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Bizeebutt

Christmas Not Jesus' Birthday

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Bizeebutt

I've heard several people mention before that the Christmas celebrated by Christians and Catholics is actually a holiday borrowed from the pagans. Noone really seems to know when Jesus was actually born, but most people who agree with this theory say that Christmas is actually a pagan celebration that the church tried to cover with the "miraculus" birth of Jesus.

Discuss amungst yourselves laugh.gif

Edited by Bizeebutt

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JennRose

And wasn't Buddah supposedly born on December 25th? I know another deified person was born on this date, but can't remember exactly whoit was...

I agree that it was a Pagan holiday 'borrowed' by the Christians. There was no exact date of Jesus' birth known.

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Q-La

I think similar apply to all saints day too. Doesn't mean that Jesus was never born right? Just that the early church elders aren't that birthdate conscious I guess.

I think it will take two scenarios at least to have the proper date pass down:

1) James (or another apostle): Well and when's your birthday?

Jesus: Hey it's November 22 do't you mess it up with a pagan celebration!

2) James (or any elder): Hey folks, let's spread the good news and God's message -oh and the right date of his birthday!

Young dude: Got it! Now this is important stuff. laugh.gif

Edited by Q-La

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pete juffalo

did they not use the pagan calendar to roughly work out the date of jesus' birth or something?

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Bizeebutt

I guess my point is that so many things are taken literally from the bible, and as far as I know, this is one thing that isn't actually mentioned in the bible... so... bascially, anyone can celebrate Christmas at any time of year...

Yay!! presents under the tree in August!!

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Mandaygo

I definately believe that Christmas is borrowed from the pagans. As are Halloween and Easter.

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beowulf

Jenn, the other deity that celebrated his birthday (long before Jesus) on Dec 25th was Mithra, but the Romans celebrated Dec 25th as Natalis Solis Invictus (roughly the birthday of invincible Sol)! The early church was very adept at adopting pagan holidays as a recruitment tool! yes.gif

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Loge

user posted image

Observe the Sun in its elliptical orbit as it travels from south to north and back again.

When it travels to the north, then the birth of the Infant Sun is celebrated. The Infant Sun is born on the Solstice of Winter, December 24th at midnight on the Dawning of December 25th.

If the Cosmic Christ, the Christ-Sun, the Solar Logos did not move northwards, the whole planet earth would become a huge piece of ice and all life would perish. Fortunately, the Solar Logos, does advance northwards on December 24th to animate and give heat and life to all creatures.

The Infant-Sun is born on December 24th on the Dawning of December 25th; then it is crucified (it crosses the equator) at the vernal equinox to give life to all that exists.

The fixed date of its birth and the variable date of its death have a profound significance in all religious theologies.

In the northern regions of our world, in winter, the hours of darkness are very long and the hours of light very short.

On one of those very long nights, the Cosmic Child of the Sun is born, frail and helpless, in this humble stable, our world.

The sign of Virgo, the Celestial Virgin rises on the horizon at Christmas, and it is then that the Child is born to save the world from death.

The Christ-Sun, in its childhood, is surrounded by dangers, since the kingdom of darkness lasts longer than its kingdom [the light] in the beginning, but the Cosmic Child lives despite all the dangers that threaten Him.

Time passes... the days become cruelly longer, and the vernal equinox arrives. This is Easter Holy Week, the moment of crossing from one extreme to another, the moment of the Lord’s crucifixion in this world. The Christ-Sun is crucified on the planet Earth to give life to all that exists.

The splendors of the Solar Light die, faint, diminish when penetrating into all the simple and compound atoms of nature. However, after its death, the Christ-Sun resurrects in all creation, ripening the grapes and the grain. The law of the Solar Logos is sacrifice.

This is the cosmic drama that is repeated from moment to moment in all infinite space, in all worlds, in all suns. This is the cosmic drama that is represented in all the temples of Egypt, Greece, India, Mexico, etc.

This is the cosmic drama that is represented in all the temples of all the worlds of infinite space.

The secondary aspect of this great drama has its parallel in the development of that solar fire within the physical, mental, psychic and spiritual life of any high initiate who, by a revolution of his consciousness, obtains the Venustic initiation, the Initiation of Freya, the Goddess of Love and becomes a Solar Hero: Mithra, Jesus, Krishna, Beleno, Osiris, Quetzalcoatl, etc., etc., etc.

grin2.gif

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Q-La

Loge have you been certified kraazy grin2.gif ? But then there's always the chance that you are too wise to be comprehended.

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girty1600

I read a study that said Jesus was most likely almost two years old by the time the wise men arrived with their crappy gifts ( I mean, who gives a newborn murr).

J/K

Anyway, the study also said that due to the shepards being out in the fields rather than closer to home, that Jesus was most likely born in the spring or summer months.

I wish I could remember where I read that but it was many years ago.

December 25th is the day we celebrate the birth of Jesus not his actual birthday.

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Loge
Loge have you been certified kraazy grin2.gif ?  But then there's always the chance that you are too wise to be comprehended.

416015[/snapback]

user posted image

Yes, from the level of Genius to that of a Madman there is only one short step and this axiomatic! yes.gif

However, I will drink the wine of wisdom within the chalice of my august cranium and in a gesture of omnipotent rebellion, I will revolt against death. I will break all the psychological chains of my mind, and I will become immortal even if they believe me to be crazy...

I won’t be the first one or the last!

To dream ... the impossible dream ...

To fight ... the unbeatable foe ...

To bear ... with unbearable sorrow ...

To run ... where the brave dare not go ...

To right ... the unrightable wrong ...

To love ... pure and chaste from afar ...

To try ... when your arms are too weary ...

To reach ... the unreachable star ...

This is my quest, to follow that star ...

No matter how hopeless, no matter how far ...

To fight for the right, without question or pause ...

To be willing to march into Hell, for a Heavenly cause ...

And I know if I'll only be true, to this glorious quest,

That my heart will lie will lie peaceful and calm,

when I'm laid to my rest ...

And the world will be better for this:

That one man, scorned and covered with scars,

Still strove, with his last ounce of courage,

To reach ... the unreachable star ...

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Wings of Selkhet

I have to sing that song for my school's V-show, Loge. tongue.gif Good song.

Anyway, I heard that Mary and Joseph were heading toward Bethlehem to do their taxes, and that Jews in those days only did their taxes in the late summer/early fall.

And the wise men arriving late thing is pretty accurate. It would've taken a couple years for them to complete such a long journey. It would've been really funny if they arrived when he was 20. laugh.gif

Edited by Wings of Selkhet

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saucy

Yes, it's true. The Catholic church set Jesus' birthday up on December 25th to compete with a popular pagan holiday. Before then "Christmas" was celebrated on January 6th. That's where we get the "12 Days of Christmas". Nobody really knows when Jesus was born, but it's quite possible he was born in late September. We know that because Jesus is six months younger than John the Baptist.

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Ashley-Star*Child
I've heard several people mention before that the Christmas celebrated by Christians and Catholics is actually a holiday borrowed from the pagans.  Noone really seems to know when Jesus was actually born, but most people who agree with this theory say that Christmas is actually a pagan celebration that the church tried to cover with the "miraculus" birth of Jesus. 

Discuss amungst yourselves laugh.gif

415900[/snapback]

Jesus was born around Passover time, not December, but the Calendars were different then too. Still, so long as you celebrate it, does it really matter which day it is? You couldn't have Christmas and Easter going at the same time, because one's about His birth and the other about His death and resurrection. Not a good mix.

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Rosewin

December 25th was the Winter Solstice under the old Julian Calendar. It is the Sun God's birthday and was declared as Jesus' birthday at the Council of Nicea. The day was chosen deliberately by Romans.

Constantine was the ruler of Rome during this time and not only embraced 'Christianity' but convened the Council of Nicea. Previous to his embrace of this new faith he was a worshipper of Mithras, the asiatic sun god. As a side note Saint Nicholas was present at the Council of Nicea.

The celebration of Saturnalia in Rome also contributed to Christmas tradition in the form of gift changing. The Germanic Yule offered us the Christmas Tree and Mistletoe. The tinsel is supposed to represent strewn human intestines offered as sacrifice to the tree deities.

Jesus though could not have been born on December 25th also for the reason that scripture states the shepherds were out. They never are in the Winter.

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SilverCougar

Poor guy... had his birthday all messed up by people playing politics...

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Bizeebutt
The celebration of Saturnalia in Rome also contributed to Christmas tradition in the form of gift changing. The Germanic Yule offered us the Christmas Tree and Mistletoe. The tinsel is supposed to represent strewn human intestines offered as sacrifice to the tree deities.

thats quite disgusting... hmm.gif but if true, it adds a new dimention to "trimming the tree" YUCK!!

BTW... great info! Keep it coming!

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Insight
I've heard several people mention before that the Christmas celebrated by Christians and Catholics is actually a holiday borrowed from the pagans.  Noone really seems to know when Jesus was actually born, but most people who agree with this theory say that Christmas is actually a pagan celebration that the church tried to cover with the "miraculus" birth of Jesus. 

Discuss amungst yourselves laugh.gif

415900[/snapback]

I am a Christian myself, and I know that December 25th is not Jesus' birthday, nor does anyone know it. I'm pretty damned sure that december 25th was originally a pagan holiday. However, most of the world has decided to celebrate the birth of their Lord on that day, and then tie it into easter.

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Ashley-Star*Child
December 25th was the Winter Solstice under the old Julian Calendar. It is the Sun God's birthday and was declared as Jesus' birthday at the Council of Nicea. The day was chosen deliberately by Romans.

Constantine was the ruler of Rome during this time and not only embraced 'Christianity' but convened the Council of Nicea. Previous to his embrace of this new faith he was a worshipper of Mithras, the asiatic sun god. As a side note Saint Nicholas was present at the Council of Nicea.

The celebration of Saturnalia in Rome also contributed to Christmas tradition in the form of gift changing. The Germanic Yule offered us the Christmas Tree and Mistletoe. The tinsel is supposed to represent strewn human intestines offered as sacrifice to the tree deities.

Jesus though could not have been born on December 25th also for the reason that scripture states the shepherds were out. They never are in the Winter.

417455[/snapback]

Yes, and it was because of this 'sun god' being his favoite that the Sabboth got changed from Friday sunset-Saturday sunset, to Sunday, because the Sun 'rules' Sunday.

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SilverCougar
I've heard several people mention before that the Christmas celebrated by Christians and Catholics is actually a holiday borrowed from the pagans.  Noone really seems to know when Jesus was actually born, but most people who agree with this theory say that Christmas is actually a pagan celebration that the church tried to cover with the "miraculus" birth of Jesus. 

Discuss amungst yourselves laugh.gif

415900[/snapback]

I am a Christian myself, and I know that December 25th is not Jesus' birthday, nor does anyone know it. I'm pretty damned sure that december 25th was originally a pagan holiday. However, most of the world has decided to celebrate the birth of their Lord on that day, and then tie it into easter.

418696[/snapback]

That would be Yule sir. Which just went by.

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Loge

user posted imageGNOSTIC WISDOM

"Christmas is a solar festival, an ineffable cosmic festival with its origin in the mysterious night of times.

"The tridimensional physical suns are only the medium through which the spiritual sun acts. Beyond the physical suns (in the superior dimensions) any mystic finds the sun of midnight, the star of Bethlehem, the Cosmic Christ.

"All ancient religions paid homage to that sun (the spiritual sun). Even the Vatican is constructed so that its doors open towards the east, towards the rising sun. Primeval Christians always uttered with great devotion: “Our Lord Jesus Christ, the Sun.”

"It is amazing how our Solar King travels among the other innumerable stars of infinite space, with a velocity of twenty kilometers per second in relation to its closest neighbors. In the center of the Milky Way, the sun travels at the astonishing speed of 270 kilometers per second. By its motion, the sun pulls the earth and the whole solar system with it.

"The earth on which we live, move, and have our being is more than just a mass of matter.

It is, without doubt, a living organism, on whose epidermis we all live as simple parasites.

"In infinite space, Earth travels a path both complicated and difficult. Earth, dancing around the sun to the music of the spheres, travels at a dizzying velocity as it revolves around the center of this awe-inspiring galaxy in which we live.

user posted image

"The Milky Way is, in fact, so gigantic that the sun, even though traveling at 270 kilometers per second, will take 220 million years to complete one revolution.

"The Milky Way is a living cosmic organism, a spiral body within which our solar system exists. All nebulae, including our Milky Way, have, as a matter of fact, the same fundamental design.

"There are three forces at work in all galaxies: the first is centripetal; the second is centrifugal; the third is neutral, serving as a point of support and equilibrium. The centrifugal force imparts movement in spiral form to a nebula in the same way that a whirlwind raises dust in a spiral manner.

"The Milky Way, with its millions of suns and innumerable planets and moons, has its center of gravity in the central sun Sirius. Ancient esoteric traditions affirm that the Transcendental Church exists in the central sun Sirius. Inside the temple of Sirius, adepts (OBE) have the pleasure of meeting the disciples of the God Sirius.

"When any adept (OBE) tries to go beyond the Milky Way, he is always obliged to return to Sirius. Adepts of Earth are prohibited from going beyond Sirius.

"Astronomers know very well that, beyond the Milky Way, there are only three galaxies visible to the naked eye. Two of these, the Large and Small Magellan Clouds, named in honor of the celebrated explorer, can be seen from the southern hemisphere.

"When the adepts of the Great White Lodge go beyond Sirius, they can see two world systems, which sparkle marvelously with a beautiful rose color. In those two galaxies, there exist other types of cosmic laws, unknown to the inhabitants of the Milky Way.

"There is a maxim in the sacred texts of occult wisdom: “Where the light shines clearest, there also the darkness is densest.” In the superior worlds, adepts can usually verify that, together with a temple of light, there is a contrasting temple of frightening darkness.

"Based on this rule, we can be sure, without any fear of error, that the central sun Sirius is double. Its companion is a gigantic, tenebrous world. The cosmic forces which rule the superior dimensions come to Earth from Sirius, nicknamed “The Dog Star” by astronomers; how ever, from its tenebrous companion, nicknamed ‘Pup,” we receive the forces which govern the infernos (inferior dimensions).

"Our galaxy is gigantic, marvelous, and formidable. It is about 100,000 light years in diameter and about 10,000 light years thick.

"The sun which warms us and gives us life, our beloved sun, source of all life, is located approximately 30,000 light years from the center, i.e. two thirds of the distance from the center of the galaxy to the perimeter. It appears to be near the interior ring of a spiral arm, near a group of very weak and distant stars, and near another group, which is closer to the center.

"There exist millions of galaxies in infinite space, an estimated 2,000,000,000 in an area of 250,000,000 light years, an astonishing distance with no sign of an end.

"The situation of our solar system is, without any doubt or exaggeration, analogous to that of a blood cell within the human body. We can verify under a microscope that a white blood cell is also composed of a nucleus or sun and its cytoplasm or sphere of influence.

It is also surrounded on all sides by millions of similar cells or systems. Together, all these cells form the whole, a great being, whose nature is surely inconceivable to an individual cell.

"The Milky Way is a living organism which was born of water and fire in the Ninth Sphere. Those who suppose that the galaxies, including the Milky Way, had their origin in an explosion of some primitive atom (big bang) are mistaken.

"There is an esoteric maxim which says, “As above, so below.” If this small microcosmic galaxy called man had its origin in the Ninth Sphere, in sex (sexual creative energy), we can deduce logically, without fear of deception that we must look for the origin of our galaxies and all other galaxies in the Ninth Sphere, in sex (sexual creative energy).

user posted image

"The Temple of Wisdom is found in the Ninth Sphere (Foundation); the Temple of Wisdom is to be found in the phallus and the uterus (the cross).

"It is impossible to experience the truth concerning the origin of the galaxies if we do not practically study the Ninth Sphere (sex). The Word fertilizes the waters of chaos in a sexual cosmic coenobium at the dawn of life. This is how galaxies and worlds are born.

"The universal sexual fire of Kundalini (Holy Spirit) always fertilizes the womb of the Great Mother (Binah)."

“In the beginning was the Word...”

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