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and then

The death of free speech

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Almighty Evan

It amazes me to see so many alleged liberals demanding and defending the suppression of free speech, and supporting violence to accomplish it.

Free Speech For Me, But Not For Thee

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aztek

liberals are fascists,  i do not think you need to be surprised by their behavior

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AnchorSteam
3 hours ago, aztek said:

liberals are fascists,  i do not think you need to be surprised by their behavior

They are NOT Liberals!!!

How many times must I say it?

But  hey, its not like Trump is a Conservative... 

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Paranormal Panther
23 hours ago, Arbenol said:

I agree. 

My only point in responding was to point out that it wasn't America. The speed with which people jump onto something, make assumptions and malign whole groups of people is what is slowly but very surely driving your country down.

We see it on these boards all the time (and, in truth, you're as guilty as anyone of this). Stereotyping all Trump supporters as fascists, and the converse stereotyping of liberals as the 'real' fascists. How many times have you alluded to "typical liberals" when a group of them does something stupid or dangerous. I don't think they are liberals in any sense of the word. They're anarchists. And the same people that protest and riot during the liberal government of the past few years, eg may day riots, occupy wall street, etc......

Most of those students will be voting Republican in 20 years, anyhow.

I invite you to prove your claim that I put all people, on the Left, in the same category. I go out of my way to separate Antifa from most liberals and most progressives, as I know that Antifa don't represent them. There are times when I don't use disclaimers since that would be tedious, but I don't lump relative moderates with relative extremists. I also almost always use the word "some" as a qualifier when I refer to groups of people. I also take issue with your comment about Americans. Yes, many Americans use caricatures and stereotypes, but my country definitely doesn't have a monopoly or a patent on that particular phenomenon. Maybe you engaged in making generalizations when you made that particular comment. It sure came across that way.

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Frank Merton
10 hours ago, aztek said:

liberals are fascists,  i do not think you need to be surprised by their behavior

I kinda get the opposite impression, especially from you.

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DieChecker

Even CNN is going on about Berkeley being nuts...

http://www.cnn.com/2017/04/24/opinions/ann-coulter-berkeley-free-speech-randazza-opinion/

 

Quote

(CNN) Are we living in an alternate reality, one in which Bill Maher and Bernie Sanders are sticking up for Ann Coulter?

What could have caused this rip in the space-time continuum? The so-called birthplace of the free speech movement, the University of California at Berkeley, has once again engaged in liberal censorship, this time of Ann Coulter, using the fear of violence as cover to suppress a voice it did not like.
Quote

Berkeley should be the epicenter of the marketplace of ideas. Unfortunately, it has become the most intolerant place in America. I would feel more comfortable preaching for Sharia law in rural Mississippi than I would feel challenging the wage gap theory or speaking out against anti-Asian discrimination in admissions at Berkeley. In Mississippi, I would likely be ignored. Jeered at worst. In Berkeley, if you do not adhere to the Leftist orthodoxy, your speech is branded "hate speech," and out come the shock troops to physically attack you or anyone who wants to listen to you.

If these people were actually "enlightened", they would meet Ann Coulter with facts, informed opinions, and passive resistance. The fact that they resort to physical threats really puts them at the KKK hate level.

Mrs Coulter actually is holding the legal and ethical side of this issue. Especially by deciding not to actually force the issue. She is the responsible Adult and the Berkeley intelligencia are the crying Infants.

Edited by DieChecker
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DieChecker
On 4/30/2017 at 6:20 AM, aquatus1 said:

It always has.  It's just that we are used to the government having a monopoly on violence.

That is complete BS Aquatus. If Mrs Clinton decided to show up to speak at Berkeley and someone threatened violence if she did, the police would cordon off the area and screen everyone within a half mile radius, to keep her safe. But since the university and city are complicit with the Violence espousing protesters, it is allowed to happen. That's not law. That's corruption.

Edited by DieChecker
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Arbenol
8 hours ago, Paranormal Panther said:

I invite you to prove your claim that I put all people, on the Left, in the same category. I go out of my way to separate Antifa from most liberals and most progressives, as I know that Antifa don't represent them. There are times when I don't use disclaimers since that would be tedious, but I don't lump relative moderates with relative extremists. I also almost always use the word "some" as a qualifier when I refer to groups of people. I also take issue with your comment about Americans. Yes, many Americans use caricatures and stereotypes, but my country definitely doesn't have a monopoly or a patent on that particular phenomenon. Maybe you engaged in making generalizations when you made that particular comment. It sure came across that way.

I'll address your second part first.

I haven't generalised because you would have to be living under a rock not to see how partisan politics is dividing America at present. It's not everyone and I doubt it's a majority - but it's enough. You only have to read the politics board here to appreciate that. And, whilst it isn't just America, it's definitely more extreme there. Britain flirted with it for a while back there with the Brexit vote, but seems to have settled down a bit now.

I will now proceed to throw myself on your mercy and apologise :D.

Looking at your recent posts you certainly have distinguished. I haven't been round here much of late and haven't kept up as well as I might have. When I made that comment I was thinking more of these kinds of posts you made:

Quote

 

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Dumbledore the Awesome
10 hours ago, AnchorSteam said:

They are NOT Liberals!!!

How many times must I say it?

But  hey, its not like Trump is a Conservative... 

I don't know if you are being sarcastic, but "liberal" has certainly become an all-purpose term of abuse by anyone on the Right and has completely lost any meaning it may have had. Much like Fascist by people on the Left (see quote below). "Commie" is another, which is even applied to the current Pope quite often in some quarters. 

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Paranormal Panther
15 hours ago, Arbenol said:

I'll address your second part first.

I haven't generalised because you would have to be living under a rock not to see how partisan politics is dividing America at present. It's not everyone and I doubt it's a majority - but it's enough. You only have to read the politics board here to appreciate that. And, whilst it isn't just America, it's definitely more extreme there. Britain flirted with it for a while back there with the Brexit vote, but seems to have settled down a bit now.

I will now proceed to throw myself on your mercy and apologise :D.

Looking at your recent posts you certainly have distinguished. I haven't been round here much of late and haven't kept up as well as I might have. When I made that comment I was thinking more of these kinds of posts you made:

 

That's why I almost always use the qualifier "some". There are times when "few" or "many" work. I'm somewhat surprised by your choices, though. I generalize more about mainstream news outlets. ;)

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docyabut2
On ‎4‎/‎20‎/‎2017 at 1:03 AM, and then said:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/ann-coulter-berkeley-lecture-cancelled_us_58f7ffcae4b0cb086d7dedb6

I'm curious to hear the responses about this bit of news.  I think she should hire personal security and give her speech.  This is a PUBLIC university.  It receives a lot of taxpayer dollars and either the administrators need to ensure free speech for ALL on that campus, or the money needs to be stopped.  I heard a radio host suggest that the Cali state guard should be Federalized and should escort her onto campus.  This crap is out of control and needs to be addressed now.  The alt right wacko, Spencer was to speak at Auburn University and when a group of mask wearing thugs showed up to protest, they were told to remove the masks or be arrested!  What a difference geography and attitude can make in these situations :) 

Berkeley is a liberal collage and is for bidding free speech  , which is wrong. You got these anarchists leading these youths of no government or laws, that grew up under the Obama youth  and can`nt get use to the change of the rule of law.

Edited by docyabut2
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Merc14
2 hours ago, Paranormal Panther said:

That's why I almost always use the qualifier "some". There are times when "few" or "many" work. I'm somewhat surprised by your choices, though. I generalize more about mainstream news outlets. ;)

Modern progressives are pretty much of one mind.  That hard core 30% requires no qualifier, they are full of hatred, it is programmed into them by their families followed by the schools and finally the rabid professors destroying our education system.  Don't give them any quarter because you will get none when they come after you.  They would happily destroy your life and your family just for not toeing the progressive line.  

Negotiations ended long ago for them so no more playing fair, time to go on the offensive.  It has happened before in this nation, nothing cataclysmic here, just understand that you must render them impotent.  

Edited by Merc14
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AnchorSteam
1 hour ago, Merc14 said:

...  It has happened before in this nation, nothing cataclysmic here, just understand that you must render them impotent.  

These are the rules they live by -

 

Rules of Disinformation
via Proparanoid

Hear no evil, see no evil, speak no evil

Become incredulous and indignant

Create rumor mongers

Use a straw man

Sidetrack opponents with name calling, ridicule

Hit and Run

Question motives

Invoke authority

Play Dumb

Associate opponent charges with old news

Establish and rely upon fall-back positions

Enigmas have no solution

Alice in Wonderland Logic

Demand complete solutions

Fit the facts to alternate conclusions

Vanish evidence and witnesses

Change the subject

Emotionalize, antagonize, and goad

Ignore facts, demand impossible proofs

False evidence

Call a Grand Jury, Special Prosecutor

Manufacture a new truth

Create bigger distractions

Silence critics

Vanish 

The antidote: tell the truth as plainly as you can. Humor helps.

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DieChecker
7 hours ago, Merc14 said:

Modern progressives are pretty much of one mind.  That hard core 30% requires no qualifier, they are full of hatred, it is programmed into them by their families followed by the schools and finally the rabid professors destroying our education system.  Don't give them any quarter because you will get none when they come after you.  They would happily destroy your life and your family just for not toeing the progressive line.  

Negotiations ended long ago for them so no more playing fair, time to go on the offensive.  It has happened before in this nation, nothing cataclysmic here, just understand that you must render them impotent.  

What is funny is that these students go to Berkeley to become some of the Elite. And yet they don't realize that they would be included in those who are rounded up and shot if their Maoist Utopia came into being. 

Edited by DieChecker
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Merc14
6 hours ago, DieChecker said:

What is funny is that these students go to Berkeley to become some of the Elite. And yet they don't realize that they would be included in those who are rounded up and shot if their Maoist Utopia came into being. 

Yep.  I think that the real vicious ones are hired guns, paid to foment violence and shipped around the country by PACs funded by Soros and others.  The second tier are very radicalized professors and senior students and the rest of the mob are the dopey progressive students studying useless subjects or simply know nothings following the pack.  What needs to happen is the people funding these PACs that foment violence be prosecuted fro inciting a riot and the PACs closed for illegal activity.  There si no right to incite violence against innocent civilians in the name of your political ideals.   Time for Soros to be investigated as well.

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DieChecker
1 hour ago, Merc14 said:

Yep.  I think that the real vicious ones are hired guns, paid to foment violence and shipped around the country by PACs funded by Soros and others.  The second tier are very radicalized professors and senior students and the rest of the mob are the dopey progressive students studying useless subjects or simply know nothings following the pack.  What needs to happen is the people funding these PACs that foment violence be prosecuted fro inciting a riot and the PACs closed for illegal activity.  There si no right to incite violence against innocent civilians in the name of your political ideals.   Time for Soros to be investigated as well.

What? You think that studying subjects like ancient Greek basket making as a Doctorate has no value???? I tell you that such people often make fine lower middle class secretaries for those who study business, science or engineering. Useless indeed...... Humf.....

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Merc14
2 hours ago, DieChecker said:

What? You think that studying subjects like ancient Greek basket making as a Doctorate has no value???? I tell you that such people often make fine lower middle class secretaries for those who study business, science or engineering. Useless indeed...... Humf.....

I was studying journalism and then noticed that most of the kids with that major were fairly well-off, meaning they didn't need to earn money to survive when they graduated.  I decidedly was not in the well-off category, took the hint and switched to business!  Upon completing my studies I promptly joined the Navy to fly jets and was on my way to Pensacola before the graduation ceremony so never got to don that cap.    

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Paranormal Panther
22 hours ago, Merc14 said:

Modern progressives are pretty much of one mind.  That hard core 30% requires no qualifier, they are full of hatred, it is programmed into them by their families followed by the schools and finally the rabid professors destroying our education system.  Don't give them any quarter because you will get none when they come after you.  They would happily destroy your life and your family just for not toeing the progressive line.  

Negotiations ended long ago for them so no more playing fair, time to go on the offensive.  It has happened before in this nation, nothing cataclysmic here, just understand that you must render them impotent.  

I view Antifa like that. I don't view all liberals or all progressives like that. I understand your exasperation, though. Many of them indeed are mini tyrants. They are playing with fire, and they are treading on thin ice. I gladly will confront any leftist who attempts to force or push their views on me or other people. They will get what they give in those cases. I'm more than willing to defend our free speech "by all means necessary".

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Uncle Sam

Antifa... have we even put up a petition to have them labeled as a terrorist organization?

Edited by Uncle Sam
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AnchorSteam
4 hours ago, Uncle Sam said:

Antifa... have we even put up a petition to have them labeled as a terrorist organization?

Who is "we"?

Sounds like a great idea to me, want to start one?

 

 

Meanwhile--


 

Quote

 

Free Speech, but Not for All?

 

Barring speakers or preventing hate speech does not safeguard the oppressed. It empowers the oppressors, and it suggests that their words are to be feared for a compelling, persuasive power that, absent the muzzle, might infect others. The elitist conviction is that conscience, alongside well-considered political and social engineering, will guide a deputized few to exercise superior moral insights in representing minority interests. It is a frighteningly slippery slope between the suppression of speech in the name of social justice and the fatwas issued against those accused of blasphemy and desecration.

 

http://www.chronicle.com/article/Free-Speech-but-Not-for-All-/239909?key=gsJGLTrc0E7aWqq9G6kbgV9K8e4jNa2bn-kThO-jWSeTQW7ucDGmLbY4qBrfU85bRzhzb3RzLXFNODJlTUpsdlJHeGxSTk1ZeDBnVmV2MzVWcmlYWmNWYURfNA

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Paranormal Panther
10 hours ago, Uncle Sam said:

Antifa... have we even put up a petition to have them labeled as a terrorist organization?

There is at least one petition out there. I'm sure that you can find it via a search engine. One petition seeks to classify Antifa as a domestic terrorist organization. One could make an argument that they could be classified as an international terrorist organization or an organized crime group.

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aquatus1

Aren't Antifa mostly white youth?  Or am I mistaking them for some different group?

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Hammerclaw
2 hours ago, aquatus1 said:

Aren't Antifa mostly white youth?  Or am I mistaking them for some different group?

Here in the States, at least. Spoiled rich kids behaving badly.

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The Silver Thong
25 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

Here in the States, at least. Spoiled rich kids behaving badly.

They believe they can get away with anything.  Take off the masks and call them what they are, terrorists.

Edited by The Silver Thong
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Princess Serenity
1 hour ago, Hammerclaw said:

Here in the States, at least. Spoiled rich kids behaving badly.

If they continue to act badly I'll gladly take their money and put it to good use.

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