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Dark_Grey

Border Wall Funds Approved

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Hammerclaw

I think enhanced border security would be more practical and attainable than an actual physical barrier, which is pie-in-the-sky in my estimation. Even so, if whatever means are effective, the government will have to turn it's attention to enhanced coastal security because that will be the alternative route. It would seem to me laws prohibiting the exploitation of foreign nationals by requiring proper documentation of each employed individual and giving them the same rights and responsibilities under US labor laws as citizens, would curtail the desire to employ them as "cheap labor". Probably, such laws already exist, but aren't enforced. Let California be required to treat them equally in benefits and wages and see how eager they are to welcome them in, then.

Edited by Hammerclaw
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AnchorSteam
41 minutes ago, Hammerclaw said:

I think enhanced border security would be more practical and attainable than an actual physical barrier, --

I think that cracking down on all the businesses that exploit illegal labor would do the trick. 

Fine them 100k per illegal employee per incident, and that would be the end of it. However, that would take real political muscle, like a President that actually has the backing of his own damned party.

Maybe Trump should form a new one, and let the Republicants just wither on the vine. 

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Bama13
On 7/14/2017 at 0:01 PM, OverSword said:

Alesia fell to the Romans despite it's walls. If the Maginot line worked how did the Germans take Paris?

Caesar built two walls around Alesia, one to keep Vercingetorix's forces in and one to keep the relief force out. They worked.

The Maginot line was built to force the Germans to go around it. Worked to a tee. Unfortunately for the French the Germans did go around, just not where they expected.

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Sweetpumper

Community outraged after feds move in Romanian ‘gypsies’ — defecating in streets, trash in yards

Residents in California, Pennsylvania, a small borough of the Pittsburgh Metropolitan Area, have said they are outraged after the federal government moved 40 Romanian ‘gypsies’ into the town of 7,000 as part of the government’s Alternative to Detention program.

On Thursday, more than 150 residents attended a community meeting about the immigrants, who residents say have failed to assimilate to American customs and norms. The residents cited trash in yards, disruptions in town markets, children and men defecating in public streets, and immigrants cutting off the heads of chickens in public areas, according to a report by WTAE-TV. None of the immigrants, who are undocumented, have been charged with any other serious criminal offenses.

http://www.theblaze.com/news/2017/07/16/community-outraged-after-feds-move-in-romanian-gypsies-defecating-in-streets-trash-in-yards/

LMAO.

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Bama13
On 7/14/2017 at 10:54 PM, AnchorSteam said:

I think that cracking down on all the businesses that exploit illegal labor would do the trick. 

Fine them 100k per illegal employee per incident, and that would be the end of it. However, that would take real political muscle, like a President that actually has the backing of his own damned party.

Maybe Trump should form a new one, and let the Republicants just wither on the vine. 

Why should we hold American citizens responsible? It isn't their job to make sure the people in this country are here legally. That would be the Federal Governments job. So why punish business owners because the government isn't doing their job?

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RavenHawk
2 minutes ago, Bama13 said:

Why should we hold American citizens responsible? It isn't their job to make sure the people in this country are here legally. That would be the Federal Governments job. So why punish business owners because the government isn't doing their job?

That’s a fair point – to a degree.  There shouldn’t be a penalty placed on the homeowner that hires a nanny for the children.  Perhaps encourage the homeowner to become a sponsor of the nanny to become a citizen??  But there are companies that go to a pickup point to get day laborers and it is well known that this pickup point is where illegals congregate looking for work.  These companies need to be heavily fined.  And the federal government should be penalized for not doing their job.  Unfortunately, that usually ends up hurting the citizens anyway.  Maybe Have Congress go without pay for a while.  Force them to live off their nest egg.

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Dark_Grey
56 minutes ago, Sweetpumper said:

Community outraged after feds move in Romanian ‘gypsies’ — defecating in streets, trash in yards

Residents in California, Pennsylvania, a small borough of the Pittsburgh Metropolitan Area, have said they are outraged after the federal government moved 40 Romanian ‘gypsies’ into the town of 7,000 as part of the government’s Alternative to Detention program.

On Thursday, more than 150 residents attended a community meeting about the immigrants, who residents say have failed to assimilate to American customs and norms. The residents cited trash in yards, disruptions in town markets, children and men defecating in public streets, and immigrants cutting off the heads of chickens in public areas, according to a report by WTAE-TV. None of the immigrants, who are undocumented, have been charged with any other serious criminal offenses.

"Alternative to Detention" = moving them to NOT a gated community. There is a strong element of elitism regarding immigration, much like in the UK. The rich and powerful keep shipping "raw" (non-assimilated,) immigrants to mid-town here and small-town there. They do this in Canada, also. What you never see is detention centers in the business district or a migrant tent city behind the Hollywood hills. It's almost like the elites don't really like people of color...

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OverSword
2 hours ago, Bama13 said:

Caesar built two walls around Alesia, one to keep Vercingetorix's forces in and one to keep the relief force out. They worked.

The Maginot line was built to force the Germans to go around it. Worked to a tee. Unfortunately for the French the Germans did go around, just not where they expected.

So the Maginot line did not work and the containment of the Celts was really more about superior forces, weapons and tactics.  Had there not been a lethal force on the other side of those walls they would not have worked.  Ours will not have lethal force waiting as a consequence of crossing it and it will not work.  It most certainly will not be funded once the dems control the house in two years or when Trump is not re-elected in four.  Waste of time and money.

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Bama13
3 minutes ago, OverSword said:

So the Maginot line did not work and the containment of the Celts was really more about superior forces, weapons and tactics.  Had there not been a lethal force on the other side of those walls they would not have worked.  Ours will not have lethal force waiting as a consequence of crossing it and it will not work.  It most certainly will not be funded once the dems control the house in two years or when Trump is not re-elected in four.  Waste of time and money.

Once again the Maginot Line was built so that the Germans would have to go through the Benelux countries and not invade France directly from Germany. The Germans did indeed go around the Maginot Line, just not where the French expected them to. So it did work. You're claim otherwise flies in the face of fact.

The Celts out numbered the Romans by around 4 to 1. Pretty much same weaponry. The tactic that made the difference was the two walls, walls which according to your post never worked anywhere. Just pointing out a couple of times where walls worked. There are many more examples. So walls have been known to work. That is my only point here.

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OverSword
13 minutes ago, Bama13 said:

Once again the Maginot Line was built so that the Germans would have to go through the Benelux countries and not invade France directly from Germany. The Germans did indeed go around the Maginot Line, just not where the French expected them to. So it did work. You're claim otherwise flies in the face of fact.

The Celts out numbered the Romans by around 4 to 1. Pretty much same weaponry. The tactic that made the difference was the two walls, walls which according to your post never worked anywhere. Just pointing out a couple of times where walls worked. There are many more examples. So walls have been known to work. That is my only point here.

The Germans took France so the line failed, period.  How can you even argue that?  The purpose of the line was to ensure Germany wouldn't defeat the French and take control of the country.  Duh.

The Celts fought as a group of disorganized individuals and the Romans fought as an organized unit.  One was warriors and the other soldiers.  The Romans equipment and armor was vastly superior to the people north of them at that time.  It was not a wall which conquered the Celts it was an army, the wall merely being a part of a larger strategy which included killing people.  See the difference between that and the boondoggle on our border? 

Edited by OverSword

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Bama13
4 minutes ago, OverSword said:

The Germans took France so the line failed, period.  How can you even argue that?  The purpose of the line was to ensure Germany wouldn't defeat the French and take control of the country.  Duh.

The Celts fought as a group of disorganized individuals and the Romans fought as an organized unit.  One was warriors and the other soldiers.  The Romans equipment and armor was vastly superior to the people north of them at that time.  It was not a wall which conquered the Celts it was an army, the wall merely being a part of a larger strategy which included killing people.  See the difference between that and the boondoggle on our border? 

The mistake the French made was in deciding where the Germans would go around the Maginot Line. They knew the Germans would go around the Line. That is why they built it. The Germans did go around it. So it worked, but the rest of the French plan didn't work. That is why the lost. Duh

The Roman weapons were no better than the Gauls had. I will grant that the average Roman had armor while the average Gaul did not, only a shield. But without the walls the Romans would have lost. So the walls worked. 

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aztek
Just now, OverSword said:

The Germans took France so the line failed, period.  How can you even argue that?  The purpose of the line was to ensure Germany wouldn't defeat the French and take control of the country.  Duh.

 

lol, what does it have to do with walls?  the line was not a wall, but a network of underground bunkers, fortifications, and cannons,.

Image result for maginot line

Edited by aztek

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OverSword
27 minutes ago, aztek said:

lol, what does it have to do with walls?  the line was not a wall, but a network of underground bunkers, fortifications, and cannons,.

 

I'm not the one comparing it.  But it did fail didn't it?  I could have swore the Germans took France in WWII.  Bama seems to think it worked like a  charm.

Edited by OverSword

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OverSword
27 minutes ago, Bama13 said:

The mistake the French made was in deciding where the Germans would go around the Maginot Line. They knew the Germans would go around the Line. That is why they built it. The Germans did go around it. So it worked, but the rest of the French plan didn't work. That is why the lost. Duh

The Roman weapons were no better than the Gauls had. I will grant that the average Roman had armor while the average Gaul did not, only a shield. But without the walls the Romans would have lost. So the walls worked. 

If you think the Celts iron was anywhere near the quality of Romes you are sadly mistaken, and as I've said the wall was only effective because of the army on the other side of it.  How does that compare with what this thread is about?  It doesn't. 

edited because I was rude

Edited by OverSword

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Quaentum
On ‎7‎/‎14‎/‎2017 at 2:56 PM, South Alabam said:

I think the closed borders will cut off the Liberals slave labor. There are millions of illegals in this country earning money, and not a cent going to the U.S.Treasury because they do not have a social security number like the rest of us taxpayers do. Do you seriously believe they are being payed fair wages? Do companies or businesses hire people and put you on a payroll without a social security number? If an illegal applies for a job, that employer might hire them at a lower wage, because just who are they going to complain to without exposing they are illegal? I'm all for immigration, but what part of illegal immigration do people have a problem understanding?

I'm sure it will affect all those republican business owners in Texas that use undocumented workers as well.   As for wages.  Just imagine no undocumented workers all making the appropriate minimum wage and every business that used undocumented workers raising their prices because of wage increses they will have to pay for documented workers.  Will you then cry that it's the liberals fault that prices increased?

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Quaentum
On ‎7‎/‎13‎/‎2017 at 0:03 PM, Dark_Grey said:

I heard the wall just got 10 ft higher...

Bill allocates $1.6 billion for Trump’s border wall

gettyimages-801461566.jpg

Above: a patriotic real estate mogul considers his next political move

TheHill
WashTimes
 

Between this, the SCOTUS ruling on Trump's travel ban and CNN sinking like a cinder block, it's a good day :tu:

GOP leaders said the $1.6 billion fully meets

Mr. Trump’s request to begin wall construction, which includes 32 miles of new border fencing in Texas, 28 miles of levee wall along the Rio Grande Valley, also in Texas, and 14 miles of replacement fence in San Diego.

So it takes 1.6 Billion for 74 miles of border fence.   But wait... There has never been a federal project that wasn't over budget.  That means the 74 miles of wall will cost more like 3 Billion dollars.

 

The entire wall will not be completed in Trumps time as president as those parts of the route that are privately owned or owned by the Indians will be tied up in the courts for years.

 

Of course, withing a year of a section of the walls completion, underground tunnels will have been dug and the inflow of illegals will continue. 

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aztek
Just now, OverSword said:

I'm not the one comparing it.  But it did fail didn't it?  

no it did not, it would be a fail, if Germans went thru it, but  it was not the case. by your logic, artillery is useless, it did not stop Germans, as is entire french army, why do they even bother having it, if Germans invaded France withing days.  they should completely disband it.

Edited by aztek
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aztek
Just now, Sweetpumper said:

Community outraged after feds move in Romanian ‘gypsies’ — defecating in streets, trash in yards

Residents in California, Pennsylvania, a small borough of the Pittsburgh Metropolitan Area, have said they are outraged after the federal government moved 40 Romanian ‘gypsies’ into the town of 7,000 as part of the government’s Alternative to Detention program.

On Thursday, more than 150 residents attended a community meeting about the immigrants, who residents say have failed to assimilate to American customs and norms. The residents cited trash in yards, disruptions in town markets, children and men defecating in public streets, and immigrants cutting off the heads of chickens in public areas, according to a report by WTAE-TV. None of the immigrants, who are undocumented, have been charged with any other serious criminal offenses.

http://www.theblaze.com/news/2017/07/16/community-outraged-after-feds-move-in-romanian-gypsies-defecating-in-streets-trash-in-yards/

LMAO.

why did feds even bring romanian gypsies?   afaik they are not in any danger in Romania. there is actually very strong presence of gypsies there 3% of entire population

maybe feeds did that to teach Californians a lesson?  

Edited by aztek

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OverSword
12 minutes ago, aztek said:

no it did not, it would be a fail, if Germans went thru it, but  it was not the case. by your logic, artillery is useless, it did not stop Germans, as is entire french army, why do they even bother having it, if Germans invaded France withing days.  they should completely disband it.

The purpose of the line was to defend France from Germany.  Did it succeed?  No.  Fail.

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aztek
Just now, OverSword said:

The purpose of the line was to defend France from Germany.  Did it succeed?  No.  Fail.

so was the purpose of the french army, you should tell them to disband it. 

in any case we are building a wall whether you like it or not. 

if anything failed it was strategic planing, the line was not long enough.

Edited by aztek

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Bama13
1 hour ago, OverSword said:

If you think the Celts iron was anywhere near the quality of Romes you are sadly mistaken, and as I've said the wall was only effective because of the army on the other side of it.  How does that compare with what this thread is about?  It doesn't. 

edited because I was rude

Sorry man. Wasn't claiming a wall will solve our illegal immigration problem. Just responding to where you said that no wall or fence ever worked. Some did, some didn't. Of course the walls have to be manned to be effective.

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Bama13
47 minutes ago, Quaentum said:

I'm sure it will affect all those republican business owners in Texas that use undocumented workers as well.   As for wages.  Just imagine no undocumented workers all making the appropriate minimum wage and every business that used undocumented workers raising their prices because of wage increses they will have to pay for documented workers.  Will you then cry that it's the liberals fault that prices increased?

Do liberals not care that illegal immigrants work for a non-living wage? That they are taken advantage of?

Just imagine, no welfare. Watch Americans take those jobs.

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aztek
Just now, Quaentum said:

I'm sure it will affect all those republican business owners in Texas that use undocumented workers as well.  

it will also affect thousands of buissness in liberal democratic new york, California, and pretty much every state one way or the other

Edited by aztek
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Kurzweil

I hope they put windows in the wall. 

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aztek
Just now, Kurzweil said:

I hope they put windows in the wall. 

naw, windows crash all the time.

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