Is there a center of the universe?

[Will Due]

2 hours ago, Noteverythingisaconspiracy said:

 

The universe is under no obligation to follow the rules you think it should follow. What you, or anyone else for that matter, think the universe should be is of no consequence to the actual truth. 

 

 

Likewise.

 

 

[Black Monk]

On 11/02/2018 at 3:46 PM, Will Due said:

 

Ya know, I never thought about it like that. You might be right.

But there is a single point in the universe, that is its center.

Everything has a center and the Universe of universes does too.

 

 

I'll say one last time and then we'll put this matter to bed: There is no single point in the universe where the Big Bang happened. The Big Bang happened EVERYWHERE. There is no centre of the universe. You cannot trace the Big Bang back to a single point, as it happened everywhere.

Edited February 17, 2018 by Black Monk

[Will Due]

21 minutes ago, Black Monk said:

it happened everywhere.

 

Then that's evidence that God created the universe isn't it.

Because all the laws of physics shows that an explosion, as in the case of a supernova, has a center.

The Universe does have a center and it's the geographical location of

Spoiler

Paradise. 

 

 

[Harte]

2 hours ago, Will Due said:

 

Then that's evidence that God created the universe isn't it.

Because all the laws of physics shows that an explosion, as in the case of a supernova, has a center.

No,  because the expansion of the universe isn't an "explosion."

It's even been regretted by Physicists that the term "bang" was ever used.

Yes, the term originates from a Physicist (Fred Hoyle,) but he coined it when deprecating the theory, as he was himself the author of the since-refuted "steady state" theory.

Harte

[bison]

A three-dimensional object within space naturally has a center.  The problem with assigning a center to the universe as a whole is this: The universe did not expand into space that already existed. Space, and time, were created as the universe expanded.  Our three-dimensional spatial universe has important similarities to the two dimensional surface of an expanding sphere.

No point on the surface of that sphere can be considered its center, and no location in space can be defined as its center. From any vantage point in the space, the rest of the universe will be seen to be expanding away from it.  This is because space itself is expanding, the universe is not expanding into space.  

[Derek Willis]

3 hours ago, bison said:

A three-dimensional object within space naturally has a center.  The problem with assigning a center to the universe as a whole is this: The universe did not expand into space that already existed. Space, and time, were created as the universe expanded.  Our three-dimensional spatial universe has important similarities to the two dimensional surface of an expanding sphere.

No point on the surface of that sphere can be considered its center, and no location in space can be defined as its center. From any vantage point in the space, the rest of the universe will be seen to be expanding away from it.  This is because space itself is expanding, the universe is not expanding into space.  

The universe, as many people have pointed out, has no center. However, this thread has been going around in circles for weeks - so I guess this thread must have a center. I wish it had an end! Will won't listen to what he is being told: I think he enjoys playing games ...

[Harte]

Will needs to find his center.

Harte

[+Noteverythingisaconspiracy]

44 minutes ago, Derek Willis said:

The universe, as many people have pointed out, has no center. However, this thread has been going around in circles for weeks - so I guess this thread must have a center. I wish it had an end! Will won't listen to what he is being told: I think he enjoys playing games ...

I don't know how well you know Will Due, but the thing about him is that he is so tied up with the Urantia Book that everything that conflicts with that is rejected. The Urantia Book says that there is a center to the universe, so Will have to believe in that, no matter what evidence exists to the contrary. 

So yes he might be playing a game, but I think it is more likely that he simply can't go against his beloved book, so he have to use mental gymnastics in order to avoid acknowledging its faults.

Edited February 18, 2018 by Noteverythingisaconspiracy

[+Noteverythingisaconspiracy]

32 minutes ago, Harte said:

Will needs to find his center.

Harte

I though Will was the center of the universe. 

[bison]

The Urantia Book seems to me to be substantially religious in nature. If such convictions are the basis for rejecting a scientific description of the universe, it's probably best to respect those beliefs, even while disagreeing with them, and move on. 

[Will Due]

Spoiler

Peeka boo

 

The Universe has a center NOT because the Urantia Book says it does.

The Universe has a center because

Spoiler

the Spirit of Truth says it does.

 

 

[Will Due]

5 hours ago, bison said:

From any vantage point in the space, the rest of the universe will be seen to be expanding away from it.  This is because space itself is expanding, the universe is not expanding into space.  

 

Space is expanding ALONG with the Universe.

Everything is expanding from a center point.

At the center of the Universe you will find what's at the center of Will Due, because what's at the center of Will Due is what's at the center of everyone.

Spoiler

The Father in heaven. 

 

 

[Harte]

Sorry, Will Due. That won't do.

Harte

[Will Due]

6 hours ago, bison said:

No point on the surface of that sphere can be considered its center, and no location in space can be defined as its center. 

 

Then why is gravity always focused on the center of a sphere, and not on every point on its surface?

 

 

[Harte]

It's not focused anywhere. The mass is under you, that's why it sucks you down. If it was above you, it would suck you up.

Harte

[Will Due]

 

I would like to say something about the Urantia Book. Hope you don't mind.

Right now, it's the baby in the family. You know, when the baby has something to say, nobody pays much attention. He's not old enough to warrant it yet.

___________________________

 

I know how most of you feel about the UB, but I'm hoping you might consider something it says about the minimum and maximum of what makes up the Universe materially, and how it's all centered. 

What the UB says about this is pretty extraordinary IMHO. What it says is that the single largest material object in the Universe, a flat elliptical sphere, is at the center of the Universe; is outside of time and space and is motionless. But everything else, including space itself, surrounds this massive central object and IS in motion.

It says further that there are two types of physical gravity, local or linear gravity like the type we're familiar with, and an unrecognized superior type of physical gravity that causes all matter surrounding the Center to revolve or spin in a gigantic flat plain around the enormous motionless object at the center of the Universe. 

And here's where it gets interesting.

On the other end of the scale, the Universe is FILLED with the smallest particle of matter. This particle, the ultimaton, is the basic material particle that makes up all matter, and exactly one hundred of them come together or "huddle" to make up the protons and electrons of all atoms. 

But unlike all other material systems from galaxies to atoms, how electrons and planets whirl about their central mass object, ultimatons do not orbit within the electron.

Instead they spin on their axis individually, and in a group of one hundred, expand out or contract in, to form the dimension of the electron by that "huddling" behavior.

 

And here's where it gets even MORE interesting regarding the centeredness of the Universe and its two types of physical gravity.

 

All matter in the Universe reacts to linear or local gravity, the type that makes an apple fall towards the center of the earth. All material objects that is, except the ultimaton. 

That's a paradox I know, but let me continue.

The ultimaton has as its nucleus that massive object at the center of the Universe, and not the center of the particular electron it constitutes in a group of one hundred. This is how the superior type of gravity which is focused on the most enormous of all universe objects at the center of the Universe causes everything in time and space to rotate in one vast orbiting elliptical plain around the Center.

 

Now we'll have to wait and see when science finds more evidence of these things, if what the UB says is true.

But I'm pretty sure that's going to be a long time from now, when the baby will have grown up to become something people pay more attention to.

 

 

Edited February 18, 2018 by Will Due

[trevor borocz johnson]

mee meep!

[Derek Willis]

4 hours ago, Will Due said:

I would like to say something about the Urantia Book. Hope you don't mind.

Right now, it's the baby in the family. You know, when the baby has something to say, nobody pays much attention. He's not old enough to warrant it yet.

People used to believe the "science" in the Bible - you know, like everything was created in six days, 4,000 years ago. Then real science showed the "science" of the Bible to be naive nonsense. It took until about the sixteenth century to do that because the vested interests who promoted - forced - belief in the Bible wouldn't let people do science. The Bible has a value as a moral guide, and that cannot be denied: but as a scientific textbook, no.

The Urantia book is less than a century old - apparently, it was written by an out of work salesman. As soon as it was published, anyone with even a basic knowledge of science knew it was nonsense. So, as time goes on, rather than the "baby in the family" becoming more mature, the situation will become even more laughable.

[Black Monk]

20 hours ago, Will Due said:

Because all the laws of physics shows that an explosion, as in the case of a supernova, has a center.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Paradise. 

 

 

The Big Bang didn't spread out into space around it as a normal explosion does. A normal explosion has a centre, and it spreads out into the space around it. The Big Bang, however, created space as it exploded outwards. Or, rather, the space that the Big Bang created as it initially occurred expanded, and continues to expand. Everywhere in the universe, therefore, is where the Big Bang occurred. The Big Bang occurred right where your house is.

Edited February 18, 2018 by Black Monk

[Will Due]

6 hours ago, Black Monk said:

The Big Bang didn't spread out into space around it as a normal explosion does. A normal explosion has a centre, and it spreads out into the space around it. The Big Bang, however, created space as it exploded outwards. Or, rather, the space that the Big Bang created as it initially occurred expanded, and continues to expand. Everywhere in the universe, therefore, is where the Big Bang occurred. The Big Bang occurred right where your house is.

 

So then, what you're saying is, it was all a miracle.

 

 

[trevor borocz johnson]

13 hours ago, Will Due said:

I would like to say something about the Urantia Book. Hope you don't mind.

Right now, it's the baby in the family. You know, when the baby has something to say, nobody pays much attention. He's not old enough to warrant it yet.

___________________________

 

I know how most of you feel about the UB, but I'm hoping you might consider something it says about the minimum and maximum of what makes up the Universe materially, and how it's all centered. 

What the UB says about this is pretty extraordinary IMHO. What it says is that the single largest material object in the Universe, a flat elliptical sphere, is at the center of the Universe; is outside of time and space and is motionless. But everything else, including space itself, surrounds this massive central object and IS in motion.

It says further that there are two types of physical gravity, local or linear gravity like the type we're familiar with, and an unrecognized superior type of physical gravity that causes all matter surrounding the Center to revolve or spin in a gigantic flat plain around the enormous motionless object at the center of the Universe. 

And here's where it gets interesting.

On the other end of the scale, the Universe is FILLED with the smallest particle of matter. This particle, the ultimaton, is the basic material particle that makes up all matter, and exactly one hundred of them come together or "huddle" to make up the protons and electrons of all atoms. 

But unlike all other material systems from galaxies to atoms, how electrons and planets whirl about their central mass object, ultimatons do not orbit within the electron.

Instead they spin on their axis individually, and in a group of one hundred, expand out or contract in, to form the dimension of the electron by that "huddling" behavior.

 

And here's where it gets even MORE interesting regarding the centeredness of the Universe and its two types of physical gravity.

 

All matter in the Universe reacts to linear or local gravity, the type that makes an apple fall towards the center of the earth. All material objects that is, except the ultimaton. 

That's a paradox I know, but let me continue.

The ultimaton has as its nucleus that massive object at the center of the Universe, and not the center of the particular electron it constitutes in a group of one hundred. This is how the superior type of gravity which is focused on the most enormous of all universe objects at the center of the Universe causes everything in time and space to rotate in one vast orbiting elliptical plain around the Center.

 

Now we'll have to wait and see when science finds more evidence of these things, if what the UB says is true.

But I'm pretty sure that's going to be a long time from now, when the baby will have grown up to become something people pay more attention to.

Will Due you try to explain your book and you skew off for paragraphs with confusing words. I'll take a laymans concise understanding of the book and discuss it if you let me.

[Will Due]

25 minutes ago, trevor borocz johnson said:

Will Due you try to explain your book and you skew off for paragraphs with confusing words. I'll take a laymans concise understanding of the book and discuss it if you let me.

 

It'll be my pleasure. 

 

 

[Derek Willis]

1 hour ago, Will Due said:

So then, what you're saying is, it was all a miracle.

No, it was physics - just like every other process that goes on in the universe.

[Will Due]

15 minutes ago, Derek Willis said:

No, it was physics - just like every other process that goes on in the universe.

 

So was it ipso facto?

 

 

[Harte]

No, more like sine qua non.

Harte