Why is it spirituality vs skepticism?

[Aquila King]

1 minute ago, back to earth said:

 

I care too ... here ya go 

  Hide contents

 

[Aquila King]

1 minute ago, XenoFish said:

The idea of god or anything positive associated to god not only changes your subjective filter, but releases both dopamine and seratonin. You know what else can release dopamine? Cocaine. Sex. A good meal. I'm starting to sound like Davros.....

Just because it releases dopamine and serotonin doesn't in any way mean God doesn't exist.

Merely thinking about doing any of the things you mentioned releases those chemicals as well (albeit in smaller quantities of course), however it doesn't mean those things don't exist.

[XenoFish]

The dopamine switch between atheist, believers, and fanatics.

Changing feel good systems in the brain.

[back to earth]

35 minutes ago, Aquila King said:

 

Yeah  ,,,, please slap my face again !   ......   another one !      .....  one more  ...

 

Ahh , thanks ... I better now    

[Will Due]

4 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

The idea of god or anything positive associated to god not only changes your subjective filter, but releases both dopamine and seratonin. You know what else can release dopamine? Cocaine. Sex. A good meal. I'm starting to sound like Davros.....

And believing belief in God is just psychological. It's a dopamine rush.

 

 

[XenoFish]

Just now, Aquila King said:

Just because it releases dopamine and serotonin doesn't in any way mean God doesn't exist.

Merely thinking about doing any of the things you mentioned releases those chemicals as well (albeit in smaller quantities of course), however it doesn't mean those things don't exist.

Again I will repeat myself. God is an idea. 

[back to earth]

28 minutes ago, Aquila King said:

 

His thought adjuster invaded your space   ! 

 

[XenoFish]

Just now, Will Due said:

And believing in God is just psychological. It's a dopamine rush.

 

 

Yes. It's similar to a drug high. 

[Aquila King]

Just now, XenoFish said:

Again I will repeat myself. God is an idea. 

Prove it.

[Will Due]

1 minute ago, XenoFish said:

Yes. It's similar to a drug high. 

Fish, you're showing your true colors. 

How disappointing.

 

 

[XenoFish]

Just now, Aquila King said:

Prove it.

What are your thoughts on god? That's where the answer is. Without putting much thought towards or into the concept of god it does not exist to you on any level. Any concept of god that someone holds is only how they want god to be and as "real" to them as they wish. You really are turning into Will Due. 

[XenoFish]

Just now, Will Due said:

Fish, you're showing your true colors. 

How disappointing.

 

 

News flash. I have always shown my true colors. I'm kinda know for it. 

[Aquila King]

Just now, XenoFish said:

You really are turning into Will Due. 

 Hey, at least I speaky de engly!

[Will Due]

11 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

News flash. I have always shown my true colors. I'm kinda know for it. 

When you think that it's purely psychological to believe in God, that too, is a purely psychological belief.

Right Fish?

Explain it to me, how it isn't the same thing.

 

 

[Aquila King]

12 minutes ago, Will Due said:

When you think that it's purely psychological to believe in God, that too, is a purely psychological belief.

Right Fish?

Explain it to me, how it isn't the same thing.

 I have to agree actually. Even the atheist's beliefs are subject to the same criticism.

[Will Due]

Convictions about God may be arrived at through wise reasoning, but the individual becomes God-knowing only by faith, through personal experience. In much that pertains to life, probability must be reckoned with, but when contacting with cosmic reality, certainty may be experienced when such meanings and values are approached by living faith. The God-knowing soul dares to say, "I know," even when this knowledge of God is questioned by the unbeliever who denies such certitude because it is not wholly supported by intellectual logic. To every such doubter the believer only replies, "How do you know that I do not know?"

That's right. It's a quote from the Urantia Book. 

 

 

[+Hammerclaw]

Well, to be fair to Xeno, a belief is an idea, that believers choose to accept as a truth. I know; I'm a believer.

John 20:29  Jesus said unto him, Thomas, because you have seen me, you have believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.

Edited September 11, 2017 by Hammerclaw

[Will Due]

Fairness towards Fish is a fundamental element of these forums. It's ubiquitous. 

What I'm wondering is when is he going to be fair.

He keeps it up about how belief is just a psychological illusion and so forth. Basically implying there's something fundamentally wrong with it.

So I'm just applying the same rules to unbelief and instead of getting an honest reply, I get nothing. There isn't a reply at all.

Go figure.

 

 

[Aquila King]

6 minutes ago, Will Due said:

Fairness towards Fish is a fundamental element of these forums. It's ubiquitous. 

What I'm wondering is when is he going to be fair.

He keeps it up about how belief is just a psychological illusion and so forth. Basically implying there's something fundamentally wrong with it.

So I'm just applying the same rules to unbelief and instead of getting an honest reply, I get nothing. There isn't a reply at all.

Go figure.

I hate to keep playing both sides, but I sorta agree with both of you to an extent.

Yes, it is irritating when he goes on and on about how everything spiritual is an illusion, but that's to be expected of course from any atheist really.

At the same time, I'm not for an insistence in faith either. Belief and skepticism should go hand in hand.

Yes, he isn't necessarily being fair with the facts, insisting it's all just chemicals and psychological processes, when there is sufficient evidence that that is not the case.

However you aren't giving any facts at all really, just quoting weird stuff from that precious book.

Idk, it's just a big mess.

[Mr Walker]

I think that spirituality requires the ability to construct belief constructs  and then to accept them as a starting point, in order to be spiritual.

Skeptics have  problems with belief because, as people, they  require evidences to accept any mental  construct,   and beliefs do not require any evidences at all. .

Skeptics  thus  have  difficulty in constructing a solid belief construct and maintaining  it, when there is no evidential reason for doing so.   

[back to earth]

Soooo , you believe people adopt their beliefs for no reason at all , just pick them out the air like passing butterflies ?   Or , as you say  ;  "  spirituality requires the ability to construct belief constructs  "

I guess, one day, without any reason, Will just thought ' I know, I will start believing in the Urantia Book ', and all of the valid reasons he gave ( for him )   don't count  ...in your counting.

Mhe  ... doesn't surprise me at all  what you try to foist here anymore .  

[XenoFish]

6 hours ago, Aquila King said:

 I have to agree actually. Even the atheist's beliefs are subject to the same criticism.

I have a thread in my signature, read it.

[XenoFish]

5 hours ago, Will Due said:

Fairness towards Fish is a fundamental element of these forums. It's ubiquitous. 

What I'm wondering is when is he going to be fair.

He keeps it up about how belief is just a psychological illusion and so forth. Basically implying there's something fundamentally wrong with it.

So I'm just applying the same rules to unbelief and instead of getting an honest reply, I get nothing. There isn't a reply at all.

Go figure.

 

 

You are thick aren't you. I've been giving answers. Answer you seem to not want at all. I have explained it before. I have a thread dedicated to the concepts behind why it works. It is in my signature. Do I need to create a 2.0 version with small words for you to understand? Or do I need to say aliens inspired me to write it?

When a child believes in the boogie man, the boogie man is "real" to them, but its not real. Just a sleight of mind. It is just an idea in there mind that changes their subjective view of things. Same with god. Nothing different, just the ideas behind it. Here I am giving you answers. You'll ignore them, but here it is. 

5 hours ago, Aquila King said:

I hate to keep playing both sides, but I sorta agree with both of you to an extent.

Yes, it is irritating when he goes on and on about how everything spiritual is an illusion, but that's to be expected of course from any atheist really.

At the same time, I'm not for an insistence in faith either. Belief and skepticism should go hand in hand.

Yes, he isn't necessarily being fair with the facts, insisting it's all just chemicals and psychological processes, when there is sufficient evidence that that is not the case.

However you aren't giving any facts at all really, just quoting weird stuff from that precious book.

Idk, it's just a big mess.

All I doing is tell you and everyone else what I've learned by reducing beliefs to what they are. No one has to agree and even though Will agree to disagree and move on he failed to do so. And here we are. 

Spiritual beliefs are accepting that something is true without proof. It's an assumption. The illusion part comes from excessive belief. You believe god will catch you so you jump off a bridge, that's just stupid. People do worse. Such belief can and do have positive benefits but God is the placebo's trigger, not the placebo's effect. 

The two kinds of belief.

Now if I am done doing the research for you. I have to go to work.

[Rlyeh]

18 hours ago, AZDZ said:

I agree. The problems start when skepticism becomes a reason to attack God for the sake of winning arguments with believers. I believe God would forgive and forget for people not believing in His existence. After all, He is responsible for hiding all the evidence so it would not be Just to condemn anyone* for not believing. (*that is, anyone who despite unbelief does as you say and lives a just life as if they believed)

But when skeptics step out of bounds, go beyond simply not believing and attack Him, that is when they set themselves up for spiritual trouble. 

I do not think it is in vain that He says His "enemy's will be made a footstool", or "every knee will bend".

So my advice would be go ahead, live life as good person to its fullest but beware of nastily critiquing something you do not understand.

Because they insult your invisible friend? Maybe you'll get lucky and death for blasphemy gets reinstated. 

[Rlyeh]

9 hours ago, mindpurge said:

The reason for me to believe isn't emotional whatsoever, although I have indeed found peace in it, it's simply a matter of logic & research. Non-believers say there is no evidence, but I refute that, and tell you there is evidence, much more than you could even possibly imagine. Lets be clear, I'm not talking religion here, religion is simply man's interpretation of God, but man doesn't even know what God is, if God is even a singularity.

There is evidence but you just don't know what it is. Isn't that a contradiction?