Paranormal Panther Posted January 22, 2017 #551 Share Posted January 22, 2017 1 hour ago, South Alabam said: I don't understand why some on the left think Trump hates Jews, Blacks, Lesbians, Gays etc.. Just uniformed I would suppose. You say uninformed, and I say dishonest. We're likely both right. Do these leftists know that his daughter is Jewish? Do they know that his grandchildren and son-in-law are Jews? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setton Posted January 22, 2017 #552 Share Posted January 22, 2017 Is it really conspiracy theory when one of them actively supported syphoning money off HIV treatment for gay conversion 'therapy' and the other openly denies the reality of climate change? Do you actually expect those pages to go back on the site under this administration? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michelle Posted January 22, 2017 #553 Share Posted January 22, 2017 6 minutes ago, Setton said: Is it really conspiracy theory when one of them actively supported syphoning money off HIV treatment for gay conversion 'therapy' and the other openly denies the reality of climate change? Do you actually expect those pages to go back on the site under this administration? I have no idea what you are talking about with the HIV thing. You have to take everything into perspective. Hillary, Bill and Obama, and no telling how many of their appointees, were all against gay marriage before they changed their minds a couple of short years ago. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Careful_perspective Posted January 22, 2017 #554 Share Posted January 22, 2017 (edited) 27 minutes ago, Setton said: Don't know about Jews and Blacks but his choice of cabinet members and running mate are definitely worrying for LGBT people. That and the disappearance of the LGBT rights page of the white house website. All the pages changed from when Bush left office and Obama came in too. They were archived and you can still see them to this day. This is standard procedure, why should the White House page be the policies of Obama now that Trump is in charge. Edited January 22, 2017 by Rinna 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paranormal Panther Posted January 22, 2017 #555 Share Posted January 22, 2017 11 hours ago, Avatar Samantha Ai said: Last April the Anti-Defamation League asked Trump not to use the phrase "America First". http://www.adl.org/press-center/press-releases/anti-semitism-usa/adl-urges-donald-trump-to-reconsider-america-first.html? Well he kept using it including during the inauguration. David Duke whose website dukeforsenate features the slogan has also tweeted, "Trump Inauguration Speech Declares War on the Neocons & Promotes Our Slogan "America First!" It is doubtful Trump cares or Netanyahu either for that matter. Although if push comes to shove they would likely disavow Duke. It is not surprising that others found anti-Semitism within Trump's speech. Time will tell where his heart is. Each can make up their own mind now or later. Who cares what the ADL say? There is absolutely nothing wrong with putting America first. The anti-Semitic card is laughable too. Did you know that Trump's grandchildren and son-in-law are Jews? Did you know that his daughter is Jewish? He wants strong ties with Israel. Look at what the Obama administration did to them. You claim to be big on proof, so prove that Trump is anti-Jewish, and prove that he made anti-Jewish comments in his inaugural speech. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setton Posted January 22, 2017 #556 Share Posted January 22, 2017 4 minutes ago, Michelle said: I have no idea what you are talking about with the HIV thing. You have to take everything into perspective. Hillary, Bill and Obama, and no telling how many of their appointees, were all against gay marriage before they changed their minds a couple of short years ago. Pence has been a staunch opponent of efforts to expand LGBT civil rights. In 2000, Pence stated "Congress should oppose any effort to recognize homosexuals as a 'discrete and insular minority' entitled to the protection of anti-discrimination laws similar to those extended to women and ethnic minorities."[161] He called for "an audit to ensure that federal dollars were no longer being given to organizations that celebrate and encourage the types of behaviors that facilitate the spreading of the HIV virus" and instead advocated for resources to be directed toward institutions "which provide assistance to those seeking to change their sexual behavior".[ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Pence#LGBT_rights 1 minute ago, Rinna said: All the pages changed from when Bush left office and Obama came in too. They were archived and you can still see them to this day. This is standard procedure, why should the White House page be the policies of Obama now that Trump is in charge. Yep, know that, covered that, see replies to Michelle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astra. Posted January 22, 2017 #557 Share Posted January 22, 2017 15 minutes ago, Captain Risky said: You know Astra, if Trump had any self control and didn't feel the need to come out and attack the media for pointing out the obvious I'd agree with you. He attacks anyone that thinks differently to him. Trump has declared war on twitter with anyone, anytime, regardless of their station if they disagree with his god given right to rule the U.S. in his own image. I understand the boundaries of Free speech and all and yes, Lilly was pointing out a valid point. But imagining Madonna blowing up the white house is just a joke and more importantly figure of speech. Trump is outspoken, opinionated and a plain speaking man and he shouldn't have a problem with others that are too. Trump's a big boy. I'm aware that Donald Trump can be thin skinned at times - and he has certainly been known to come back on the attack. I have never been overly fussed on the man - and probably never will be. The thing is - he is now in power and people have to accept this. I'm also for freedom of speech, and people need to / and should have a right to express themselves by getting their message across. I have always liked Madonna and her music. And I'm aware she probably used those words only as a figure of speech regarding her thoughts about 'blowing up the white house'. But in light of some of the destruction that is currently taking place with the anti-Trump thugs on the streets...I feel that her chosen words were not only stupid.....but were also irresponsible. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Careful_perspective Posted January 22, 2017 #558 Share Posted January 22, 2017 2 minutes ago, Astra. said: But in light of some of the destruction that is currently taking place with the anti-Trump thugs on the streets...I feel that her chosen words were not only stupid.....but were also irresponsible. This! So much this. Free speech should be protected, but speech about provoking violence should not. Imagine if one of Trump's associates had said "I thought about blowing up that women's march.." Oh my goodness, the media would lose their collective minds! 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unusual Tournament Posted January 22, 2017 #559 Share Posted January 22, 2017 2 minutes ago, Astra. said: I'm aware that Donald Trump can be thin skinned at times - and he has certainly been known to come back on the attack. I have never been overly fussed on the man - and probably never will be. The thing is - he is now in power and people have to accept this. I'm also for freedom of speech, and people need to / and should have a right to express themselves by getting their message across. I have always liked Madonna and her music. And I'm aware she probably used those words only as a figure of speech regarding her thoughts about 'blowing up the white house'. But in light of some of the destruction that is currently taking place with the anti-Trump thugs on the streets...I feel that her chosen words were not only stupid.....but were also irresponsible. BOLDED: Totally agree. Madonna and alot of other artists seem to think that their popularity is a licence to avoid the social and legal constraints that the rest of us have to suffer. She's a idiot for being outspoken on such a matter and no different to what she hates about president Trump. But a threat? C'mon. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michelle Posted January 22, 2017 #560 Share Posted January 22, 2017 9 minutes ago, Setton said: Pence has been a staunch opponent of efforts to expand LGBT civil rights. In 2000, Pence stated "Congress should oppose any effort to recognize homosexuals as a 'discrete and insular minority' entitled to the protection of anti-discrimination laws similar to those extended to women and ethnic minorities."[161] He called for "an audit to ensure that federal dollars were no longer being given to organizations that celebrate and encourage the types of behaviors that facilitate the spreading of the HIV virus" and instead advocated for resources to be directed toward institutions "which provide assistance to those seeking to change their sexual behavior".[ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Pence#LGBT_rights Well, I look at it this way...I'm an Atheist and my husband is kind of Christian lite. I wish we could agree on every single issue that is important to both of us. We agree to disagree on certain things, but the others would have been deal breakers. We compromise and find a happy medium. You'll never find anyone you agree with 100% and neither will anyone else. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setton Posted January 22, 2017 #561 Share Posted January 22, 2017 Just now, Michelle said: Well, I look at it this way...I'm an Atheist and my husband is kind of Christian lite. I wish we could agree on every single issue that is important to both of us. We agree to disagree on certain things, but the others would have been deal breakers. We compromise and find a happy medium. You'll never find anyone you agree with 100% and neither will anyone else. I think it's a slightly different matter when someone writes you off as ill and worth less than other people (see also Pence's comments on 'family values' and homosexuality). You might disagree with your husband on some small issues but presumably nothing too drastic. As you say, they would have been deal breakers. Well Trump choosing Pence as a running mate was the deal breaker for lots of LGBT people. They're not asking for a VP who 100% agrees with them, they're asking for one who values them the same as any other person. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astra. Posted January 22, 2017 #562 Share Posted January 22, 2017 1 hour ago, Michelle said: I surprised they let men march. They aren't all inclusive. They scared the women who aren't pro choice off. If you don't march to the beat of their drum you weren't welcome. I'm also pro choice - but either way everyone should have a right to march without feeling bullied or intimated. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michelle Posted January 22, 2017 #563 Share Posted January 22, 2017 Just now, Astra. said: I'm also pro choice - but either way everyone should have a right to march without feeling bullied or intimated. It makes them nothing but bigots and they, like many others, helped get Trump elected. Their way or no way! People are tired of it. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Careful_perspective Posted January 22, 2017 #564 Share Posted January 22, 2017 2 minutes ago, Michelle said: It makes them nothing but bigots and they, like many others, helped get Trump elected. Their way or no way! People are tired of it. You're only a real feminist if you have the exact same views as they do. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawken Posted January 22, 2017 #565 Share Posted January 22, 2017 24 minutes ago, Astra. said: I'm aware that Donald Trump can be thin skinned at times - and he has certainly been known to come back on the attack. I have never been overly fussed on the man - and probably never will be. The thing is - he is now in power and people have to accept this. I'm also for freedom of speech, and people need to / and should have a right to express themselves by getting their message across. I have always liked Madonna and her music. And I'm aware she probably used those words only as a figure of speech regarding her thoughts about 'blowing up the white house'. But in light of some of the destruction that is currently taking place with the anti-Trump thugs on the streets...I feel that her chosen words were not only stupid.....but were also irresponsible. She crossed the line. There's a difference between free speech and making idle threats to the president (like him or not) and attempting to incite more riots. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michelle Posted January 22, 2017 #566 Share Posted January 22, 2017 16 minutes ago, Setton said: I think it's a slightly different matter when someone writes you off as ill and worth less than other people (see also Pence's comments on 'family values' and homosexuality). You might disagree with your husband on some small issues but presumably nothing too drastic. As you say, they would have been deal breakers. Well Trump choosing Pence as a running mate was the deal breaker for lots of LGBT people. They're not asking for a VP who 100% agrees with them, they're asking for one who values them the same as any other person. You can't have everything. They don't have to live together and Trump is pretty good at telling people when he's heard enough. I'm sure if he tells Pence to drop it, he will. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setton Posted January 22, 2017 #567 Share Posted January 22, 2017 3 minutes ago, Michelle said: You can't have everything. They don't have to live together and Trump is pretty good at telling people when he's heard enough. I'm sure if he tells Pence to drop it, he will. They aren't asking for 'everything'. They're asking to be treated as equals. We can only hope that Trump doesn't share Pence's views and you're right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Merton Posted January 22, 2017 #568 Share Posted January 22, 2017 14 hours ago, Setton said: I'm not saying the reasons you stated aren't factors in the lower attendance at Trump's inauguration, just that they're not the only ones. The simple fact is that Trump is not as popular now as Obama was at his first inauguration. It's not bias or hating on Trump or denying any of the other reasons that lead to the lower attendance. It's simple maths. A little dissatisfaction with Trump may already be setting in (he can't possibly do all the stuff he promised); then, again, it is easy to travel a couple miles to a local rally, harder to take the time to go to DC -- and DC and all the area around it is very blue. By the way, I assume we all understand that the red hats stood for red states, not for Communism. Nowadays Communism is dead except for a few aging dictators trying to use the ideology as an excuse for holding power. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baz Dane Posted January 22, 2017 #569 Share Posted January 22, 2017 24 minutes ago, Captain Risky said: BOLDED: Totally agree. Madonna and alot of other artists seem to think that their popularity is a licence to avoid the social and legal constraints that the rest of us have to suffer. She's a idiot for being outspoken on such a matter and no different to what she hates about president Trump. But a threat? C'mon. The threat is the complete MORON... and there's plenty to chose from lately... that takes her words seriously and goes about making it happen. These celebrities blathering on are beyond rediculous and sickening... and dangerous too. As evidenced, there are already enough stupid sheeple running around out there with no other intent than to disrupt civilized society. We don't need celebrities throwing fuel on the fire with their own stupidity spewing from their mouths, while perched on a soapbox, in front of masses of mindless drones gobbling it up. Remember when John Hickley Jr shot President Reagan because of Hinckley's supposed infatuation of a celebrity... Jody Foster. That moron didn't even need a trigger like Madonna's comments to set him off... and of course back then Foster didn't say anything politically... but can you imagine if Foster had actually said something like ..."I'm angry... I have thought an awful lot about shooting Ronald Reagan". These celebrities need to keep their mouths shut when it comes to politics. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setton Posted January 22, 2017 #570 Share Posted January 22, 2017 1 minute ago, Frank Merton said: A little dissatisfaction with Trump may already be setting in (he can't possibly do all the stuff he promised); then, again, it is easy to travel a couple miles to a local rally, harder to take the time to go to DC -- and DC and all the area around it is very blue. By the way, I assume we all understand that the red hats stood for red states, not for Communism. Nowadays Communism is dead except for a few aging dictators trying to use the ideology as an excuse for holding power. I think you're still overcomplicating things. Less popular president = smaller crowd at inauguration. That should be obvious but some people want to take anything as an attack on Trump and try to make unnecessary excuses. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Careful_perspective Posted January 22, 2017 #571 Share Posted January 22, 2017 Honestly, with how extreme some people are behaving, the idea Madonna is normalizing thoughts of blowing up the White House is troublesome. Blow up the White House? So basically, she has no respect for our government, or one of our nations most historic buildings. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michelle Posted January 22, 2017 #572 Share Posted January 22, 2017 2 minutes ago, Setton said: They aren't asking for 'everything'. They're asking to be treated as equals. We can only hope that Trump doesn't share Pence's views and you're right. Maybe you haven't noticed with any other president, but you can't make a decree and everyone across the country fall in line. Federal and state laws are two different things. It still won't change people's feelings. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Merton Posted January 22, 2017 #573 Share Posted January 22, 2017 4 minutes ago, Setton said: I think you're still overcomplicating things. Less popular president = smaller crowd at inauguration. That should be obvious but some people want to take anything as an attack on Trump and try to make unnecessary excuses. Really? I think your view way oversimplifies things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setton Posted January 22, 2017 #574 Share Posted January 22, 2017 Just now, Michelle said: Maybe you haven't noticed with any other president, but you can't make a decree and everyone across the country fall in line. Federal and state laws are two different things. It still won't change people's feelings. No but you can't deny that the president's stance on an issue will have an effect both on the perceptions of the public and of other politicians. I think I'm going to have to go with Terry Pratchett on government. What we really need are benevolent dictators. They make all good decisions and don't have to work their way through complicated political processes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Merton Posted January 22, 2017 #575 Share Posted January 22, 2017 4 minutes ago, Michelle said: Maybe you haven't noticed with any other president, but you can't make a decree and everyone across the country fall in line. Federal and state laws are two different things. It still won't change people's feelings. This is going to be the real flash point. Trump may say he has no problem with gay marriage and is not anti-semitic nor anti-Muslim and thinks women are equal and is not a racist, but his past history contains reason to doubt, and his list of proposed appointments to the Supreme Court was of conservatives that just delight the racists, so one has to wonder how honest he is being about all this. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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