Refugees/Citizens of Muslim Countries Barred

[Sweetpumper]

This is fantastic. Weird having a president that does stuff. And still no golf!

[Lilly]

Everyone can go back and forth as to which President (Obama or Trump) was or is 'messing up the most', but in the final analysis perhaps we should take a look back at what Khalid Sheik Mohammed said when he spilled the beans at Gitmo. KSM said that by causing large refugee populations to move into Europe and the USA this would give the Jihadists a real advantage. He also gave great insight into the mind set of Radical Islamic Extremism. These are not 'good people', there is no such thing as 'moral relativism' where people like this are concerned. Shutting down movement of non-citizens for 90 days in order to re-group doesn't seem all that excessive to me.

Information on Khalid Sheik Mohammed:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/a-horrifying-look-into-the-mind-of-911s-mastermind-in-his-own-words/2016/11/28/bf5827a8-b575-11e6-b8df-600bd9d38a02_story.html?utm_term=.f2219a1fba24

[Lilly]

6 minutes ago, Avatar Samantha Ai said:

 

http://www.npr.org/2017/01/29/512305163/fact-check-trump-tweets-on-christians-isis-and-vetting-miss-the-bigger-picture

But that number of Christian refugees did not all come from the war zone of Iraq and Syria. Christians compromise about 10% of the population in Iraq and Syria but only 1% have been given asylum elsewhere. The Pope (a couple of years ago) referred to what's happening to Christians in Iraq and Syria as being essentially genocide.

[Clarakore]

1 minute ago, Lilly said:

But that number of Christian refugees did not all come from the war zone of Iraq and Syria. Christians compromise about 10% of the population in Iraq and Syria but only 1% have been given asylum elsewhere. The Pope (a couple of years ago) referred to what's happening to Christians in Iraq and Syria as being essentially genocide.

 

Quote

It's true that 99 percent of the 12,587 refugees from Syria admitted in 2016 to the U.S. were Muslim and less than 1 percent were Christian. That would outpace Muslims' population in Syria, which is 93 percent. But that's based on 2010 numbers. With the civil war going on and the millions who have been displaced, it's nearly impossible to tell exactly what the most current percentages are.

Another possible reason for the lower percentage of Christians being admitted from Syria to the U.S. is because of protection they have received from the Assad regime.

As the Christian Post reported in 2015:

"Christians, who have been caught in the crossfire of the Arab Spring and civil war, have found a measure of protection under Assad's dictatorship.In October, the Catholic Herald reported on comments from one of Syria's leading Christians who said [Russian President Vladimir] Putin's intervention, while possibly motivated by selfish reasons, is helping and giving hope to Christians."

http://www.npr.org/2017/01/29/512305163/fact-check-trump-tweets-on-christians-isis-and-vetting-miss-the-bigger-picture

[Clarakore]

7 minutes ago, Lilly said:

...The Pope (a couple of years ago) referred to what's happening to Christians in Iraq and Syria as being essentially genocide.

 

Quote

Syrian Archbishop: The Pope Is Right, The Definition Of ‘Genocide’ Applied To The Plight Of Christians In The Middle East Is Misleading

Even for Archbishop Hindo, the definition of genocide does not apply to the sufferings of Christians even on a historical effectual plan, “because there are many more Muslims, even Sunnis, who are killed as apostates by fanatic jihadists”.

https://hcef.org/790801170-syrian-archbishop-pope-right-definition-genocide-applied-plight-christians-middle-east-misleading/

[Lilly]

The thing is, ISIS wants to get all Muslims to capitulate to their Radical form of Islam, but ISIS just wants to eradicate Christians. And therein lies the difference.

[Clarakore]

16 minutes ago, Lilly said:

Everyone can go back and forth as to which President (Obama or Trump) was or is 'messing up the most', but in the final analysis perhaps we should take a look back at what Khalid Sheik Mohammed said when he spilled the beans at Gitmo. KSM said that by causing large refugee populations to move into Europe and the USA this would give the Jihadists a real advantage. He also gave great insight into the mind set of Radical Islamic Extremism. These are not 'good people', there is no such thing as 'moral relativism' where people like this are concerned. Shutting down movement of non-citizens for 90 days in order to re-group doesn't seem all that excessive to me.

Information on Khalid Sheik Mohammed:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/a-horrifying-look-into-the-mind-of-911s-mastermind-in-his-own-words/2016/11/28/bf5827a8-b575-11e6-b8df-600bd9d38a02_story.html?utm_term=.f2219a1fba24

 

On 1/28/2017 at 9:55 AM, Lilly said:

That was 16 years ago, the main threat now is from ISIS in Syria and Iraq.

 

Using your own logic KSM was 16 years ago, the main threat is from ISIS in Syria and Iraq.

KSM is Al-Qaeda and not ISIS.

[Lilly]

3 minutes ago, Avatar Samantha Ai said:

 

 

Using your own logic KSM was 16 years ago, the main threat is from ISIS in Syria and Iraq.

KSM is Al-Qaeda and not ISIS.

Look, the mind set of Radical Jihadist Extremism hasn't changed both Al Qaeda and The Islamic State are on the same page there. The locations where said Radical Jihadist Extremism is being tolerated/allowed has changed though.

Edited January 30, 2017 by Lilly
oops

[aztek]

1 hour ago, Farmer77 said:

Some differences : Did President Obama ‘Ban’ Iraqi Refugees?

While Obama did halt the refugee program, it did not impact green card holders, or anyone with a visa. It also did not affect refugees who had already gone through the vetting process. Trump’s travel ban barred entry to the United States to those groups, causing a chaotic situation for travelers from the seven affected countries and leading to protests at airports across the country.

 

Trump’s order gives preference to religious minority groups, such as Christians, when the admissions resume, according to The New York Times.

Obama didn’t give any preference to religious minority groups, and his action was limited to refugee resettlement

 

 

 

 

 

trump's order has nothing to do with religion, even Christians, or Jews coming from those countries would be treated the same

[ellapenella]

24 minutes ago, Avatar Samantha Ai said:

 

http://www.npr.org/2017/01/29/512305163/fact-check-trump-tweets-on-christians-isis-and-vetting-miss-the-bigger-picture

The agency within the Homeland Security Department that issues noncitizens their long-sought-after “green cards” continues to produce documents with errors while sending others to the wrong recipients, the department’s inspector general found.

"This is unacceptable. We cannot let 'free passes' into America fall into the wrong hands and be used by terrorists, criminals, or others to hide amongst us. Whether it's aviation security or the security of our immigration system, the American people are losing faith that DHS is able to do its job. This is yet another wake-up call that it's time for sweeping reform across the department.”

http://www.govexec.com/technology/2016/11/thousands-immigrant-green-cards-have-gone-missing-watchdog-finds/133370/

The main issue we face is, our national security.

[Farmer77]

1 minute ago, aztek said:

trump's order has nothing to do with religion, even Christians, or Jews coming from those countries would be treated the same

From the horseasses mouth: 

President Donald Trump said in a new interview Friday that persecuted Christians will be given priority over other refugees seeking to enter the United States, saying they have been "horribly treated."

Trump says US will prioritize Christian refugees

[Clarakore]

5 minutes ago, Lilly said:

The thing is, ISIS wants to get all Muslims to capitulate to their Radical form of Islam, but ISIS just wants to eradicate Christians. And therein lies the difference.

Theories and hypotheticals abounding, in practice ISIS kills more "apostate" Muslims than Christians.

No one is falling for the sensationalism and fear mongering. 

[Farmer77]

1 minute ago, Ellapennella said:

The main issue we face is, our national security.

I would contend that the main issue we face is balancing the need for security with maintaining our freedoms and identity. 

[imrunningthismonkeyfarm]

12 minutes ago, Lilly said:

But that number of Christian refugees did not all come from the war zone of Iraq and Syria. Christians compromise about 10% of the population in Iraq and Syria but only 1% have been given asylum elsewhere. The Pope (a couple of years ago) referred to what's happening to Christians in Iraq and Syria as being essentially genocide.

Yes. Thousands of Christains are beheaded in Muslim countries or driven out, not welcome and no one does anything but then a strong president with his country and its citizens are put first and everyone cries about it.

Too many traitors in the world.

 

[aztek]

4 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

From the horseasses mouth: 

President Donald Trump said in a new interview Friday that persecuted Christians will be given priority over other refugees seeking to enter the United States, saying they have been "horribly treated."

Trump says US will prioritize Christian refugees

so? yea given priority, not allowed to skip the vetting, and they are treated horribly.  by none other than Muslims due to religion, some of whom, i have no doubt try to come here,

Edited January 30, 2017 by aztek

[Lilly]

Just now, Avatar Samantha Ai said:

 

No one is falling for the sensationalism and fear mongering. 

Seriously? 'Fear mongering' because one doesn't want to risk monsters like ISIS entering into their country?

[Farmer77]

Just now, aztek said:

so? yea given priority, not allowed to skip the vetting, and they are treated horribly.  

SO, your own words were that they would be treated the same, Trumps own words said Christians will get priority. 

[aztek]

2 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

SO, your own words were that they would be treated the same, Trumps own words said Christians will get priority. 

ok, you got a point here, they will be vetted before muslims

[Lilly]

Just now, Farmer77 said:

SO, your own words were that they would be treated the same, Trumps own words said Christians will get priority. 

That is interesting, perhaps Trump sees Christians in this particular area (Iraq and Syria) as being even more vulnerable somehow? Personally, I think the Yazidi, Shia and Kurds are quite likely equally vulnerable.

[ellapenella]

2 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

I would contend that the main issue we face is balancing the need for security with maintaining our freedoms and identity. 

The deficit  too is being balanced right now.

[Clarakore]

7 minutes ago, Lilly said:

Look, the mind set of Radical Jihadist Extremism hasn't changed both Al Qaeda and The Islamic State are on the same page there. The locations where said Radical Jihadist Extremism is being tolerated/allowed has changed though.

They are not on the same page. The following is from prepared testimony before the Subcommittee on Counterterrorism and Intelligence of the House Committee on Homeland Security.

Quote

Comparing Al Qaeda and ISIS: Different goals, different targets 

Al Qaeda and its affiliates remain a threat to the U.S. homeland, while the Islamic State’s danger is more to the stability of the Middle East and U.S. interests overseas. 

Much of their rivalry involves a competition for affiliates, with both trying to spread their model and in Al Qaeda’s case to ensure its operational relevance.

For now the Islamic State’s focus is primarily on Iraq and Syria and to a lesser degree on other states in the Muslim world, particularly Libya. In the United States and in Europe it may inspire “lone wolves,” but it is not directing its resources to attack in these areas, and security services are prepared for the threat.

Al Qaeda is weaker and less dynamic than the Islamic State, but the former remains more focused on attacking the United States and its Western allies.

https://www.brookings.edu/testimonies/comparing-al-qaeda-and-isis-different-goals-different-targets/

[White Unicorn]

Just now, Lilly said:

That is interesting, perhaps Trump sees Christians in this particular area (Iraq and Syria) as being even more vulnerable somehow? Personally, I think the Yazidi, Shia and Kurds are quite likely equally vulnerable.

I think the whole thing ended up in a mess this time because Homeland security wasn't  informed enough by the Administration on the particulars of  how to handle the executive order. The Trump people don't seem well coordinated or experienced enough on security to know how to make it work seamlessly yet. 

[ellapenella]

Just now, White Unicorn said:

I think the whole thing ended up in a mess this time because Homeland security wasn't  informed enough by the Administration on the particulars of  how to handle the executive order. The Trump people don't seem well coordinated or experienced enough on security to know how to make it work seamlessly yet. 

Oh, simple as that right? Not.

It seems like Obama's HLS & President Trump's HLS differ. Obama's did a lot of negligence,deliberate possibly.

[imrunningthismonkeyfarm]

5 minutes ago, Lilly said:

That is interesting, perhaps Trump sees Christians in this particular area (Iraq and Syria) as being even more vulnerable somehow? Personally, I think the Yazidi, Shia and Kurds are quite likely equally vulnerable.

Every non Muslim soul on Earth is vulnerable as long as these vile cowards are spreading the word of radical Islam. Unfortunately it's too late now, we've let them over run us. We are in the minority now. The time to end this mindless violence was at the beginning.

[Clarakore]

In more fake news...

Quote

Sean Spicer Uses San Bernardino Shooting To Justify Muslim Ban

The shooters weren’t tied to any of the countries targeted in the ban.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/sean-spicer-san-bernardino_us_588f3d65e4b08a14f7e6f416?