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Lilly

Trump Tower Wiretapped?

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Paranormal Panther
21 hours ago, Yamato said:

You'll have to show me where I ever excused Obama amidst your blizzard of rhetorical excuses for Trump.   You're the blackest of kettles PP.

It was impossible to make you rightlings focus on what was important like the damage being done to this country by Obama from our foreign policy, domestic policy, monetary policy, and health care disasters.    It always went back to fake news nonsense from the right about birth certificates or emails or executive orders or Obamacare.  

Now emails should be secret, executive orders are cool, and even Obamacare is okay.   Total right wing hypocrisy in our faces every day.

Trump discredited himself by leading the Birther movement and it's been more of the same ever since.  It's embarrassing.  I'm embarrassed for this country.  I'm especially embarrassed for people who don't see the problem with their orange God.

I'm embarrassed for *you*. That's a nice speech for your fellow leftists, but it has little or nothing to do with any of my views. You know that too. If not, seek help.

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Derek Willis
2 minutes ago, Lilly said:

No, there are actual leaks of information that have not been released via proper means.

Like I say, I am far from the action, but has the content of the leaks been released in any sort of detail?

As an aside, I was in Chicago on election day - the place was as high as a kite after the Cubs won, and was then plunged into despair. 

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thedutchiedutch

news.jpg

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Paranormal Panther
19 hours ago, Captain Risky said:

You keep saying that I have misrepresented you but all I've done is point out that wild alligations are not worth anything. You think that Trump deserves the benefit of doubt I say that the onus is on him to make available any proof he has. If Trump knows something then the Attorney general should be leading an investigation and not twitter. 

What is wrong with you people? You and I agree on how this should be handled. Yet, you have this weird need to be argumentative. In one of my posts, I even say that Pence should replace Trump if the charge is bogus, but you reality-impaired leftists will ignore that too.

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Lilly

Well, you could say much the same about waiting for the evidence that Trump is in cahoots with the Russians.

As to the leaks, they range from information about Trump's Supreme Court choice to details about various legislation. Certain things should not be made public until such time as the White House releases them.

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thedutchiedutch
4 minutes ago, Lilly said:

Well, you could say much the same about waiting for the evidence that Trump is in cahoots with the Russians.

But Lilly this thread is called "Trump Tower Wiretapped? President Trump claims Obama Admin. wiretapped Trump Tower".

Let's stick to the topic :)

 

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Yamato
16 minutes ago, Paranormal Panther said:

I'm embarrassed for *you*. That's a nice speech for your fellow leftists, but it has little or nothing to do with any of my views. You know that too. If not, seek help.

And there you go, you couldn't find where I excused Obama, and so you're embarrassed for me?   Don't be embarrassed for me dude.  I won't be the one making lame excuses for Trump that include some of the worst Presidents and Presidential candidates ever.

Comparing Trump favorably to the worst things ever is like trying to argue the point that Trump must be the 2nd worst thing ever.   That argument is so weak, anyone making it should be embarrassed.  Sorry.

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Derek Willis
5 minutes ago, Lilly said:

Well, you could say much the same about waiting for the evidence that Trump is in cahoots with the Russians.

As to the leaks, they range from information about Trump's Supreme Court choice to details about various legislation. Certain things should not be made public until such time as the White House releases them.

I agree there are proper processes and channels for the release of information. But here in the UK (and most other countries, I would imagine) politicians and the media have for generations made claims about having information on people or events, but then do not present proof of the claims by citing national security or by saying it would compromise the sources and so on. Often that is the case, and often it is a convenient way of hiding the fact that they don't really have any proof. 

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Paranormal Panther
47 minutes ago, Yamato said:

And there you go, you couldn't find where I excused Obama, and so you're embarrassed for me?   Don't be embarrassed for me dude.  I won't be the one making lame excuses for Trump that include some of the worst Presidents and Presidential candidates ever.

Comparing Trump favorably to the worst things ever is like trying to argue the point that Trump must be the 2nd worst thing ever.   That argument is so weak, anyone making it should be embarrassed.  Sorry.

In other words, you're not willing to give him a chance before you declare his month-long presidency the worst. Nice!

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Yamato
Just now, Paranormal Panther said:

In other words, you're not willing to give him a chance before you declare his month-long presidency the worst. Nice!

No, not at all.

No longer comparing him to the "worst" things ever doesn't mean not giving him a chance.   Trump has a chance of being a great President, he still has a small chance of that.  I'm not going to take it from him.  I don't have a choice but to give him a chance. 

"Give him a chance" is fake rhetoric.  What it really means is "Be ignorant!"

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OverSword

Can't we all just get along?

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Paranormal Panther
22 hours ago, Merc14 said:

Yep, very confusing and while the denizens of DC rip each other to shreds over silliness (the Russians didn't change the election results, Hillary did) the country limps on, not solving its problems or fixing itself. 

Will this ever change? It seems doubtful right now.

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Paranormal Panther
13 minutes ago, Yamato said:

No, not at all.

No longer comparing him to the "worst" things ever doesn't mean not giving him a chance.   Trump has a chance of being a great President, he still has a small chance of that.  I'm not going to take it from him.  I don't have a choice but to give him a chance. 

"Give him a chance" is fake rhetoric.  What it really means is "Be ignorant!"

No, it means to give him a chance. You don't get to tell me what I mean.

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BlackBearWolf
25 minutes ago, Paranormal Panther said:

No, it means to give him a chance. You don't get to tell me what I mean.

Im sure you agree a healthy dose of skepticism is also in order. We have all been burned before in the past.

Now more than ever we should be holding or officials to the highest standards.

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Paranormal Panther
Just now, BlackBearWolf said:

Im sure you agree a healthy dose of skepticism is also in order. We have all been burned before in the past.

Now more than ever we should be holding or officials to the highest standards.

I agree with you. I have *huge* reservations about Trump's claims of wiretapping, which sound about as bogus as "because Russians".

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BlackBearWolf
1 minute ago, Paranormal Panther said:

I agree with you. I have *huge* reservations about Trump's claims of wiretapping, which sound about as bogus as "because Russians".

I think today information age is a double edged sword. We get information so fast from leaks or fake news sites we do not know what is real anymore. And it is getting harder to trust the people in charge of investigating.

But it is also getting harder to hide corruption and things can be fact checked on the fly. 

 We all must be vigilant and not let politicians from either party take advantage of us. We are the People of the United States. We all want the same basic peaceful life. Do not let the media and political parties tear us apart.

  Heck if anyone wants to come to california I could show some beautiful things and show you how generous and mellow us coastal folk can be, and I am sure anyone from middle America could show me some things that would blow my mind! We let the loudest and worst get all the attention.

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Paranormal Panther
1 minute ago, BlackBearWolf said:

I think today information age is a double edged sword. We get information so fast from leaks or fake news sites we do not know what is real anymore. And it is getting harder to trust the people in charge of investigating.

But it is also getting harder to hide corruption and things can be fact checked on the fly. 

 We all must be vigilant and not let politicians from either party take advantage of us. We are the People of the United States. We all want the same basic peaceful life. Do not let the media and political parties tear us apart.

  Heck if anyone wants to come to california I could show some beautiful things and show you how generous and mellow us coastal folk can be, and I am sure anyone from middle America could show me some things that would blow my mind! We let the loudest and worst get all the attention.

It's been like that for years, but new forms and new sources of information make it even worse. Most news outlets have some degree of bias. It's almost impossible to find a genuinely neutral source. Most of them have some kind of agenda. It could be a leftist one or a rightist one. It doesn't really matter. The truth often gets lost in the fray. Put the truth on a milk carton.

You're right about the extreme. It gets more airtime and press than the mainstream. The mainstream isn't as sexy (in the journalistic sense) as the extreme. Rioting is sexier than debating. It brings in the clicks and the views, and it garners higher ratings. It also presents a false view of reality in that it portrays the extreme as the mainstream in subtle ways. Some people begin to think that men bite dogs more than vice versa. It's hard to believe that this trend will reverse itself. 

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Hammerclaw
36 minutes ago, Paranormal Panther said:

I agree with you. I have *huge* reservations about Trump's claims of wiretapping, which sound about as bogus as "because Russians".

If there was some sort of surveillance, I doubt President Obama ordered it, directly. I do think there was a mad scramble, before and after the election by his supporters to find a smoking gun to derail Trump's candidacy and subsequent  election and inauguration. Obviously, they failed.

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Paranormal Panther
8 hours ago, BlackBearWolf said:

The claim is they influenced the election by releasing private e-mails of Hillary's campaign manager

The fact they did not hack trumps emails (They probably did) and release them as well shows a preferred candidate they wanted to win.....

I have yet to hear or see genuine proof of that from the purported "17 agencies". Let's say that the campaign head, whose password ostensibly was "password", was really hacked. Were the email contents true? That's the elephant in the room, the one that Hillary's magicians try to make disappear.

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Paranormal Panther
6 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

If there was some sort of surveillance, I doubt President Obama ordered it, directly. I do think there was a mad scramble, before and after the election by his supporters to find a smoking gun to derail Trump's candidacy and subsequent  election and inauguration. Obviously, they failed.

I would be very surprised if that *didn't* happen. Political machines make "House Of Cards" look like a Disney cartoon.

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Hammerclaw
7 minutes ago, Paranormal Panther said:

I would be very surprised if that *didn't* happen. Political machines make "House Of Cards" look like a Disney cartoon.

Trump Towers is probably riddled with corporate espionage listening devices, anyway. The repurposing of one or more of those by clandestine operatives with no direct link to the Government would do quite nicely. Of course, it's only speculation but a reasonable possibility, never-the-less.

Edited by Hammerclaw
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Paranormal Panther
10 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

Trump Towers is probably riddled with corporate espionage listening devices, anyway. The repurposing of one or more of those by clandestine operatives with no direct link to the Government would do quite nicely. Of course, it's only speculation but a reasonable possibility, never-the-less.

Perhaps a British operative spied on his campaign. He or they wouldn't have to worry about American laws. He could just share his findings with Democratic operatives. Where there's a shill, there's a way.

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Hammerclaw
1 minute ago, Paranormal Panther said:

Perhaps a British operative spied on his campaign. He or they wouldn't have to worry about American laws. He could just share his findings with Democratic operatives. Where there's a shill, there's a way.

Considering what the NSA was doing without the apparent knowledge of the President, I don't know how anyone could bat their eyes, vapidly and declare with certainty it could never have happened under Obama's watch.

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Paranormal Panther
9 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

Considering what the NSA was doing without the apparent knowledge of the President, I don't know how anyone could bat their eyes, vapidly and declare with certainty it could never have happened under Obama's watch.

Well, James Clapper said that there was nothing to it. Oh, wait! ;)

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Hammerclaw
12 minutes ago, Paranormal Panther said:

Well, James Clapper said that there was nothing to it. Oh, wait! ;)

Well, well, look at this. The manure may be deeper than anyone thought.                                      http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/this-former-british-lawmaker-is-at-the-heart-of-the-trump-wiretap-allegations/ar-AAnU2xB?li=BBmkt5R&ocid=spartandhp

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