Habitat Posted November 10, 2016 #151 Share Posted November 10, 2016 (edited) 7 hours ago, Grand Moff Tarkin said: not to be confused with the shape shifting Republicans, who were the ones who jumped ship and declared that They were With Her. Which puts Trump in a unique position, not beholden to the party machine, and having unprecedented freedom of action. Interesting times. Edited November 10, 2016 by Habitat 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merc14 Posted November 10, 2016 #152 Share Posted November 10, 2016 41 minutes ago, Kurzweil said: From what I heard he called back the investigation so the current president couldn't pardon her. Once Trump is sworn in the files will reopen. Lots of dirt too clean up and Comeyknows it. He's playing the cards right. Ford pardoned Nixon in advance of any charges being made and it was allowed so the precedent is set. As much as I want to see these two criminals punished I'd almost welcome a pardon so that we can move on and fix the destruction Obama has wrought, namely $10 trillion dollars of additional debt with nothing to show for it, Obamacare which has failed miserably and left millions of middle class broke and with no real healthcare, a failed foreign policy that will take decades to repair, infrastructure that Obama ignored while building billion dollar solar cell plants that closed within a year of being completed and on and on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unusual Tournament Posted November 10, 2016 #153 Share Posted November 10, 2016 2 hours ago, stereologist said: I have not seen people posting party affiliations here. I suppose you are suggesting people critical of president Obama are republicans. They might be democrats, libertarians, progressives, union party, green party,, or independent or something other than what I have listed. I don't think he was a failure. I do view him as a novice. I expect the same from Trump. Obama was and is a great campaigner. He tried to run his presidency by campaigning and by edict and learned over time that neither was the manner in which a president runs the office. I think Obama was a middle ability president, not bad and not great. My hope is that each president including Trump do at least as well. It's a tough job and no matter what you do there will be many people that will be unhappy with your performance. Please be careful of labeling those critical of the president of being in one party or another. Sorry Stereo, but I don't think any ardent democrats on this site were critical of Obama... at least not as critical as they were for Trump. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yamato Posted November 10, 2016 #154 Share Posted November 10, 2016 14 minutes ago, Habitat said: Which puts Trump in a unique position, not beholden to the party machine, and having unprecedented freedom of action. Interesting times. Now that Republicans are on the verge of dominating the federal government, I can already tell he'll be the partisan excuse that's used to word over the party criticisms and disappointments. Especially if we see much tension between Trump and Republicans. I don't see much of that happening. He's going to do what's most effective for him to do and he'll take advantage of the benefits from the home team in order to get it done. If he won as a 3rd party I could speculate on the freedom from partisanship but insulting 16 other republicans in the primaries doesn't cut it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F3SS Posted November 10, 2016 #155 Share Posted November 10, 2016 51 minutes ago, Yamato said: Now that Republicans are on the verge of dominating the federal government, I can already tell he'll be the partisan excuse that's used to word over the party criticisms and disappointments. Especially if we see much tension between Trump and Republicans. I don't see much of that happening. He's going to do what's most effective for him to do and he'll take advantage of the benefits from the home team in order to get it done. If he won as a 3rd party I could speculate on the freedom from partisanship but insulting 16 other republicans in the primaries doesn't cut it. Some of whom will surely fill his cabinet. I seen you wondering earlier who may be his billionaire backers. There's an article on TheBlaze right now about his possible cabinet and they name some of his friends. Don't feel like linking it, read it earlier, but it's on the front page. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Likely Guy Posted November 10, 2016 #156 Share Posted November 10, 2016 1 hour ago, Habitat said: ... Interesting times. "May you live in interesting times" - ancient Chinese curse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yamato Posted November 10, 2016 #157 Share Posted November 10, 2016 9 minutes ago, F3SS said: Some of whom will surely fill his cabinet. I seen you wondering earlier who may be his billionaire backers. There's an article on TheBlaze right now about his possible cabinet and they name some of his friends. Don't feel like linking it, read it earlier, but it's on the front page. I got totally distracted by the "Your tears are delicious and your parties will die." says Libertarian Chairman lol I didn't see the point in so many different people on one stage unable to distinguish themselves when it comes to policy. So unless he's going to tap Rand Paul or something. That would make me feel a little better. Not for his cabinet of course, Rand Paul won't pull a Palin and abandon his constituents. But to run some kind of committee to help peel off a layer or two of Obama... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrLzs Posted November 10, 2016 #158 Share Posted November 10, 2016 (edited) 7 hours ago, Grand Moff Tarkin said: Are you been deliberately disingenuous? Not so much disingenuous, just having a little sideways dig at how the debates often seem to ignore the real problem.. The real problem isn't that some people break/bend the laws - I think we can agree that there will always be those who will do the wrong thing. It seems to me that if you have major levels of corruption in your justice system, or almost as bad, a tax system that allows those who can afford a decent (actually INdecent) lawyer the ability to use tax havens and other ways to (immorally if not illegally) steal money.. then that is the problem, and what the great knight in shining armor should be riding in to fix... I'm not naive enough to think that some degree of corruption isn't hereabouts too, but to the extent that you guys are claiming with Hillary? Nope. I do agree our tax system is just as bad, so Donald at least could do his tricks here too and get away with them. But I think our justice system is about as clean as one could reasonably expect. Quote Do you really think someone with that many powerful friends behind her would be subject to the normal processes of law? They're for the ordinary people! If the crimes are that heinous, then I can't see how a justice system can forever escape from scrutiny and eventual exposure, as long as the evidence is there... While we do see odd examples of corruption from time to time here, it seems to get fairly effectively fought.. it sounds like it is beyond endemic over there, if I believe the vitriol... Quote From the evidence seen here, Australians do seem to have a very trusting view of the world of politics. I don't have a lot of respect for politicians, but I'd say more than half of the ones here seem to be decent folks, and some are outstanding (if not currently in charge, sadly). Maybe we have better systems in place... nah that can't be right.. We do have a few trump-ish characters, and even a few people who have shady, perhaps criminal backgrounds, but they don't seem to be able to rise to the top as Trump and Clinton have over there... Yet. Perhaps our time will now come - we seem to want to adopt all the stuff you guys get up to, if a little bit later... Edited November 10, 2016 by ChrLzs forgot to close my brackets - another heinous crime! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrLzs Posted November 10, 2016 #159 Share Posted November 10, 2016 7 hours ago, aztek said: yea, i got that feeling as well, but not all, some are very much live in reality, and can see world for what it really is. now the bigger question is why? is Australian politics, justice system is so flawless, or they were conditioned to believe it is? imo it is the 2nd. And your opinion is based on what particular evidence? May I suggest you do not rely on tinfoilhat websites for that evidence, as some of us live in Australia and we may not be quite as apathetic as you seem to surmise... And to Merc14.. I'll happily confess I have no real inclination or time to delve that deeply into the Clinton's web, but let's just accept that her crimes/misdemeanors were worthy of her at least being deemed inappropriate for office - it seems to me that the problem you have is not her (or Trump) so much.. it's that you have a system that has somehow left you with her and trump as not only viable choices, but also your only two choices... Be it your justice system, your tax system, your political process, or a combination of all three and lots of other stuff, I just can't imagine being forced to pick from them, and them only. Eurgh. Here in Oz, as Mangoze pointed out with some great examples (that will be as unknown to you as are Clinton's precise 'crimes' are to us) our system to date, hasn't got to that point and frankly I don't see how it ever could. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHaYap Posted November 10, 2016 #160 Share Posted November 10, 2016 It seems many are forgetting the Emperor's new set of clothes and the GOP isn't really aware of the full extent of their folly done during the run up as yet ... ~ Quote Fractured Michigan GOP seeks to unite behind Trump Paul Egan , Kathleen Gray and Todd Spangler , Detroit Free Press 3:37 p.m. EST November 9, 2016 ~ Detroit Free Press link ~ It will all come to naught regardless of Trump being the answer to the faithful or not ... its like sitting at the table with your new wife / husband and your ex spouses sitting right across the both of you ... and the in laws all around the table ready to claim and claw at the crumbs that falls off the table .. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
preacherman76 Posted November 10, 2016 #161 Share Posted November 10, 2016 (edited) We have never seen anything like what we just saw. I for one am gonna wait and see what his presidency will look like before I assume the worst. The man just climbed obstacles no one thought he could. Against near impossible odds. He deserves a shot BEFORE being labeled for things he hasn't yet done. Then again, I think he works best under this kinda pressure. Edited November 10, 2016 by preacherman76 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
preacherman76 Posted November 10, 2016 #162 Share Posted November 10, 2016 I mean the guy hasn't picked a single cabinet member yet, and people are already assuming the worst possible outcome. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrLzs Posted November 10, 2016 #163 Share Posted November 10, 2016 30 minutes ago, preacherman76 said: I mean the guy hasn't picked a single cabinet member yet, and people are already assuming the worst possible outcome. Well, they won't be disappointed.... Expecting the worst is always a good strategy I reckon. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Commander Travis Posted November 10, 2016 #164 Share Posted November 10, 2016 More nonsense from various World Leaders (i.e. those who'd like to be World Leaders but have ended up just being loyal vassals of America, and are now worried that Uncle Sam may not be willing to want to keep Leading the World); the French are apparently worried that the World is Collapsing around our Ears , while the Big Chief of NATO, who was perhaps disappointed that, being Danish, he wasn't able to join the Mighty American Fighting Machine and has compensated for it by being perhaps the most bloodthirsty and belligerent Chief of NATO ever, has explained that this will encourage Vladi Putin to invade Europe, because that's just the kind of guy he is! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stereologist Posted November 10, 2016 #165 Share Posted November 10, 2016 9 hours ago, Silver_Lyre said: Sorry Stereo, but I don't think any ardent democrats on this site were critical of Obama... at least not as critical as they were for Trump. These are guesses on your part and I like that you made it clear that these were guesses. Think back and you will easily recall that many Republicans were critical of Trump. That does not make them democrats. Within both parties there is a wide range of opinions that can be characterized as radical to conservative. Obama has detractors as well. I know democrats in my area that are disenchanted with him because he did not go far enough in health care and others that can't believe he was so loved worldwide during his campaign 8 years ago and has lost almost all of it in 8 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merc14 Posted November 10, 2016 #166 Share Posted November 10, 2016 8 hours ago, ChrLzs said: And your opinion is based on what particular evidence? May I suggest you do not rely on tinfoilhat websites for that evidence, as some of us live in Australia and we may not be quite as apathetic as you seem to surmise... And to Merc14.. I'll happily confess I have no real inclination or time to delve that deeply into the Clinton's web, but let's just accept that her crimes/misdemeanors were worthy of her at least being deemed inappropriate for office - it seems to me that the problem you have is not her (or Trump) so much.. it's that you have a system that has somehow left you with her and trump as not only viable choices, but also your only two choices... Be it your justice system, your tax system, your political process, or a combination of all three and lots of other stuff, I just can't imagine being forced to pick from them, and them only. Eurgh. Here in Oz, as Mangoze pointed out with some great examples (that will be as unknown to you as are Clinton's precise 'crimes' are to us) our system to date, hasn't got to that point and frankly I don't see how it ever could. It is amazing that the man hasn't even been sworn in yet and you have already deemed him an utter failure. The last time I saw the left react like that was when Ronald Reagan was elected. Listen, I am sure you cheered loudly when the brilliant Barack Obama was elected. I knew, from day one , that the man would be the worst thing to happen to race relations since the democrats blocked Jim Crowe laws from being repealed back in mid 20th century (that's right, the democrats were the ones who supported Jim Crowe and turned dogs on Martin Luther King, not the republicans) and I was proved correct. Obama's presidency has been an utter failure in all respects and I dare any leftist to challenge that. His accumulating ten trillion dollars in debt in one presidency (more than the combined debt of every president in US history) and we saw no benefits in infrastructure or anything lese speaks volumes for how corrupt this country has become. Hillary Clinton offered four more years of Obama and only an idiot asks for more of that. Trump was not my first choice and I will not defend his stupid public statements, that isn't my job. He is, however, a FAR better choice than Hillary if only to make sure she doesn't appoint two or three radically left, anti-constitution Justices to the Supreme Court. Trump has already presented his list of proposed Justices and all concur that they are brilliant choices, even the left agrees to that (although they will try and block). As far as our Justice system being corrupt it most certainly is and Wikileaks proved that to many people who refused to believe it. Eric Holder and Loretta Lynch have blocked prosecution of many crimes base on race and ideology. They allowed the IRS (our tax gathering organization, think gestapo with calculators) to persecute Obama's political enemies, something Nixon resigned from the presidency for only threatening to do. Obama actually did it! Clinton should've been going in front of the Grand Jury, that is what the FBI recommended and demanded based on the massive evidence of public corruption and Lynch said no, with Obama's agreement presumably, because of the election. We are a mess and Hillary would've emade sure that mess became a generations long one. Maybe Trump will fail miserably but Hillary was guaranteed to do so, in fact she promised it. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorvir Posted November 10, 2016 #167 Share Posted November 10, 2016 3 hours ago, preacherman76 said: I mean the guy hasn't picked a single cabinet member yet, and people are already assuming the worst possible outcome. 6 minutes ago, Merc14 said: It is amazing that the man hasn't even been sworn in yet and you have already deemed him an utter failure. The last time I saw the left react like that was when Ronald Reagan was elected. Listen, I am sure you cheered loudly when the brilliant Barack Obama was elected. I knew, from day one , that the man would be the worst thing to happen to race relations since the democrats blocked Jim Crowe laws from being repealed back in mid 20th century (that's right, the democrats were the ones who supported Jim Crowe and turned dogs on Martin Luther King, not the republicans) and I was proved correct. Obama's presidency has been an utter failure in all respects and I dare any leftist to challenge that. His accumulating ten trillion dollars in debt in one presidency (more than the combined debt of every president in US history) and we saw no benefits in infrastructure or anything lese speaks volumes for how corrupt this country has become. Hillary Clinton offered four more years of Obama and only an idiot asks for more of that. Trump was not my first choice and I will not defend his stupid public statements, that isn't my job. He is, however, a FAR better choice than Hillary if only to make sure she doesn't appoint two or three radically left, anti-constitution Justices to the Supreme Court. Trump has already presented his list of proposed Justices and all concur that they are brilliant choices, even the left agrees to that (although they will try and block). As far as our Justice system being corrupt it most certainly is and Wikileaks proved that to many people who refused to believe it. Eric Holder and Loretta Lynch have blocked prosecution of many crimes base on race and ideology. They allowed the IRS (our tax gathering organization, think gestapo with calculators) to persecute Obama's political enemies, something Nixon resigned from the presidency for only threatening to do. Obama actually did it! Clinton should've been going in front of the Grand Jury, that is what the FBI recommended and demanded based on the massive evidence of public corruption and Lynch said no, with Obama's agreement presumably, because of the election. We are a mess and Hillary would've emade sure that mess became a generations long one. Maybe Trump will fail miserably but Hillary was guaranteed to do so, in fact she promised it. Typical intolerant, knee-jerk reactions that lack any intellectual substance and critical thinking. Shame, because some of the people hating on Trump right now in this thread are known for their critical thinking and logical approach to other things, such as paranormal evidence and such. The majority of ignorance and intolerance seems to be coming from foreigners btw...those that have no say nor have no sway on what goes on here. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
preacherman76 Posted November 10, 2016 #168 Share Posted November 10, 2016 2 hours ago, ChrLzs said: Well, they won't be disappointed.... Expecting the worst is always a good strategy I reckon. If we are talking about a storm I guess. In this case you have people complaining about something that hasn't happened, and might not happen at all. Either way I think people should wait till they have something to complain about, instead of complaining for complaing's sake. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merc14 Posted November 10, 2016 #169 Share Posted November 10, 2016 16 minutes ago, Thorvir Hrothgaard said: Typical intolerant, knee-jerk reactions that lack any intellectual substance and critical thinking. Shame, because some of the people hating on Trump right now in this thread are known for their critical thinking and logical approach to other things, such as paranormal evidence and such. The majority of ignorance and intolerance seems to be coming from foreigners btw...those that have no say nor have no sway on what goes on here. I blame it on the press, Same thing when Obama was elected, no one in the media had even looked into the man's past much less read his book or asked why was he sitting in Reverend Wright's church for 20 years and has never heard one of his rage filled anti-American sermons (DVDs available in the church lobby, BTW). I remember two to of the line commentators who were huge fans of Obama sitting in front of the cameras the night he got elected and asking each other "What do we really know about Barack Obama?" and I screamed "Read his F'ing book you morons." Agree it is very disappointing that people who pride themselves on rational thinking are reacting irrationally. The man is two months away from swearing in, hasn't even selected a cabinet and Rachel Maddow is afraid of nuclear war. Somehow that crazy woman wasn't afraid if Hillary was elected: you know Hillary, the one who was threatening war with Russia. LMAO Al Trump is said is we have to stop rattling sabers with Putin and figure out how to work together to defeat ISIS, a far cry from Clinton's rhetoric. Classic I don't care what they said, I care about how I feel, leftist BS. Even I gave Obama a chance, recognized his presidency and hoped for the beat. Unfortunately I was far too prophetic. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted November 10, 2016 #170 Share Posted November 10, 2016 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Ellapennella said: actually I should ETA some more to that..like illegals , especially the criminal ones and people who do not believe in the rule of law. Wow thats incredibly immature of you Ella. Many people hate Trump for various reasons that doesnt make them bad people. His employees whom he busted their union, the scottish land owner who had his reputation smeared in Trumps golf course land grab and the folks who lost their savings at the fake Trump University would be good examples of people who have issues with Trump because of nothing to do with politics. Edited November 10, 2016 by Farmer77 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
preacherman76 Posted November 10, 2016 #171 Share Posted November 10, 2016 Ella wears her heart on her sleeve. She is good people, but tends to let emotions get the best of her. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Commander Travis Posted November 10, 2016 #172 Share Posted November 10, 2016 37 minutes ago, Farmer77 said: You really should throw an "LOL" at the end of that Ella So if people who support the Big fellow are Deplorable, those who deplore him are racist commie Marxist sharia loving anti American ignorant individuals? "Deplorable" is snappier. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vorg Posted November 10, 2016 #173 Share Posted November 10, 2016 A democracy voted Trump as next president, and the left needs to get over it. There are protest, and all kinds of efforts calling for his dismissal, etc..and unless between now, and inauguration day something keeps him from being there, he will be the 45th president. Sure, he upset the status quo, which is why I voted for him. This country needed a release from the political elites who really control who is elected, at that level. According to the wikileaks email, the media colluded with each other to push the 3 weakest candidates ahead of the pack on the republican side, ensuring Hillary an easy win, however it backfired on them. He was shown trailing in the polls, always, then pulled of a stunner to the world. Thing is, to me, had the polls been accurate we could have foreseen this. Fox was basically the only ones showing Trump leading here and there, and mainstream media always showed him trailing. To me, the polls were what mainstream media wanted people to see, this way the undecided ones would vote for Hillary. I say give Trump a chance. I really believe he will be a great leader when all is said and done. He will sit and listen to counselors and advisors, before making tough decisions, and not be some rogue leader who gets mad at North Korea or some other nation and says "hand me the nuke button" like only the gullible would have you believe. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ellapenella Posted November 10, 2016 #174 Share Posted November 10, 2016 (edited) 2 hours ago, Thorvir Hrothgaard said: Way to stoop to their level. And way to post a generalizing, inaccurate claim. Unless you can prove your claim...? Because I despise Trump personally....me, Mr. Rightie. So does that mean I'm a racist commie Marxist sharia loving anti American ignorant individual? You don't like Trump but you wanted who? Cruz? So in other words you wanted more of what ?the same ol' hacks....So I should add people like yourself who just didn't get it as the un informed bunch to the list. You only voted for Trump because it was either him or Hillary but you were all ready and willing to vote for the establishment which was what? more bad deals more immigration and un safe borders. give me a break with your self righteous attitude.. I was for Sanders for a couple of weeks at first until I looked into socialism and how it just isn't American. But I'll tell you what, I unlike you was never for the establishment. You people need to wake up and be thankful. Edited November 10, 2016 by Ellapennella Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stereologist Posted November 10, 2016 #175 Share Posted November 10, 2016 I may be a late comer but Bernie and his pals are saying I told you so http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/11/09/team-bernie-on-trump-we-told-you-so.html 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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