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Russia warns the US of serious consequences


seeder
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1 minute ago, Claire. said:

Yes, we're aware, but that in no way tarnishes the reports of other doctors, most of whom stated the symptoms were indicative of exposure to a nerve agent. The doctors' diagnoses were later confirmed post mortem.

 

bravo. even I can certify a dead man as having died.

But nothing so far says who is to blame

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8 minutes ago, seeder said:

 

erm.... because he was elected and has the support of his people?

 

If indeed the result was legitimate and not massaged.

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Just now, A rather obscure Bassoon said:

If indeed the result was legitimate and not massaged.

 

oh like US elections you mean?  :lol:  theres as many conspiracy theories about those too

 

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3 minutes ago, seeder said:

 

oh like US elections you mean?  :lol:  theres as many conspiracy theories about those too

 

Since voting was only held in government controlled areas, a landslide for Assad comes as no surprise.

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Saddam Hussein, Gadaffi, now Assad?

sounds like entire regime change in the mid east doesnt it?

Instigated by the US of course...and Israel approves of course...as does Turkey.... both of whom want Syrian land

Yes that may get some flack.... but Ive got broad shoulders

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Lets bomb evil Assad ..... and when (the US) kill innocents.... well that doesnt matter

 

Quote

 

US-led coalition killed more Syrian civilians than Isis or Russia in March, figures show

In the same month, number of deaths from US air strikes across region soars as Russia scales back its operation

More civilians caught up in the Syrian conflict were killed by US-led coalitions than by Isis or Russian-led forces in the last month, according to figures released by a human rights organisation.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/us-coalition-air-strikes-isis-russia-kill-more-civilians-march-middle-east-iraq-syria-network-for-a7663881.html

 

 

 

 

now why wont the world bomb the USA..... because it kills women and children? Oh yeh I know....they are ONLY Syrian kids and women so it doesnt matter does it?

 

 

 

 

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14 minutes ago, seeder said:

Saddam Hussein, Gadaffi, now Assad?

sounds like entire regime change in the mid east doesnt it?

Instigated by the US of course...and Israel approves of course...as does Turkey.... both of whom want Syrian land

Yes that may get some flack.... but Ive got broad shoulders

Seeder, Saddam, Gadaffi...all term valuable players who are good until they are not good anymore. 

War is bussines. End of story.

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2 minutes ago, odas said:

Seeder, Saddam, Gadaffi...all term valuable players who are good until they are not good anymore. 

War is bussines. End of story.

 

It doesnt make it right tho does it?

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46 minutes ago, Claire. said:

Why don't you start by telling us why he should stay.

 

whats up Claire?  Cat got your tongue?

Please answer

Quote

 

Lets see who here is really smart

WHY is the US determined Assad MUST GO?

 

 

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1 hour ago, seeder said:

 

Oh? perhaps you have some info the rest of us dont?  Pls  enlighten us on exactly who initiated the chem attack?  As I believe no-one actually knows for sure

Several news stations have all reported this (that the origin of the chemical attacks was known). Now, unless you happen to be there in Syria and happen to have seen the planes depart and happen to be in the vicinity of the chemicals being released (see what I mean). So, do you know any better than what the news sources are reporting? Personally, I wasn't there so I have to go with what has been reported across the board. Honestly, none of us can say we know anything for certain unless we were there...which (I doubt) any of us were.

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31 minutes ago, seeder said:

whats up Claire?  Cat got your tongue?

Please answer

Dinner takes priority. No need to chase me down.

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35 minutes ago, seeder said:

 

It doesnt make it right tho does it?

It never does. 

And why Assad has to go? Easy. Look arround. Putin takes a part of Georgia, then Crimea, his eyes are on the baltics and balkans. He OWNS Erdog now. He is good with Iran, Isis is HIS baby with unintentional help of the west. He is prepairing for the big move. Assad is his lamb that he will slaughter once he has done his job. Assad needs to go before Putin achieves what he wants and he is close.

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2 hours ago, Lilly said:

Like I said, we struck the airbase from which the chemical attackers originated. Tends to throw a real wrench into the ability of whoever did it to do it again.

 

what?    90 million dollars of missiles and they still didnt disable the runways...... planes are STILL taking off from the same place.... and there are reports many missiles missed the targets all together!

Call that a wrench?  More like a knee jerk waste of time

oh and YOUR country peoples tax money.
 

Quote

 


Syrian jets take off from Shayrat airbase hours after it was pummeled by US bombs, reports suggest

By taking off, the warplanes had 'done the impossible', according to the London based Syrian Observatory for Human Rights

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/syrian-planes-shayrat-air-base-homes-us-air-strikes-syrian-observatory-human-rights-bashar-al-assad-a7673511.html

 

 

 

 

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NOTE: Lets all remember.... we all have our opinions. We may agree on some topics, we may like each others comments too,  on those topics... and because some of us may not agree on this topic...

well.... its just another topic..

no need for bad feelings

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Personally, I'm not aware of what Putin's endgame in Syria actually is. He could be planning to let Assad take the fall and cozy up with the Iranians? There could be a variety of options he's entertaining. I do know one thing for sure, whatever it is that Putin's up to it isn't going to be good for America.

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1 hour ago, seeder said:

bravo. even I can certify a dead man as having died.

But nothing so far says who is to blame

Post mortems are conducted to determine the cause of death. Determination of death itself occurs prior to a body hitting the slab — at least in ideal circumstances. What is important about the autopsy results is that they confirmed that sarin was indeed the nerve agent used.

Does that tell us who's to blame. You bet it does.

Aum Shinrikyo was the Japanese doomsday cult responsible for the Tokyo subway attack in 1995. They are the only non-state group known to have engaged in large-scale sarin production. Not only did they have to build a facility with proper process controls, they had to hire chemists and chemical-engineers, not to mention various other scientists and experts. Total cost: $30 million.

So tell me, who in Syria could build such a facility? Who in Syria can assemble the scientists and other experts required to manufacture, store and assemble sarin for distribution? And who in Syria has the millions required to get it all done?

I'm aware of the various theories floating about in various topic threads about how rebels or ISIS could have been behind the various sarin attacks, and how they might have been able to get their hands on it, but the probability of that is slim next to none — especially when you're looking at the scale of the 2013 attack, as well as the attack from last week. Sarin is too complex a nerve agent to deal with — It's not something you can mix in your backyard. It's also, as already mentioned, prohibitively expensive. That's why you'd be most likely to see rebels and terrorists using cheaper, easier to obtain chemicals.

So everyone can theorize all they want, but know this: there is a huge difference between theoretical possibility and operational reality. And the only suspect who falls within the realm of 'operational reality' in this instance, is the Syrian government.

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27 minutes ago, Claire. said:

Post mortems are conducted to determine the cause of death. Determination of death itself occurs prior to a body hitting the slab — at least in ideal circumstances. What is important about the autopsy results is that they confirmed that sarin was indeed the nerve agent used.

Does that tell us who's to blame. You bet it does.

 

 

You forgot to add....in your opinion

Anyone could have gotten chem weapons into that area....the US....or its proxies..... aka terrorists..... Assad had no reason as he was winning the war against ISIS.... every week it was reported how ISIS was on the run and how more territory was free of terrorists

Its even been stated there could have been a munitions dump hit......or heck...the US could even have dropped a chem bomb disguised as Syrian. Im sure the US are not beyond that, sadly

But who did the right thing and went and investigated the bomb site? Who went and retrieved evidence of Syrian involvement?

Yes thats right. No-one. You dont  sentence a man to death in the US and many more parts of the world without proof

And here..... there is no proof

 

 

 

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13 minutes ago, Claire. said:

So everyone can theorize all they want, but know this: there is a huge difference between theoretical possibility and operational reality. And the only suspect who falls within the realm of 'operational reality' in this instance, is the Syrian government.

Sarin production can and has occurred in Turkey also, Claire. The below link even mentions a Turkish MP bring up the issue in the Turkish parliament. The raw ingredients can be produced in a foreign country and mixed and readied in the host country by combatants. So its not just Syria that has this capability. Just saying...

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/world-news/sarin-gas-materials-sent-to-isis-from-turkey-claims-mp-eren-erdem-34286662.html

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2 minutes ago, seeder said:

You forgot to add....in your opinion

Anyone could have gotten chem weapons into that area....the US....or its proxies..... aka terrorists..... Assad had no reason as he was winning the war against ISIS.... every week it was reported how ISIS was on the run and how more territory was free of terrorists

Its even been stated there could have been a munitions dump hit......or heck...the US could even have dropped a chem bomb disguised as Syrian. Im sure the US are not beyond that, sadly

But who did the right thing and went and investigated the bomb site? Who went and retrieved evidence of Syrian involvement?

Yes thats right. No-one.

For someone anxious to keep things civil, you certainly have no qualms about utilizing sarcasm. That's three times now with me.

I did not forget to add in my opinion as that is the opinion of many experts, including scientists. Assad does indeed have his reasons. They've already been outlined, but obviously you don't agree. As for the munitions dump hit, I have twice explained (citing expert and scientific opinion) on why that is not possible. Again, you obviously do not agree with the experts.

But yeah sure, if you want to believe that Americans have a sarin facility in the area, a couple of Syrian planes on standby, and the willingness to drop a nerve agent on an innocent population for the purpose of getting into a war with Syria and Russia, then by all means do so.

 

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11 minutes ago, Claire. said:

For someone anxious to keep things civil, you certainly have no qualms about utilizing sarcasm. That's three times now with me.

I did not forget to add in my opinion as that is the opinion of many experts, including scientists. Assad does indeed have his reasons. They've already been outlined, but obviously you don't agree. As for the munitions dump hit, I have twice explained (citing expert and scientific opinion) on why that is not possible. Again, you obviously do not agree with the experts.

But yeah sure, if you want to believe that Americans have a sarin facility in the area, a couple of Syrian planes on standby, and the willingness to drop a nerve agent on an innocent population for the purpose of getting into a war with Syria and Russia, then by all means do so.

 

 

 

do you understand the word proxies?   and why would they need Syrian planes? And as I have posted already, the US has already killed countless civilians incl women and kids,,,, in Syria, why care about a few more so long as they can blame others? Like Assad? The man they want gone

 

 

 

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14 minutes ago, Claire. said:

 

 

Again, you obviously do not agree with the experts.

 

 

thats healthy of course. US, Russian, and Syrian experts dont agree either..... and they are all experts :lol:

 

 

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Old news...funny enough....about Syria. 2013
 

Quote

 

Who Made the Sarin Used in Syria?

Some telltale signs could hint at the origins of the nerve poison

 Clues to the source of the chemical poison that U.S. officials say killed more than 1,400 people in Syria last month may come from the weapon casing, not the material itself.

The source question boils down to who made the substance, thought to be sarin—the government or another actor. Secretary of State John Kerry today told Senators that he is “certain” none of the opposition has the weapons or capacity to make a strike of this scale, but distinguishing purified military grade sarin from sarin brewed up at home by studying traces left at an attack site, is not easy.

The two versions do differ in some ways. Military grade sarin, for instance, would not contain chemical byproducts likely to be present in sarin made through other recipes. And traces of the impurities in home-brewed sarin would be detectable in soil. But different recipes for the home-brewed version will yield different byproducts, and investigators may have no way of knowing which ones to seek. Even if the byproducts were known, detectives would need to know the normal levels of those compounds in the soil to determine whether the amounts are elevated.

Likewise, examining tissues from victims would provide little help.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/who-made-the-sarin/


 

 

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1 hour ago, Captain Risky said:

Sarin production can and has occurred in Turkey also, Claire. The below link even mentions a Turkish MP bring up the issue in the Turkish parliament. The raw ingredients can be produced in a foreign country and mixed and readied in the host country by combatants. So its not just Syria that has this capability. Just saying...

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/world-news/sarin-gas-materials-sent-to-isis-from-turkey-claims-mp-eren-erdem-34286662.html

Thanks Cap, I'm aware of Eren Erdem's statements. I'm also aware of the evidence challenging their veracity.

From what I recall, the chemical substances discovered were not sarin, but rather, substances used to produce anti-freeze. Furthermore, the police launched an investigation into Al-Nusra, Al-Qaeda’s Syrian branch, not ISIS. Erdem also cited a telephone call where a formula for sarin was supposedly discussed. Turns out it was just a list of ingredients, but sarin is not something that's made from mixing a few ingredients in a bowl. Even if that was the case, they had the wrong 'recipe'.

There is absolutely no way sarin can be manufactured in someone's basement. The ingredients, in many ways, are more dangerous than the final product. Furthermore, the amount of sarin used in the 2013 attacks would have required an industrial effort and factory sized facility.

Seymour Hirsh, an American journalist, also blamed Turkey for the 2013 attack. This article from The Guardian deconstructs Hirsh's allegations and makes a solid case why Turkey could not possibly have been behind the attack. It's a long article, but well worth the read.

Edited by Claire.
Corrected spell-check.
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2 hours ago, seeder said:

erm.... because he was elected and has the support of his people?

You mean the election considered illegitimate and criticized by the UN and others in the international community for taking place during a civil war? That same election where many refugees and expatriates were not allowed to vote? That same election where only people able to get to government-controlled areas could vote? That same election where there was no independent election monitoring?

Granted at one time he was seen as a potential reformer, but then... SURPRISE!

I'm not going to bother getting into the sordid details. The allegations of war crimes against him speak for themselves.

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14 minutes ago, Claire. said:

You mean the election considered illegitimate and criticized by the UN

 

you seem to believe a lot of what you read without citing sources

Of course, the election of Trump was rigged too.....

yawn  :sleepy:  is that all you got?

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