Refugees/Citizens of Muslim Countries Barred

[Agent0range]

1 minute ago, F3SS said:

How many times do you need reminded of what you asked for? Lilly had very signicant posts earlier in this thread about why these seven countries are on the list and others like SA aren't and Rinna had a link about how these seven countries were chosen. Do keep up.

Aaaand, fiancee Visa's still aren't vetted as refugees.  That won't change, no matter how many times you say it.

[Careful_perspective]

It looks like it has been modified already:

"Green card holders already overseas seeking to return to their homes in the US will be processed through a waiver authority that has already been established.

One official said there is a case-by-case admissions process and another said it is being done "expeditiously."

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/01/28/politics/green-card-donald-trump-travel-ban/

 

 

Edited January 29, 2017 by Rinna

[Agent0range]

1 minute ago, Rinna said:

It looks like it has been modified already:

"Green card holders already overseas seeking to return to their homes in the US will be processed through a waiver authority that has already been established.

One official said there is a case-by-case admissions process and another said it is being done "expeditiously."

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/01/28/politics/green-card-donald-trump-travel-ban/

 

 

Oh, and I'm sure we should thank our President for that.  What a wonderful, kind, understanding man.  It certainly had nothing to do with the Federal Judge that granted the emergency stay.  

[Careful_perspective]

Just now, Agent0range said:

Oh, and I'm sure we should thank our President for that.  What a wonderful, kind, understanding man.  It certainly had nothing to do with the Federal Judge that granted the emergency stay.  

I didn't say who we should thank...just..posting the links. 

[Agent0range]

Just now, Rinna said:

I didn't say who we should thank...just..posting the links. 

I know.  I'm just completely disgusted right now.  It's not you.  I have never been ashamed of our country..I'm not yet, but I am damn close.

[F3SS]

So that's why we have checks and balances. To dot the I's and cross the T's that are sometimes overlooked and now maybe our green card holders won't be as put out.

[acidhead]

Hey Agent Orange... what's gotten into you man?  After 8 yrs in the service and 4 of them on tour in the ME you've now developed a syndrome which is at odds?  I think this is called the Obama syndrome or effect.  Don't feel guilty man.  Be angry at being lied to, mislead, used and made to feel remorseful for the repercussions now at hand.  It is what it is... the bed has been made.  Where were you and others when Obomber was droning the ME for the last 8 yrs????????

[Unusual Tournament]

1 hour ago, Rinna said:

It looks like it has been modified already:

"Green card holders already overseas seeking to return to their homes in the US will be processed through a waiver authority that has already been established.

One official said there is a case-by-case admissions process and another said it is being done "expeditiously."

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/01/28/politics/green-card-donald-trump-travel-ban/

 

 

LOL... the only modification that Trump made was to exclude Middle Eastern country's with whom he has business links with... Turkey, Saudi Arabia and Egypt. Where's the FBI director now!

http://fortune.com/2017/01/27/donald-trump-muslim-immigration-ban-conflict/

[The Butler]

4 minutes ago, Captain Risky said:

LOL... the only modification that Trump made was to exclude Middle Eastern country's with whom he has business links with... Turkey, Saudi Arabia and Egypt. Where's the FBI director now!

http://fortune.com/2017/01/27/donald-trump-muslim-immigration-ban-conflict/

Yeah, there's no chance of terrorists coming from those countries .......  

[Unusual Tournament]

Just now, The Butler said:

Yeah, there's no chance of terrorists coming from those countries .......  

Man, not even Afghanistan made Trump's list... can you believe that. 

[Unusual Tournament]

1 hour ago, F3SS said:

So that's why we have checks and balances. To dot the I's and cross the T's that are sometimes overlooked and now maybe our green card holders won't be as put out.

The checks and balances you're refering to have nothing to do with a conflict of interest. 

Edited January 29, 2017 by Captain Risky

[acidhead]

10 hours ago, Yamato said:

Then there's also the Constitution.    But I guess if one can't make the laws, just skip the laws, and defacto make them up yourself with orders!   Incidentally that's how we wound up in another war zone like Syria in the first place.   Or-durr. 

Our policy in Syria since the day the Obama administration walked in has been stalemate while we search far and wide for our "moderates" sweethearts and patsies.  Just grinding up the meat into perpetuity while we hope to change yet another regime, replete with the red white and blue bells and whistles a snowflake needs to hear like "no boots on the ground".    It's illegal as crime and wrong as sin.

Once upon a time way back when in 2002, the R's and the D's delegated their authority to the President over Iraq because of 9/11 citing UN resolutions as the authority for the President to be able to decide the issue.   And predictably we wind up thinking a decade or two later that religion is the problem.   Now our President is a King who can do whatever the hell he wants to out there in the whole of the Middle East and beyond, a Congress and a nation of voters too stupid by an order of magnitude to stop it.

That we should even be here at all, minding these midget problems that result from this titanic blunder....like affirmative action rhetoric over how many Christians.   Just how dark and deep is this hole anyway, has anyone at least got a flashlight?

If Assad had to go, and more violence was the enlightened religion-free American whitewash solution to the problem, that's what should have been done all the way..   Assad wouldn't have lasted five weeks if the US took care of it like it could have.   But we play the stalemate game of hamburger hill instead.   Hundreds of thousands are now dead.  Scores of cities and towns completely destroyed.  Nobody grieves, nobody even cares.  It's just wanton violence in the end.   wanton violence followed by a lack of compassion for human beings who've been through said hell.  

What the heck is going on here?   What's the big stinking problem with Assad fighting terrorism in his own country?   Assad lets arms slip through to Hezbollah (according to globalist bureaucrats, a terrorist organization) so Hezbollah could defend Lebanon from Israeli forces who invaded.   That was a big opportunity to defacto annex s'more land which got blown.  The Hez put an AK-47 on their flag, that's not going to play well politically for Israel's national security.  So this is all about Israel once again using us like a little bee itch to clean up its own self-proclaimed mess, and thus, "Assad Must Go."   Obama made enormous apologistic claims for Israel before he was ever even President.   And Master Bibi has had nothing but praise for him ever since.   But, what we could do today....

I do have a fool's hope however.   It's that in the end, the Donald won't bow down at the foot of The Bibi unless it serves his own interests.   King Bibi does have tremendous control over the minds of our bipartisan automaton, but at the end of the day, Bibi won't tell what to do, Donald will tell Bibi.  

We now live in a reality where the President makes the deals (makes the money).   Tell me, what fabulous ideas for profitable real estate wealth don't exist when you can steal the deeds, the keys and the house right out of peoples' hands.   

I must be old fashioned or something, I still believe in property rights.  

Ohhhhhh, they're brown people.   Brown peoples' hands.   Now I see.   Imagine, a political movement of Europeans and Americans invading the Semites, and calling anything else that doesn't agree with it "anti-Semitic".   That's one hell of a trick, that they can even pull it off is incredible.

But nevermind all that....

We now return to our regularly scheduled programming of fooling around with "radical Islamic terrorists", being the wind-up-doll voice boxes of their propaganda, stealing (taking), murdering (liberating), making it worth our while (making it great again), $$ & et al.

 

 

Its a fools game Yam...... there's no hope.....  hope has no basis in reality.  We're f----ed either way  with us or without us strategy.  No wonder GWB was so relaxed during the invasion of Iraq when troops returned home in body bags.... remember how calm he acted?  people hate me for this but its soooo obvious Israel is taking over the ME using the USA and its troops lives..... it's obvious a calculation has been determined that the use of force is the only way to stop the spread of Islam

Edited January 29, 2017 by acidhead

[toast]

7 hours ago, Avatar Samantha Ai said:

Are people actually doing that? 

Unfortunately, a lot. But I hope he will carry on in the same fashion like he did since last week as I think that is the only way to make more ppl aware about the fact that he isnt a president of the people but a magnet for trouble and a bad one man show as well. So lets cross fingers.

Edited January 29, 2017 by toast

[bee]

3 hours ago, acidhead said:

Its a fools game Yam...... there's no hope.....  hope has no basis in reality.  We're f----ed either way  with us or without us strategy. No wonder GWB was so relaxed during the invasion of Iraq when troops returned home in body bags.... remember how calm he acted?  people hate me for this but its soooo obvious Israel is taking over the ME using the USA and its troops lives..... it's obvious a calculation has been determined that the use of force is the only way to stop the spread of Islam

.

re bolded - he was probably on medication .... prozac or something similar  (I'm not joking)

I don't think we are definitely f......ed - although there may be a very rocky road ahead especially
with the Globalists creating such havoc, indoctrinating people with MSM, Face Book Twitter etc -

.

 

[Farmer77]

Trump's executive orders dramatically expand power of immigration officers 

My biggest concern about Trump's anti immigrant campaign has been the logistics. How do you kick out illegal immigrants in the aggressive manner which he suggested during the campaign while preserving the rights of the rest of us. 

"An ICE officer is now making the determination to detain and deport someone that no one has adjudicated for veracity," Altman said. "Innocent people get arrested in the United States a lot. ... Especially among communities of color, there are always going to be instances of racial profiling, and minorities face more aggressive policing than white communities -- that's true as well for immigrant communities. This (order) renders presumption of innocence completely meaningless."

[Claire.]

Interesting recent report on Muslim-American Involvement with violent extremism. Bottom-line, since 9/11, no one has been killed here in a terrorist attack by anyone who emigrated from or whose parents emigrated from Syria, Iraq, Iran, Libya, Somalia, Sudan and Yemen. And as that report states, of Muslim Americans involved in violent extremism of any kind (such as  plotting terrorism or supporting a terrorist group) only 23 percent had family backgrounds in those countries.

Stats sourced from the report and The New York Times

Also from that same NYT article:

There was a random quality to the list of countries: It excluded Saudi Arabia and Egypt, where the founders of Al Qaeda and many other jihadist groups have originated. Also excluded are Pakistan and Afghanistan, where persistent extremism and decades of war have produced militants who have occasionally reached the United States. Notably, perhaps, the list avoided Muslim countries where Mr. Trump has major business ventures.
Continue reading the main story

Nor did the list include the European countries where disenfranchised Muslim communities have become hotbeds of militancy, leading to major attacks in Paris and Brussels in the name of the Islamic State. Because no visas are required for travel by most European citizens to the United States, and because of the volume of tourism and business, restricting travel from Europe would have been far more difficult and consequential than banning it from only the seven countries named.

So um yeah, the ban will do little by way of making us safer. And even if it is temporary, there is little they can do within that short period of time to make the already stringent vetting process any better, because the improvement it needs (i.e., more comprehensive intelligence gathering and sharing for database purposes) is an iterative process.

[Farmer77]

US JUDGE BARS DEPORTATIONS UNDER TRUMP TRAVEL BAN

In her three-page order, Donnelly wrote that without the stay "there will be substantial and irreparable injury to refugees, visa-holders and other individuals from nations subject to the Jan. 27, 2017, executive order.

 

Good to see the checks and balances at work. 

 

[Farmer77]

2 minutes ago, Claire. said:

Interesting recent report on Muslim-American Involvement with violent extremism. Bottom-line, since 9/11, no one has been killed here in a terrorist attack by anyone who emigrated from or whose parents emigrated from Syria, Iraq, Iran, Libya, Somalia, Sudan and Yemen. And as that report states, of Muslim Americans involved in violent extremism of any kind (such as  plotting terrorism or supporting a terrorist group) only 23 percent had family backgrounds in those countries.

Stats sourced from the report and The New York Times

Also from that same NYT article:

There was a random quality to the list of countries: It excluded Saudi Arabia and Egypt, where the founders of Al Qaeda and many other jihadist groups have originated. Also excluded are Pakistan and Afghanistan, where persistent extremism and decades of war have produced militants who have occasionally reached the United States. Notably, perhaps, the list avoided Muslim countries where Mr. Trump has major business ventures.
Continue reading the main story

Nor did the list include the European countries where disenfranchised Muslim communities have become hotbeds of militancy, leading to major attacks in Paris and Brussels in the name of the Islamic State. Because no visas are required for travel by most European citizens to the United States, and because of the volume of tourism and business, restricting travel from Europe would have been far more difficult and consequential than banning it from only the seven countries named.

So um yeah, the ban will do little by way of making us safer. And even if it is temporary, there is little they can do within that short period of time to make the already stringent vetting process any better, because the improvement it needs (i.e., more comprehensive intelligence gathering and sharing for database purposes) is an iterative process.

In other words this is pure politics. 

[Claire.]

11 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

In other words this is pure politics. 

Let's face it, they picked on countries that are not in strong enough a position to retaliate politically, militarily or economically; not meaningful allies; and, not critical to Trump's business ventures. If you are going to do something like that for the reasons you stated, then do it right. Target ALL countries, including the European ones, that pose a potential threat. Don't be half-assed about it. Know in advance exactly what it is that you're trying to really accomplish, that this is indeed the way to do it, and have a plan and timeline in place to do it all.

This whole situation is just terrible, it really is. It's not who we are or should be.

Edited January 29, 2017 by Claire.
Grammatically challenged this morning.

[Jarocal]

43 minutes ago, Claire. said:

Let's face it, they picked on the countries that are not in a strong enough a position to retaliate politically, militarily or economically; not meaningful allies; and, not critical to Trump's business ventures. If you are going to do something like that for the reasons you stated, then do it right. Target ALL countries, including the European ones, that pose a potential threat. Don't be half-assed about it. Know in advance exactly what it is that you're trying to really accomplish, that this is indeed the way to do it, and have a plan and timeline in place to do it all.

This whole situation is just terrible, it really is. It's not who we are or should be.

I agree the situation is terrible, especially the part where the last eight years showed longterm continuation of a policy with meddling in the middle east.

  But please clarify why the temporary ban which would allow the incoming administration to review/revise policies for peoole coming to the US from those affected countries is evil or unamerican.

Everyone (including the NYT author who wrote the earlier linked article) knows Saudi Arabia is not on the list because of oil, and Egypt is not there because of it's weird relationship with Israel. Perhaps if both sides stopped using disingenuous arguments in their criticisms of the other side a dialog could be maintained. If the author of the article truly believes we should sever ties with the Saudi's and Egypt then they should state so and make a case for it. They should not use what has been a longstanding relationship to bash an administration this new.

Time to wake up in the actual world again not bash a one week old administration for continuation of strategic alliances which have been upheld for decades and would have been upheld by the candidate that news organization endorsed and projected to win the presidency.

 

As far as bans from European countries, their problems with immigrants wont become an issue here unless Merkel was nice enough to give them a German passport.

 

[F3SS]

There are suddenly a lot of new foreign policy experts here. It's only been one week out of 4 years. You all better gear up or you're going to end up in a funny farm. These hysterics aren't healthy for you.

Edited January 29, 2017 by F3SS

[Farmer77]

1 minute ago, F3SS said:

There are suddenly a lot of new foreign policy experts here. It's only been one week out of 4 years. You all better gear up or you're going to end up in a funny farm. These hysterics aren't healthy for you.

It doesnt take a foreign policy expert to point out the obvious issues with Trumps actions here. ...which fits i suppose since he isnt exactly a foreign policy expert 

[F3SS]

 

 

[Lilly]

15 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

It doesnt take a foreign policy expert to point out the obvious issues with Trumps actions here. ...which fits i suppose since he isnt exactly a foreign policy expert 

Like I said before, perhaps all this is being done for some purpose verses Trump just being a 'screw up'?

[StarMountainKid]

(White House policy director) Miller also noted on Saturday that Trump administration officials are discussing the possibility of asking foreign visitors to disclose all websites and social media sites they visit, and to share the contacts in their cell phones. If the foreign visitor declines to share such information, he or she could be denied entry. Sources told CNN that the idea is just in the preliminary discussion level.

CNN

I wonder what's next after this?