Explosions in Manchester

[+and-then]

4 hours ago, aztek said:

i wont argue, you are correct, but just like you said, lately it has been all about muslims, there will always be people willing to kill for their cause,  like timothy mcvain, unibomber....  however very few of them do it just because they fell like it, no, they do it as a response to something.  

Bin Laden decided to wage war on American civilians because of our presence in S.A.  Or so he claimed.  The bottom line is that those who wage Jihad against us have made it clear that they don't make peace.  They are in it for the long haul and will do whatever it takes to recreate the Caliphate.  I'm beginning to believe that they just might have a chance at success, based on our idiotic reactions so far.  The same mindset that causes the Europeans to consistently demand concessions from Israel while asking nothing of the Palestinians is what's driving these acts of butchery in Europe.  They are surrender monkeys at heart.  Unless someone stands against these governments, Islam WILL rule over Europe in a few decades or sooner.  The import of that is staggering to me.  European democracies have been at the forefront of expanding liberty throughout my life.  Socially, anyhow.  They have always seemed to have a bad case of "NO!  You don't tell me, I tell YOU!"  But now, in the space of 20 years or less, they've become disgustingly docile and compliant.  How a man or woman, especially if they have children, can just accept imminent slavery is beyond my comprehension.

[aztek]

Just now, quillius said:

but the civilians are not the intended target! 

do they care? would you if you were them? look at it from their pov, not yours

Edited May 23, 2017 by aztek

[quillius]

3 minutes ago, Bella-Angelique said:

There is a deadly virus and the people figure out it is carried by mosquitoes.

Now, do people try to wipe out all mosquitoes across the earth or should they target the specific type of mosquito that carries the virus?

The specific type of Islam that carries the virus of terrorism is named Wahhabi Islam. 

if you cannot distinguish between the types of mosquitoes then yes I would move towards wiping out all mosquitoes. Albeit quite extreme....

if we could remove all mosquitoes (instead of wiping them out) then this would be preferable.

[Sweetpumper]

2017 Has Seen a Terror Attack Attempted in Europe Every Nine Days

Security services in Britain — population 65 million — are known to be tracking 3,500 potential terror suspects or persons posing a threat. Meanwhile Belgium, with its population of just 12 million, is tracking around 18,000 potential jihadists.

http://www.breitbart.com/london/2017/05/23/2017-seen-terror-attack-attempted-europe-every-nine-days/

[quillius]

1 minute ago, aztek said:

do they care? would you if you were them?

point taken. although I do think there is a big difference. And as stated by someone earlier, I would be just as angry with those that were targets and hid behind the children.

[+OverSword]

Another known wolf attack. 

[Dark_Grey]

2 minutes ago, aztek said:

do they care? would you if you were them?

I think if you were already brain-washed to hate infidels, like Palestinian children have been brain-washed to hate Jews, it wouldn't take much of a push to create a suicide-vest wearing Jihadist. Remember that in Islam, jihad is a guaranteed ticket to heaven, whereas other, less deadly avenues only give you a good chance. Here's a fictional scenario:

You are a young Muslim in North Africa with potentially lower than average intellect (due to generations of marrying first cousins,) and a lifetime of listening to your father talk about the evils of Western culture. You know your future is bleak anyway, but every Friday at the Mosque you hear a sermon about the glory of death in Jihad and the paradise that awaits those who fulfill the will of Allah.

The Imam's words starts turning gears in your head and next thing you know, you are on a worn out boat with 30 other young men headed to a port in France. You can see smiling white people on the shores waving banners of welcome, completely unaware of the dark seed that has been planted in your mind...

Fictional, but not far-fetched. I would put more weight on our actions in the Middle-East but given the rate at which Muslims kill Muslims and the lack of a peaceful, tolerant Muslim nation anywhere on Earth leads me to think it probably doesn't matter. Hate is hate is hate.

[+susieice]

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2017/05/23/manchester-terror-attack-suspect-identified-as-salman-abedi.html

[Bama13]

1 hour ago, ExpandMyMind said:

Yes, and there are many descriptions for this such as lies, propaganda, slanted views, etc. Their stories aren't 'fake news', however. Fake news is something entirely different. And this would be common knowledge if Trump hadn't latched onto the term in a desperate attempt to discredit any negative story about him.

I've read "Faux news" for "Fox news" for years on this site. Way before Trump. 

[Sweetpumper]

‘Diversity’ doesn’t mean tolerating the murder and maiming of dozens of young people

Manchester has joined Berlin, Brussels, London, Nice, Orlando, Paris, and San Bernardino, among others, as another example of the rise of radical Islamic terrorism in the West. And yet, no matter how many men, women, and children are ruthlessly struck down by terrorists in the name of a violent ideology, the leftist media-driven conversation in most of Europe and the United States remains the same: This is just an isolated incident. There’s no need to worry. Only racists are afraid.

And then it happens again. And again. And again.

http://www.theblaze.com/news/2017/05/23/commentary-diversity-doesnt-mean-tolerating-the-murder-and-maiming-of-dozens-of-young-people/

[+susieice]

6 minutes ago, OverSword said:

Another known wolf attack. 

An arrest has been made in connection with the attack. Not a lone wolf.http://ktla.com/2017/05/23/manchester-attack-carried-out-by-1-man-police-say-british-prime-minister-calls-incident-callous/

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-05-23/manchester-attack-man-arrested-police-say/8552554

Edited May 23, 2017 by susieice

[aztek]

Just now, Dark_Grey said:

I think if you were already brain-washed to hate infidels, like Palestinian children have been brain-washed to hate Jews, it wouldn't take much of a push to create a suicide-vest wearing Jihadist.

maybe, but when you have foreign army in your home, and their bombs falling on you, killing your family,  it hits home, and you'll hate those foreigners without any brainwashing.

 

[Dark_Grey]

4 minutes ago, aztek said:

maybe, but when you have foreign army in your home, and their bombs falling on you, killing your family,  it hits home, and you'll hate those foreigners without any brainwashing.

It definitely doesn't help. Look, I'm not saying we aren't culpable at all, but there is looong history of conquest and violence by that religion that predates America by thousands of years. Unless the terrorist comes out and says "this is because of America" or draws attention to Western involvement in some way, I have to assume they are committing this kind of violence for some other reason. Think about Charlie Hebdo - they murdered people because of a cartoon.

A cartoon.

Nothing to do with Western involvement, nothing to do with bombs over Baghdad. Just killing for the sake of killing because of outdated ideology.

[aztek]

Just now, and then said:

  They are in it for the long haul and will do whatever it takes to recreate the Caliphate. 

yes, that is pretty much what their goal is, that is why i'm not much against us being there, however you can't dismiss what we are doing as far as regular people there who just live their lives.  our presence there also angers those Muslims who are here, not that it will make a terrorist out of someone who was against it before, but it may just make them support those who are bombing. and stay quiet if they find out\see\hear something. 

i wonder how Muslims in no go zones reacted, i have a feeling it is the same reaction that some Muslims here had after 911, may be even more open celebration. trump wa snot lying when he said thousands cheered. may be he bumped the number, maybe not. but it did happen,.

 

the rest of your post i have no disagreements with

[aztek]

Just now, Dark_Grey said:

Unless the terrorist comes out and says "this is because of America" or draws attention to Western involvement in some way,

they have said it many times, they do not like our involvement there,and our support of israel.

in bin ladens famous cave interview that is what he said. 

Edited May 23, 2017 by aztek

[Dark_Grey]

13 minutes ago, Sweetpumper said:

"This is just an isolated incident. There’s no need to worry. Only racists are afraid.

And then it happens again. And again. And again."

Do you know what we call a string of related but isolated incidents?

"A pattern".

[Dark_Grey]

3 minutes ago, aztek said:

they have said it many times, they do not like our involvement there,and our support of israel.

Some do not like our involvement there. We should be careful about differentiating between the many factions. There are just as many videos/pictures of American soldiers being welcomed with open arms as there are of our boys being shot at and spit on. It's incredibly divided over there, hence the continuous violence and unrest. The ones that don't want us siding with Israel are on the wrong side of history, IMO

[aztek]

Just now, Dark_Grey said:

Some do not like our involvement there. We should be careful about differentiating between the many factions. 

those that do not like our involvement, bomb us, those that do not mind, do not bomb us, that is all differentiation that we need

[aztek]

Just now, Dark_Grey said:

 There are just as many videos/pictures of American soldiers being welcomed with open arms as there are of our boys being shot at and spit on. 

it was not uncommon during soviet-afgan war, the same people that welcome you with open arms during the day, shot you in the back at night, i heard it from ex soviet officer who was stationed in Afghanistan in early 80s. i'm sure same thing happens now. 

 

Three US Marines gunned down by traitor Afghan police commander who invited them to dinner - and it's the THIRD such deadly betrayal of allied forces in a week

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2186506/Three-US-Marines-gunned-traitor-Afghan-police-commander-invited-dinner--THIRD-deadly-betrayal-allied-forces-week.html#ixzz4hpRBpLtP 
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

Edited May 23, 2017 by aztek

[RavenHawk]

3 hours ago, quillius said:

Phase One:

 

Throw everyone on terrorist watchlist out of the country.

Take down every mosque in the UK.

 

 

 

Well the first thing is that the West needs to acknoledge that this *IS* a clash of cultures.  We must realize that even though the teachings of Muhammed are very familiar to some degree, they are completely imcompatible with the sensibilities of the West.  We are at war with Islam.  But with that said, we are not at war with every Muslim.  Once we acknoledge this, we can then move forward.  This is not a blank check to go bomb every Muslim in sight or to lynch the token Muslim in your neighborhood.  We have to understand that the majority of Muslims around the world prefer Sharia law.  This is simply because this is what they’ve grown up in.  They really know nothing else.  They’ve never had guidence in anything else.  Our sense of Freedom in the West comes from the Age of Enlightenment.  That all persons have Natural GOD-given Rights.  In Islam, Freedom is being free of Man’s law and be fully emmersed into Allah’s law. 

 

 

The average of Sharia followers is higher in Muslim nations and deminishs as it moves to non-Muslim nations.  Why?  It’s because most Muslim immigrants in Western nations have assimilated to their new nation.  They have been corrupted by the West.  But the numbers are still too high in the West of those that prefer Sharia.  And they are adding to their ranks with new immigrants and refugees.  The problem is that there is no adequate asimilation and inclusion.  There is no insistence on this effort.  We are seeing self-segregation with these no-go zones or Muslim ghettos.  It occurs for two reasons.  Their faith prevents them from commiting Shirk and Bida to assimilate and they aren’t being accepted by the indiginous.  It is fine to incorporate one’s old culture into the new as long as the individual assimilates completely to the new.  This is the problem with nations being multicultural.  Because of that the youth flock to the faith (Salafism).  The youth have no identity, not being one or the other (not knowing the ways of their parents or the expectations of the new host).  And the faith cannot reform to modernity.

 

 

The solution is to close the borders to any new Muslim immigrants or refugees.  Next, is to expel anyone on a Muslim watchlist (as quillius has suggested).  Next is to scrutinize every mosque.  Close down only those that pose a radical threat.  And then force asimilation.  It must be the primary duty of the new immigrant or refugee to assimilate before anything else.  Officially disenfranchise any Sharia courts.  They must turn their back on their old culture and embrace the new ways.  If anyone cannot handle that then give them free passage out of the country.  The host nation needs to assure that the individual really wants to be here and anyone caught in subversive acts will be dealt with severely.

Edited May 23, 2017 by RavenHawk

[AnchorSteam]

Another "vigil"... another perfect target for a terrorist attack.

Welcome to the new normal, as your leaders have told you to expect. 

Oh, and be sure to keep doing the same thing over and over while expecting some sort of new result, that sure has been working great so far.

 

I won't be praying for anyone in Manchester, I just don't see the point. Anyone who stays so passive and submissive while picking nails out of their little daughter's eyes (after ignoring all the muslim Pedophile rage-gangs) do not deserve my time, even my derision would be wasted. I have been in the position of someone watching a distant cousin sink into morbid addiction and self-destruction for too long... my give-a-damn is officially busted.

Goodbye, farewell, ahmen.

Edited May 23, 2017 by AnchorSteam

[Gary Meadows]

Horrible tragedy!  Such heartless monsters out there. 

Having said that, I guess Ariana Grande's wish almost came true. 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2760170/Ariana-Grande-said-hoped-fans-f-ing-die.html

 

[AnchorSteam]

11 minutes ago, RavenHawk said:

 

 

Well the first thing is that the West needs to acknoledge that this *IS* a clash of cultures.  We must realize that even though the teachings of Muhammed are very familiar to some degree, they are completely imcompatible with the sensibilities of the West.  We are at war with Islam.  But with that said, we are not at war with every Muslim.  Once we acknoledge this, we can then move forward.  This is not a blank check to go bomb every Muslim in sight or to lynch the token Muslim in your neighborhood.  We have to understand that the majority of Muslims around the world prefer Sharia law.  This is simply because this is what they’ve grown up in.  They really know nothing else.  They’ve never had guidence in anything else.  Our sense of Freedom in the West comes from the Age of Enlightenment.  That all persons have Natural GOD-given Rights.  In Islam, Freedom is being free of Man’s law and be fully emmersed into Allah’s law. 

 

 

 

The average of Sharia followers is higher in Muslim nations and deminishs as it moves to non-Muslim nations.  Why?  It’s because most Muslim immigrants in Western nations have assimilated to their new nation.  They have been corrupted by the West.  But the numbers are still too high in the West of those that prefer Sharia.  And they are adding to their ranks with new immigrants and refugees.  The problem is that there is no adequate asimilation and inclusion.  There is no insistence on this effort.  We are seeing self-segregation with these no-go zones or Muslim ghettos.  It occurs for two reasons.  Their faith prevents them from commiting Shirk and Bida to assimilate and they aren’t being accepted by the indiginous.  It is fine to incorporate one’s old culture into the new as long as the individual assimilates completely to the new.  This is the problem with nations being multicultural.  Because of that the youth flock to the faith (Salafism).  The youth have no identity, not being one or the other (not knowing the ways of their parents or the expectations of the new host).  And the faith cannot reform to modernity.

 

 

 

The solution is to close the borders to any new Muslim immigrants or refugees.  Next, is to expel anyone on a Muslim watchlist (as quillius has suggested).  Next is to scrutinize every mosque.  Close down only those that pose a radical threat.  And then force asimilation.  It must be the primary duty of the new immigrant or refugee to assimilate before anything else.  Officially disenfranchise any Sharia courts.  They must turn their back on their old culture and embrace the new ways.  If anyone cannot handle that then give them free passage out of the country.  The host nation needs to assure that the individual really wants to be here and anyone caught in subversive acts will be dealt with severely.

 

You are exactly right, and that is the very last thing that is likely to happen while Europe is ruled by the Hard-Left.

The deaths of their people means very little to them, it is ideology that matters! They would vastly prefer to see the deaths of millions of people, or even all of them, before they admit they were ever wrong about anything at all.

That is exactly what the pattern of behavior indicates, to date. Their only reaction to any of this is to curtail the freedoms of their own people... convenient for the authoritarians, isn't it?

[aztek]

Just now, AnchorSteam said:

 

I won't be praying for anyone in Manchester, I just don't see the point. Anyone who stays so passive and submissive while picking nails out of their little daughter's eyes (after ignoring all the muslim Pedophile rage-gangs) do not deserve my time, even my derision would be wasted. I have been in the position of someone watching a distant cousin sink into morbid addiction and self-destruction for too long... my give-a-damn is officially busted.

Goodbye, farewell, ahmen.

unfortunately it was not kids of politicians who made it all possible that got hurt, i'm sure those were regular folks like you and me who hate this islamization of their home country, that got their kids blown up. 

[Bella-Angelique]

17 minutes ago, Gary Meadows said:

Horrible tragedy!  Such heartless monsters out there. 

Having said that, I guess Ariana Grande's wish almost came true. 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2760170/Ariana-Grande-said-hoped-fans-f-ing-die.html

 

I have been seeing this making the rounds of the net today. Yeah, it is spreading like fire. Really bad for her. 

I was not aware of it before, just of her handling and licking food for sale on a counter and putting it back for an unlucky customer to come along and by.

.