all the crime scene photos, Tate is clearly pregnant. I really think this Rosie planted ideas into Garretson's head and he so badly wanted to believe someone other than him survived. He's very lucky those dogs barked and Krenwinkel didn't go into the guesthouse. It is possible, and this is purely speculation, that she thought Steven Parent was the caretaker. They had caught him leaving before he reached the gate and he was already dead. 

Yeah, lucky, but one often wonders at what cost. . .survivor's guilt alone is enough to send people spiraling into insanity, alcoholism and drug abuse. . .Just look at the 9-11 survivors. . .no one gave a **** about them at first because everyone was like oh you survived, we only care about the dead. . .it took a women (who was lying through her teeth) to finally organize a group that supported the survivors. . .

 

Has Garretson mentioned any therapy he might have taken to mollify this? 

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susieice

He says nothing about therapy but when he's talking about what he saw when he was watching out the windows, he still can't bring himself to fully state what he saw. That's the feeling I get from listening to the interview. He says he saw a man straddling another man on the front lawn. We now know he saw Tex Watson finishing off Voytek Frykowski, but he doesn't mention what Tex was doing, which we know was stabbing him. He says he saw two women running from the main house towards where he was. We now know that was Patricia Krenwinkel chasing Abigail Folger, who was already stabbed multiple times and bleeding profusely. Most likely, she was also screaming. He says he heard screaming from the house, a lot of it, but still can't say entirely what he saw. He said he heard someone say "don't stab me anymore, I'm already dead". He can't figure out why someone would say that. He's already seen Abigail through the window being chased and hearing her now pleading with Tex who had come to help Krenwinkel. Still, he tries to block out what he knows is happening. If he heard the shots that killed Parent, I'm sure he heard the other ones too. Sebring was shot and Frykowski was shot 3 times. He says he heard the doorknob to the guesthouse being turned. Then the dogs barked and he says he heard a woman running back to the main house. He couldn't have heard any of that if there was loud music playing and he wouldn't have known it was a woman unless he looked out the window and saw her. We know Krenwinkel tried that door, found it locked and went to tell Tex there was no one inside. She probably thought Parent was the caretaker, already dead and the only living things inside that building were a couple dogs she didn't want to deal with.

Then the police get to him and he relates that in Podcast #39. They kept pressing him about 5 bodies and he kept saying he only saw 3. They never took him into the house, so he never saw Tate or Sebring. He probably didn't know the people in the house. He only knew the Porsche was there a lot and the man on the lawn was staying around and was somehow connected to Roman Polanski. By the time he got to the body in the car he was probably so deep in shock he wasn't able to associate it with Steven Parent, who was only an acquaintance and not a friend. Parent had stopped by totally unexpectedly on the pretense of selling him a clock radio, which police found on the seat next to his body. He was probably so frightened and afraid that they wouldn't believe him if he could tell the truth so he lied and said he was playing loud music and writing letters, so he didn't hear anything. He did write letters that night, but not until it quieted down. His lie detecter tests indicated that he was telling the truth when he said he had nothing to do with the murders but were muddy when answering questions about what he knew about what happened. I can't imagine how this man feels now that he's in his late 60's and has had to live with this for most of his life. Maybe it's a little cleansing to talk about it as much as he has, but still, he seems pretty messed up.

After this Rosie shows up and he tells the story about the men coming to the guesthouse, one holding a gun on him and one holding a baby, I just think this woman played on his shattered emotional state about that night. I don't doubt he has survivor's guilt and was holding on to a hope that someone else had survived too. That's why he left her use him for awhile. 

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susieice

I just wanted to add that back in 1969, the effects of PTSD were just starting to be researched because of tramatized soldiers returning from Vietnam. And therapy wasn't anywhere near as common or advanced as it is today.

This poor guy doesn't even survive a murder. He survives the Manson family and Sharon Tate, like it's something he's ever going to get away from. Even if no one remembers his name, he can never escape it or the memories. He is really messed up to this day.

Edited by susieice

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susieice

This has always been a matter of speculation.

http://www.mansonblog.com/2013/02/did-manson-return-to-cielo-late-on.html

I found a two hour long youtube video where it was reported that neighbors heard men arguing at the Tate residence much later than midnight. There was also a question about a large puddle of blood on the front porch that was Sharon Tate's, but Sharon never left the house. 

Here is the original police report stating that type O blood was found on the porch, in a large stain. Only Tate and Sebring were type O. Frykowski, Parent and Folger were type B.

http://www.mansondirect.com/police-report-tate-1st.html

Did someone, maybe not even Manson, go to the house after the murders, go to the guesthouse to try and use the phone, and then leave? I wonder if Garretson is remembering parts of something that really happened, though I don't believe the baby part. 

Could try to post the video, but will try to find other links that report this. The video is long and rather graphic in parts.

This neighbor says he heard all these things at 2-2:30 AM. That would have been long after the murders took place. We know that was just after midnight because that's when Steven Parent left the guesthouse. It's possible the family even saw him getting into his car.

http://www.cielodrive.com/archive/tate-neighbor-heard-shots-screams-in-murder-house-about-2-in-morning/

Could the whole timeline be wrong?

Edited by susieice

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susieice

Manson had been at Cielo Drive several times and knew Melcher didn't live there anymore.

http://www.cielodrive.com/archive/manson-at-tate-home-in-march-69-trial-told/

Here is LAP's second progress report covering Sept 1969-October 1969

http://www.mansondirect.com/police-report-tate-2nd.html

Edited by susieice
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susieice

Can still find no way to access this E interview.

http://www.lsb3.com/2011/03/william-garretson.html

Looks like Linda Kasabian also decided to talk when she was 60. Must have been a very tough life to live with all this guilt in her head. I can only imagine the moments she must have had.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2009/aug/02/charles-manson-linda-kasabian-polanski

 

Edited by susieice

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Phaeton80

Interesting..

 

Quote

This small kitten, wrapped in a blanket or towel, could have been what Bill remembers, only with the shock and trauma of the day’s events and with outside influences from Sharon baby imposter and former girl friend, “Rosie Tate Polanski”, Bill could now have a kitten in a blanket morph into a “baby in a blanket”.

Bill lets us know once again that even he doubts what he is saying are the facts with his oft repeated phrase when he knows his story is derailing;

Bill – “…the main thing that’s going through my mind…if he shoots me, I fall down, the baby is going to get hurt too! What the hell’s going on? Something’s not right…It was alive…the baby’s eyes were open…there is a mark on this baby.”

Brian – “A birthmark?”

Bill – “Yes. It’s not light where I’m at, you know, outside. It appears to be and it looks like another eye….Oh my goodness. This is not right….it’s kind of off to the side…it looked like a little bump, I told Rosie, it looks like if you close your eyes, like your eyeball…if you close your eye, a little slit, it looks like an eye….Why would they bring the baby to the Guest House though, if it’s Sharon’s baby? There was no phone. They came over there to call…the people in the suits go one way, and I’m [Bill says], ‘Hey, I’m going with you.’…and the other guy – in casual dress [possibly Animal Control with the kitten] – going the direction, is going towards the house… [Bill says again] ’Hey, I’m going with you.’ And a guy pointed a gun at me [and said]…’There’s enough people dead already.’ What he’s talking about? [guy says] ‘You go in that direction.” [inside the Guest House and Bill obeyed].

http://2ndofficialtate-labiancamurdersblog.blogspot.nl/2012/10/bill-garretsonmore-unplugged-than-usual.html

 

Sounds like a Rosemaries Baby spinoff..

Edited by Phaeton80
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susieice

Yes. I think he does remember people showing up, but I think that woman calling herself Rosie put the idea of a baby being with them into his head. This poor guy went through so much I think he feels a need to unburden himself now. He's 67 yrs old. No one will believe it now anymore than they would have believed him then. That's probably why he stayed quiet.

The problem with linking what was said in 1969 is that it's now buried in 2 hrs of youtube video.

Edited by susieice

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susieice

The true nature of the relationship between the Manson group and the victims revolved around drug deals. Sebring was "Candyman" to the Hollywood milieu and Frykowski was one of many dealers to the Manson group. Steve Parent, the first to die on the night of the Cielo Drive murders isn't as innocent as he has been painted either. Neither were the La Bianca's, who were to die on the second night's killing spree. Leno La Bianca was up to his neck in mob debts, while his wife, Rosemary, was a regular supplier to Sebring and Frykowski, and was known to have dealings with Charles Watson. Schreck concludes that the only innocent victims in all of this was Sharon Tate and Abigail Folger, who were in the wrong place at the wrong time as their drug-addled boyfriends conducted a drug deal that went badly wrong, with fatal consequences.http://www.nikolasschreck.eu/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=90%3Athe-manson-file-myth-and-reality-of-an-outlaw-shaman&catid=35&Itemid=53

 

 

Edited by susieice

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susieice

http://www.tlbradio.com/2015/04/under-drug-burn-theory.html

When these murders were first discovered, half of Hollywood went into a panic. Garretson says men in suits showed up right after the murders. Hummmm.

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susieice
On 8/12/2016 at 6:40 AM, Phaeton80 said:

Interesting..

 

 

Sounds like a Rosemaries Baby spinoff..

It's not unusual for real life crimes to be based on movies. It could be possible Charlie was planning something like this on Roman Polanski. He was certainly evil enough to come up with the idea. If you can concoct a race war out of a Beatle's song, and those men really did show up at the guesthouse with a baby...who knows what Charlie was really doing? He, unfortunately, is not talking.

Edited by susieice

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Antilles

As far as I'm aware, Manson was at Cielo only once before the murders and he saw Sharon Tate. He wasn't hunting her, he was hunting Terry Melcher. She was just in the wrong place at the wrong time.

As far as Garretson is concerned, I don't think we will ever know the real truth. He had the head phones on but he had the dogs, the family tried the door knob. I personally don't believe that he didn't know about the murders. What I do believe is that he was scared out of his brain and he didn't want to know.

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susieice
9 minutes ago, Antilles said:

As far as I'm aware, Manson was at Cielo only once before the murders and he saw Sharon Tate. He wasn't hunting her, he was hunting Terry Melcher. She was just in the wrong place at the wrong time.

As far as Garretson is concerned, I don't think we will ever know the real truth. He had the head phones on but he had the dogs, the family tried the door knob. I personally don't believe that he didn't know about the murders. What I do believe is that he was scared out of his brain and he didn't want to know.

Manson was there twice and twice he was told Melcher didn't live there anymore. Altobelli and Sharon's photographer both told him and both times he saw Sharon Tate. Tate wasn't the target. She wasn't supposed to be there that night.

Garretson has now said he lied to police. His first interview was with E! The radio interview is in the links in the first posting. He tells what he saw and what happened that night. I don't doubt he was scared. Now that he's older, maybe he doesn't want all this on his conscience anymore.

 

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susieice

Here's a strange forum that looks into the mob connection. It is well established that Manson knew a lot of mobsters when he was in prison, before he got out and started the family. I don't agree with all of it, but I do think LAPD was on to something from the very beginning when they suspected mob and drug ties. Now that Garretson has talked and mentioned the men in suits who came to Cielo Drive after the murders,  and said he should stay inside because there were enough dead people already, I know who I'd think they were. They're almost saying if he goes outside, they'll have to kill him, and they tell him which direction to head in, which he did.

http://letsrollforums.com//charles-manson-family-murders-t26183.html?s=2e58612944f3305c08814be6482f9436&

http://www.nikolasschreck.eu/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=47:the-manson

Edited by susieice

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susieice

Haven't come into this thread for awhile. Found this story about the LaBiancas. Like the article says, not to ruin the reputations of the deceased, but when looking at a crime, a good detective will follow all leads. It seems these people lived in fear all the time.

http://www.mansonblog.com/2012/09/thoughts-on-labiancas-and-motive-on.html

Here's another link that suggests there was a tight drug connection with some of the Tate victims and the family.

http://www.mansonblog.com/2015/12/the-tate-labianca-murders-is-truth.html

Another interesting angle. Hineman was killed over money he couldn't pay that Manson needed to go to the desert.

http://www.cielodrive.com/archive/manson-slashed-hinman-witness-says/

Yet , after the LaBianca killings, that's where the family went. They had been busted for auto theft. Where did the money come from? Certainly not the $70 they got from Abigail Folger.

https://thedesertfiles.wordpress.com/2012/04/24/barker-ranch-last-hideout-of-charles-manson/

Edited by susieice

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