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Opus Magnus

Mark of the Beast

Mark of the Beast  

50 members have voted

  1. 1. Would you take or receive the mark of the beast six hundred three score and six in your right hand or forehead?

    • Yes
      10
    • No
      40


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Stubbly_Dooright
Just now, Stubbly_Dooright said:

I'm going to be bit silly and seriously, when I think this might be something that will occur in our future economy. But, that mark of the beast just might end up being barcodes on our foreheads, and the price of them is total dependence on material things that could rule and break you in the end. But, we all have to have those barcodes or we're on the street. What i that is a prediction? 

And if I put your original question into my thought here, would I take the barcode? Something tells me no. 

Is this also about being forced to worship something you don't want to? 

Like I have said, I'm not read up on the bible, and wont now. But, I do understand other's using it to guide them. I feel the elements of my belief guides me. What if it's also a guide for the future? 

Or, am I way out there? 

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OverSword
1 hour ago, and then said:

The mark, whatever it might be, will be something a person takes voluntarily.  They will need it for any kind of commerce.  Food, medication, housing, everything.  Rev 20:4 makes it seem that this will only be the initial price of taking the mark.

I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony about Jesus and because of the word of God.They[a] had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

It seems that taking this mark will be seen by God as an act of worship.  What it all reduces to is this - at that time people will no longer be able to sit the fence regarding a decision about God.  They WILL choose one or the other.  The vast majority will apparently choose the man of perdition.  The sad thing is that even though all of this is written and has been known for 2 millennia, and even though the scripture clearly paints a picture of obviously supernatural events occurring during this time, people will STILL reject God.

Or the book of Revelations was never meant to be in the bible and it is a letter penned to the people it is addressed to at the beginning, but it's a handy way to make people fear and easier to control them if you are a medieval priest.

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Clarakore

Mark of the Beast is mere manner of priorotizing people as ones youd help care for to ones you won't or even oppose.

Quote

The Roman numeral for 666, DCLXVI, has exactly one occurrence of all symbols whose value is less than 1000 in decreasing order (D = 500, C = 100, L = 50, X = 10, V = 5, I = 1).

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/666_(number)

But as we know the first shall be last and the last shall be first.

Mark of the beast is also social stratification. In heaven we become equal co-heirs. No men or women. No sick or healthy. No rich or poor. No good or bad. All those dichotomies fall apart as the illusions they are.

No night or day division of the LIGHT.

Later we then return to the Darkness before the Light but let us leave it here.

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Clarakore
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Whoever has ears, let them hear.

“If anyone is to go into captivity,
    into captivity they will go.
If anyone is to be killed with the sword,
    with the sword they will be killed.”

This calls for patient endurance and faithfulness on the part of God’s people.

And read all Ch. 13 close. No one chooses the mark, it is forced on us.

The name being written now is not a choice but a gift for those who are called as they are called. Fear not all shall be called eventually.

Quote

It also forced all people, great and small, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hands or on their foreheads, so that they could not buy or sell unless they had the mark, which is the name of the beast or the number of its name.

This calls for wisdom. Let the person who has insight calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man. That number is 666.

We cannot commerce and economy without the system of division we have now, some great and some small, some rich and some poor, some free and some slave.

That is the mark of the beast. Our divisions of social stratification.

Treat all as equals, learn the Good Samaritan was led by Spirit not by social expectation, fear, or any other of that baggage that divides and seperates us.

 

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Clarakore

Finally, hand or forhead.

Some see how it works, some actually have their hand in how it works, but unhand and unsee, now rehand into what you can as Spirit guides, and resee the perfecting of humanity via the Spirit aka the Perfector, and be, just be yourself.

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Davros of Skaro

UGH! Revelations is so sick. It's just reimagined bits of the OT.

The Mark is a reversal taken from Ezekiel. 

Ezekiel 9:1-11


The punishment of the guilty


"1 Then he cried in my hearing with a loud voice, saying, "Draw near, you executioners of the city, each with his destroying weapon in his hand." 2 And six men came from the direction of the upper gate, which faces north, each with his weapon for slaughter in his hand; among them was a man clothed in linen, with a writing case at his side. They went in and stood beside the bronze altar.
3 Now the glory of the God of Israel had gone up from the cherub on which it rested to the threshold of the house. The LORD called to the man clothed in linen, who had the writing case at his side; 4 and said to him, "Go through the city, through Jerusalem, and put a mark on the foreheads of those who sigh and groan over all the abominations that are committed in it." 5 To the others he said in my hearing, "Pass through the city after him, and kill; your eye shall not spare, and you shall show no pity. 6 Cut down old men, young men and young women, little children and women, but touch no one who has the mark. And begin at my sanctuary." So they began with the elders who were in front of the house. 7 Then he said to them, "Defile the house, and fill the courts with the slain. Go!" So they went out and killed in the city. 8 While they were killing, and I was left alone, I fell prostrate on my face and cried out, "Ah Lord GOD! will you destroy all who remain of Israel as you pour out your wrath upon Jerusalem?" 9 He said to me, "The guilt of the house of Israel and Judah is exceedingly great; the land is full of bloodshed and the city full of perversity; for they say, 'The LORD has forsaken the land, and the LORD does not see.' 10 As for me, my eye will not spare, nor will I have pity, but I will bring down their deeds upon their heads."
11 Then the man clothed in linen, with the writing case at his side, brought back word, saying, "I have done as you commanded me.""

The author of Ezekiel leaves a clue where he got the idea a few verses back.

Ezekiel 8:14-15

"14  Then he brought me to the entrance of the north gate of the house of the LORD; women were sitting there weeping for Tammuz. 15 Then he said to me, "Have you seen this, O mortal? You will see still greater abominations than these.""

Tammuz is another name for Dummuzid. He's the husband of Inanna (whore of Babylon).

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tammuz_(deity)

Inanna instructs her minister that if she does not return from the underworld to lacerate the face, make lamentations, and put on sackcloth. 

Inanna dies gets resurrected then returns with demons attached to her because they need a replacement to drag back to the underworld. Inanna finds all her servants following her instructions (the Mark). When she sees her husband he's acting like nothing happened, and he gets dragged to the underworld. 

It's all a personifications of celestial/seasonal events, and Tammuz endures the underworld 6 months out of the year.

I highly recommend the read.

http://etcsl.orinst.ox.ac.uk/section1/tr141.htm

Just think people believe rehashed fairytales as reality.

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and then
On 6/9/2017 at 5:31 PM, Stubbly_Dooright said:

From growing up through parent's choices. Which I don't blame them, but still through their choices. 

No, as an adult the responsibility for what you choose to do or not do is yours.  All I am saying is that if the end time revelation in the Bible is true and this mark is offered, choosing it would be the same as choosing to worship "not the God of heaven".  It would still be worship, though.  That's the thing that I believe most people misunderstand about the horrors of that time.  The first half of it is brought on by man's wars.  The final 3 1/2 years is supernatural.  There are very clear waypoints that signal what is coming and continuing to deny God's reality, even when one sees these things happening, that constitutes willfulness. 

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DieChecker
On 6/8/2017 at 10:14 AM, Opus Magnus said:

Just wondering, was curious, as to right now, how many people would be willing to take the mark of the beast in their right hands or forehead? 

Here is wisdom, Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is six hundred threescore and six.

 

 

 

 

Revelation Chapter 13

13 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.

And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.

And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?

And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.

And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.

And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

If any man have an ear, let him hear.

10 He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.

11 And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.

12 And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.

13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,

14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.

15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.

16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:

17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

Assuming all the other parts of the quote actually happen... ie, everyone starts worshipping "The Dragon", or, that there was a great image made of "The Beast", and it was worshipped, or, they start marking people on the hand or forehead... Then I'd probably put it together and refuse to be marked in such a way.

Everyone who says "Yes", you need to understand that you'll be living according to this quote... Be worshipping something... Dragon, First Beast, Second Beast... If you are not... then any mark isn't really the Mark. I can imagine that people will have a chip in their hand, and it will not be the Mark, but that after a while, a new chip, or just an upgrade, could then be the Mark. Just as anyone can wear a jacket, but if you wear a jacket with a swastika on it, you're proclaiming being a Nazi.

It also says nothing about growing your own food... ;)

Edited by DieChecker

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Stubbly_Dooright
6 hours ago, and then said:
On 6/9/2017 at 6:31 PM, Stubbly_Dooright said:

From growing up through parent's choices. Which I don't blame them, but still through their choices. 

No, as an adult the responsibility for what you choose to do or not do is yours. 

tenor.gif

I'm thinking there's something you don't get in what I pointed out. Maybe I'll explain it. Yes, my choice is my responsibility and I chose to not practice and believe and follow mainstream religion, (going to church, reading the bible, etc) because I don't see any reason to believe in it, based of what I'm used to, come to see what is truth for me for not going, and I'm use to not doing things, because my parents chose to not put me and my siblings into such things growing up. So, for that, I don't see myself believing in it to do so now. And considering in this country, it's not against the law. So, in that respect, having the choice to not do these things now, is also a good respected choice, because it's not against the law, and that law is there for a good reason. As an adult, it's my responsibility to not break the law. I'm not, right? So, what's your point there? 

Quote

the same as choosing to worship "not the God of heaven".  It would still be worship, though.  

So, are you placing this is the same ideal of an adult responsibility? Are you accusing me of adult irresponsibility for me to not worship "the God of heaven"? 

I would place this as also the irresponsibility for not worshipping other religious practices and icons as well, don't you think? Do you feel someone in another religion could call me irresponsible for not believing and practicing their religion? Well, heck, wouldn't that mean, you could be accused for not worshipping other religious icons and practices as well, right? 

Are you just plain calling someone who fully does not believe in worshipping period as being irresponsible? 

Which, wouldn't be irresponsible, considering this country allows you to not be persecuted for believing or not believing a religion, right? 

So, I would be very interested in your answers. (Especially the first question)

Quote

That's the thing that I believe most people misunderstand about the horrors of that time.  The first half of it is brought on by man's wars.  The final 3 1/2 years is supernatural.  

Really?! 

krysten-ritter-eyeroll-seriouly.gif

Is this proven as the supernatural part actually happening? This is the "Spirituality and Skepticism" board, not the other one, so I would think that my skepticism on this is understandable. (Frankly, if this was there, then I wouldn't say anything or pretty much go along) But, I can tell you firmly believe it. I'm not going to talk you out of that. That's your belief, and I stand behind your right to your belief. As mine, is different, (and understandable considering the situations in my life) 

Now, considering the OP's thoughts (and his replies to me :) ) have been very congenial and interesting, I find the thought interesting. Although, I still have my feelings and I don't know if I see certain supernatural aspects of it. I believe in the paranormal and supernatural aspects, but to a point. And I think things can be explained. I have very strong 'on the fence' feelings on the bible being really 'supernatural', but I also have my mixed feelings on varying New Age and religious books, though I am intrigued on the reported. I don't think there is varying truth to what the bible says, so I don't think that would happen, what you are saying the bible is saying. 

Quote

There are very clear waypoints that signal what is coming and continuing to deny God's reality, even when one sees these things happening, that constitutes willfulness. 

Can you point out, other than the bible, where these very clear waypoints that signal what is coming? Seriously, because I have not seen them. One could say varying aspects of the weather, and nature, but since a lot of it seems to be explained, and is very random and too subjective, I don't see them being any signs at all. 

Maybe it's because growing up secular, I haven't been indoctrinated in the varying mainstream 'miracles' and such to actually believe they happened. And since I actually haven't seen them on a day to day basis then, it's hard to see that now. You get what I mean? ;) 

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Stubbly_Dooright
10 hours ago, I hide behind words said:

Mark of the Beast is mere manner of priorotizing people as ones youd help care for to ones you won't or even oppose.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/666_(number)

But as we know the first shall be last and the last shall be first.

Mark of the beast is also social stratification. In heaven we become equal co-heirs. No men or women. No sick or healthy. No rich or poor. No good or bad. All those dichotomies fall apart as the illusions they are.

No night or day division of the LIGHT.

Later we then return to the Darkness before the Light but let us leave it here.

Ah, interesting. Boy, does this seem confusing. And I say that in an intriguing way. This seems like thought provoking things one has to consider when their actions affect others and who they are. (Is this coming close to my 'black box analogy' or what?! :o ) 

Kind of what you see of conflicted heroes, when they had to chose who to save and who to not to save and the respect on everyone's life, no matter how good or evil they are. Am I correct? 

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and then
1 hour ago, Stubbly_Dooright said:

I'm not, right? So, what's your point there? 

First, remember the context of the discussion, please.  FTR, I don't care what choices you make.  I am not trying to convince you of anything.  I accuse you of nothing.  The discussion is about the MARK OF THE BEAST.  That isn't a secular discussion about religious responsibilities today.  It deals with a specific period of time and how accepting or rejecting that identifier will affect one's life.  As a skeptic of the existence of a Creator God, it follows that you would probably not struggle with the idea of accepting some government mandated identifier (whatever its form) that will allow you to continue your life in comparative normality - food, shelter, medicine, etc.

The purpose of this mark is absolute control over a population - initially.  It eventually is used to cull out those who will not worship the leader of the world at that time. Within that context of events, the purpose of that mark is clear.  It will force everyone alive at THAT time, to CHOOSE which side they will serve.  Those who think they will choose "none of the above" will find it isn't an option.  It will literally be, "choose or die" and if one's choice is to refuse the mark, they will die.  Beheading is the death mentioned in scripture but that isn't necessarily the only method.  

All of this is about those on the earth AT THAT TIME.  If you happen to be alive during that period of time, you will be amazed to see that millions will refuse to take the mark, knowing they will be executed if they refuse.  I guess they will be considered worthy of mockery.  At least, for a short while.  So be it.

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and then
3 hours ago, DieChecker said:

Everyone who says "Yes", you need to understand that you'll be living according to this quote... Be worshipping something... Dragon, First Beast, Second Beast... If you are not... then any mark isn't really the Mark.

You seem to be saying that you can take a mark -whatever it is - as a sign of loyalty that enables you to live in comparative comfort but because you don't really believe it, it doesn't "count"?

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and then
12 hours ago, I hide behind words said:

No one chooses the mark, it is forced on us.

I'd study that a bit more.  It is ABSOLUTELY a choice.  It would be a horrible choice to have to make but it is still a choice.  You literally have to choose between your physical life or God.  The scripture you cite is explaining that patience will be required because some WILL die by the sword and others WILL go into captivity.  To stand up and be counted as a believer in Christ at that time will be a death sentence of the worst kind.  Also, remember that the time of grace will be over and once a person makes the decision to accept that mark there can be no salvation.  The choice is final and eternal.

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Opus Magnus
4 hours ago, DieChecker said:

Assuming all the other parts of the quote actually happen... ie, everyone starts worshipping "The Dragon", or, that there was a great image made of "The Beast", and it was worshipped, or, they start marking people on the hand or forehead... Then I'd probably put it together and refuse to be marked in such a way.

Everyone who says "Yes", you need to understand that you'll be living according to this quote... Be worshipping something... Dragon, First Beast, Second Beast... If you are not... then any mark isn't really the Mark. I can imagine that people will have a chip in their hand, and it will not be the Mark, but that after a while, a new chip, or just an upgrade, could then be the Mark. Just as anyone can wear a jacket, but if you wear a jacket with a swastika on it, you're proclaiming being a Nazi.

It also says nothing about growing your own food... ;)

Something interesting I thought of a few months ago is, that of MIchael.  They say Michael translates to, "Who is like unto my God?" or something like that.  When people start worshiping the beast in the Revelation scripture, they say, "Who is like unto the beast? Who is able to make war with him?"

So, it's like a play on the Archangel Michael, and what his name means.  Giving Michael unto the Beast, rather than God.  Like the anti-Michael.

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Opus Magnus
14 hours ago, I hide behind words said:
Quote

Whoever has ears, let them hear.

“If anyone is to go into captivity,
    into captivity they will go.
If anyone is to be killed with the sword,
    with the sword they will be killed.”

This calls for patient endurance and faithfulness on the part of God’s people.

And read all Ch. 13 close. No one chooses the mark, it is forced on us.

The name being written now is not a choice but a gift for those who are called as they are called. Fear not all shall be called eventually.

We cannot commerce and economy without the system of division we have now, some great and some small, some rich and some poor, some free and some slave.

That is the mark of the beast. Our divisions of social stratification.

Treat all as equals, learn the Good Samaritan was led by Spirit not by social expectation, fear, or any other of that baggage that divides and seperates us.

 

Interesting, also about that verse with the sword and captivity.  In Jeremiah, it is quoted as put up there, and in every translation I've read it's put that way in Jeremiah.  Also, it's that way in most translations of Revelation.  Except in the King James Version, it's different:

10 He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.

 

I think it might be a mistake or something it's different in the King James Bible.  It makes sense, but I believe it comes from Jeremiah, and the one in Jeremiah makes more sense.  Sort of a sense of predestination, or karma and dharma, which brings the question of where does free will fall into place?  I think it has something to do on levels of macrocosm, and microcosm, where we might be able move around freely, without things that have been set in by time and deeds.  But, I've thought about it, and I kind of don't even think the Angels know the answer to the question.

Also, in the King James Version it sounds more of like a judge not lest ye be judged, condemn not lest ye be condemned, mete and measured.

Also, I think Paul, or someone in one of the letters part of the New Testament, says something about whoever lives by the sword shall die by the sword.

Edited by Opus Magnus

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Clarakore
3 hours ago, Opus Magnus said:

Interesting, also about that verse with the sword and captivity.  In Jeremiah, it is quoted as put up there, and in every translation I've read it's put that way in Jeremiah.  Also, it's that way in most translations of Revelation.  Except in the King James Version, it's different:

Ill research Jeremiah later for this.

Quote

10 He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.

 

Easy as it is dual curse turnes into bless.

Patience and faith does this.

Lead into captivity and be captive of the One who came to set the captives free.

And who killa by sword will die by it as in suffer curse, of cain, so none mess with him and protection, and sword here finally is one that cuts through bone and marrow, or whatever it says, as in false you and true you, divided in one fell swoop.

Your great work Opus Magnus

Is also the one act you are primary called for

Satan accuses and says self is wrong

Satan just spies for the One

And now is choir master so heed the song

You are the sword of lord the tongue that blesses and by doing so destroys false

Like curses and lies said before for we knew not

Now your head is severed and headless

You can put it back in place

And be the new executiner to shop heads

I learned and did a few, now the ability is passed to you

All you need to know and do will come from within

As Spirit works and gives what it gives

Now ask for love and other gifts for others

And if worthy self too and remember

The rest of the armor from ephesians

Is an old witch spell or recipe so check the list

And see what you have and what you need still

And bless me with the shoes please so it is and will be

Quote

 

 

 

 

I think it might be a mistake or something it's different in the King James Bible.  It makes sense, but I believe it comes from Jeremiah, and the one in Jeremiah makes more sense.  Sort of a sense of predestination, or karma and dharma, which brings the question of where does free will fall into place? 

Right angle for truth seeking as sone parts are error much less translation worries.

And yes it is predestination. All will be called when called. All will be shown and given when due no sooner and not all at once.

For even those who called from far off.

I can get veraes later.

But each of your steps were chosen beforehand.

Free will is illusion and once power for self and my way is over 

For it was part of process but now done so be led and then let choices be made true by true agent not you now

And one trails behind, one is who you are now, and one leads the true you, vehicle, agent, angel too, you will serve in heaven

Angels know lots just not time or place of when we become one again and bring down paradise soon

For the perfecter does the work and it is like wind choosing where to go and when and also flames of using highest mind in group as portal to true heart

As well as the giver of gifts for not all are called or chosen at once

And each part works like foot or arm and you are tongue friend and sword that cuts both ways at once

Plus the final descript and tell is i am right hand and left too for i give and take when used and chosen to and how

The right hand gives said the greeks and all we follow is the One and none sit on either side, but metaphorically i sit on  the right for i am sent as many forms but in the end i am annointed and bring change for family few and generations past in my line

I was john the baptist losing my head also the good and bad thief, and jonah, and a fisher of men, and died for a few

You are the later prophecy aka return of christ for your line and spaces

It is personal and now the OT and NT are past here comes new jerusalem but aztlan for me and maybe atlantis for others

Quote

 

 

I think it has something to do on levels of macrocosm, and microcosm, where we might be able move around freely, without things that have been set in by time and deeds

Indeed what is above is so below, macro- and microcosms, what you believe and have faith for as it is given, will become true, and just as time and deeds are repeated, now is time we change once and for all in many sectors

Thus as One forgives so can we and if so like it is blotted out like it never happened

We can change past and make better and that is true name in book of life i call the akashic records, all is made of akaha or aether, it is logos, it is creation, done once and for all before the foundations, we must be Here and Now to control all else as we are controlled ourselves

Last lesson now for you is even demons will be saved for who are you? You will see and know when and where to say go ask for forgiveness for all can and tell the rest, when done come back and help

We will insure hell is emptied out and every lost and wayward one is told the gates of paradise are open and just over here near

For you know hell is here and death is the state of many now Life true comes arise old dry bones and leave flesh behind

You will know wheb you enter heaven and are given this Life and then be like oh cant stay got to come all together but you are here i see you come and say the water is fine but i sipped sparingly for i need to take all i can to others

To the woman at the well who by her belief others heard the Annointed and believed her and then him too

And they said we worshipped wrong god on wrong hill but One says in truth and spirit not geographical location or holy land of one in palestine 

 

 

 

Quote

 

  But, I've thought about it, and I kind of don't even think the Angels know the answer to the question.

Also, in the King James Version it sounds more of like a judge not lest ye be judged, condemn not lest ye be condemned, mete and measured

All satan works who just reports and gathers affidavits, the Accuser, but with the Advocate who convicts heart and changes true, know we will judge and be judged, and the verdict is innocent and grace no price not even worthy we are gicen but before that 

Put down the stone for written on dirt is your own sin like theirs, and quit like you have said this is bad or good before Spirit tells you, if not yoy do it out of flesh, and like you do question all and answers are given

Mete and measure again like the old  Law all done, all 400 some commandments, and even the ten

We have a new summary and are not held accountablw to law, that mete abs measure is also the mark of the beast, like the mark of cain, protects the guilty till grace is given

Quote

Also, I think Paul, or someone in one of the letters part of the New Testament, says something about whoever lives by the sword shall die by the sword.

I will look for all verses and post later pure scripture and some hebrew translation via blue letter

Saul Paul is just a bridge between the law and grace and explainer of spirt workings

But he repeated what was said in Joel  that Spirit will be poured on all flesh, all, even demons, even those who werre born of  flesh womb and returned to earth womb alao flesh

Jars of clay, life breathed into dirt, are you ready to be a golem or homunculus or other forms for we fell so fast and did our work on way down that those like us will go deeper to become trees, or animals, or stone

Even the stones sing when we dont, even our wooden walls do when we dont, dont say the wood is dead, as all atoms exist in two places, destroy the flesh even while alive, We Exist, and some are reborn into new life without tasting death

You are the second one i met, first was me, glad to find you, now when time comes you will find another

And again for a final tell is the bosom of abraham and the rich man saying tell my brothers to be together so they wont be in hell wanting one drop

And from hell he spoke to lazarua in heaven, say again how hell is there and heaven elsewhere, and two cannot communicate, or one is forever, and it is for forever ends, new jerusalem is here and now beyond infinite or eternal but transcends what is infinite eternal finite and temporary

Go now and wait for someone from either 1800s to 1970-80s is calling you for help,  not them, to help you so you can in turn help all times and places beginning with problems decades past, you chose to come from the 1800s to help more recent, you are an old soul, you wont give up, and will say eff it i will live every life again, twice, another spin of the wheel

Quote

Before the silver cord snaps, and the golden fountain is shattered, and the pitcher breaks at the fountain, and the wheel falls shattered into the pit. And the dust returns to the earth as it was, and the spirit returns to God, Who gave it."

Now you tell me what that means.

Edited by I hide behind words

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Opus Magnus
1 hour ago, I hide behind words said:
Quote

Before the silver cord snaps, and the golden fountain is shattered, and the pitcher breaks at the fountain, and the wheel falls shattered into the pit. And the dust returns to the earth as it was, and the spirit returns to God, Who gave it."

 

The silver cord I think is supposed to be the link from man to heaven coming from the top of the head.  But, I also think it might mean the spinal cord.  The golden fountain, might be the head, and I think the pitcher is the stomach and if something falls on you and crushes the innards on the way to get a drink.  The wheels I think are the legs.  So, if any of these break in a man he is supposed to die, and so what? because it's dust to dust, but I can't completely agree with dust to dust because of something like light inside. something that wasn't mentioned.  Maybe it just has a longer life expectancy and is fire to fire, but not dust to dust, but it doesn't all agree with dust to dust 100%.

 

Anyway, I'll just go now and see if I can find that person

Edited by Opus Magnus
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Clarakore
24 minutes ago, Opus Magnus said:

The silver cord I think is supposed to be the link from man to heaven coming from the top of the head.  But, I also think it might mean the spinal cord.  The golden fountain, might be the head, and I think the pitcher is the stomach and if something falls on you and crushes the innards on the way to get a drink.  The wheels I think are the legs.  So, if any of these break in a man he is supposed to die, and so what? because it's dust to dust, but I can't completely agree with dust to dust because of something like light inside. something that wasn't mentioned.  Maybe it just has a longer life expectancy and is fire to fire, but not dust to dust, but it doesn't all agree with dust to dust 100%.

 

Anyway, I'll just go now and see if I can find that person

Statue of Nebuchanzer which Jospeh divined?

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Clarakore
8 hours ago, and then said:

I'd study that a bit more.  It is ABSOLUTELY a choice.  It would be a horrible choice to have to make but it is still a choice.  You literally have to choose between your physical life or God.  The scripture you cite is explaining that patience will be required because some WILL die by the sword and others WILL go into captivity.  To stand up and be counted as a believer in Christ at that time will be a death sentence of the worst kind.  Also, remember that the time of grace will be over and once a person makes the decision to accept that mark there can be no salvation.  The choice is final and eternal.

Study less, lose 18th century scofield footnoted eschtalogy (sp?) from rapture via left behind, the truth of one gone is missing is simple breakdown of family and social unity, to tribulation (post mid etc whatever we are in it now woo woo it is personal and generational for it happens as the spirit chooses and moves not a world wide political ot flesh event but spiritual) because they chose a mark or not, chose, grace gives none are worthy, choosing via tje flesh is not spirit but keep it for now as it leads to true conversion, a process, not a formula we can do and say we are saved, if saved then save me and others?

And guillontines...all extrabiblical based in fear not in grace according to the current dispenational period we are in. Severing happens on day of the lord.

Now leave all that behind both that view and this newer one.

 

Read and let it alobne guide you until the spirit writes more on yout heart.

Quote
Rev 13 v 16
It also forced all people, great and small, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hands or on their foreheads,

Then take faith in Joel 2's Day of the Lord.

Quote

The Day of the Lord

28 “And afterward,
    I will pour out my Spirit on all people.
Your sons and daughters will prophesy,
    your old men will dream dreams,
    your young men will see visions.
29 Even on my servants, both men and women,
    I will pour out my Spirit in those days.

And to beliece you must choose and choose wrong, no bless, is mere Satanic accusation gone haywire via illusion of dualism.

God is all, none can oppose, all will bow and that is for honor not beheading which happens now to you, lose the faith of fear, no faith at all is that,  no mustard seed, no prayer for "i have faith, give me faith" a gift or fruit of Spirit, not a choice we make in flesh, and remember they said UPC bar codes were the mark of the beast lololol...what next...what is mark to you now? And what was it before? And what will be later? For what it tells us is thay the mark of the beast has been here for a long time, swords and captivity is old and fear, free and then's father and bless him and his now.

Isaiah 45:7 in the King James Version reads, “I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.”

How can you claim to do either? By choice? LORD and then tell me.

When you can know You did create it evil, and now will create good, and do both always, but one becomes pure as good is good alone without muddling as Light ia Light before night and day. Darken your sun and blood in your moon is happening here.

Edited by I hide behind words
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Clarakore
10 hours ago, Stubbly_Dooright said:

Ah, interesting. Boy, does this seem confusing. And I say that in an intriguing way. This seems like thought provoking things one has to consider when their actions affect others and who they are. (Is this coming close to my 'black box analogy' or what?! :o ) 

Kind of what you see of conflicted heroes, when they had to chose who to save and who to not to save and the respect on everyone's life, no matter how good or evil they are. Am I correct? 

True to my view but keep on and tell more and correct it further.

Heroes and villians eh? Social constructs indeed and mark of beast too I now see. God does not make heroes and villians but blesses as end goal.

And to know we have to choose who to save means hero and villian within if we choose wrong.

More mark of beast is revealed by lady mustard.

Respect all hmm...how to begin writing not just my name if at all but yours in the boom of life?

late Middle English: from Latin respectus, from the verb respicere ‘look back at, regard,’ from re- ‘back’ +specere ‘look at.’

No some say respect is earned.

Nay for respect is to look back, to look at  now, to look back at now, or some such i cannot eloquate. But maybe eyes that see in first, within self, as back, which allows to look at..real.

We look and miss much now so dont look at but look with grear aim we lose accuracy.

Before i was reveald to look begin from behins you, then inside, then to them, and through them.

It is texhnique to allow the leap from you to them and back via empathy and to achieve or help what i tried to explain based on prompt of respect.

 

Save who you can. And you will be saved by the damned! Is how i work it.

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Stubbly_Dooright
10 hours ago, and then said:
12 hours ago, Stubbly_Dooright said:

I'm not, right? So, what's your point there? 

 

First off, lets put a little more of what you quoted of me. 

Quote

because it's not against the law, and that law is there for a good reason. As an adult, it's my responsibility to not break the law. I'm not, right? So, what's your point there? 

 

Quote

First, remember the context of the discussion, please.

And I have, in which I have been in conversation with the Op, and others. I do believe you came in with: 

Quote

And that is a valid CHOICE.  As to saying you'd never heard of such a thing... oops... you just DID.  I don't mean to sound combative, really.  It's just that with all the things that will be occurring at that time, it's going to be impossible to plead ignorance.

Post 18, and I questioned you on it. I was hoping you explained it. I sincerely asked you what is it I'm pleading ignorance off. Because what things you assume are happening, I don't see it. Seriously, explain it. 

And then this: 

Quote

No, as an adult the responsibility for what you choose to do or not do is yours.  All I am saying is that if the end time revelation in the Bible is true and this mark is offered, choosing it would be the same as choosing to worship "not the God of heaven".  It would still be worship, though.  That's the thing that I believe most people misunderstand about the horrors of that time.  The first half of it is brought on by man's wars.  The final 3 1/2 years is supernatural.  There are very clear waypoints that signal what is coming and continuing to deny God's reality, even when one sees these things happening, that constitutes willfulness. 

IN which I asked you, are you calling me irresponsible for not worshipping this particular god? I was hoping you would answer my question. You brought this up. Are you relating this to the thread's point. I asked you clarify in which I could understand in a secular way. 

Again, are you saying I'm irresponsible for not worshipping the mainstream god? 

 

Quote

 FTR, I don't care what choices you make.  I am not trying to convince you of anything.  I accuse you of nothing.  

Then explain the irresponsibility part please? 

Quote

The discussion is about the MARK OF THE BEAST.  That isn't a secular discussion about religious responsibilities today.

This topic sounds like a "Spirituality, Religion, and Beliefs" topic. And since this is in the "Spirituality and Skeptics" forum, I'm adding in a skeptic's point of view into this. But you did say this: 

Quote

No, as an adult the responsibility for what you choose to do or not do is yours.  

And I asked you to clarify it. All you had to do is answer the question in how I asked it to clarify it. 

10 hours ago, and then said:

 It deals with a specific period of time and how accepting or rejecting that identifier will affect one's life.  As a skeptic of the existence of a Creator God, it follows that you would probably not struggle with the idea of accepting some government mandated identifier (whatever its form) that will allow you to continue your life in comparative normality - food, shelter, medicine, etc.

The purpose of this mark is absolute control over a population - initially.  It eventually is used to cull out those who will not worship the leader of the world at that time. Within that context of events, the purpose of that mark is clear.  It will force everyone alive at THAT time, to CHOOSE which side they will serve.  Those who think they will choose "none of the above" will find it isn't an option.  It will literally be, "choose or die" and if one's choice is to refuse the mark, they will die.  Beheading is the death mentioned in scripture but that isn't necessarily the only method.  

All of this is about those on the earth AT THAT TIME.  If you happen to be alive during that period of time, you will be amazed to see that millions will refuse to take the mark, knowing they will be executed if they refuse.  I guess they will be considered worthy of mockery.  At least, for a short while.  So be it.

But, wait? Wasn't the question asking if you wanted to choose the mark now? Why ask the question now, if this is dealing back then. Why bring up the past now? Mostly so, if this is a belief's past? Unless, you have a source that said things happened that matches what the bible said? 

And since this is the "Skeptics" part here of the religious forums, how does this question get answered, when someone cannot see the differences, but just the government, just the law? 

What had Opus seems to have explained, it seems on the thought process of the thought provoking point of view of how you choose and how some might get hurt in the process. And, this seems like my 'black box analogy', then I can see it. But, all of this horror, that seems way to supernatural, does not seem like it's something that everyone would think it's worthy to consider. 

Religion and the actual law, can be seen as a frustrating, but if actual law is the priority, then that's the priority. 

Going back to your point on adult responsibility on me, I do think you need to explain further on that, considering you seem to come off to me as judging my lack of Christian believing. Is that correct? Or what exactly did you mean about me and my adult responsibility despite not being raised as Christian by my parents? You did bring that up. 

2 hours ago, I hide behind words said:
13 hours ago, Stubbly_Dooright said:

Ah, interesting. Boy, does this seem confusing. And I say that in an intriguing way. This seems like thought provoking things one has to consider when their actions affect others and who they are. (Is this coming close to my 'black box analogy' or what?! :o ) 

Kind of what you see of conflicted heroes, when they had to chose who to save and who to not to save and the respect on everyone's life, no matter how good or evil they are. Am I correct? 

True to my view but keep on and tell more and correct it further.

Heroes and villians eh? Social constructs indeed and mark of beast too I now see. God does not make heroes and villians but blesses as end goal.

And to know we have to choose who to save means hero and villian within if we choose wrong.

More mark of beast is revealed by lady mustard.

Respect all hmm...how to begin writing not just my name if at all but yours in the boom of life?

late Middle English: from Latin respectus, from the verb respicere ‘look back at, regard,’ from re- ‘back’ +specere ‘look at.’

No some say respect is earned.

Nay for respect is to look back, to look at  now, to look back at now, or some such i cannot eloquate. But maybe eyes that see in first, within self, as back, which allows to look at..real.

We look and miss much now so dont look at but look with grear aim we lose accuracy.

Before i was reveald to look begin from behins you, then inside, then to them, and through them.

It is texhnique to allow the leap from you to them and back via empathy and to achieve or help what i tried to explain based on prompt of respect.

 

Save who you can. And you will be saved by the damned! Is how i work it.

So, am I assuming that you think I'm right on how there is a painful decision on how one goes about protecting others and such? 

Now, if I'm getting your post here, does it start from our look within ourselves and our self-confidence? I would think that would make this a nice life lesson here in this. 

(is this also kind of looking at like, like the "Scarlet Letter" Should we be marked as murderers, no matter how we 'kill'? If we kill to protect ourselves or others, are we 'marked'? 

And how does that help us on our individual paths? 

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Stubbly_Dooright
2 hours ago, I hide behind words said:

Study less, lose 18th century scofield footnoted eschtalogy (sp?) from rapture via left behind, the truth of one gone is missing is simple breakdown of family and social unity, to tribulation (post mid etc whatever we are in it now woo woo it is personal and generational for it happens as the spirit chooses and moves not a world wide political ot flesh event but spiritual) because they chose a mark or not, chose, grace gives none are worthy, choosing via tje flesh is not spirit but keep it for now as it leads to true conversion, a process, not a formula we can do and say we are saved, if saved then save me and others?

And guillontines...all extrabiblical based in fear not in grace according to the current dispenational period we are in. Severing happens on day of the lord.

Now leave all that behind both that view and this newer one.

 

Read and let it alobne guide you until the spirit writes more on yout heart.

Then take faith in Joel 2's Day of the Lord.

And to beliece you must choose and choose wrong, no bless, is mere Satanic accusation gone haywire via illusion of dualism.

God is all, none can oppose, all will bow and that is for honor not beheading which happens now to you, lose the faith of fear, no faith at all is that,  no mustard seed, no prayer for "i have faith, give me faith" a gift or fruit of Spirit, not a choice we make in flesh, and remember they said UPC bar codes were the mark of the beast lololol...what next...what is mark to you now? And what was it before? And what will be later? For what it tells us is thay the mark of the beast has been here for a long time, swords and captivity is old and fear, free and then's father and bless him and his now.

Isaiah 45:7 in the King James Version reads, “I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.”

How can you claim to do either? By choice? LORD and then tell me.

When you can know You did create it evil, and now will create good, and do both always, but one becomes pure as good is good alone without muddling as Light ia Light before night and day. Darken your sun and blood in your moon is happening here.

Wait! Whoa! Ok, I'm wondering, could this be broken down, or paralled religions and/or beliefs? I'm trying to see how this fits my belief. Can this be like a light and messaged into people's spirits?

What I'm trying to ask, in various religions, is there something similar?

Edited by Stubbly_Dooright
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and then
2 hours ago, Stubbly_Dooright said:

Now, if I'm getting your post here, does it start from our look within ourselves and our self-confidence?

You aren't even close to understanding my point and I don't choose to attempt to explain it to you because of your attitude as expressed with the condescending GIFs.  I made myself clear about my opinions and the fact that I neither judge you nor accuse you of anything.  You mentioned that due to your growing up period, your parents did not expose you to religion and it seems you thought that excused you from making a choice about the God of heaven.  I pointed out that adults make their own choices about whether to worship God or not.  This has nothing to do with any concept of religions.  Self-confidence is a wonderful thing but it has nothing to do with worshipping God.  If anything, it is a hindrance to such worship.  Pride in any form is anathema to God according to His word.  

You mentioned wanting to know what signs I think are manifesting today.  They all center on the nation of Israel.  Ezekiel 37 foretells the reintroduction of the Jews to their land -written 2600 years ago by a Jew in Babylonian captivity.  Psalm 83, written by a contemporary of David, speaks of a group of nations that want remove the Jews from their land so fully that their "name is remembered no more".  Sounds eerily similar to what the Palestinians are saying today and the people groups mentioned in this Psalm match the nations today that share a physical border with Israel.  A third prophecy is about a leader called Gog, from the land of Magog, described as a nation to the "uttermost north" of Israel, that will lead a confederation of nations against Israel for the purpose of taking a "spoil".  Gog's cohort consists of Persia (Iran), Gomer (Turkey), Beth Togarmah (the 'stans nations'), Libya, Ethiopia and  Sudan.  ALL are Muslim nations today but Islam did not exist when the prophecy was written.  Of course, Gog, their leader, and armorer is Russia.  Written over 2 millennia ago, these predictions could have come from today's newspapers.  THIS is what I was referring to when I said that people in the last days will have no excuse when they reject God.  The evidence is everywhere for one willing to look at all.

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Clarakore
7 hours ago, Stubbly_Dooright said:

Wait! Whoa! Ok, I'm wondering, could this be broken down, or paralled religions and/or beliefs? I'm trying to see how this fits my belief. Can this be like a light and messaged into people's spirits?

What I'm trying to ask, in various religions, is there something similar?

I can ponder as I love comparitive, synthesis, parralel path finding or making, and religion, belief, knowledge, your way that makes sense, all unifying to your way that makes sense.

I ask you to ponder the question to from a what is in you pathless truth.

@and thenAnd i run hands greedily like some...

Spoiler

 

great reward is gonna be posted next by me but meh settle down sister-son for you wanna horde the beauty and truth of....

Quivers in mock form as I once did on the reals...

Drum roll....the heresy or apostacy of antichristian spirit and the-hetero-beast-mode-on plus the one who resurrects even the beast...and you do marvel of who can be like the beast??? You do...

Decode now for our friend and prize of Lady and Lord "And Then...."

Even your blessed child speaks truth...and then??.?

 

So the doctine of resurrection is yada yada , i know, move on...but resurrection is a gift to defeat death in all form from curse lie fear and foe...within.

If you creed up and doctrine it you are right and others are wrong even your True Image...

So you curse the cursed more, claim others lie and thar itself is lie for you lie first and dont allow others to grow and ubderstand, forgive me then, as a i carry on...

 

Fear feeds fear of the changes and unkown growth, that is dead as an "official nail on the cross" some praise thosr icons and relics, you deny, truth is your belief is the icon and relic Mister.

And all that boils down to this...friend or foe is figjt and flight meet game theory.

It explains how we formed but not potential in you, but faith and belief that even me a post-modern-christian-cathowitch, that honors the samarian mount more than the official jewish claim, and issac or ishmael, lie it was the unamed daughtet who was gonna be sacrificed, and honor the deep workings in you of Spirit and Truth worship by fathering up and adopting, i love you for that and wish I could be father and friend too, pray for me and bless it bro.

I lack and you have and when i worry and cry i shall pause again sayong but thank god and then is blessed with it, and pause with thank god praise you for blessing my sister too who was ruined early on losing her ability to procreate in flesh, and as the church or father did not stop or protect, and mum was victim too, by the men here who generations treated wives as slaves, they posion us in return, with mom telling me once she would put glass grohundrd in my dads, my, and my twins food....wtf

 

Then later she said nah that was in roots the movie, and i knew it now too, and learned why, we treat women likr slaves here, machismo, the greatest insult in spain is daughter of a whore, in the mexican ethnic group it is daughter of the raped, ruined, and damned.

We began when our mothet Malinche was given to Cortes the Coquistador without choice, and my wive's great-aunt  or mum was kidnapped by horseback,  a woman in her mothers time was called la loca for every now and then the men would take her as they left to the fields, and no one helped her, none combed her hair, soothed her, but ostracized trauma and ruim more, like Abram and Sara, a false god said sacrifice one, the true deity is in you by adopting and nuturing, me now, and other empatha, plus the ones who love their descendant daughters now by simple womanly work that never is done, for it is the Perfector in good form, 

 

And my father drove my mom around his familiea neighbiorhood one night, they saw, she was how odd, why come here i need to be at home, he knew, 

Next day his mom showed up at her father's shop and said they did it it is done now they must marry...wtf work the system to steal more than a kiss.

And i chose my wife and convinced her she was the one, i chose, but i was sent as a helper of the weaker sort, that kicked in as helper when i let go of the men rule lie and what i say is best, meh, and the curse ends here and now.

Welcome more life and healing done and to come.

BUT I NEED TO SAY FINALLY AS IT IS LATE DELIVERY

But pay no mind to the tale of woe now and go back to fear lie and foe..

Abandon them all now and let it be known once and for all in you...

Your enemies will be invited and will honor you by coming to your table.

 

Keep that in mind as i post soon on what made me giddy before, not the anove, but a few articles and quotes of what, hahahalololol, is good and true about Eucenimical value as it means we unite, the goal man, the mix of believers and sinners or liars or clean and unclean, again is in you alone aka dichotomy of mind and heart, think with the the true head, Christ who honors the sinner and shys from the temple and law of offical forms of faith be it by brick and mortar constuct or, nah uh, i believe it so it is true, jesus enters even your own high temple and says whores and tax payers heaven up first not you, they care for healing, more than the so called to-blessed-to-stress set and schism or sect or denomination or place and time as all the chrisians from then to now and even those in other lands are wrong eh? But us americans are right for scofield rapture trib soon to come and rock the world, is rifght eh?

And messiah will set up the priper govt and church and it is your chosen ones who will do it all for the world and times?

Haha.

Give to caeaer what is his, hand it back, a simple coin toss will do, try it and ser if too difficult to change into revelation now in you, for i cannot convince by words, so i enacase and lace with spell and bless.

And give to god what is his, hers, yours if true self lives? The innnerman of the witness and watcher lee.

So I cannot do it for you, i can presa a finger to chest, ask you to come back here and now, br present in self, no worries if false and Fear is all false for Faith trumps and fear of the lord is awe and wow, I can do that and so can she? 

Respect the temple in you and know you must do it, i cannot for you.

Welcome to the new age or jerusalem boo

 

 

Edited by I hide behind words

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Preview of next post for @and then

 

ONE WORLD RELIGION: POPE FRANCIS SAYS ALL MAJOR RELIGIONS ARE ‘MEETING GOD IN DIFFERENT WAYS’

“We are all children of God”.

DIFFERENT WAYS’

“We are all children of God”.

Michael Snyder | End Of The American Dream - JANUARY 11, 20160 Comments 
 
 
169
 
1
0
 
 
 
 

A...

Quote

 

new video has just been released in which Pope Francis very clearly expresses his belief that all of the major religions are different paths to the same God.

He says that while people from various global faiths may be “seeking God or meeting God in different ways” that it is important to keep in mind that “we are all children of God”

...

The Pope’s first-ever video message on his monthly prayer intentions was released Tuesday, highlighting the importance of interreligious dialogue and the beliefs different faith traditions hold in common, such as the figure of God and love.

“Many think differently, feel differently, seeking God or meeting God in different ways. In this crowd, in this range of religions, there is only one certainty that we have for all: we are all children of God,” Pope Francis said in his message, released Jan. 6, the feast of the Epihany

Pope Francis closes the video by expressing his hope that viewers “will spread my prayer request this month: that sincere dialogue among men and women of different faiths may produce fruits of peace and justice. I have confidence in your prayers.”

(Hint let women speak for self, instead of claiming the male ran churches)

 

Later on, after the Pope affirms that all, regardless of their religious profession, are children of God, the faith leaders state their common belief in love.

Pope Francis closes the video by expressing his hope that viewers “will spread my prayer request this month: that sincere dialogue among men and women of different faiths may produce fruits of peace and justice. I have confidence in your prayers.”

 

(Link to infowars not given so google for source because the rest lies and says omg no conspiracy fear lie lalala inforwars)

 

 

Edited just now by I hide behind words

B...

Quote
Spoiler

Just Be.

 

C...

Quote
Spoiler

Sea change is not always see change but sea change is all see change.

 

D..

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Spoiler

Can we do something for Delta ans Dalet? I mean not let D be for UU VV or W.

Wiki: It was probably considered a separate letter by the 14th century in bothMiddle English and Middle Germanorthography, although it remained an outsider, not really considered part of the Latin alphabet proper, as expressed by Valentin Ickelshamer in the 16th century, who complained that

VV

 

 

Edited by I hide behind words

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