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lost_shaman

Right to an education without indoctrination.

187 posts in this topic

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preacherman76

I hear about school systems sexualizing children, and frowning on anything humanly normal.

I'd show you hundreds of examples, but I just don't have the stomach to look at it today.

 

Lets play a game and assume Im right here. What reason can you think of as to why. Just for fun, you are me, go.

ETA

LOL I thought this post would end up under EMM's post

Edited by preacherman76
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Kismit

Just playing Devils advocate here but what if politics was compulsory. 

Not saying any particular ideology should be pushed, but what if at any early age people where encouraged to (face to face) discuss political rolls and ideas. Although I think it should be combined with a class on communication skills.

 

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aztek

no, there is no such right. yet anyone who wishes not to put  their kids thru public schools, can do so, either private\religious school, or home school.  it is kinda pointless to expect no political indoctrination, from a school system that is very much political. and controlled by state\fed gvmnt.

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Gunn
4 hours ago, preacherman76 said:

Maybe it was. Maybe the OP can clarify.

 

Its to bad more people don't home school. I certainly would if I could. Kids who are home schooled are far more intelligent then their public school peers.

Well one would think so, wouldn't they? Unfortunately, that's not always true. As a parent of a home schooled child, who is now a young adult, I can testify that's not always the case. So I'm afraid your partially wrong on that statement.

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Paranormal Panther

Keep personal views, on politics and religion, out of it. Teach the subject, and evaluate students on how well they grasp the subject. Teachers don't need to share their views, on Trump, etc., with the class. Save that for the teachers' lounge. 

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Paranormal Panther
5 hours ago, Dark_Grey said:

Yeah, it is getting very weird in Commiefornia. Now they are producing Buzzfeed type videos introducing kids to sex toys. When I say "kids", I mean like 11 year old kids. It's extremely uncomfortable to watch, no matter how fun the music they use.

Something I've been pondering lately: maybe the Christian right was....right? Maybe there is something to the moral decay of the progressive Left that all started with gay marriage. They didn't even take a moment to celebrate that victory then it was on to trans-bathrooms. They got trans-bathrooms so naturally they've moved on to hormone replacement and puberty blockers for kids(?) 

Now they are just straight up sexualizing children. Note that ALL of this took place in a very, very short span of time. When did Obama legalize gay marriage? Look how far down the rabbit hole we have gone since then.

"Give them an inch and..."

We now should refuse to give them a millimeter more. It's blatant social engineering designed to change our beliefs about a variety of issues, and they will conflate movements (racial equality compared to trans bathrooms) to fool people. "Intolerant bigots", who realize this, will not be tolerated by leftist propagandists. They need to further indoctrinate captive audiences in public school classrooms with no interference and no opposition from the other side.

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Paranormal Panther
5 hours ago, Dark_Grey said:

What's going to happen is all the progressive Left finger pointing will create all the monsters they are afraid of. By continually injecting white guilt in to young minds, telling black kids to be afraid of Cops, etc. we are headed in to a very volatile future. The prog Left is literally creating a 4th Reich - an entire generation of young Conservatives that will kick the pendulum really hard back towards nationalism and white pride. The counter reaction to culture will not be a good one. If you think Trump getting elected as a reaction the left was bad...I got sour news for ya.. 

Let's hope that we don't reach a point where it's just communists and White extremists. Inevitably, as the transition from Obama to Trump so well illustrates, the pendulum swings. It would be nice to have some balance, based on common sense, for a change. It's sad that extremists don't understand that they're creating opposing extremists who form as a reaction to them.

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Setton
7 hours ago, preacherman76 said:

Depends on where you are from. What state you live in. In Cali they are having full blown drag queens who look like they are ready for Halloween teaching pre K classes on gender identity. Now I don't care who you are, or how you lean politically. That should disturb anyone. Deeply  

Why? Humour me. Why is that disturbing?

6 hours ago, ExpandMyMind said:

Oh, how will those poor kids ever survive. It's been 20 years and the scars of Mrs Doubtfire still haunt me every day.

I wish I could like this twice.

5 hours ago, Dark_Grey said:

They are bent on destroying traditional Western structures, whether consciously or not. Interestingly, most blue haired, depressed, gender-fluid trans people come from broken homes. Fancy that. 

Any actual data to support that?

27 minutes ago, Paranormal Panther said:

Keep personal views, on politics and religion, out of it. Teach the subject, and evaluate students on how well they grasp the subject. Teachers don't need to share their views, on Trump, etc., with the class. Save that for the teachers' lounge. 

In general I agree. But how do you think a teacher should handle it if a child asks about these issues directly?

Also, the one thing I note here that seems to be becoming more and more common with US posters is the conflation of political issues with moral/scientific/religious ones.

Politics is about how a country should be run. Not about who somebody is sexually attracted to or what gender they are.

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Paranormal Panther
1 minute ago, Setton said:

In general I agree. But how do you think a teacher should handle it if a child asks about these issues directly?

Also, the one thing I note here that seems to be becoming more and more common with US posters is the conflation of political issues with moral/scientific/religious ones.

Politics is about how a country should be run. Not about who somebody is sexually attracted to or what gender they are.

Teachers could tell the students to ask their parent(s) if they have questions about any of these issues. I agree with your last comment, but pressure groups and professional politicians make that nigh impossible. Pandering, to various interest groups (all kinds), is an art form here. It would be great if we *could* separate politics from sex.

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Kismit
8 minutes ago, Setton said:

Why? Humour me. Why is that disturbing?

I wish I could like this twice.

Any actual data to support that?

In general I agree. But how do you think a teacher should handle it if a child asks about these issues directly?

Also, the one thing I note here that seems to be becoming more and more common with US posters is the conflation of political issues with moral/scientific/religious ones.

Politics is about how a country should be run. Not about who somebody is sexually attracted to or what gender they are.

I wish I could like this twice.

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rashore
6 hours ago, preacherman76 said:

Mm Ex they are drag queens. They call themselves drag queens.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/19/style/drag-queen-story-hour-puts-the-rainbow-in-reading.html

21DRAG1-WEB-superJumbo.jpg

Just saying...

This has nothing to do with public schooling. It was a story hour presented by a public library. 

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lightly

When I went to school, we learned a little about history... which happens after politics turns into Policies.

i always say politics is the business of making appealing excuses for what are usually essentially ECONOMIC policies.

questionmark told me that was an oversimplification.

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lost_shaman
10 hours ago, Dark_Grey said:

I don't think education is a "right" but of course the material should be taught without any political influence.

Well I agree it is not explicitly innumerated as a "right" in the Constitution, that said in the U.S. we have to put our children in school or prove you are Homeschooling them. You can not simply keep you child at home without any schooling.

 

10 hours ago, Dark_Grey said:

At the end of the day, it only seems to matter for the..."lowest common denominator" students. The bright ones will naturally start asking the right questions and begin a journey of self discovery, regardless of what their teachers believed.

I don't agree. As a single father of two young daughters in their early 20's I've spent plenty of time around young people in and freshly out of Highschool. Many of these kids are very bright but they are almost all indoctrinated in progressive leftist ideology. It's ingrained in them it's all many of them have ever heard. Now what you are saying does happen, it is just that I think it's likely in rare cases and that may take many years.

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lost_shaman
10 hours ago, ChaosRose said:

I thought it was about home schooling.

 

10 hours ago, preacherman76 said:

Maybe it was. Maybe the OP can clarify.

From the OP I asked... "Should we accept (Leftest) single party indoctrination of our children in Public Schools and College?"

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lost_shaman
10 hours ago, The Narcisse said:

If a kid is home schooled they just end up being indoctrinated by their parents...so it's not about them being indoctrinated...but what they're being indoctrinated with.

Not necessarily. I mean in the U.S. you as a Parent you can teach your Kids whatever you want as long as there are no laws broken. And furthermore as a child you don't have a "right" not to listen to your Parents within reason. 

So, you can't legislate the Parent/child relationship... you can legislate certain boundaries in Public Schools however. 

Edited by lost_shaman

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Tatetopa
17 hours ago, Lilly said:

Back in ancient times, right after the dinosaurs departed, when I was a kid, here's how it went down: Teachers did not talk about political issues. Teachers did not talk about religion. Teachers did not talk about sexual issues. Teachers taught English, Science, Math, History, Language. The parents talked to their children about religion, politics, sexual issues. The parents actually took part in the socialization and development of their children. I know this is a shocking revelation for some but that's how it was 'way back then'.

I'm not saying everything was perfect (far from it) but there's something to be said about allowing people their differences in how they desire to raise their children. As for College level studies, young adults should be able to attend Universities where there exists diverse opinions on these adult issues. They should be able to hear speakers from all sides and they should be free to make up their own minds.

Back  when I went to elementary school, we prayed and said the pledge first thing every day.  Our history classes were taught  from a specific point of view as well.  Politics is more than just Republicans and Democrats. Its hard to keep all politics out of school.  Polis, Greek, the city, the root where we get policeman , man of the city.  is also the root of politics.  It is about the ordering of society.  In our case that might include teaching about  democracy over other forms of government.   Should we not teach that?

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Tatetopa

Religion is indoctrination.  Does civics fall under that classification too?

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lost_shaman
8 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

Religion is indoctrination.

Religion is already Restricted and or heavily monitored in the U.S. public school system.

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RoofGardener
12 hours ago, Kismit said:

Just playing Devils advocate here but what if politics was compulsory. 

Not saying any particular ideology should be pushed, but what if at any early age people where encouraged to (face to face) discuss political rolls and ideas. Although I think it should be combined with a class on communication skills.

Good Plan. Perhaps we could include Citizenship in it as well ?

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lost_shaman
8 minutes ago, RoofGardener said:

Perhaps we could include Citizenship in it as well ?

That actually doesn't relate to the U.S. educational system. 

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Setton
8 hours ago, Paranormal Panther said:

Teachers could tell the students to ask their parent(s) if they have questions about any of these issues. I agree with your last comment, but pressure groups and professional politicians make that nigh impossible. Pandering, to various interest groups (all kinds), is an art form here. It would be great if we *could* separate politics from sex.

Teachers could tell them that but that won't address a child's curiosity. Don't teachers have a responsibility to teach children how to debate politics? Especially when so many adults are so ill informed. 

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toast
15 hours ago, preacherman76 said:

Take a good look at this, and tell me this is appropriate for year olds

So we are talking about a handfull of kids who saw the performance and there is a big fuss on it now. Thats ridiculous. The more important issue is the question how many 5y olds are confronted with violent contents on TV every day. Millions. Thats a real issue and not the little stunt in NY.

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Susanc241
16 hours ago, preacherman76 said:

 Kids who are home schooled are far more intelligent then their public school peers.

Intelligence has nothing to do with education, or the lack of.  I think what you are trying to assert is that home schooled children are more knowledgeable.  Knowledge doesn't infer intelligence either.  You can know without understanding (facts/the implications).  Intelligence is the innate ability that allows you to maximise your understanding of the knowledge you acquire through the education you receive, and to expand on it to a greater or lesser degree, depending on the level of intelligence at the disposal of the individual.

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lightly
4 hours ago, RoofGardener said:

Good Plan. Perhaps we could include Citizenship in it as well ?

That reminds me!  We were actually graded on "citizenship" in grade school....If i further remember correctly, part of that was a comment section for the teacher (or principal?) to fill out... I remember seeing..  "works well with others"   written in that section of my report card!

  We recited the pledge of alleigiance every morning....to the flag which was displayed in Every classroom.

Edited by lightly

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rashore
17 hours ago, Kismit said:

Just playing Devils advocate here but what if politics was compulsory. 

Not saying any particular ideology should be pushed, but what if at any early age people where encouraged to (face to face) discuss political rolls and ideas. Although I think it should be combined with a class on communication skills.

 

Not early age for me but... I did have politics in high school, it was called government. It was about the U.S. government a lot, but also had other forms of world governments. That class covered the politics that U.S. and World history classes didn't get too deep into. It kind of went along with the current events class. Sociology and economics were also mandatory classes. Speech and communication class was in junior high.

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