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Mr. Argon

Is Demiurge a Satan?

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Some sources describe a Demiurge as a benign creator of physical universe, while some describe him as a personification of evil. So I am really puzzled about a nature of this Deity. First of all Plato and Gnostics have a contrasting view of Demiurge. Plato describes him as benign while the Gnostics on the other hand describe him as a blind God who created a physical world as a prison for the soul. This concept of the Gnostics is also at odds with Christianity which claims that all of the creation is a deed of all-good God, which I find absurd considering evil which we encounter all around us. Also, Demiurge is sometimes equated with a God of the Old Testament. Pretty confusing.

 

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4 hours ago, Mr. Argon said:

Some sources describe a Demiurge as a benign creator of physical universe, while some describe him as a personification of evil. So I am really puzzled about a nature of this Deity. First of all Plato and Gnostics have a contrasting view of Demiurge. Plato describes him as benign while the Gnostics on the other hand describe him as a blind God who created a physical world as a prison for the soul. This concept of the Gnostics is also at odds with Christianity which claims that all of the creation is a deed of all-good God, which I find absurd considering evil which we encounter all around us. Also, Demiurge is sometimes equated with a God of the Old Testament. Pretty confusing.

 

You can find some good things in the OT as well. It's just that there's a whole lot more stuff that could be attributed to a demiurge. 

There's a lot of pain and suffering. Everything has to survive by eating everything else. Everything is flawed.

It doesn't seem like the work of a perfect being, or even a benevolent one. 

So if there was a creator, I don't think it's nice. 

If there is a true God, then I don't think it's responsible for this. Maybe it doesn't have anything to do with the material world. 

 

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Supposing for a moment that there is a YHVH and a Satan and archons. 

The way the story goes, YHVH would have been responsible for creating the Satan and the archons, so they would obviously be in service to it.

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8 minutes ago, ChaosRose said:

You can find some good things in the OT as well. It's just that there's a whole lot more stuff that could be attributed to a demiurge. 

There's a lot of pain and suffering. Everything has to survive by eating everything else. Everything is flawed.

It doesn't seem like the work of a perfect being, or even a benevolent one. 

So if there was a creator, I don't think it's nice. 

If there is a true God, then I don't think it's responsible for this. Maybe it doesn't have anything to do with the material world. 

This is my quote from another thread about a possible role of a Demiurge as a creator of a physical universe, maybe it is flawed but maybe its interesting;

Quote

What comes to my mind is the nature of the physical universe itself. Is it really meant to be a prison or is this entrapment really a necessary condition for free will. In other words if there is no opposition and thus no choice between the two opposites which we call "good and evil" there wouldn't be a potential for individual growth of a soul since it would all be pre-determined. Is material manifestation and Duality which proceeds from it only a necessity for a free will, and thus a part of original plan of a true higher God?

 

 

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Well, if we were (as the gnostics say) already spirit and in union with the divine...what was the point of separating us? 

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16 minutes ago, ChaosRose said:

Supposing for a moment that there is a YHVH and a Satan and archons. 

The way the story goes, YHVH would have been responsible for creating the Satan and the archons, so they would obviously be in service to it.

The more I think about this things the more I get a perhaps an insane notion that Demiurge (Satan) is somewhat analogous (in a view to a Godhead) to what Carl Jung called a Shadow archetype of a human psyche in humans.And since a human being is according to occult teachings a microcosm - maybe it has some sense.

Edited by Mr. Argon

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1 minute ago, Mr. Argon said:

The more I think about this things the more i get a perhaps an insane notion that Demiurge (Satan) is somewhat analogous (in a view to a Godhead) to what Carl Jung called a Shadow archetype of a human psyche in humans.

I think that's really what Blavatsky was on about.

Archons (if that's what you want to call them) seem to have a lot to do with the pysche.

Edited by ChaosRose
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People don't realize how apt the term "inner demons" is. 

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1 minute ago, ChaosRose said:

I think that's really what Blavatsky was on about.

Yes. I thinks she was, and I think it is an interesting idea to say at least.

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9 minutes ago, ChaosRose said:

Well, if we were (as the gnostics say) already spirit and in union with the divine...what was the point of separating us?

This is a crucial question. Been pondering it myself. What is the point? The point of manifestation is perhaps only a point of a cosmic dance. Perhaps a macabre one from one perspective, but perhaps a wonderful and magical one from another.

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Just now, Mr. Argon said:

This is a crucial question. Been pondering it myself. What is the point? The point of manifestation is perhaps only a point of a cosmic dance. Perhaps a macabre one from one perspective, but perhaps a wonderful and magical one from another.

Depends on the experiences.

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You start getting this picture in mind that is much like Dark City...with people arbitrarily being placed in various dilemmas. Sometimes being privileged, sometimes being destitute, etc.

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Like this, only with maybe different lifetimes.

It still wipes our minds each time, though, lest we actually learn something.

Edited by ChaosRose

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1 minute ago, ChaosRose said:

You start getting this picture in mind that is much like Dark City...with people arbitrarily being placed in various dilemmas. Sometimes being privileged, sometimes being destitute, etc.

The story goes like this. God as Unity contemplated itself and created Duality by casting it's own shadow (Satan). This is a biblical fall. From it proceeds all this dance of a Universe in all its horrors and glory.

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Just now, Mr. Argon said:

The story goes like this. God as Unity contemplated itself and created Duality by casting it's own shadow (Satan). This is a biblical fall. From it proceeds all this dance of a Universe in all its horrors and glory.

Or something less than God somehow stole sparks of divinity and cast them into an Earthly prison so it could have a cosmic ant farm.

 

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5 minutes ago, ChaosRose said:

Or something less than God somehow stole sparks of divinity and cast them into an Earthly prison so it could have a cosmic ant farm.

I guess that is worthy of discussion. But I can't really grasp it at the moment.

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YHVH often seems juvenile. Kinda like the teen that gets into Dad's wallet, and then all manner of chaos ensues.

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3 minutes ago, ChaosRose said:

YHVH often seems juvenile. Kinda like the teen that gets into Dad's wallet, and then all manner of chaos ensues.

He buys a rubber doll for night fun, and Christian fundamenalist Dad doesn't think it's funny?

Edited by Mr. Argon
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1 minute ago, Mr. Argon said:

He buys a rubber doll for night fun, and Christian fundamenalist Dad doesn't think it's funny?

LOL.

Except in this case, went and created the universe.

Edited by ChaosRose

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And the true God facepalms and says...I told you you couldn't have pets.

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13 minutes ago, ChaosRose said:

Except in this case, went and created the universe.

You are a dancing queen...

(I mean the Universe :su?)

Edited by Mr. Argon
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3 minutes ago, Mr. Argon said:

You are a dancing queen...

Feel the beat from mah tambourine...

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1 minute ago, ChaosRose said:

Feel the beat from mah tambourine...

Oh yeah.

You can dance.

Edited by Mr. Argon

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13 minutes ago, Mr. Argon said:

tambourine...

I heard that in ancient times this instrument was played by females. Maybe it's symbolic.

Edited by Mr. Argon

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4 minutes ago, Mr. Argon said:

I heard that in ancient times this instrument was an instrument females played. Maybe it's symbolic.

We're not allowed to play it now?

Someone should have told me.

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