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rodentraiser

Why is it spirituality vs skepticism?

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Xeno-Fish

When you've dedicated so much time, effort, emotion and faith in something you believed it. Then you start to go deeper and deeper into the subject. Looking towards scientific research when spirituality fails. Then you find that what you believe wasn't as real as you'd hoped. It was a product of the mind, of the imagination, a magical placebo effect.

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Mr Walker
51 minutes ago, papageorge1 said:

My belief is that sprit/consciousness is fundamental and that matter is a derivative of the One cosmic consciousness that animates all of us. This Consciousness permeates through the higher spiritual planes and incarnates the physical. It's all downward causation Mr. W.

Whereas my 55 years of association with the comic consciousness has lead me to a slightly different perspective.

MAtter and energy evolve first, and slowly self aware consciousness evolves

This INCLUDES the ancient cosmic consciousness.

. In the present era this ancient cosmic conscious does indeed permeate at least our part of the universe and, from my experience, all of it. (Although the furthest i have travelled and explored using its networks is right into the heart of the milky way galaxy which is a place of great beauty, light and wonder.  

It connects all self aware beings,  and stores and records individual memories  It is itself accessible to a human consciousness but also provides a link from one consciousness to another anywhere in the universe and going back for at least 100000 years (as far back as i have been able to travel using it)   It allows you to move your consciousness out of your body across the world and across the universe using the synapses or energy line s of the consciousness.

It "inhabits"  or rather permeates plants and animals and all of nature, so you can link into it via a tree, or an animal, or the earth itself, and use it  to become any of those things.

 It heightens your awareness of other people, animals and the environment  so that you can walk through a wilderness alone, without fear, and without ever getting lost .

It even allows you to enter into the stored minds of peole who have died but whose minds are stored within the consciousness

Self aware consciousness and its powers and abilities are so advanced as to see almost magical but are actually both, evolved properties, and in the case of the cosmic consciousness, technologically enhanced abilities of mind  

BUT matter and energy come first and mind is a product of environment Without a natural or artificial material host consciousness cannot come into existence o rsurvive  .  

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Aquila King
3 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

Gee I guess you now know what it feels like to be me.

<_< Yeah, well, most of my frustration here is spilling over from another forum.

I just wrote basically a damn book's worth of information, then I get hit with a **** ton of posts openly denigrating it all without ever even clicking the links and reading any of it. I'm 'bout to rage quit this whole shindig.

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third_eye
2 minutes ago, Aquila King said:

I just wrote basically a damn book's worth of information, then I get hit with a **** ton of posts openly denigrating it all without ever even clicking the links and reading any of it. I'm 'bout to rage quit this whole shindig.

:tu:

THanks for an obscure word revival ...

~

Just now, Aquila King said:

:mellow: ...You're right...

It is finished.

I'm done.

 

No need to press for an improbable two way street on a public forum my good man ... in all seriousness UM is the last place to to take any discussion of such a nature with too much seriousness ... an inexplicable mystery in its own right

:)

~

Edited by third_eye
double post bypass
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Aquila King
4 minutes ago, third_eye said:

What Does Tetelestai Mean?

:mellow: ...You're right...

It is finished.

I'm done.

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Aquila King
1 minute ago, third_eye said:

:tu:

THanks for an obscure word revival ...

~

:lol: Lol, thanks for the lighthearted lifting of spirits here.

Doesn't take much I tell you, to lift me up out of it all. :tu:

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back to earth
42 minutes ago, Mr Walker said:

Sorry, but what does training and conditioning have to do with; conscious self awareness, creativity, spirituality and religion?   The picture is funny/amusing, but is not indicative that the dog is performing a self aware religious ritual . You aren't seriously suggesting that it is? 

 

I might be . I might also be suggesting that the monk in the same picture is following a similar training programme .

because, I believe, unlike you Walker , that we develop our religious beliefs for a reason  .... and do not just randomly select them out of thin air - like you suggested .

And those reasons do not have to involve a conscious decision ... much of it is programming ... just like that little doggy .

And how you know he isn't 'self aware '  ?     If he was chasing his own tail around in circles  ( like 'some ' do )   I might concede he isn't aware its his own tale  .... ooops, I mean  tail .

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third_eye
Just now, Aquila King said:

:lol: Lol, thanks for the lighthearted lifting of spirits here.

Doesn't take much I tell you, to lift me up out of it all. :tu:

Now that's the spirit ...

:yes:

~

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Mr Walker
9 minutes ago, Aquila King said:

Cue the atheists to spam denigrate everything you just said. As well as the religious to spew their self validating dogma.

Seriously papa, gimme a reason why we're even doing this at this point?

It is just my experience, but this  (the cosmic consciousness and the abilities it gives to human beings) is very real.

I've known and understood some of this since i was  a pre- schoolerk  and began extending my consciousness and manipulating my mind to connect and control both my conscious and subconscious minds .

I first encountered the cosmic consciousness and enlightenment when I was about 12 years of age after working on my mind for five years Id never heard about it before, thought it was some sort of super power and   continued to work on the avenues that access to it gave to me.

It is irrelevant what others believe or disbelieve.  This is knowledge and working reality for me and has been for about 60 years.

The strange thing is that  it wasn't until the internet began, and i was about 50 years old, that i even discovered online that other people had had similar experiences and developed similar abilities  All the time I had thought this was something unique or special to me yet it has been recorded over time, and even named as i named it  while a child, because it has occurred to other human beings.   

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papageorge1
9 minutes ago, Aquila King said:

Cue the atheists to spam denigrate everything you just said. As well as the religious to spew their self validating dogma.

Seriously papa, gimme a reason why we're even doing this at this point?

I've been feeling fissures and lowering of the pedastal with some of them actually.

Also this boosts believers not as mature as some of us who have been around the block decades now.

Thirdly, it's challenging and keeps improving my arguments and thinking skills on these subjects.

Fourthly, I don't have enough other things going on maybe.

 

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back to earth
41 minutes ago, Mr Walker said:

I Am self aware of this dichotomy, but I am not sure Will yet is.

For me it remains important to tell a truth, even if others do not want to hear that truth.  

It is not insane for me, because the rationale behind it is logical.  ie.

I have a duty and obligation, even to those who are  antagonistic and skeptical, to tell them something which could enhance their life, and increase their potential as a human being.

Plus, surely you saw the smiley. :) 

I am not insane enough to expect everyone to believe me.

 

Yet you spend hours and pages of forum to try and convince us !    :huh:

( now you stepped the other foot in it !  )

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Aquila King
1 minute ago, Mr Walker said:

It is irrelevant what others believe or disbelieve.  This is knowledge and working reality for me and has been for about 60 years.

Yes, you're right. I think I've been putting a little too much effort into trying to convince others. It's only natural, being human and all, but I think I need to merely develop my own spirit and then merely express what I've learned, rather than trying to prove what I've learned all the time.

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Aquila King
4 minutes ago, papageorge1 said:

I've been feeling fissures and lowering of the pedastal with some of them actually.

Also this boosts believers not as mature as some of us who have been around the block decades now.

Thirdly, it's challenging and keeps improving my arguments and thinking skills on these subjects.

Fourthly, I don't have enough other things going on maybe.

:blink: I think maybe the last point is the most relevant to me (unfortunately), but yeah, I do get your other points...

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Xeno-Fish
11 minutes ago, Aquila King said:

<_< Yeah, well, most of my frustration here is spilling over from another forum.

I just wrote basically a damn book's worth of information, then I get hit with a **** ton of posts openly denigrating it all without ever even clicking the links and reading any of it. I'm 'bout to rage quit this whole shindig.

You know I get this in my own way. I've personally given up the whole god does/doesn't exist thing. Its a pointless argument where no one has a real answer. Hell I have my own ideas, but something may change one day. Still I  present what I've learned.

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Mr Walker
1 minute ago, back to earth said:

 

Yet you spend hours and pages of forum to try and convince us !    :huh:

( now you stepped the other foot in it !  )

Clearly you aren't reading the words i am writing, but only the words you see in your mind as you read.   I just explained all this simply and clearly.

There are may types of readers on this forum That includes  ttotal skeptics who wont believe anything. People who have an open mind and can be convinced by reasonable points and arguments. People who desperately want to believe and require no convincing . My posts are aimed at the middle group.

 But i am not here to convince, merely to keep telling a narrative which is as true as i can make it, based on my own experiences in life  I do not have any obligation to convince but i do have an obligation to spread knowledge and understanding and to tell the truths i have learned in my life  This is because of the empowerment and  potential having such knowledge and understandings gives to any human being  its like telling others about the benefits of exercise or a vegetarian diet or not smoking.

Not my job to convince, but my duty to report/  

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back to earth
30 minutes ago, third_eye said:

What Does Tetelestai Mean?

:)

~

~

 

:)    

 

MAGISTER TEMPLI. Mother of Heaven, beloved of the Stars, wherefore hast thou awakened the Poison of Eld, the Dweller in Eternity?

MATER CŒLI. Shabbathai.

 

Image result for smilie   snooze

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Xeno-Fish

Oh.....Walkers posting in this thread. That's what those grey blocks are between post.  You know, a thread does look a lot smaller when I can't see a wall,of text.

Edited by XenoFish
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back to earth
34 minutes ago, Mr Walker said:

Whereas my 55 years of association with the comic consciousness has lead me to a slightly different perspective.

Yep, we acknowledge that  in you ! 

 

 

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back to earth

Okay, that's three time you stepped in it  ... just as well you think you look like  'Jake the peg' ... with his extra leg    ( diddle diddle diddle diddle  )

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Aquila King
Just now, XenoFish said:

You know I get this in my own way. I've personally given up the whole god does/doesn't exist thing. Its a pointless argument where no one has a real answer. Hell I have my own ideas, but something may change one day. Still I  present what I've learned.

Yeah, I think I need to stop trying to go out of my way to prove my point to people and just simply express myself as calmly and casually as I can. Of course I won't let this make me lazy in proving things to myself so to speak, but well, you know what I'm sayin'.

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papageorge1
4 minutes ago, Aquila King said:

:blink: I think maybe the last point is the most relevant to me (unfortunately), but yeah, I do get your other points...

Aren't you gung-ho like me to change the culture some here?

 

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third_eye
1 minute ago, back to earth said:

Yep, we acknowledge that  in you ! 

 

 

True to form ... I beheld my keyboard for the spasms ... just couldn't get the keys from wobbling ...

:lol:

~

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Xeno-Fish
Just now, Aquila King said:

Yeah, I think I need to stop trying to go out of my way to prove my point to people and just simply express myself as calmly and casually as I can. Of course I won't let this make me lazy in proving things to myself so to speak, but well, you know what I'm sayin'.

I say "god is an idea" and people lose their minds. They freak out as if I've mortally wounded their ego. I can back most if not all of my perspective up with links.

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Xeno-Fish
2 minutes ago, papageorge1 said:

Aren't you gung-ho like me to change the culture some here?

 

No. I'm here for a wide variety of reason. One of those is to present some solid ground concerning beliefs and how the affect us. All you have to do is show me the evidence.

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Aquila King
1 minute ago, papageorge1 said:

Aren't you gung-ho like me to change the culture some here?

Yeah, well, I may just be tired of what seems to be apparent futility atm... :sleepy: Changing the culture expends a lot of energy, and it's hard to find motivation in a sea of negative feedback...

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