+and-then Posted April 1, 2017 #351 Share Posted April 1, 2017 33 minutes ago, Farmer77 said: Whether someone from the "other side of the aisle" broke some laws in order to tell others that team trump was shady has nothing to do with whether or not team trump actually is shady. I have to say that having watched the interview in question im not entirely sure all the claims from the right about it are true, more to the point I dont really care. Put her on trial and end the bickering Two issues and BOTH are important. The FBI seems to already be in the process of investigating any ties, collusion or tampering in the election by Russia/Trump. That investigation could take years. THAT is not beneficial for Trump or the country but it certainly allows the Left to continue with unprovable insinuations, yes? If EVIDENCE that Trump colluded with Russian officials or even affiliated hackers, to win the election can be produced and that evidence doesn't require guessing about what effect such hacking had on the process then I'll be all about Trump's removal. But to dig up some vague or tangential connections without proving that the effects actually cost HRC the election, THAT is still just conjecture. Meanwhile, I have no bloodlust for Farcas or anyone else to go to prison. Give someone immunity. But if a formerU.S. government official openly brags about disseminating "intelligence" and "sources and methods" (Farcas' words on air) about a U.S. citizen who is NOT a target in an investigation then someone at her pay grade or above needs to be sworn in and deposed under oath. Give her/them immunity. I just want to know which official in the Obama government unmasked and disseminated that identity and whatever facts were associated with it, to multiple government agencies so that it could be leaked with a higher likelihood of the source remaining confidential. That all sounds like we're getting deep into the weeds but I can clear it all up for you VERY quickly. If this whole scandal got your name put out in the public and all sorts of insinuations were being carefully written to make you look like a criminal but to leave you with NO legal recourse against those who were lying about you, I think you would have a greater appreciation for how serious a matter this really is. This has been going on - by her timeline - since BEFORE Trump announced his candidacy. Her soliloquy on MSNBC made it seem that she was dealing with current info from intel sources that she had no clearance for since she left government service to work for the Clinton campaign in 2015. Maybe she, in her role as a "consultant" for MSNBC, was bragging about things she really hadn't done or she hadn't been as deeply connected to as she SAID on air on March 3rd, last. Maybe she had intel shared with her by HRC (another crime). If something like this had popped up on Fox and it was a former Trump campaign worker who had said things that looked like she was spilling some VERY serious secrets about him and the scandal, wouldn't YOU want to see that person interviewed under oath? Dude, I'm telling you, you are about to see a crap-storm like you cannot even imagine if Trump allows Session's assistant AG to order Comey to depose her OR Nunes sources. If she is placed in legal jeopardy and starts talking about who did what, when, this whole fishing expedition over Russia is going to explode into the biggest scandal since Watergate. The media will do everything they can to cover for the Dems and Obama's people by confusing the narrative as much as they can, but ultimately someone is going to have to provide EVIDENCE that Trump or his team colluded EFFECTIVELY with a foreign government to subvert a U.S. election. If that cannot be done and no evidence is shown to justify the unmasking of U.S. citizens who were not in government and in fact were part of an opposition campaign for president, for heaven's sake, somebody is going down hard. Farcas is looking a LOT like a potential sacrificial goat to me at this point. If she doesn't have a REALLY good counsel yet, she's a fool. Trump needs to stay of Twitter if he possibly can control himself and he needs to listen to Sessions on the course of this train wreck. The FBI is FAR better at probes like this than ANY House or Senate committee. Comey needs to be ordered by someone in authority NOT named Trump, to drag everyone potentially involved in this scandal into a well lighted room, with their own counsel, and they need to be sworn and deposed. After that, let the chips fall wherever they fall. If evidence is found of illegality by the current administration then Impeachment proceedings should begin and be made COMPLETELY PUBLIC. If, otoh, the evidence shows that someone in the previous administration was responsible for criminal misuse of intelligence assets, THEY should be tried with complete public access to the record. This ****-storm needs cleaning up and when it's all over, the public needs EVIDENCE of who did what and what sanctions they have suffered for the crimes. Anything less and I think we can call finished on trust in our government from now on. Think about where THAT realization will lead. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted April 1, 2017 #352 Share Posted April 1, 2017 1 minute ago, and then said: The media will do everything they can to cover for the Dems and Obama's people by confusing the narrative as much as they can, but ultimately someone is going to have to provide EVIDENCE that Trump or his team colluded EFFECTIVELY with a foreign government to subvert a U.S. election. I dont think the effectiveness of any collusion should have any bearing on the case. If there was collusion, regardless of whether it was effective or not it was wrong. Other than that though great post I cant argue with any of what you said. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bee Posted April 1, 2017 #353 Share Posted April 1, 2017 (edited) . @and then....... good post above.. (#352) except IMO, (even though I'm not American ) ... I think Trump should keep Tweeting as that is his direct line to his voters and supporters - instant communication when he wants to say something even if that something is sometimes used against him - .edit to say --- but he will have to be careful with legal stuff regarding what is happening - although I'm sure he will be very aware of that... . Edited April 1, 2017 by bee 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted April 1, 2017 #354 Share Posted April 1, 2017 4 minutes ago, bee said: . @and then....... good post above.. (#352) except IMO, (even though I'm not American ) ... I think Trump should keep Tweeting as that is his direct line to his voters and supporters - instant communication when he wants to say something even if that something is sometimes used against him - .edit to say --- but he will have to be careful with legal stuff regarding what is happening - but I'm sure he will be very aware of that... . As the loyal opposition I agree with that wholeheartedly, trump absolutely should keep tweeting As an American though i wish he would stop embarrassing us with that garbage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+and-then Posted April 1, 2017 #355 Share Posted April 1, 2017 13 hours ago, Claire. said: Here’s what we know so far about Team Trump’s ties to Russian interests. Congress and U.S. intelligence agencies are scrutinizing connections between Russia and and the Trump campaign as they investigate evidence that Russia interfered in the 2016 election. Here are members of Team Trump who are known to have Russian connections and the story lines that have made those ties relevant. Source: The Washington Post Article provides an interactive graphic illustrating the various connections, with detailed explanations following. http://thehayride.com/2017/03/smoking-gun-if-you-havent-seen-the-evelyn-farkas-morning-joe-video-check-it-out-here/ This interview/political piece was aired on MSNBC on 3 March, 2017. The interview includes both Evelyn Farcas (former Obama deputy defense official) and Michigan Senator(?) Debbie Stabenow. It's about 6 minutes long and is the ORIGINAL. The controversial statements by Dr. Farcas begin at approximately 4:50. While the video is embedded in another article, there is no need to even read that article or it's opinions. I just looked for a clean copy of her words. I'm not even sure what researcher stumbled over this because it was overlooked by EVERYONE else in the MSM, including Fox. Listen to the whole thing in context if you have the time but at least listen from 4:50 on. As I mentioned to Farmer, the FBI is ALREADY investigating any potential criminal ties or collusion by Trump or his team. I'll be happy to see the fruits of that investigation. Meanwhile, THIS is a totally separate issue. This is a former government official who is very clearly, with precise language, bragging about her role in saving and disseminating as much intelligence info as possible to folks on the "Hill" before Obama's term ends and his people are replaced. She said she fears that once those officials are gone then the "sources and methods" by which she and "they" "knew what they knew" about Trump's staff's communications with the Russians might be lost to them. Her language is not that of a mid-level bureaucrat who is just spinning a tale. The language is very precise in its meaning and scope. She should be offered immunity from all prosecution for everything but perjury during her sworn deposition by the FBI. She is alluding to "intelligence" info - HER words - that would be far above her pay grade. Also, even if she did have legal access at the time, it is still a FELONY to identify U.S. citizens that are swept up incidentally in a probe if they are not targets or don't meet a couple of other very specific criteria. She committed a Felony during her dissemination of that info. But she was only repeating info that others had or that she had received form those above her. Give her a get out of prison free card and get her on the record. NOW. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lilly Posted April 1, 2017 #356 Share Posted April 1, 2017 Ok, Ms Farkas sure seems to be implying that these "folks on the Hill" know all sorts of damning evidence about Trump and the Russians. I watched the whole video and I really got the impression that the officials using these "sources and methods" must literally have smoking gun evidence of some very serious criminal activity. Why don't they do something then? Why haven't they dropped this evidence bomb already? Hell, why wasn't it dropped before the election? Or, at least dropped before Trump was sworn in? What I want to know is: Where's the damn evidence? Anyone can sit and tell tales in a hush-hush tone. Anyone can claim another person is a criminal. In the United States however, one needs evidence before calling out others as being criminals. All this makes me sick. If team Trump colluded with Russia to throw the US election we need to see the evidence of this and President Trump needs to be impeached immediately. However, if there really isn't any evidence of this criminal action then someone (or some group) is involved in sedition against a duly elected United States President. Either way, some very serious crimes have taken place...we need resolution to this and we need it quickly. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted April 1, 2017 #357 Share Posted April 1, 2017 as Putin would say, where is your proof 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent0range Posted April 1, 2017 #358 Share Posted April 1, 2017 10 hours ago, aztek said: lol, they were sold everywhere in nyc, as tourist attraction, i have a deck somewhere, what planet do you live on? And they were fake. A company making a replica of something for profit is not propaganda... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent0range Posted April 1, 2017 #359 Share Posted April 1, 2017 11 hours ago, Michelle said: If you were in the service at that time, you may not be aware they were widely distributed in the news. There were many memes about them too. Not that I care to, but one would think it would be fairly easy to look up. I tried looking up a meme, and came up empty. Where were these memes being posted in 2004? Myspace? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aztek Posted April 1, 2017 #360 Share Posted April 1, 2017 37 minutes ago, Agent0range said: And they were fake. A company making a replica of something for profit is not propaganda... i said they were tourist attraction, i never said anything about propaganda. what makes you think the same company that made them for you did not make them for everyone else? did yours come with certificate of authenticity? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merc14 Posted April 1, 2017 #361 Share Posted April 1, 2017 2 hours ago, Lilly said: Ok, Ms Farkas sure seems to be implying that these "folks on the Hill" know all sorts of damning evidence about Trump and the Russians. I watched the whole video and I really got the impression that the officials using these "sources and methods" must literally have smoking gun evidence of some very serious criminal activity. Why don't they do something then? Why haven't they dropped this evidence bomb already? Hell, why wasn't it dropped before the election? Or, at least dropped before Trump was sworn in? What I want to know is: Where's the damn evidence? Anyone can sit and tell tales in a hush-hush tone. Anyone can claim another person is a criminal. In the United States however, one needs evidence before calling out others as being criminals. All this makes me sick. If team Trump colluded with Russia to throw the US election we need to see the evidence of this and President Trump needs to be impeached immediately. However, if there really isn't any evidence of this criminal action then someone (or some group) is involved in sedition against a duly elected United States President. Either way, some very serious crimes have taken place...we need resolution to this and we need it quickly. I saw it very differently Lilly. I saw a woman who, the day before, did something very stupid, namely admit to the world that while attached to the Clinton campaign she still had access to high level intelligence and used it against the opposition. She never said she saw anything damning, just that there was communication between Trump associates and the Russians, something entirely legal. Her CNBC appearance was an attempt to change her story and cover up the fact that she had access to intelligence she should not have had after leaving the government. I am quite sure that any evidence of Trump/Russian collusion would have appeared by now and the fact that it hasn't speaks volumes. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lilly Posted April 1, 2017 #362 Share Posted April 1, 2017 Personally, I can't get past the issue that any actual evidence of the Trump/Russia collusion doesn't appear to be forth coming. Exactly what Ms Farkas was implying there doesn't seem to be very clear (to me anyway). And, she doesn't say that the 'folks on the Hill' have the irrefutable damning evidence of Trump/Russia collusion. So, exactly what's the point Ms Farkas is trying to make? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merc14 Posted April 1, 2017 #363 Share Posted April 1, 2017 18 minutes ago, Lilly said: Personally, I can't get past the issue that any actual evidence of the Trump/Russia collusion doesn't appear to be forth coming. Exactly what Ms Farkas was implying there doesn't seem to be very clear (to me anyway). And, she doesn't say that the 'folks on the Hill' have the irrefutable damning evidence of Trump/Russia collusion. So, exactly what's the point Ms Farkas is trying to make? Personally, I think she was bragging. Think about this, she is a hard core leftist on a hardcore leftist network talking to fellow travelers and decided to brag about just how much she did to damage the most hated administration the left has ever known. You could see Mika Berzizinski try to reel her back in as she started dropping these bombshells that, in Farkas' small group of operatives, is well known information. We caught an elitist leftist bragging to her pals about what she did during the war and now the true believers in the media are rushing to bury it as deep as possible.. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Silver Thong Posted April 1, 2017 #364 Share Posted April 1, 2017 https://www.google.ca/#q=clinton+russian+connections&* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+and-then Posted April 1, 2017 #365 Share Posted April 1, 2017 42 minutes ago, Merc14 said: Personally, I think she was bragging. Think about this, she is a hard core leftist on a hardcore leftist network talking to fellow travelers and decided to brag about just how much she did to damage the most hated administration the left has ever known. You could see Mika Berzizinski try to reel her back in as she started dropping these bombshells that, in Farkas' small group of operatives, is well known information. We caught an elitist leftist bragging to her pals about what she did during the war and now the true believers in the media are rushing to bury it as deep as possible.. EXACTLY! When I first heard this little diatribe I, frankly, was stunned. Then when I listened again to see if I heard it correctly, I picked up on her tone and it smacked of arrogance and the fact that she felt totally comfortable sharing this info in that setting because she knew she was among friends. She sounded like she had absolutely no concern for what she was saying. In fact she seemed to be enjoying herself. I noticed Brzezinski beginning to seem a little troubled by it but I got the impression she was just trying to manage the clock. IF this proves to be the smoking gun and Miss Mika really was clueless, she is going to look foolish even to her own circle. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted April 1, 2017 #366 Share Posted April 1, 2017 9 hours ago, Lilly said: Ok, Ms Farkas sure seems to be implying that these "folks on the Hill" know all sorts of damning evidence about Trump and the Russians. I watched the whole video and I really got the impression that the officials using these "sources and methods" must literally have smoking gun evidence of some very serious criminal activity. Why don't they do something then? Why haven't they dropped this evidence bomb already? Hell, why wasn't it dropped before the election? Or, at least dropped before Trump was sworn in? What seems like two years ago,but was actually like within a week of trump taking office Pelosi (yuck) said they have enough to begin impeachment proceedings but are holding off until its a 100% slam dunk for sure thing that trump wont survive. While I enjoyed the concept I didnt really take her too seriously at the time, perhaps though she wasnt wrong? 9 hours ago, Lilly said: Either way, some very serious crimes have taken place...we need resolution to this and we need it quickly. Amen! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yamato Posted April 1, 2017 #367 Share Posted April 1, 2017 Quote Anything less and I think we can call finished on trust in our government from now on. Think about where THAT realization will lead. A million Yamatos running around no longer believing 99% of the Real Owners' crap they're told? Sounds like it leads to the promised land. Better late than never. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lilly Posted April 1, 2017 #368 Share Posted April 1, 2017 If Nancy Pelosi claims they (the Democrats?) have proof that Trump colluded with Russia to throw the 2016 election then why hasn't she surrendered this proof to FBI Director Comey? Something just doesn't seem right about that IMO. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.ZZ. Posted April 1, 2017 #369 Share Posted April 1, 2017 (edited) 25 minutes ago, Farmer77 said: What seems like two years ago,but was actually like within a week of trump taking office Pelosi (yuck) said they have enough to begin impeachment proceedings but are holding off until its a 100% slam dunk for sure thing that trump wont survive. While I enjoyed the concept I didnt really take her too seriously at the time, perhaps though she wasnt wrong? Her threat is about as real as Maxine Water's wig. Did you hear about that? She wears the identical model wig that James Brown wore! Edited April 1, 2017 by .ZZ. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted April 1, 2017 #370 Share Posted April 1, 2017 Well at least someone's laughing: ‘Press 2 if hackers needed’: Russian FM April Fools voicemail leaves US media unamused On April 1, the Russian Ministry of Foreign Affairs posted a spoof voicemail offering "Russian hackers services" and "election interference." And the mainstream US media appears not amused. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer77 Posted April 1, 2017 #371 Share Posted April 1, 2017 2 minutes ago, .ZZ. said: Her threat is about as real as Maxine Water's wig. Did you hear about that? She wears the identical model wig that James brown wore! No way 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.ZZ. Posted April 1, 2017 #372 Share Posted April 1, 2017 I'm laughing my butt off! Nothing! That's what they got! Nothing! Maxine isn't a good sport at all. Hahaha link 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paranormal Panther Posted April 1, 2017 #373 Share Posted April 1, 2017 11 hours ago, Lilly said: Ok, Ms Farkas sure seems to be implying that these "folks on the Hill" know all sorts of damning evidence about Trump and the Russians. I watched the whole video and I really got the impression that the officials using these "sources and methods" must literally have smoking gun evidence of some very serious criminal activity. Why don't they do something then? Why haven't they dropped this evidence bomb already? Hell, why wasn't it dropped before the election? Or, at least dropped before Trump was sworn in? What I want to know is: Where's the damn evidence? Anyone can sit and tell tales in a hush-hush tone. Anyone can claim another person is a criminal. In the United States however, one needs evidence before calling out others as being criminals. All this makes me sick. If team Trump colluded with Russia to throw the US election we need to see the evidence of this and President Trump needs to be impeached immediately. However, if there really isn't any evidence of this criminal action then someone (or some group) is involved in sedition against a duly elected United States President. Either way, some very serious crimes have taken place...we need resolution to this and we need it quickly. There's a third option. Imagine somebody committing homicide while recording a bank robbery. It may turn out that some unpleasant truths will be discovered if there is a fair and full investigation of Trump's purported collusion. Maybe that's why they're so skittish about putting *all* of their cards on the table. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gromdor Posted April 2, 2017 #374 Share Posted April 2, 2017 2 hours ago, .ZZ. said: Her threat is about as real as Maxine Water's wig. Did you hear about that? She wears the identical model wig that James Brown wore! Yeah, I laughed about that when I heard it too. But Bill really needs to reign in his insults. Between himself and FOX he's already paid out over $13 million for sexual and verbal abuse: http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/oreilly-pushes-back-after-harassment-reports/ar-BBzaxcL?li=BBmkt5R&ocid=spartanntp 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.ZZ. Posted April 2, 2017 #375 Share Posted April 2, 2017 2 hours ago, Gromdor said: Yeah, I laughed about that when I heard it too. But Bill really needs to reign in his insults. Between himself and FOX he's already paid out over $13 million for sexual and verbal abuse: http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/oreilly-pushes-back-after-harassment-reports/ar-BBzaxcL?li=BBmkt5R&ocid=spartanntp I heard about all of that. When I heard the alleged details of his phone calls I thought how sick he is. I can't get into on this forum, but now it's all I can think of when I see him. He's an arrogant ____ and all he does is plug his books on his show. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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