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and then

The death of free speech

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Lilly
2 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

What?

Perhaps he means, "One man's rights end where another man's rights begin"?

Honestly though, I'm not sure what SW of Hats is getting at either. I'm sure he'll return to clarify a bit.

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Hammerclaw
1 minute ago, Lilly said:

Perhaps he means, "One man's rights end where another man's rights begin"?

Honestly though, I'm not sure what SW of Hats is getting at either. I'm sure he'll return to clarify a bit.

Yes, I'm sure he thought it was terribly clever. It's the part about violating the rights of others who didn't attend that floored me.

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Hammerclaw

Violence begets violence and the Right is big on self-defense. I hope some of the Left don't wind up in hospital, or worse, because they "protested" a little too energetically with the wrong people.

Edited by Hammerclaw

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Lilly

Anyway, here's the latest on whether or not Ann Coulter will be allowed to speak at Berkeley: http://www.theblaze.com/news/2017/04/20/ann-coulter-vows-to-speak-at-berkeley-despite-free-speech-movement-birthplace-cancelling-her-talk/

Back when I was young Berkeley was championed as the birthplace of modern free speech. How ironic that it's now quite the opposite.

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Hammerclaw
1 minute ago, Lilly said:

Anyway, here's the latest on whether or not Ann Coulter will be allowed to speak at Berkeley: http://www.theblaze.com/news/2017/04/20/ann-coulter-vows-to-speak-at-berkeley-despite-free-speech-movement-birthplace-cancelling-her-talk/

Back when I was young Berkeley was championed as the birthplace of modern free speech. How ironic that it's now quite the opposite.

Yes, the political poles have shifted and it is the Left that is closed-minded and reactionary and prone to McCarthyism, now. 

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MstrMsn
8 hours ago, Tatetopa said:

When I went to hear a lecture by Carl Sagan, James Leakey,  astronomer Thomas Gold, or Sir David Attenborough , I paid money and bought a ticket.  Why do public Universities feel compelled to offer speaking platforms to right  or left?  Education would be a better application of public funds.  I know you might say that these viewpoints are educational,but only in a broad sense.  In another sense, organizations on the Left  are using 18-21 year old immature, easily influenced, young people with too much time and too little discipline to be their foot soldiers and further their own ends which have nothing to do with education. This platform is a waste of public money, a waste of young people's education, and inflames stupidity and ill-will. I am not opposed to free speech, but I am not sure it needs to be publicly subsidized. If Ann Coulter or Hillary Clinton wants to exercise their free speech, let them rent a hall or stand in a public park. Universities have a responsibility to preserve and transmit culture and knowledge, why do we think they are supposed to host political speakers?  Maybe that's too reactionary, just asking.

They aren't, students are. Any funding that goes into these events comes from the students, not the school.  

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Lilly
2 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

Yes, the political poles have shifted and it is the Left that is closed-minded and reactionary and prone to McCarthyism, now. 

Yes, things have come full circle it seems.

The most insane aspect of all this is when some folks defend those who are utterly despicable such as: criminal illegal felons and radical extreme Islamic jihadists. But God forbid they tolerate a politically conservative person.

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Hammerclaw
4 minutes ago, Lilly said:

Yes, things have come full circle it seems.

The most insane aspect of all this is when some folks defend those who are utterly despicable such as: criminal illegal felons and radical extreme Islamic jihadists. But God forbid they tolerate a politically conservative person.

Sometimes I wish we could take the best of both Parties--not the worst, as is usually the case--and form a viable Third Party, but that's never been the American Way.

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Lilly

Well, some Democrats lean more to center and some Republicans lean more to center so that does help matters a bit. There's also the Libertarian position but there are problems there as well.

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Hammerclaw
2 minutes ago, Lilly said:

Well, some Democrats lean more to center and some Republicans lean more to center so that does help matters a bit. There's also the Libertarian position but there are problems there as well.

Yes, they're not viable except for some to "make a statement" without any real effect on the status quo. It's the nasty fringe of both Parties that cause all the trouble and take all civility out of public discourse. Problem is they've wormed their way into positions of authority. Foul things do float to the top.

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Lilly

Now this is interesting, Berkeley is now trying to re-schedule Ms Coulter. They've chosen a time when she is not available (how convenient).

See link: http://www.berkeleyside.com/2017/04/20/uc-berkeley-reverses-decision-ann-coulter-will-speak-campus-may-2/

Something tells me that we won't see Ms Coulter speaking at Berkeley...ever.

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Merc14
On ‎4‎/‎20‎/‎2017 at 5:18 AM, sees said:

What's missing in your quote is the topic of the proposed speech.  That it is highly provocative and unpopular is very relevant here!   I find it inspiring that it offends the morality of so many.  It should cause pause for thought and possible reassessment of her stance.... 

So let me get this straight, if someone is giving a speech, the topic of which you find "highly provocative and unpopular " then there is justification top physically attack and injure them?    I found Ashley Judd's screeching speech not only "highly provocative and unpopular " but vulgar, disgusting and demeaning to women in general but she has every right in the world to screech it out and should be protected by the law while screeching it.  

Sees, you provide a wonderful illustration of how out of control and fascistic the left has become in our modern times.  People that carry these alt-left attacks should be arrested and imprisoned for felony rioting and given the maximum sentence.  In addition they should be heavily fined and put on life long parole.  Why?  Because they are a clear and present danger to our equal rights under the constitution and YOUR party's coddling of these criminals during the last corrupt administration has allowed this fascistic disease to metastasize.   The Attorney General of the US should also launch an investigation into the law enforcement that was on scene and allowed this violence to occur and then stand by while innocent people were brutally attacked.   Trump is spot on correct when he demanded Berkeley offer equal time to pother political views and the pulling of a federal funding is the correct thing to do if this behavior continues.

Thanks for showing us who and what you are sees,  Not only a believer in al things woo but a thug, left wing radical.  :tu:

Edited by Merc14
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preacherman76
13 hours ago, Agent0range said:

LOL, what?  I have been in college as recently as the fall semester, and you are full of it.  If you haven't been to college recently, how can you accurately make that statement?  Want to post some proof of your statement Lilly?  Some actual proof, and not some crazy article of another loon that hasn't been to college in 20 years?

What freakin planet are you on?

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Merc14
12 hours ago, Gromdor said:

Personally, I see the death of free speech coming from something along the lines of banning protests all together under the pretense of the violence that everyone here seems to be saying is happening.   

Two questions:

1.  Do you believe that physically attacking someone with or without a weapon is a legitimate form of protest?

2.  Are you suggesting that these riots in Berkeley and other places are not violent?   If so I can link all kinds of news video and newspaper reports but one would think you'd do that yourself before posting.

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Merc14

Check this out.  This thug is, apparently, a Professor Eric Clanton from Diablo Valley College and possibly SFSU.  The weapon is a bike lock, 15 of which he bought two days before from Amazon (they hacked his account).   The professor is still a free and employed man but the victim has filed charges anyways. 

 

Edited by Merc14
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Uncle Sam
1 hour ago, Merc14 said:

Check this out.  This thug is, apparently, a Professor Eric Clanton from Diablo Valley College and possibly SFSU.  The weapon is a bike lock, 15 of which he bought two days before from Amazon (they hacked his account).   The professor is still a free and employed man but the victim has filed charges anyways. 

 

Did me and you argue about this years ago? How you thought it was conspiracy theory and I was blowing smoke? I really do wish this was some conspiracy theory, but it isn't... :( 

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Merc14
1 minute ago, Uncle Sam said:

Did me and you argue about this years ago? How you thought it was conspiracy theory and I was blowing smoke? I really do wish this was some conspiracy theory, but it isn't... :( 

This event, the one in the video, just happened a few days ago on the Berkeley campus so it can't be. 

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Uncle Sam
7 minutes ago, Merc14 said:

This event, the one in the video, just happened a few days ago on the Berkeley campus so it can't be. 

I am talking year ago... when I posted a thread about how liberals are destroying our education and limit college students only to their ideology, thus creating generation of radicalized left wing citizens who will cause utter chaos when it comes to free speech.

These past two years have show what I theorized what was happening to be true sadly...

http://bigthink.com/21st-century-spirituality/college-liberalism-and-the-destruction-of-free-speech

Or was it someone else... I get confused at times.

Edited by Uncle Sam

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Merc14
3 minutes ago, Uncle Sam said:

I am talking year ago... when I posted a thread about how liberals are destroying our education and limit college students only to their ideology, thus creating generation of radicalized left wing citizens who will cause utter chaos when it comes to free speech.

These past two years have show what I theorized what was happening to be true sadly...

http://bigthink.com/21st-century-spirituality/college-liberalism-and-the-destruction-of-free-speech

No, that wouldn't have been me, as I agree with you and in fact have been saying that for years.  College campuses are overrun with this crap and have been for a couple decades. The biggest change is that instead of random violence now and then the violence now occurs on a regular basis. 

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Uncle Sam
Just now, Merc14 said:

No, that wouldn't have been me, as I agree with you and in fact have been saying that for years.  College campuses are overrun with this crap and have been for a couple decades. The biggest change is that instead of random violence now and then the violence now occurs on a regular basis. 

And it is only going to get worse as it goes... this isn't something that is going to go way. It is being actively taught in schools with the admins having the last say what is going to be taught. There is total control over our college campus and the teachers are mostly liberals, any conservative teacher is mostly told to shut up or ran out of college.

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Merc14
56 minutes ago, Uncle Sam said:

And it is only going to get worse as it goes... this isn't something that is going to go way. It is being actively taught in schools with the admins having the last say what is going to be taught. There is total control over our college campus and the teachers are mostly liberals, any conservative teacher is mostly told to shut up or ran out of college.

The violence can be stopped by arresting anyone who engages in it and giving them the harshest possible felony conviction and sentence plus years of probation after prison.   Right now they are heroes but putting a few hundred of them behind bars for three years would cool the fervor to injure fairly quickly.   The professor above, if guilty, should spend 10 years in a federal prison for hitting that kid.

It has to start at the DoJ  and be pursued as a hate crime if state justice refuses to step in.  Pulling federal funding from schools like Berkeley, as Trump has threatened to do, will wake up the far left administration as well.

Edited by Merc14
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Dark_Grey
2 hours ago, Merc14 said:

Check this out.  This thug is, apparently, a Professor Eric Clanton from Diablo Valley College and possibly SFSU.  The weapon is a bike lock, 15 of which he bought two days before from Amazon (they hacked his account).   The professor is still a free and employed man but the victim has filed charges anyways. 

 

Our friends in the nether-web tracked this guy down almost overnight, complete with pictures of his house, his parents house (big place in the burbs, surprise, surprise,) and even going so far as to identify the make of clothing he was wearing (how long would it take local PD to do the same?)

The kicker? Eric Clanton is a professor of ethics. It will be an open and shut prosecution - hope it was worth it, Eric. Say goodbye to the rest of your career.

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Lilly

Good, find the ones who are violently assaulting others and hit them with everything the law allows. Perhaps some time in jail and some hefty fines will stop this violence. Shame on those who hide behind masks and brutally attack others.

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Dumbledore the Awesome
On 4/20/2017 at 10:18 AM, sees said:

What's missing in your quote is the topic of the proposed speech.  That it is highly provocative and unpopular is very relevant here!   I find it inspiring that it offends the morality of so many.  It should cause pause for thought and possible reassessment of her stance.... 

Do we know what she was supposed to say? It says it's about immigration, and knowing what she's like it would probably be controversial, but does that make it Hate speech in and of itself, and who decidees what is? 

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Merc14
46 minutes ago, Dark_Grey said:

Our friends in the nether-web tracked this guy down almost overnight, complete with pictures of his house, his parents house (big place in the burbs, surprise, surprise,) and even going so far as to identify the make of clothing he was wearing (how long would it take local PD to do the same?)

The kicker? Eric Clanton is a professor of ethics. It will be an open and shut prosecution - hope it was worth it, Eric. Say goodbye to the rest of your career.

Has he been arrested?

36 minutes ago, Lilly said:

Good, find the ones who are violently assaulting others and hit them with everything the law allows. Perhaps some time in jail and some hefty fines will stop this violence. Shame on those who hide behind masks and brutally attack others.

This could be considered a hate crime and therefore prosecuted in federal court if CA chooses to look the other way, just as they did while the riot was in progress.  he could/should be charged with felony assault with a deadly weapon and felony rioting which carry 20 and10 year sentences.  http://www.criminaldefenselawyer.com/crime-penalties/federal/felony-assault-battery.htm

As Dark_Grey said, this is an all "civilian" investigation so I can't say for sure this is the guy but guilty or innocent, the man's life must be very interesting right now.  My fear is,what if it isn't the guy and all that info is out there and the rage is directed at the wrong person?   This brings to the forefront the problem we have when law enforcement is politicized and chooses to not do its job because your politics are not aligned with theirs or the administrations.  Unlike many countries, Americans will turn to vigilantism and that all too often hurts innocent people. 

The FBI, the Berkeley Police Dept. and the California State troopers seem to be missing in action because the man attacked and severely injured supports Trump.  At  least that is the appearance at the moment and we are all to aware how this works after 8 years of Obama, Holder and Lynch, and the "There can't be a hate crime if the victim is white." (Holder) or Lois Lerner walks away after her crime (Holder again) or Hillary committed a crime but no penalty (Comey/Lynch) etc. so now we don't bother to wait for justice because it isn't coming in our cases, at least not in Berkeley CA.   

 

Edited by Merc14
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