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keithisco

Opening gambits in EU / UK exit negotiations;

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Eldorado

In the News....

"BMW could move some production of engines and its Mini model out of Britain if the country does not secure an orderly departure from the European Union, the German carmaker said on Tuesday, in the latest Brexit warning from the auto industry."

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-autoshow-geneva-brexit-idUSKCN1QM13G

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L.A.T.1961

Another piece of news today on the threat of restricting the inward flow of isotopes used for cancer, this was made much of when UK said it would leave Euratom as part of brexit.

The threat - "Medical experts and charities have said that Theresa May's plan to leave Euratom — the EU's atomic energy agency - will disrupt the inward flow of isotopes used for cancer treatment and put thousands of patients "at risk" of delays to treatment." 

The reality -" Euratom have confirmed the final international agreement with Japan is now in place, which means the UK now has all the international agreements required to ensure that civil nuclear trade with our key international partners can continue following withdrawal from Euratom."

“The accountancy and monitoring system for a domestic safeguards regime is now up and running in parallel with the Euratom system, and safeguard regulations have now been approved by Parliament. 

“This means the core part of the industry’s day to day business, would be unhindered in the event of a no deal Brexit.”

 Perhaps those who informed cancer patients of the almost certain problems around treatment caused by brexit will now apologise to them for causing unnecessary worry  ;)

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RabidMongoose

Have the Real IRA tried blowing us up today?

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stevewinn

 

 

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spud the mackem

If the E.U. (Germans) are so worried about their B.M.W.'s , why have the French firm Peugeot bought out Vauxhall (British)  just before Xmas 2018. Do they know something that the Germans don't .

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L.A.T.1961
8 minutes ago, spud the mackem said:

If the E.U. (Germans) are so worried about their B.M.W.'s , why have the French firm Peugeot bought out Vauxhall (British)  just before Xmas 2018. Do they know something that the Germans don't .

Vauxhall have done well since brexit, Vauxhall-Opel posted a profit for the first time in 20 years -

At a press conference on PSA’s 2018 results PSA Group boss Carlos Tavares said. -

"Vauxhall had actually grown in the UK since the vote to leave the European Union. “Since Brexit was announced the overall profitability of the passenger car business in the UK has doubled, our market share has improved and our customer satisfaction index has improved,” he said.

“That is very surprising, because since we announced Brexit we have all spent our time saying ‘it’s going to be a nightmare, it’s going to be difficult, blah, blah blah,’ and sterling has lost significant value – and and all of this is true.

But the reality is that we have adapted our sales channel mixes, we corrected our pricing, we made cost reductions, we tried to be more thoughtful in the way we do business, and since Brexit was announced our profitability in the UK doubled. Vauxhall brand an opportunity for PSA. We are managing our marketing communications in the UK in a way that is very supportive of a British brand in the UK."

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/industry/vauxhall-can-be-brexit-survivors-claims-psa-boss

 

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spud the mackem
5 minutes ago, L.A.T.1961 said:

Vauxhall have done well since brexit, Vauxhall-Opel posted a profit for the first time in 20 years -

At a press conference on PSA’s 2018 results PSA Group boss Carlos Tavares said. -

"Vauxhall had actually grown in the UK since the vote to leave the European Union. “Since Brexit was announced the overall profitability of the passenger car business in the UK has doubled, our market share has improved and our customer satisfaction index has improved,” he said.

“That is very surprising, because since we announced Brexit we have all spent our time saying ‘it’s going to be a nightmare, it’s going to be difficult, blah, blah blah,’ and sterling has lost significant value – and and all of this is true.

But the reality is that we have adapted our sales channel mixes, we corrected our pricing, we made cost reductions, we tried to be more thoughtful in the way we do business, and since Brexit was announced our profitability in the UK doubled. Vauxhall brand an opportunity for PSA. We are managing our marketing communications in the UK in a way that is very supportive of a British brand in the UK."

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/industry/vauxhall-can-be-brexit-survivors-claims-psa-boss

 

Having driven both a Vauxhall (which I own) and a B.M.W.  I rate the Vauxhall better , its cheaper on petrol , insurance , running costs and services, and cheaper to buy ,  as far as I am concerned the Germans can keep their B.M.W.

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L.A.T.1961
33 minutes ago, spud the mackem said:

Having driven both a Vauxhall (which I own) and a B.M.W.  I rate the Vauxhall better , its cheaper on petrol , insurance , running costs and services, and cheaper to buy ,  as far as I am concerned the Germans can keep their B.M.W.

I have owned a Vauxhall in the past, it was a 1.8 CD Cavalier Mk2. Very dependable and decent to drive back in the day when Vauxhall and Ford controlled the fleet market in UK. 

Showing my age ;)

image.jpeg

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stevewinn
On 06/03/2019 at 7:38 PM, spud the mackem said:

If the E.U. (Germans) are so worried about their B.M.W.'s , why have the French firm Peugeot bought out Vauxhall (British)  just before Xmas 2018. Do they know something that the Germans don't .

mainly to get its hands on GMs / Vauxhall battery and autonomous tech, also to spread its investment risk, while trying to compete with the likes of the Nissan-Renault-Mitsubishi. partnership. Peugeot make no mistake about it they'll drop Vauxhall (UK) production once they get what they wanted.

21 Days till Brexit or the biggest deceit in our history.

either way politics in this country will never be the same again.

 

 

 

 

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Captain Risky
18 minutes ago, stevewinn said:

mainly to get its hands on GMs / Vauxhall battery and autonomous tech, also to spread its investment risk, while trying to compete with the likes of the Nissan-Renault-Mitsubishi. partnership. Peugeot make no mistake about it they'll drop Vauxhall (UK) production once they get what they wanted.

21 Days till Brexit or the biggest deceit in our history.

either way politics in this country will never be the same again.

well as always its got nothing to do with the EU and everything to do with the UK and its not so well thought out brexit decision. let me explain... the biggest deceit is why haven't your politicians just told the the EU to' **** off we're not separating Northern Ireland from the rest of Great Britain?' brexit is no longer about economics, never was. now its a question of national survival. 

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stevewinn
12 hours ago, Captain Risky said:

well as always its got nothing to do with the EU and everything to do with the UK and its not so well thought out brexit decision. let me explain... the biggest deceit is why haven't your politicians just told the the EU to' **** off we're not separating Northern Ireland from the rest of Great Britain?' brexit is no longer about economics, never was. now its a question of national survival. 

Brexit is about the people vs the establishment, both here at home and on the continent. Its clear May as worked hand in glove with the EU. As you perfect highlight the northern Irish border is a non issue. never was, it was only ever a means to keep the UK tied to the EU. something which was accepted by both the UK and EU. - Its clear, the plan was to kick Brexit as far down the road as possible and in the meantime get the people to change their minds. - It hasnt worked and both the UK and EU establishment are ****ed. it was never meant to turn out this way.

 

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bee
44 minutes ago, stevewinn said:

Brexit is about the people vs the establishment, both here at home and on the continent. Its clear May as worked hand in glove with the EU. As you perfect highlight the northern Irish border is a non issue. never was, it was only ever a means to keep the UK tied to the EU. something which was accepted by both the UK and EU. - Its clear, the plan was to kick Brexit as far down the road as possible and in the meantime get the people to change their minds. - It hasnt worked and both the UK and EU establishment are ****ed. it was never meant to turn out this way.

 

 

and now Gordon Brown is ramping up Project Fear.... calling for a YEAR delay on Brexit ...

random link (Independent)

Former prime minister Gordon Brown says Brexit should be delayed for a year to “consult” voters and prevent an “impending national disaster”.

The ex-Labour leader said the Article 50 negotiating period should be extended to allow MPs to listen to the public’s views on the current Brexit proposals through a “citizen’s consultation”.

 

like the referendum wasn't a citizen's consultation...

Brown, of course, just wants to stop it happening and knows that playing for time is the best bet for remaining..



 

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RAyMO

Erg brexit is finished. Well will be by Thursday. 

May's brexit can only survive with Erg support. 

Either mays brexit next week, or customs union brexit during the delay. 

Its up to the erg and the dup (whose strategy on this has been calamity driven from day 1). 

 

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stevewinn
22 minutes ago, bee said:

 

and now Gordon Brown is ramping up Project Fear.... calling for a YEAR delay on Brexit ...

random link (Independent)

Former prime minister Gordon Brown says Brexit should be delayed for a year to “consult” voters and prevent an “impending national disaster”.

The ex-Labour leader said the Article 50 negotiating period should be extended to allow MPs to listen to the public’s views on the current Brexit proposals through a “citizen’s consultation”.

 

like the referendum wasn't a citizen's consultation...

Brown, of course, just wants to stop it happening and knows that playing for time is the best bet for remaining..



 

You only have to look at barniers tweet. The eu wants the uk to remain  in the customs union for 2yrs.  but it can leave at anytime but northern Ireland must remain. It does seem, the comments by the 'beast ' Martin Seylmar are coming true, "the price of brexit must be the loss of Northern Ireland" i said that the eu commission had hinted at uniting the island of ireland. And the Irish pm as gone along with that. (putting his countries economy on the line in the hope the EU can deliver on their promise)

Its now clear, but it always has been, from the start the EU said no talks until britain triggers article 50. Article 50 was triggered. (something they though we wouldn't do) but we did, so it was then we won't talk trade until you have left in 2yrs time. All the last 2yrs 9 mths as been is a delaying tactic, and to get the UK to remain and more importantly keep contributing to the eu financially.

Its time to leave. The ERG & the DUP. Need to bring this remainer govt down for the good of the country. Country before party.

Notice how the four day port strikes in France havent brought our country to its knees. No lack of food the shelves, just in time manufacturing not brought to a halt. No lack of medicines.

A real life dummy run. And everything and everyone is coping. Obviously if this delay at the ports was down to brexit it would be all over the news headlines.

20 days till brexit.

 

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spud the mackem

In a talk on T.V.  at Grimsby (a leave area) May has suggested that if she loses the next vote or 2 , there may be no Brexit , so where has DEMOCRACY  gone . If this does happen we shall a dictatorial gov't who go against the wishes of the people ,and  in this case there Will be an uprising and riots that this country has never before seen , worse than the miners strikes when Maggie was on the" throne" . The Gov't is rapidly going down the pan and is nearly round the bend ,so how can they still govern .

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stevewinn
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, spud the mackem said:

In a talk on T.V.  at Grimsby (a leave area) May has suggested that if she loses the next vote or 2 , there may be no Brexit , so where has DEMOCRACY  gone . If this does happen we shall a dictatorial gov't who go against the wishes of the people ,and  in this case there Will be an uprising and riots that this country has never before seen , worse than the miners strikes when Maggie was on the" throne" . The Gov't is rapidly going down the pan and is nearly round the bend ,so how can they still govern .

May's words highlight just how out of touch Westminster is. - the game for her is up, and a full inquiry into the conduct of the officials in this Brexit charade, i still cant get my head around the fact Treasonous May showed the German govt the WA before her own Cabinet or Parliament and nothing was made of it on the NEWS, the only question she faced was on the Wednesday at PMQ's and she dodged answering.

We even had Dominic Grieve MP recipient of the French legion civil honour having talks this week with French President Macron on how to push and have a second referendum vote. its bloody bonkers.

We could write a bloody good book on the subject. (if we had hundreds of people including nobility, gentry and MP's in 1930's/40's plotting then its not beyond today's people, nobility and MP's in a  modern day treachery)

Good factual book by the way. (highly recommend)

Easy to read, but very worrying.
World War II was a desperate time, the whole country was united in their stand against fascism (and indeed a puerile, violent system most adolescents would reject). To be sure of being safe we interned German Jews who sought refuge in the UK. Yet some very senior people, plotted for us to lose and planned for themselves to be installed as a Nazi Government of the UK working under Hitler, with German jackboots marching through our towns. Some traitors were hung, some were given lengthy prison terms, but all the leaders of this treachery, without exception, were never touched. senior Aristocrats, Members of Parliament and the House of Lords and some senior Generals, including the retired head of Military Intelligence, were not only involved, some made no secret of their treachery, nor of their fascist thinking. We can only speculate why we knowingly allowed them to side with our enemies, whilst still MP’s and other senior positions in Society.
Would it be different today with the EU?

51-ZiLL2o6L._SX324_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg

 

 

 

Edited by stevewinn
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Captain Risky
4 hours ago, spud the mackem said:

In a talk on T.V.  at Grimsby (a leave area) May has suggested that if she loses the next vote or 2 , there may be no Brexit , so where has DEMOCRACY  gone . If this does happen we shall a dictatorial gov't who go against the wishes of the people ,and  in this case there Will be an uprising and riots that this country has never before seen , worse than the miners strikes when Maggie was on the" throne" . The Gov't is rapidly going down the pan and is nearly round the bend ,so how can they still govern .

the fact that May has laid out a clear path for NO brexit is very telling. this opens the door to having another referendum. and thoughts of democracy being sabotaged will quickly be forgotten if a good majority wins the day. i know you disagree and think that rebellion or rather the threat of it will force brexit through but the deep state is only interested in a sensible solution. you can't have a sensible solution if your country is broken up and the economy fails. interesting times. 

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stevewinn

Interesting week.

 

Quote

 

The whipping for this week

John Redwood MP
Published: March 11, 2019

I have been sent a whip for this week which tells me I have to be present in Parliament until 10.30pm on Monday, to  7.30pm on   Tuesday,  7.30pm on Wednesday and  6pm on Thursday  – all three line whips. I was planning to be there anyway.Attendance at Questions, non Bill committees and other meetings at other times of day are  not whipped.

The whip does not tell me how they wish me to vote on any of those days, nor what the government motions might be. Indeed, Wednesday’s business is down as a general debate on housing where no vote is likely, and Thursday is down as a general debate on NICE and rare diseases, again  where a vote would be unlikely.

If as I hear on the media Wednesday turns out to be a motion over exit from the EU without signing the Withdrawal Agreement, I expect a three line whip to tell me to vote to keep so called No deal on the table. If Thursday turns out to be a motion over delay, I expect a 3 line whip to tell me to vote against delay, in accordance with the PM’s often stated policy that we will leave on 29 March with or without a deal. I assume there will be a three line whip for me to vote for the Withdrawal Agreement on Tuesday, which I will be unable to accept. The Manifesto we stood on as Conservatives said very clearly they would negotiate the Future Partnership at the same time as the Withdrawal Agreement. They should have kept their word. Signing a Withdrawal Agreement making many concessions to the EU without signing a Partnership at the same time would be crazy. We would be paying far more than the advertised £39bn for nothing.

The government wants Leave voting MPs to fear that Parliament will take control and stop Brexit if we do not vote for the Withdrawal Agreement. There is no need for that to happen if we reject the Withdrawal Agreement. The government will have to offer leadership if that happens, by explaining why we must not take no deal off the table, and why delay brings  nothing but more  uncertainty and trouble. The government can stop Parliament voting to change the law if it wishes. It now has to assert itself and say it will battle to ensure we leave on 29 March with or without the Withdrawal Agreement as promised.

That is why I have set out what the whipping should be for this week in the absence of any clarity from Mrs May.

 

 

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RabidMongoose
On ‎09‎/‎03‎/‎2019 at 9:51 PM, Captain Risky said:

the fact that May has laid out a clear path for NO brexit is very telling. this opens the door to having another referendum. and thoughts of democracy being sabotaged will quickly be forgotten if a good majority wins the day. i know you disagree and think that rebellion or rather the threat of it will force brexit through but the deep state is only interested in a sensible solution. you can't have a sensible solution if your country is broken up and the economy fails. interesting times. 

The only outcome that will ever happen will be No Brexit.

Every other possibility will always fail as there isn't enough support for anything. The Irish are playing games hoping to use the EU to get their claws on Northern Ireland. We should just leave.

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Ozymandias
1 hour ago, RabidMongoose said:

The only outcome that will ever happen will be No Brexit.

Every other possibility will always fail as there isn't enough support for anything. The Irish are playing games hoping to use the EU to get their claws on Northern Ireland. We should just leave.

[RabidMongoose, I left a mathematical brain teaser for you on another thread that you reactivated. If you can't give an answer before tomorrow I'll put up the solution.]

As to the Irish using the EU to help get its claws on Northern Ireland (NI), well, to be honest with you I can't think of a more stupid comment! Besides the fact that NI is as Irish as any other part of the island of Ireland, 'the Irish' voted in a referendum 93% in favour of NI deciding upon its own future without fear of any interference from the outside. Again, 'the Irish' voted to relinquish all claim to NI as part of their endorsement of the Good Friday Agreement. Nothing has changed, except maybe that the UK will renege on the Good Friday Agreement.

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Captain Risky
2 hours ago, RabidMongoose said:

The only outcome that will ever happen will be No Brexit.

Every other possibility will always fail as there isn't enough support for anything. The Irish are playing games hoping to use the EU to get their claws on Northern Ireland. We should just leave.

You should just leave without a deal because the Irish and the EU want to punish the UK. Yes I strongly believe that. Of course not acting in good faith and bluffing during the Brexit referendum and withdrawal negotiations didn’t help your cause much. Just leave and pray that the UK economy will be able to be self sufficient enough to not turn Brexit into the biggest folly of the UK nation has ever known. Because the EU will never sign anything and be generous enough to make any deal benefit your country. Not now anyway.

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Captain Risky
33 minutes ago, Ozymandias said:

[RabidMongoose, I left a mathematical brain teaser for you on another thread that you reactivated. If you can't give an answer before tomorrow I'll put up the solution.]

As to the Irish using the EU to help get its claws on Northern Ireland (NI), well, to be honest with you I can't think of a more stupid comment! Besides the fact that NI is as Irish as any other part of the island of Ireland, 'the Irish' voted in a referendum 93% in favour of NI deciding upon its own future without fear of any interference from the outside. Again, 'the Irish' voted to relinquish all claim to NI as part of their endorsement of the Good Friday Agreement. Nothing has changed, except maybe that the UK will renege on the Good Friday Agreement.

Let’s be honest. The Irish backstop is just meaningless nonsense. As if a technical solution can’t be found. The EU will also stir up Scotland and bully any others into signing more comprehensive deals with the EU to the detriment of the UK. It’s vindictive but also the UK bears some blame in not dealing honestly with the EU.

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Ozymandias
5 minutes ago, Captain Risky said:

You should just leave without a deal because the Irish and the EU want to punish the UK. Yes I strongly believe that. Of course not acting in good faith and bluffing during the Brexit referendum and withdrawal negotiations didn’t help your cause much. Just leave and pray that the UK economy will be able to be self sufficient enough to not turn Brexit into the biggest folly of the UK nation has ever known. Because the EU will never sign anything and be generous enough to make any deal benefit your country. Not now anyway.

Seriously! Brexit is just as damaging to Ireland as it us to the UK, so your logic seems to be that Ireland is determined to punish itself!

Ireland only wants the UK to honour its agreements concerning the border.

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Ozymandias
6 minutes ago, Captain Risky said:

Let’s be honest. The Irish backstop is just meaningless nonsense. As if a technical solution can’t be found. The EU will also stir up Scotland and bully any others into signing more comprehensive deals with the EU to the detriment of the UK. It’s vindictive but also the UK bears some blame in not dealing honestly with the EU.

The backstop is an insurance policy to protect the current Irish botder arrangements. It is only intended to be invoked in the event that the UK and EU cannot agree equally effective alternative arrangements.

How is that 'meaningless nonsense'?

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