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Is North Korea really a problem?


imrunningthismonkeyfarm

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North Korea fires ballistic missile, US official says 

Update on the story, RT is reporting the missile failed, CNN is reporting it launched and landed in the sea of Japan 

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They managed to hit the Sea of Japan? Hold me.

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I'm wondering now if the middles are failing on purpose. Not sabatoge but by Kim's order. That way he gets to talk tough yet back down from the fight without looking like a chicken. 

Edit: missiles not middles 

Edited by F3SS
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I wonder if someone else is helping his missiles fail. Sounds like he was attempting to scare Japan. The boy is a fool.

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Some good conspiracy theories coming out here, I'm glad to see. 

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8 hours ago, Hammerclaw said:

They managed to hit the Sea of Japan? Hold me.

Exactly and that's what they hit every single time so don't buy into Donald Trump's kool aid fear mongering about Kim's "ICBMs".   Every time he fires a missile it goes *ploop* right into the drink a few hundred miles away, if it even launches at all.   

Really, who is actually scared of North Korea?   At least Japan is right across the pond and the Emperor is dead already.   A prudent response to China's buildup and North Korea's antagonism would be to take the limiters off Japan's "self defense" military and let them rebuild their decimated forces.    But I know...foreigners live in a safety bubble of entitlement complex where the US "takes care of" them while they assure their loyalty in rhetoric only.

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In the face of serious threats from China and the US, he launches again.  I'm beginning to really wonder about his sanity.  I heard someone today who said Seoul was the most densely populated city on the planet.  About 25 million people.  The fact that we've seen no panic or even war drills from the ROK government tells me they know something we don't.  

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1 hour ago, and then said:

In the face of serious threats from China and the US, he launches again.  I'm beginning to really wonder about his sanity.  I heard someone today who said Seoul was the most densely populated city on the planet.  About 25 million people.  The fact that we've seen no panic or even war drills from the ROK government tells me they know something we don't.  

Well check what someone sezz next time because it's not even close.  Extrapolating from 2012 numbers at 22M and 10k, it's a bit over 11,000/km2   That doesn't account for a breakdown of smaller parts of the city where people may be really packed in.   But even if you were right, it's all the more reason not to rattle sabres.

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2 hours ago, Yamato said:

Exactly and that's what they hit every single time so don't buy into Donald Trump's kool aid fear mongering about Kim's "ICBMs".   Every time he fires a missile it goes *ploop* right into the drink a few hundred miles away, if it even launches at all. 

That might, however, have unfortunate consequences if it was to land on a ship that happened to be passing by. i doubt NK would be too scrupulous about maintaining exclusion zones and warning shipping to keep clear.

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2 hours ago, Yamato said:

 

Really, who is actually scared of North Korea?   At least Japan is right across the pond and the Emperor is dead already.   A prudent response to China's buildup and North Korea's antagonism would be to take the limiters off Japan's "self defense" military and let them rebuild their decimated forces.    

That seems to be what Honest Abe, their current leader, seems to be wanting to do. He's recently brought back the recitation of the pledge of allegiance to the Emperor in schools and has begun building up what is, in effect, with the addition of VSTOL aircraft, a carrier strike force, and has also, interestingly, said that Mein Kampf would be a useful teaching aid in schools. :unsure: 

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3 hours ago, and then said:

In the face of serious threats from China and the US, he launches again.  I'm beginning to really wonder about his sanity.  I heard someone today who said Seoul was the most densely populated city on the planet.  About 25 million people.  The fact that we've seen no panic or even war drills from the ROK government tells me they know something we don't.  

S. Korea and US did several evacuation drills throughout January and February. 

US and South Korea hold joint military exercise lots of war drills going on too. 

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11 hours ago, F3SS said:

I'm wondering now if the middles are failing on purpose. Not sabatoge but by Kim's order. That way he gets to talk tough yet back down from the fight without looking like a chicken. 

Edit: missiles not middles 

I'd say that's crediting him with too much intelligence.

It's more likely that the failures are due to pushing too fast for results, on limited resources. I'd imagine he's like a spoiled child, angrily demanding that those around him bring him his toys, NOW!

For anyone questioning whether Kim Jong-un is actually mad, consider this; if he stopped ranting and raving about destroying non-existent Western enemies, and abandoned his nuclear ambitions, North Korea, with its location between South Korea and China, could easily be one of the biggest economic growth areas on the planet. His conventional military would probably even have a massive boost economically and technologically if he abandoned the nuclear aspect.

He's living proof that raising a child to believe that they are some kind of deity is not a good idea.

Edited by LV-426
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1 hour ago, Manfred von Dreidecker said:

That might, however, have unfortunate consequences if it was to land on a ship that happened to be passing by. i doubt NK would be too scrupulous about maintaining exclusion zones and warning shipping to keep clear.

I feel compelled to warn everyone to take special precautions for being struck by lightning because that also might happen.

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1 hour ago, Manfred von Dreidecker said:

That seems to be what Honest Abe, their current leader, seems to be wanting to do. He's recently brought back the recitation of the pledge of allegiance to the Emperor in schools and has begun building up what is, in effect, with the addition of VSTOL aircraft, a carrier strike force, and has also, interestingly, said that Mein Kampf would be a useful teaching aid in schools. :unsure: 

You make it sound like free brownie points for the Trumpster.

http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2017/04/15/national/social-issues/japan-tolerates-use-hitlers-autobiography-schools/#.WQR4NNy1uUk

I don't see the big deal.  Don't be morbidly afraid of reading what Hitler wrote or anything related to the Holocaust for that matter.  That's what all that Godwin's crap is.   People are mortified to make comparisons so they have little whistles to obstruct discussion.  Because God forbid one does some homework about the Nazis and realizes that we talk and act just like them.   Of course Japanese can learn from it.   If we don't learn from history we're doomed to repeat it.   And this OP is the kind of topic where there is no if -- we are doomed to repeat it.  Most likely in Syria, the proxy of Iran and Russia.  

Although a better question for the Foreign Policy thread, what is US foreign policy in N. Korea?   Is Donald Trump going to launch another one of his beautiful missile strikes if North Korea detonates another nuke?

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Just now, Yamato said:

Is Donald Trump going to launch another one of his beautiful missile strikes if North Korea detonates another nuke?

Nahh itll be because the N. Koreans  commit a "terrorist attack" using a chemical or bio weapon once enough negative trump stories stack up in the media. 

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34 minutes ago, LV-426 said:

I'd say that's crediting him with too much intelligence.

I agree. That was just a fleeting thought.

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Kim Jong-Un Pretends to Fly a Plane

The (actual) commentary is priceless. 

Edited by Manfred von Dreidecker
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8 hours ago, Yamato said:

Exactly and that's what they hit every single time so don't buy into Donald Trump's kool aid fear mongering about Kim's "ICBMs".   Every time he fires a missile it goes *ploop* right into the drink a few hundred miles away, if it even launches at all.   

Really, who is actually scared of North Korea?   At least Japan is right across the pond and the Emperor is dead already.   A prudent response to China's buildup and North Korea's antagonism would be to take the limiters off Japan's "self defense" military and let them rebuild their decimated forces.    But I know...foreigners live in a safety bubble of entitlement complex where the US "takes care of" them while they assure their loyalty in rhetoric only.

The Japanese themselves are loathe to rebuild their military, no one is holding them back. As for Korea, their capabilities down the road is what concerns me. Better to put an end to this frozen conflict now, than later, when their ballistic missile subs may be lurking off our coasts.

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58 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

The Japanese themselves are loathe to rebuild their military, no one is holding them back.

They're not at all loathe to rebuild their military, they've already got one of the strongest in Asia and they're expanding still further. 

Japan Maritime Self-Defense Force

Japan Air Self-Defense Force 

Japan Ground Self-Defense Force

 

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11 hours ago, Yamato said:

Exactly and that's what they hit every single time so don't buy into Donald Trump's kool aid fear mongering about Kim's "ICBMs".   Every time he fires a missile it goes *ploop* right into the drink a few hundred miles away, if it even launches at all.   

Really, who is actually scared of North Korea?   At least Japan is right across the pond and the Emperor is dead already.   A prudent response to China's buildup and North Korea's antagonism would be to take the limiters off Japan's "self defense" military and let them rebuild their decimated forces.    But I know...foreigners live in a safety bubble of entitlement complex where the US "takes care of" them while they assure their loyalty in rhetoric only.

It really makes me wonder, the smartest people in NK who have to be able to think objectively and use science are the engineers and scientists who are the ones actually doing the work of building his nukes and missiles. They are smart enough to know that they need to follow orders, but there are many ways they themselves could sabotage his efforts to prevent a madman from obtaining these terrifying capabilities. I have heard similar stories of NAZI scientists doing similar things to slow down the German nuclear program behind the scenes.

 

Perhaps the NK people are the key here.

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8 hours ago, Farmer77 said:

S. Korea and US did several evacuation drills throughout January and February. 

US and South Korea hold joint military exercise lots of war drills going on too. 

 

That link was about combat air power coordination.  Do you have a link for the evacuation drills, please?  I haven't seen any mention of it. If they are indeed working on such plans, actively, then this is potentially more troubling.

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8 hours ago, LV-426 said:

I'd say that's crediting him with too much intelligence.

It's more likely that the failures are due to pushing too fast for results, on limited resources. I'd imagine he's like a spoiled child, angrily demanding that those around him bring him his toys, NOW!

For anyone questioning whether Kim Jong-un is actually mad, consider this; if he stopped ranting and raving about destroying non-existent Western enemies, and abandoned his nuclear ambitions, North Korea, with its location between South Korea and China, could easily be one of the biggest economic growth areas on the planet. His conventional military would probably even have a massive boost economically and technologically if he abandoned the nuclear aspect.

He's living proof that raising a child to believe that they are some kind of deity is not a good idea.

 

So true.  And if he had the ability to break out of that mindset he'd be showered with tech and investment that would make him go down in their history as the greatest of "Great Leaders".  Instead, it looks like he's just going to die and take a million or so with him.  Same old, tired story with all too much human suffering attached.

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8 minutes ago, and then said:

That link was about combat air power coordination.  Do you have a link for the evacuation drills, please?  I haven't seen any mention of it. If they are indeed working on such plans, actively, then this is potentially more troubling.

More troubling? Sensible contingency planning, surely, and probably something that they'd had as a contingency plan for a long time.

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