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kartikg

How will God prove himself?

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Liquid Gardens
24 minutes ago, WoIverine said:

 There are quite a few prophetic things mentioned which would be very hard to deny. Easy to sit back and scoff, but...what if you're wrong?

What do you think is the prophecy that is the hardest to deny?

What if you're wrong? Depending on what the actual truth is, you may be in the same boat as me depending on what the true god/gods really want.

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WoIverine
1 hour ago, Liquid Gardens said:

What do you think is the prophecy that is the hardest to deny?

What if you're wrong? Depending on what the actual truth is, you may be in the same boat as me depending on what the true god/gods really want.

Hi, thanks for the reply.

One example, I think the white throne judgement would be nearly impossible to deny.

If I'm wrong and there really is no God, and this is all there really is, then I will be ok with that. I've tried to do what's right as much as I can, which isn't a bad thing.

If there is a God though, thank God (no pun intended) that He's given us one heck of a warning about the freight train that's heading our way, with time enough to get off the tracks before we get squashed.

Edited by WoIverine
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Liquid Gardens
49 minutes ago, WoIverine said:

Hi, thanks for the reply.

One example, I think the white throne judgement would be nearly impossible to deny.

Hi Wolverine,

Sorry I misinterpreted you, I thought you were referring to prophecies that have already occurred that it would be tough to deny were divine prophecies.  I'd agree if the Last Judgment occurs then that's going to be tough to deny.

Quote

If I'm wrong and there really is no God, and this is all there really is, then I will be ok with that. I will have lived a good life, knowing that I've tried hard to do what's right as much as I can. I will know that I've loved, and given love, and I'll be at peace with how I've lived.

Well put, and I'm okay with my life even if by some chance there is a god.  I tried to do the right thing in my life with varying degrees of success, and am definitely thankful for it.  If God disapproves all I can do is shrug, he should understand perfectly why I don't believe in him and I'm more than willing to explain to him my case for my disbelief.

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WoIverine
8 minutes ago, Liquid Gardens said:

Hi Wolverine,

Sorry I misinterpreted you, I thought you were referring to prophecies that have already occurred that it would be tough to deny were divine prophecies.  I'd agree if the Last Judgment occurs then that's going to be tough to deny.

Well put, and I'm okay with my life even if by some chance there is a god.  I tried to do the right thing in my life with varying degrees of success, and am definitely thankful for it.  If God disapproves all I can do is shrug, he should understand perfectly why I don't believe in him and I'm more than willing to explain to him my case for my disbelief.

Fair enough man! :tu:

The concept of Hell is what freaks me out. I've seen / heard some NDEs where people end up there temporarily before resuscitation. That is no bueno.

It makes me think that if it's real, maybe there's some mechanism in place that God actually can't alter. Kind of like building a program, if you change a fundamental design element, it could break the entire program. From what I've been told, supposedly hell wasn't meant for humans.

Edited by WoIverine
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Stubbly_Dooright
1 hour ago, WoIverine said:

It's God, you would more than likely know it's Him as He fulfills what has been written. There are quite a few prophetic things mentioned which would be very hard to deny. Easy to sit back and scoff, but...what if you're wrong?

Ok, let me ask you a few things to see if it's understandable that I still believe or don't believe in what you do. 

Quote

It's God, you would more than likely know it's Him

Well, first, considering my post and the reply post and such were talking about what's written and what I believe as the possibility of why God or a higher power doesn't want it to be provable of it's existence, because of not lowering itself or not wanting to overwhelm it's people, then how does it come to actually knowing it's actually him? And you putting it in the 'more than likely' and not 'definitely', shows me that you don't know for sure either. 

And I believe it's all boiled down to subjective reasoning of knowing him, so one person's proof is probably not another person's proof. Frankly, I think one will likely know it's him, when he actually goes, 'hey, it's me, it's God. And here are my credentials.'

You know what I mean?

Quote

it's Him as He fulfills what has been written.

Are there real life examples, (as well as written down ones, and not in the bible) that shows this happens each time? 

Also, on that note, I think I made note that my belief doesn't rely on the written down for definite. I rely on something else for my belief. Plus, I will repeat my history if necessary, I grew up secular, so I have not read or was forced to read the bible, growing up. So, how am I suppose to know he fulfills what has been written? (I'm assuming you mean the bible.)

Quote

There are quite a few prophetic things mentioned which would be very hard to deny.

Feel free to show and prove them here then. Plus, it should be noted where these prophetic things were written and how credible the source of that is. 

And again, I don't have the recollection of knowing what they are, if it's in the bible. 

Quote

Easy to sit back and scoff, but...what if you're wrong?

Oh geez, here we go again. :no:

So, every disciple of every religion can ask that and assume that's a thought provoking question to get you to convert? What if you could be wrong about my belief's tenets and such? What if I'm right about mine? 

How many religions are there again? How many religions are there that could make a person wrong by chance if they sit back and scoff? 

Yes, it is easy to sit back and scoff, because the proof is hard to find more than likely, right? More so, if you have to 'ask' 'what if you're wrong' question. That, in itself, is not a good point to prove existence. 

 

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WoIverine
2 hours ago, Stubbly_Dooright said:

Ok, let me ask you a few things to see if it's understandable that I still believe or don't believe in what you do. 

Well, first, considering my post and the reply post and such were talking about what's written and what I believe as the possibility of why God or a higher power doesn't want it to be provable of it's existence, because of not lowering itself or not wanting to overwhelm it's people, then how does it come to actually knowing it's actually him? And you putting it in the 'more than likely' and not 'definitely', shows me that you don't know for sure either. 

And I believe it's all boiled down to subjective reasoning of knowing him, so one person's proof is probably not another person's proof. Frankly, I think one will likely know it's him, when he actually goes, 'hey, it's me, it's God. And here are my credentials.'

You know what I mean?

Are there real life examples, (as well as written down ones, and not in the bible) that shows this happens each time? 

Also, on that note, I think I made note that my belief doesn't rely on the written down for definite. I rely on something else for my belief. Plus, I will repeat my history if necessary, I grew up secular, so I have not read or was forced to read the bible, growing up. So, how am I suppose to know he fulfills what has been written? (I'm assuming you mean the bible.)

Feel free to show and prove them here then. Plus, it should be noted where these prophetic things were written and how credible the source of that is. 

And again, I don't have the recollection of knowing what they are, if it's in the bible. 

Oh geez, here we go again. :no:

So, every disciple of every religion can ask that and assume that's a thought provoking question to get you to convert? What if you could be wrong about my belief's tenets and such? What if I'm right about mine? 

How many religions are there again? How many religions are there that could make a person wrong by chance if they sit back and scoff? 

Yes, it is easy to sit back and scoff, because the proof is hard to find more than likely, right? More so, if you have to 'ask' 'what if you're wrong' question. That, in itself, is not a good point to prove existence. 

 

Hey Stubbly,

I apologize in advance, I really don't feel like picking apart what you wrote there and commenting on each item individually, I just don't have the energy for that.

I'm not here to argue, prove, or disprove. I will say that it's perfectly ok to believe in God, or to not believe in God. Whether or not God is real is left up to the individual to decide.

I suppose I approach things somewhat differently, as I believe that all things are possible. That being the case for me, I choose to believe.

 

Edited by WoIverine
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crystal sage

I think all that is expected of us is to live good lives... be kind and considerate.. and we have been given 'Free Will'   the magnificent ability to think and reason to  create whatever we want...   ...   we are told not to judge as God Judges us... our deeds.. our works... but then bits of God forces are in everything.. all things are connected.. we are all social beings designed to work together.. we judge ourselves by measuring ourselves against all we know.. feel.. sense.. constant reflection of how our actions bounce off against reality.   Karma seems to work this way too... allegedly once we pass over.. we experience our lives through how we have affected others in our lives.. ( note we are said to feel all the pain  .. suffering.. and good that our actions or inactions have cause others ... or world or realities of influence throughout our lives... we judge ourselves by the reflections of our influences against all realities... this is how we measure our worth... are said to use these measurements... whether they were intended so or not... we are measured by how we and our actions.. choices  were perceived  by the rest of reality.  ( this is where Fake News... lack of communication.. misunderstandings.. false perceptions play a big part.. )   Where we become super Empaths... raw to all that we are surrounded by...   it may be experienced as hell or purgatory until all is sorted... where forgiveness.. compassion on all sides are important... less one is thrown back into the felt need to do a 'do over'.. to fix things.. ... :)  It seems that a more sensible thing may be to forgive.. learn lessons.. build a bridge to a better future for all.. not get dragged back.. ( is emotional black mail another indicator of Karmic influence... where we are dragged back to help others try and fix things.. with their attempts at "do overs"  to pass a test of worthiness to move to the next phase... we feel such a connection  to help others that we are emotionally attached to so that we are dragged back anyway... why?? because we are basically good.. we judge ourselves.. we want to help others heal..   Like spiritual therapy... counselling... doing our homework to create new and better habits.. ways.. or to help influence others to do better...   Is it the perceived God influence ?  the God in us?   note the people who feel too much ... the empaths... they feel like they are living their hell on earth as they feel everyone's pain... to the extent it drives them down to their depths that they see no way out... depression... it is because they are essentially good... not evil.. their focus on light to help them out.. focusing on the good in the world.. feeding the good.. getting fueled and healed  by the good in all.. the beauty of nature.. perceptive flips... by the intrinsic healing ability of helping others.. creating beauty.. art...

 

Is it the God in all... the  free will of creative choices.. ?  that determines our experiences??? our experiential realities ??? positivity   appreciation and gratitude for happiness.. ( appreciation.. gratitude.. hope.. faith.. determination.. creation..   ) the fuel of prayers.. the essence of life ...

 

The miracle of life and realities... the mystical magic outside cause and effect. the unfathomable infinite.. depth .. breadth and  mystery of consciousness... sub conscious.. conscious.. super conscious...   inspirational  unknown.. unseen influences .. the results and interactions of our expanded senses..    the unlimited potentials of  our  ability . that is only limited by our levels of perceived awareness..  are  all evidence of some sort of supernatural God effects.   the  collective influences of all that we are aware of and have  yet to be aware of... an unlimited playing field of potentials... note how even the past... memories.. or perceived future realities  can affect us at any and every moment.. we are thus multi dimensional beings.. experiencing life via past .. present and future influences.. including the influences of all the other players in our realities.. every word we read.. every thing we learn.. get taught.. experience.. or have experiences.. every thing we imagine.. or others have experienced.. imagined.. been taught.. influences us on all levels at anyone time.. like a form of informational experiential  internet clouds.. that can be accessed  consciously and unconsciously at any and every moment..  

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crystal sage
14 hours ago, RabidMongoose said:

 The human brain is fully capable of creating reality (we do so when we are dreaming).

In my opinion our creation of reality is layered. Our basic thought processes and conscious awareness lay the foundations. Then ontop of that the higher thinking (perceptions and ideas) we engage in builds up the reality we experience. Anywhere we place our conscious awareness we get the same reality because the basic and higher thoughts going on inside our heads didnt change.

So the dream reality reflects the real reality. And if you have tried placing your conscious awareness anywhere else (astro-projection) then that reality is the same too.

I am currently working on changing aspects of my mind to see if it seems to affect reality and I am having some success.

The quickest way for me to manifest things.. situations is to simply "wonder" about something...   The most significant one was years ago when I was driving along and noticed that a building that I had driven past often had changed color.. as in being renovated .. repainted.. I noticed that the building was a Nutrametics headquarters.. one of the first all natural makeup pyramid selling organizations.. the Tupperware of makeup and creams.. they promoted that their products were so natural .. that you could eat them..   I went to one of those parties over 20 years earlier impressed with what they promoted and so bought their range of moisturizers.. lipsticks etc.. only to find out that they caused one of the worst rashes ever for me.. with lumps all over my face.. not willing to put the blame on the makeup at first..  and waste the money I spent on it..  I waited for a while and tried again  .. only to realize that  the old Oil of Ulan and Nivea worked better for me..    so.. getting back to my story... when I noticed the building... It brought back all my memories of the people at that Nutrametics party.. ( more coincidences as the girl who hosted it was the best friend of my next door neighbor  from way back in primary school who I hadn't seen in over a decade) . When I got home I began wondering what sort of products that firm was selling now, if the range was any different... if I was still allergic to it.   Minutes after that thought the phone rang, and  this time it was the niece of  the husband of  my   best friend neighbor  of 10 years  ( who I had only briefly met once before at my neighbour's house ) who was holding the party and invited me to the Nutrametics party she was holding !!!    What was the chance of that !!!!  :)  I was still allergic to the products.. my skin came up in hundreds of bumps..

Other times I just merely think of an object of something that I might like.. like design in a glass or a vase.. the next time I go to the shops.. I seem to get drawn to a store.. and there it is.. exactly the object I visualized... and at a remarkably good price.. and each time.. the shop owner had no clue that they sold the product... had to look up their lists.. often there was only the one.. or the quantity I was looking for in the shop...   other times there are time displacements.. where I get lost.. eg.. traffic forces me to take a detour into a strange side street and a short distance later I find myself near a place I recognize.. eg .. the local shopping center.. I know that I should not have arrived there as I took the detour at the other side of the city.. that it was impossible time wise to get where I arrived . I then decide  that I may as well pick up a grocery item or two.. only to run into  another friend that I hadn't seen in years.. they too would comment on the randomness of their arrival at that place at that time... ( the situation is almost how it would appear in a dream.. but is real.. eg.. items bought during that time now in the house .. proof that it occurred... )    it is little things like that that connect people.. situations.. yet do not affect the overall picture of reality ... that constantly amazes me... makes me realize that we have little mini realities in the world.. the glitches that are not quite connected to all...

 

:) maybe that is why my deliberate wonderings  of winning Tattslotto don't work.. 

  Or maybe it is the power of all the thoughts on how Money is exempt from spiritual experiences.. The ideation brought on by various religions  that money is sinful...  ( note these organizations are happy in helping us rid ourselves of this burden.. and have gained huge wealth and power associated with this.. yet seem rather hesitant to share it with those of their flock who need it... )  This idea that money is not Godly  is BS  !!!  .. as it is the credit we exchange to exist in our world.. it is our security.. we know that people.. friends.. loved ones are important.. but we have no idea how important money is until we are at threat of losing our homes.. not having the funds to pay for medical treatment for our children, money to clothe,, to fix the car.. replace the worn tires of our car.. to buy the gift our children desire for their birthday.. to afford the music, art or sport lessons, the related instruments or clothing .. they need to belong. The money to even put the food on the table.. to pay for the electricity or the phone..   then we know that money is important for the well being and survival.. just like the air we breath.. the water.. the sun.. money does make our world go around.. :) offers security... they say money does not bring happiness... ???  Who said that?  It is so much easier to be miserable with money than without.. Those who are miserable with no money can tell you that .

 

http://www.acts17-11.com/money.html

 

Who wrote all of this ???  creating a world that required money to exist.. ( unless you were a survivalist living off the grid)  or just lived off the land and trade goods.. you would only live part of a life... you would still have more of a life with modern technology.. sewerage.. water on tap.. heating.. light... internet.. flights to all places in the world.. cars and good roads to mobilize you... note the survivalists are all weaponed up as there is no security.. no police force to keep the place safe.. no immediate care with sudden illnesses like appendix.. fevers.. injuries.. birth.. you are segregated from most of the world... for?? the need to grow food... be reliant on weather.. the seeds.. the soils.. ?   We need each other and have basically done an amazing job with our technology so far.. true we need to clean up our messes.. and not take advantage of others or destroy nature  on the road to progress ... but other than the stresses and the too many hours it takes  towards making enough money to be part of this new world.. we are on the road.. already they are considering from the success of their past experiments..  http://www.dominionpaper.ca/articles/4100

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/rob-commentary/the-time-for-a-guaranteed-annual-income-might-finally-have-come/article25819266/

http://www.economist.com/blogs/freeexchange/2013/09/working-hours

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by crystal sage

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Stubbly_Dooright
18 hours ago, WoIverine said:

Hey Stubbly,

I apologize in advance, I really don't feel like picking apart what you wrote there and commenting on each item individually, I just don't have the energy for that.

I'm not here to argue, prove, or disprove. I will say that it's perfectly ok to believe in God, or to not believe in God. Whether or not God is real is left up to the individual to decide.

I suppose I approach things somewhat differently, as I believe that all things are possible. That being the case for me, I choose to believe.

 

Thanks Wolverine for your nice reply. :) 

It might be me, (more than likely) but you came off to me, like devout and totally believing in it. Your comments in your post seemed similar to some who just flat out make statements. *shrugs* 

I'm the same way, and feel strongly with anyone believing and not believing. I wouldn't say I'm on the fence, but what I do believe, it's already something that I have very strong confidence in and my place in it. :yes: 

Even if I'm not sure if I'm feeling messages in my heart from what 'guidance' I get. I feel at peace at it, even if I'm not sure. My belief is also against prosetylizing, so it doesn't matter if I have proof for others or not. 

It is definitely something for me to believe, the incredible subjectiveness of it. :D 

 

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WoIverine
1 hour ago, Stubbly_Dooright said:

Thanks Wolverine for your nice reply. :) 

It might be me, (more than likely) but you came off to me, like devout and totally believing in it. Your comments in your post seemed similar to some who just flat out make statements. *shrugs* 

I'm the same way, and feel strongly with anyone believing and not believing. I wouldn't say I'm on the fence, but what I do believe, it's already something that I have very strong confidence in and my place in it. :yes: 

Even if I'm not sure if I'm feeling messages in my heart from what 'guidance' I get. I feel at peace at it, even if I'm not sure. My belief is also against prosetylizing, so it doesn't matter if I have proof for others or not. 

It is definitely something for me to believe, the incredible subjectiveness of it. :D 

 

Hey, sorry. I didn't mean to come off as preachy, I wasn't trying to.

I don't really know how to explain it, when I accepted God, I just had this sense of joy, like everything was going to be ok. Even though it seems like we're in some pretty crazy times what with political upheavals, etc, those things no longer bother me anywhere near as much as they did before.

I don't know how it works, or why it works, but I've never been at peace, until now.

Anyway, just wanted to share, thank you for being accepting, and open minded. :tu:

Edited by WoIverine
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jmccr8
On 5/25/2017 at 2:32 AM, crystal sage said:

We already know that we see what we expect to see.. or know should be there in our experiential  existence.. but science has already found that there are vibrations.. sounds.. colors.. that are not visible.. or comprehensible to us... we know that our senses gather more information than we are aware of  at any time.. which may trigger our intuition.. our ;) sixth  or seventh sense... triggers.. vibrations.. subliminal or superliminal  information that registers in our subconscious  ...  just think... our awareness follows helps create our expectations.. intents..

In part I am inclined to consider that our senses play a bigger part in our lives, well more specifically my life and what I see in the people that I encounter. Certain skill/experience creates signals whether or not we know what we are, we use all of our skills to personally evolve, much of this is dependent on environment but the basics always apply.( I should clarify that the we is me :D). Certain truths are common because of how they relate/re-act in different perspectives.

jmccr8

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Stubbly_Dooright
On 5/28/2017 at 0:07 AM, jmccr8 said:
On 5/25/2017 at 5:32 AM, crystal sage said:

We already know that we see what we expect to see.. or know should be there in our experiential  existence.. but science has already found that there are vibrations.. sounds.. colors.. that are not visible.. or comprehensible to us... we know that our senses gather more information than we are aware of  at any time.. which may trigger our intuition.. our ;) sixth  or seventh sense... triggers.. vibrations.. subliminal or superliminal  information that registers in our subconscious  ...  just think... our awareness follows helps create our expectations.. intents..

In part I am inclined to consider that our senses play a bigger part in our lives, well more specifically my life and what I see in the people that I encounter. Certain skill/experience creates signals whether or not we know what we are, we use all of our skills to personally evolve, much of this is dependent on environment but the basics always apply.( I should clarify that the we is me :D). Certain truths are common because of how they relate/re-act in different perspectives.

jmccr8

I think, that is very important to point out. :yes: 

 

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Only_
On 2017-05-26 at 9:47 AM, WoIverine said:

I don't really know how to explain it, when I accepted God, I just had this sense of joy, like everything was going to be ok. Even though it seems like we're in some pretty crazy times what with political upheavals, etc, those things no longer bother me anywhere near as much as they did before.

You accepted the true God, not the creator of this world. That's the difference.

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WoIverine
3 hours ago, TruthSeeker_ said:

You accepted the true God, not the creator of this world. That's the difference.

To me, they're one and the same.

To you, they may not be.

Edited by WoIverine
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Maureen_jacobs

God needs not to prove himself.  Those who believe will know when he arrives.

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Stubbly_Dooright
10 hours ago, Maureen_jacobs said:

God needs not to prove himself.  Those who believe will know when he arrives.

I'm curious. (I'm sorry Maureen, this seems vague. ) but, if it's only those who believe, then still everyone wont know, if it's only those who believe in him. Does that mean, that when he arrives, non-believers could mistake him for a natural situation? 

Now, I can relate to those who feel they have been touched by something. I feel that way about my belief. Some posts here describe the same thing of what I feel. I do feel it's still extremely subjective. In fact, while the effects are the same for me, as it is for them, the player(s) are different. I just feel it's a higher power. That's the thing, I don't think you can label quickly it's something that you can lecture to others, considering how inconsistent the specifics are. 

 

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Onoma

I think a better question is how God will / could be proven, objectively true in some sense, and then still have people doubt the Bible

The book says that all knees will bow, and all tongues confess, and that simply isn't going to happen if people still doubt the " divine authorship " of the Bible

Yet, the book is the most heavily edited book ever, with different versions, even differing letter counts in the supposed perfectly kept Torah

..and " divinity " has not been objectively defined, afaik, so even the definition of  " divine authorship " is not settled

So, in order for the statements in the Bible to be true ( all knees and all tongues ) and there to be no more doubt in the " divine " source of the scriptures, you'd think from that one could infer that if there is a way to prove God exists and is real and true in some capacity, that that proof would be somehow connected to the proof of the divinity of the Bible itself

If the Bible is " sacred " or divine in some way, nobody has yet to prove it

And, afaik, the only way to prove things objectively is with natural and symbolic languages, ie " math proofs "

...so....good luck with that

 

:P

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Maureen_jacobs
On 5/31/2017 at 9:42 AM, Stubbly_Dooright said:

I'm curious. (I'm sorry Maureen, this seems vague. ) but, if it's only those who believe, then still everyone wont know, if it's only those who believe in him. Does that mean, that when he arrives, non-believers could mistake him for a natural situation? 

Now, I can relate to those who feel they have been touched by something. I feel that way about my belief. Some posts here describe the same thing of what I feel. I do feel it's still extremely subjective. In fact, while the effects are the same for me, as it is for them, the player(s) are different. I just feel it's a higher power. That's the thing, I don't think you can label quickly it's something that you can lecture to others, considering how inconsistent the specifics are. 

 

Perhaps I was not clear.  I am saying God will not need to prove himself to anyone, we will already know he is here.  I'm not religiously inclined, however, I believe that if God were here on earth, all would be well.  He would present himself in a way where we would all see him.

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crystal sage
On ‎5‎/‎30‎/‎2017 at 11:43 PM, Stubbly_Dooright said:

I think, that is very important to point out. :yes: 

 

 

On ‎5‎/‎28‎/‎2017 at 2:07 PM, jmccr8 said:

In part I am inclined to consider that our senses play a bigger part in our lives, well more specifically my life and what I see in the people that I encounter. Certain skill/experience creates signals whether or not we know what we are, we use all of our skills to personally evolve, much of this is dependent on environment but the basics always apply.( I should clarify that the we is me :D). Certain truths are common because of how they relate/re-act in different perspectives.

jmccr8

I think somehow we know outside our senses...   our senses work at measuring our place in and how to navigate our shared world.. a shared world of interjected agreed meanings of what .. how.. why and where our world is to us all.  We need common groundings to communicate on levels that we can understand each other.. as a base line to measure our realities.  we need others to interact and share meanings.. to motivate us and to inspire us to search and create more.  We need external interactions to inspire  to think.. to even bother to find meaning. Happiness is also found in the freedom to have choices.. will..  assess and implement creative possibilities.. to stimulate our minds... consciousnesses.  even when we are resting.. and our body is restoring and rebuilding itself ,  our minds travel .. do things.. explore potentials in our sleep our dreams..

 

I'd say that god includes the sum of all our consciousnesses.. the sub conscious.. conscious.. super conscious.. as well as what we assume is our central ego that assesses .. it is our central egoic self that influences and activates cause and effect...   the God force would have to be some sort of super Ego.. the whole that exceeds the sum of all parts.. all egos.. thinking of our egoic selves as lint attached or floating around to attach to the major Egoic Force.  a gravitational field of consciousness ??

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Only_
On 2017-05-30 at 10:12 PM, WoIverine said:

To me, they're one and the same.

To you, they may not be.

Our Divine sparks are trapped here, in the material world, because of an ignorant emanation of the Godhead.

Edited by TruthSeeker_

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GoldenWolf
11 minutes ago, TruthSeeker_ said:

Our Divine sparks are trapped here, in the material world, because of an ignorant emanation of the Godhead.

Must suck to be spiritually bankrupt.

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Stubbly_Dooright
3 hours ago, Maureen_jacobs said:

Perhaps I was not clear.  I am saying God will not need to prove himself to anyone, we will already know he is here.  I'm not religiously inclined, however, I believe that if God were here on earth, all would be well.  He would present himself in a way where we would all see him.

I don't know, I guess it's my secular/non-religious upbringing. That still seems kind of vague to me. If he would present himself where we all would see him, how would that be? 

On 5/31/2017 at 1:43 PM, Onoma said:

I think a better question is how God will / could be proven, objectively true in some sense, and then still have people doubt the Bible

The book says that all knees will bow, and all tongues confess, and that simply isn't going to happen if people still doubt the " divine authorship " of the Bible

Yet, the book is the most heavily edited book ever, with different versions, even differing letter counts in the supposed perfectly kept Torah

..and " divinity " has not been objectively defined, afaik, so even the definition of  " divine authorship " is not settled

So, in order for the statements in the Bible to be true ( all knees and all tongues ) and there to be no more doubt in the " divine " source of the scriptures, you'd think from that one could infer that if there is a way to prove God exists and is real and true in some capacity, that that proof would be somehow connected to the proof of the divinity of the Bible itself

If the Bible is " sacred " or divine in some way, nobody has yet to prove it

And, afaik, the only way to prove things objectively is with natural and symbolic languages, ie " math proofs "

...so....good luck with that

 

:P

I find this post very interesting, and probably have it as an example to Maureen_jacobs. 

2 hours ago, crystal sage said:

 

I think somehow we know outside our senses...   our senses work at measuring our place in and how to navigate our shared world.. a shared world of interjected agreed meanings of what .. how.. why and where our world is to us all.  We need common groundings to communicate on levels that we can understand each other.. as a base line to measure our realities.  we need others to interact and share meanings.. to motivate us and to inspire us to search and create more.  We need external interactions to inspire  to think.. to even bother to find meaning. Happiness is also found in the freedom to have choices.. will..  assess and implement creative possibilities.. to stimulate our minds... consciousnesses.  even when we are resting.. and our body is restoring and rebuilding itself ,  our minds travel .. do things.. explore potentials in our sleep our dreams..

 

I'd say that god includes the sum of all our consciousnesses.. the sub conscious.. conscious.. super conscious.. as well as what we assume is our central ego that assesses .. it is our central egoic self that influences and activates cause and effect...   the God force would have to be some sort of super Ego.. the whole that exceeds the sum of all parts.. all egos.. thinking of our egoic selves as lint attached or floating around to attach to the major Egoic Force.  a gravitational field of consciousness ??

So, that's how some say God is all around us? I would think that, heck reflect that a lot. Can each of our senses have proof of each of them? An interesting thought there. :yes: 

1 hour ago, TruthSeeker_ said:
On 5/30/2017 at 10:12 PM, WoIverine said:

To me, they're one and the same.

To you, they may not be.

Our Divine sparks are trapped here, in the material world, because of an ignorant emanation of the Godhead.

:unsure2: 

Sorry, I think Wolverine makes more sense in that. 

58 minutes ago, Mystic Crusader said:

Must suck to be spiritually bankrupt.

:lol:

 

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Tatetopa
On 4/5/2017 at 2:48 AM, kartikg said:

I was just thinking, if God does come down to earth, how would he prove that he is god. Without breaking any laws of nature.

What I wonder about this is not how but why?  I don't mean to imply insignificance, only a matter of differentiation; how would you prove to an ant or a rose bush that you are human?  Why would you care?  Why would the ant or rose bush care?  The awareness of an ant or rose bush is not set up to embrace humanness or its implications. Likely we are too different from god if he exists to appreciate his scope or motives.  

The question seems to imply a preconception of god as a human-like all powerful king.  Obey the king's laws or he will chop your hand off or cut off your head.  The king will protect his subjects from dangerous animals and enemies.  It seems as circumscribed a vision of the universe as a citizen of Ur or Babylon might have about their city and its king.  

 

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crystal sage
3 hours ago, Stubbly_Dooright said:

I don't know, I guess it's my secular/non-religious upbringing. That still seems kind of vague to me. If he would present himself where we all would see him, how would that be? 

I find this post very interesting, and probably have it as an example to Maureen_jacobs. 

So, that's how some say God is all around us? I would think that, heck reflect that a lot. Can each of our senses have proof of each of them? An interesting thought there. :yes: 

:unsure2: 

Sorry, I think Wolverine makes more sense in that. 

:lol:

 

I think maybe that they were thinking of Jesus reappearing.. would we know Him if he suddenly reappeared... why do some religious people interchange God and Jesus ?       Unless they are thinking of  a partial manifestation of God... just like the elementals "appear" to the shamans and Druids.. as a spirit of the trees.. or of the lake..  http://www.dnaalchemy.com/Devas_Elementals_and_Fairies.html     God  could then conceivably manifest  as ...

Quote

The word deva is from the Sanskrit language, meaning "a being of brilliant light" and is used to indicate a non-physical being.

A Deva refers to any of the spiritual forces or beings behind nature. According to Theosophists like Leadbeater and Alice A. Bailey, Devas represent a separate
evolution to that of humanity. The concept of Devas as nature-spirits derives from the writings of the Theosophist Geoffrey Hodson

In the Findhorn material, the term refers to archetypal spiritual intelligences behind species, in other words the group soul of a species. But elsewhere the term is
used to designate any elemental or nature spirit, the equivalent of fairies.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deva

Consciousness of the devas is directed to expansion.   Devas are always conscious of their cosmic environment, and want to become ever more conscious of that
what they encompass. Devas have an instinctive knowledge of cosmic patterns, relationships, and harmonies  therefore they do not have to acquire knowledge.  
They exist in the form of energy in the astral realm and they are like fluid open vortexes of cosmic consciousness.   People can often perceive them intuitively as the
flowing essence of vortexes of energies.  However, we may often perceive a physical shape as our consciousness filters the energy into something we can relate to.

http://soul-guidance.com/houseofthesun/devas.htm

and would it be the God of the Earth... the God of our Galaxy.. or the God of our Universe be one that is expected... or the God of all... which is rather hard to even spread your mind to conceive.. 

 

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Stubbly_Dooright
5 hours ago, crystal sage said:

I think maybe that they were thinking of Jesus reappearing.. would we know Him if he suddenly reappeared... why do some religious people interchange God and Jesus ?       Unless they are thinking of  a partial manifestation of God... just like the elementals "appear" to the shamans and Druids.. as a spirit of the trees.. or of the lake..  http://www.dnaalchemy.com/Devas_Elementals_and_Fairies.html     God  could then conceivably manifest  as ...

http://soul-guidance.com/houseofthesun/devas.htm

and would it be the God of the Earth... the God of our Galaxy.. or the God of our Universe be one that is expected... or the God of all... which is rather hard to even spread your mind to conceive.. 

 

I must say, I enjoyed the music in that video. 

I appreciate your reply to me. :yes: And I feel, that there will always be more to reflect. I think though, considering the title and definition of this thread, I wonder if the question can be answered. I think the people and their outlook, show a different spin at looking at it, (and how I can see it too. :) ) but in the end, it's still extremely subjective. If God wants to show himself to us, it would be all of us, I would think, right? In an objective way. In which, reflecting (and maybe using your points in your posts here, :yes: ) how is that done, when there is a world full of different perspectives in how he's seen. (or not seen due to disbelief) I see many different groups of spiritualists (and I may have this point of view) have their own way of subjectively seeing God, but in someone or another group, point of view, they may see something else. 

I think your video shows a more secular outlook of how one sees one's self in scheme of things, which is coming to the conclusion of feeling small to the universe. I have read and heard varying accounts of those have been in space and come to conclusions of seeing down unto the Earth. (I was trying to find out who does the music of the video, but got nowhere.) 

I think Tatetopa's recent post, makes a good point of why would the event occur, if God does want to show himself. I think there is a lot more to think about in why and how, that I think it's really very complicated.

I'm thinking, no wonder everything is so subjective!   :o 

;) 

:tu: 

 

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