Russia probes kick into high gear

[RAyMO]

6 minutes ago, bee said:

maybe Mueller himself might be having trouble sleeping and will be glad when it's all over - 

I speculated a while back that he might step down for ''''health reasons'''' to save face..

I am pretty sure he does have sleepless nights - quite a thankless job he has there.

Yes indeed I remember reading your post on this .... who knows..

Edited February 18, 2018 by RAyMO

[bee]

Just now, RAyMO said:

I am pretty sure he does have sleepless nights - quite a thankless job he has there.

Yes indeed I remember reading your thoughts on this .... who knows..

 

Yes - It has turned into a poisoned chalice  -   

[Merc14]

4 hours ago, RoofGardener said:

Umm... I dunno Merc14. I think it's been going on since.. gosh.. dunno... 1917  ? 

Agreed and we have been fighting them since 1917 but somehow they spent millions of dollars buying ads and no one knew until Mueller uncovered it?  Really?  The NSA, CIA and FBI were all clueless?  Obama knew something because he told Putin to "Stop it."  Now we are all up in arms because Trump is in office?  I saw some idiot on this forum saying Trump should be impeached because he hasn't increased the sanctions for what the Russians did in 2016 and the ass-hat is silent about the actual president who was in office and knew about it. 

[acidhead]

3 minutes ago, Merc14 said:

Agreed and we have been fighting them since 1917 but somehow they spent millions of dollars buying ads and no one knew until Mueller uncovered it?  Really?  The NSA, CIA and FBI were all clueless?  Obama knew something because he told Putin to "Stop it."  Now we are all up in arms because Trump is in office?  I saw some idiot on this forum saying Trump should be impeached because he hasn't increased the sanctions for what the Russians did in 2016 and the ass-hat is silent about the actual president who was in office and knew about it. 

Donald J. Trump

 

@realDonaldTrump

·

9h

 

 

If it was the GOAL of Russia to create discord, disruption and chaos within the U.S. then, with all of the Committee Hearings, Investigations and Party hatred, they have succeeded beyond their wildest dreams. They are laughing their asses off in Moscow. Get smart America!

[Merc14]

16 minutes ago, acidhead said:

Donald J. Trump

 

@realDonaldTrump

·

9h

 

 

If it was the GOAL of Russia to create discord, disruption and chaos within the U.S. then, with all of the Committee Hearings, Investigations and Party hatred, they have succeeded beyond their wildest dreams. They are laughing their asses off in Moscow. Get smart America!

Spot on!  Mission acomplished.

[Paranormal Panther]

5 hours ago, and then said:

Ex is engaging in that fine old legal tradition of parsing.  Remember the example of Bill Clinton - "It depends on what 'IS', is"  

The anti-Trump Hysteria Brigade feel it should be sufficient to show a pattern of behavior that Trump INTENDED to work with the Russians to harm HRC's chances.  That's what this has all come down to.  Pathetic, really.

A couple forum members could teach master classes on the fine art of parsing. They make Bill Clinton look like a novice by comparison.

[ExpandMyMind]

Former Trump aide Rick Gates to plead guilty; agrees to testify against Manafort

[Merc14]

27 minutes ago, ExpandMyMind said:

Former Trump aide Rick Gates to plead guilty; agrees to testify against Manafort

Wow, a sentence reduction for pleading guilty and testifying against Manafort.  I thought you said that isn't how plea bargains work EMM?  

Edited February 19, 2018 by Merc14

[ExpandMyMind]

15 minutes ago, Merc14 said:

Wow, a sentence reduction for pleading guilty and testifying against Manafort.  I thought you said that isn't how plea bargains work EMM?  

That's exactly how I said it works. You cooperate and are rewarded with leniency.

[Merc14]

7 minutes ago, ExpandMyMind said:

That's exactly how I said it works. You cooperate and are rewarded with leniency.

No, you said charges are dropped and told me I don't watch enough Law shows when I said that Mueller wouldn't drop more serious charges, he'd simply reduce Flynn's sentence, just as was done in Gate's case.  I can go back and copy everything if you insist on dodging your obvious error.

Edited February 19, 2018 by Merc14

[Astra.]

1 hour ago, ExpandMyMind said:

Former Trump aide Rick Gates to plead guilty; agrees to testify against Manafort

Thanks EMM...for keeping this thread updated as to keep people informed concerning this saga.

What I don't quite understand is why Mr Trump surrounded himself (either by appointment) or some who were affiliated with his campaign (in one way or another) who ended up being such dishonest and shady characters. 

I'm certainly no 'legal eagle' when it comes to such an in-depth investigation etc... such as Mr Mueller is dealing with right now, and /or exactly what will happen when all of this mire eventually comes to light...including possibly others who were involved (either directly or indirectly) concerning having corrupt Russian ties.  

All in all tho, I do respect in which the way Mr Mueller is going about this business in a quiet and professional manner whilst piecing this puzzle together. Fingers crossed tho, that things will come to an end, sooner than later.  

[Space Commander Travis]

3 hours ago, Astra. said:

What I don't quite understand is why Mr Trump surrounded himself (either by appointment) or some who were affiliated with his campaign (in one way or another) who ended up being such dishonest and shady characters. 

I'm certainly no 'legal eagle' when it comes to such an in-depth investigation etc... such as Mr Mueller is dealing with right now, and /or exactly what will happen when all of this mire eventually comes to light...including possibly others who were involved (either directly or indirectly) concerning having corrupt Russian ties. 

All in all tho, I do respect in which the way Mr Mueller is going about this business in a quiet and professional manner whilst piecing this puzzle together. 

So you don't see it as at all a witchhunt that doesn't look at all at anything the Democratic party or the Clinton campaign might have been involved in, then, and you see it as totally unbiased and disinterested and concerned only with upholding the sacred American Democracy? 

[RoofGardener]

42 minutes ago, Vlad the Mighty said:

So you don't see it as at all a witchhunt that doesn't look at all at anything the Democratic party or the Clinton campaign might have been involved in, then, and you see it as totally unbiased and disinterested and concerned only with upholding the sacred American Democracy? 

Pfffft... you're thinking 2-dimensionally, Vlad. Like I said a few posts ago... "you really havn't cottoned on yet ? "

This whole thing is a Trump/Republican setup. They have tricked and manipulated the Democrats - never the sharpest knives in the drawer -  into getting involved. The end-game is for the entire inquiry to collapse into disorder and disarray. THEN... during the NEXT presidential election campaign, President Trump can nullify ANY criticism by saying "Bah... it's all fake news and Liberal chicanery.... just like the Russian collusion accusations . ".

The future is bright... the future is Orange !

Edited February 19, 2018 by RoofGardener

[Space Commander Travis]

Or even worse, use the proof that the FBI and the Intelligence Services are irrevocably corrupted and are blatant political tools, as a reason to abolish the whole organisation and replace it with a hand-picked Internal Security Department (or Geheime Staatspolizei) that will have to swear an oath of undying loyalty to the Leader! This is how totalitarianism starts! 

Edited February 19, 2018 by Vlad the Mighty

[RoofGardener]

1 minute ago, Vlad the Mighty said:

Or even worse, use the proof that the FBI and the Intelligence Services are irrevocably corrupted and are blatant political tools, and abolish the whole organisation and replace it with a hand-picked Internal Security Department (or Geheime Staatspolizei) that will have to swear an oath of undying loyalty to the Leader! This is how totalitarianism starts! 

I would suggest that it will START with the Secret Service ?

I mean.... "Secret Service" .... " SchutzStaffel "  ... they BOTH have the initials of "SS", and both are a protection squadron. (that's what SchutzStaffel translates as ). It's kinda obvious when you think about it ?

[ExpandMyMind]

7 hours ago, Merc14 said:

No, you said charges are dropped and told me I don't watch enough Law shows when I said that Mueller wouldn't drop more serious charges, he'd simply reduce Flynn's sentence, just as was done in Gate's case.  I can go back and copy everything if you insist on dodging your obvious error.

I said he 'might even get immunity'. 

What you are rewarded with depends entirely on what you offer the investigation and how valuable that is to them.

I would like for you to go back and show me where you said he would just reduce Flynn's sentence. I honestly don't remember reading that in your posts. And I certainly have never denied that a reduction can be a result of cooperating.

 But you seem to be under the impression that only one of those two outcomes is possible. Both are possible depending on the individual case. You understand that people get immunity for cooperating,  yes? Is that not a dropping of charges, instead of merely a reduction of sentence? Are you catching on? 

[Carpet]

I remember when Jerry Orbach discovered russian collusion but it only turned out to be uranium 1 so it was like no big deal. Orbach was all p***ed because Markie Post was working on a different case on night court in that same episode. And Harry Anderson and John Larroquette weren't about to let Orbach be walking around their hot chick lawyer friend so Richard Moll made up this dossier and oh boy crazy stuff. 

[Merc14]

7 hours ago, RoofGardener said:

I would suggest that it will START with the Secret Service ?

I mean.... "Secret Service" .... " SchutzStaffel "  ... they BOTH have the initials of "SS", and both are a protection squadron. (that's what SchutzStaffel translates as ). It's kinda obvious when you think about it ?

Vlad is eerily silent on how Obama corrupted and weaponized the IRS, FBI and DoJ against the right while threatening That Trump will do what Obama has already done.  That is the paradox of such blind hatred, imagining the hated party will do what your side has already done (and cheering while they did it). 

[Merc14]

7 hours ago, ExpandMyMind said:

I said he 'might even get immunity'. 

What you are rewarded with depends entirely on what you offer the investigation and how valuable that is to them.

I would like for you to go back and show me where you said he would just reduce Flynn's sentence. I honestly don't remember reading that in your posts. And I certainly have never denied that a reduction can be a result of cooperating.

 But you seem to be under the impression that only one of those two outcomes is possible. Both are possible depending on the individual case. You understand that people get immunity for cooperating,  yes? Is that not a dropping of charges, instead of merely a reduction of sentence? Are you catching on? 

Please stop excusing your errors by making even more of them.  You are simply lying now.  Listen, I realize by now that you are not a big man enough to admit when you make a mistake and that you are incapable of apologizing.  No worries, most (99%) leftists suffer from the same weakness, I am just pointing out your mistakes to let you know the lies and misstatements are not forgotten.  I'd say "Grow up! but what would be the point, we are way past that.

Edited February 19, 2018 by Merc14

[Space Commander Travis]

47 minutes ago, Merc14 said:

Vlad is eerily silent on how Obama corrupted and weaponized the IRS, FBI and DoJ against the right while threatening That Trump will do what Obama has already done.  That is the paradox of such blind hatred, imagining the hated party will do what your side has already done (and cheering while they did it). 

Merc ,I was being sarcastic, please don't worry. 

[Tiggs]

I have returned from singing the songs of my people.

Three interesting news stories from last week that I haven't seen posted here:


Before Donald Trump and Steve Bannon were enemies, they were allies. And not long before that, Bannon was part of an effort to sink Trump's presidential hopes -- even if Trump didn't know it.

A conservative watchdog group led by Bannon tried to discredit Trump in the early stages of the 2016 Republican presidential primary by shopping a document alleging that Trump had ties to mobsters, according to conservative sources and a copy of the document reviewed by CNN.

Source: CNN

 

Steve Bannon, who served as President Donald Trump’s chief strategist, was interviewed by special counsel Robert Mueller over multiple days this week, NBC News has learned from two sources familiar with the proceedings.

Bannon spent a total of some 20 hours in conversations with the team led by Mueller, who is investigating possible collusion between the Trump campaign and Russia as well as other issues that have arisen around the probe.

Source: NBC

 

Adam Schiff, the top Democrat on the House intelligence committee, said Wednesday that the panel had seen an “abundance” of evidence of collusion with Russia and obstruction by Donald Trump’s campaign and administration that is not yet public.

Speaking to reporters in Washington, Schiff said a lot of information was already in the public domain that pointed to extensive contacts between the Trump campaign team and the Kremlin, and later efforts by the Trump entourage to cover up those contacts. But Schiff said there was much more to come out.

He said: “There is certainly an abundance of non-public information that we’ve gathered in the investigation. And I think some of that non-public evidence is evidence on the issue of collusion and some … on the issue of obstruction.”

Source: The Guardian
 

[+and-then]

13 minutes ago, Tiggs said:

Adam Schiff, the top Democrat on the House intelligence committee, said Wednesday that the panel had seen an “abundance” of evidence of collusion with Russia and obstruction by Donald Trump’s campaign and administration that is not yet public.

It will be good to finally see some of it then.  It seems to be as elusive as a non-anonymous source in an MSM news story.

[Tiggs]

4 minutes ago, and then said:

It will be good to finally see some of it then.  It seems to be as elusive as a non-anonymous source in an MSM news story.

Wouldn't expect Schiff to make an unforced lie. Would expect him to phrase his statements in a way that's most politically beneficial.

There's evidence, and then there's evidence. I think what we're all still waiting for is "the smoking gun" -- and I don't think he has that.

[.ZZ.]

I saw some recent Schiff interviews and he appeared to be scrambling after this news on Friday.

Quote

There's no allegation that any American was knowingly involved in the conspiracy, Rosenstein said. Nor was there an allegation that the efforts of the defendants affected the outcome of the election.

 

Edited February 19, 2018 by .ZZ.

[Gromdor]

There's no allegation that any American was involved in the conspiracy?  Trump needs to stop complaining then.  He's acting like some one who was alleged to have conspired with the Russians.