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Rinna

The EU signs deal to unite their military

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From:  https://qz.com/1127984/eu-army-bloc-forging-ahead-with-its-military-integration-to-shake-off-us-dependence/

It took 70 years, but the European Union finally signed a pact today (Nov. 13) agreeing to integrate military funding, weapons development, and deployment of European defenses. In a way, creating a unified mega army.

Edited by Rinna
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The foundation for the creation of a European Republic.

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The end goal of the EU is to have Europe became one country. It' why yhe UK left 

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Germany finally gets to control Europe, third time is a charm!

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this oughta be interestin...

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Remember kids the Guardian is a bastion of truth and virtue

"Claims from the leave side about moves to unify Europe’s armed forces are nothing more than fantasy"

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/27/is-there-a-secret-plan-to-create-an-eu-army

There are so many juicy quotes to use but I won't post anymore. Makes no difference this article was from May 2016 it was common knowledge even then that Juncker was looking to unite the military.

Remember kids Nigel Farage is a bad man and  liar

"Pro-EU establishment not telling the truth - European Union pushing for a full EU army."

 

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9 hours ago, Rinna said:

 

35 minutes ago, likwidlite said:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/27/is-there-a-secret-plan-to-create-an-eu-army

There are so many juicy quotes to use but I won't post anymore.

 

 

awww I like juicy quotes :) --- for example from your link --

" But, contrary to reports, it will not propose an EU army. “There is absolutely no plan to set up an EU army with the global strategy,” a spokeswoman for Mogherini said."
 

and from Rinna's link

EU foreign policy chief Federica Mogherini, called the pact “historic."

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I heard somewhere that the announcement about a EU army was deliberately delayed because of the UK referendum -

They knew it could swing the vote to Leave - 

As it happened Leave won the day anyway in spite of relentless fear mongering - so perhaps the announcement is a sign
that the EU is accepting that the UK really is going to leave - so now they can come out and say it - ?

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:D So entertaining! Don't you people know that under the Lisbon Treaty the creation of a unified EU army requires UNANIMOUS agreement of all member states. Ireland is not, and will not be, joining any such army. Thiis new agreement between 23 of the 27 is about pooling procurement budgets for military resources.

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This won't happen because there are to many arguments as to which country will be top dog, I can't see France letting Germany be uber alles, and some countries have long memories about what happened to them in WW 2. 

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20 minutes ago, Ozymandias said:

:D So entertaining! Don't you people know that under the Lisbon Treaty the creation of a unified EU army requires UNANIMOUS agreement of all member states. Ireland is not, and will not be, joining any such army. Thiis new agreement between 23 of the 27 is about pooling procurement budgets for military resources.

Call it what you like, but the lack of participation of the three fringe countries including two Island nations leaves a solid block and tantamount to Franco-German military hegemony. It all hinges on the commitment of these two countries--especially Germany--to address and remedy the current state of their appallingly inadequate conventional military infrastructure. A lack of genuine resolve from either will render the agreement little more than window dressing.

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23 minutes ago, Ozymandias said:

:D So entertaining! Don't you people know that under the Lisbon Treaty the creation of a unified EU army requires UNANIMOUS agreement of all member states. Ireland is not, and will not be, joining any such army. Thiis new agreement between 23 of the 27 is about pooling procurement budgets for military resources.

 

well it took TWO referendums for Ireland to ratify the Lisbon Treaty - 

maybe it will take 2 or 3 to agree to be in the EU Army..?

I expect if Ireland refuses to contribute to the EU army the EU will try to make some concessions to keep Ireland in -

Or perhaps it can't back down on the EU army (like the open borders) and it will be the  driving force for Ireland to Leave - ?

I'm sorry but if you think Ireland can stop the creation of an EU army I think you are mistaken -

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Ireland is not joining an EU army. We have been internationally neutral since we held the Presidency of the League of Nations in the 1930s. We are the country of choice for UN peace-keeping troops and have sacrificed nearly 100 of our military in that role.

As a small country we have no military power and don't want any. Our military is a defence force only. We would not be able to deter or fight off a military invasion but we would make life hell for any occupying force.

Right now under EU treaty agreements we have a veto on the establishment of an EU army. And we would need a referendum here to change our neutrality status.

Regarding our two bites at a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty, the first time our electorate was stampeded by a media 'fear campaign' into rejecting it - very much like what happened with the Brexit referendum in the UK in 2016. The second time around we had a much more rounded and informed national debate where the pros and cons were objectively debated and the treaty was accepted. Hence, today, we have a veto on agreeing to, or joining, an EU army.

This thread is typical of all the other 'fake news' and exaggerated bias against the EU. The quality of the journalism in some newspapers is shameful. Their banner headlines are not borne out by the FACTS. Is it any wonder that their gullible readership is helplessly indoctrinated. Their editors and writers have no pride in their profession but prostitute it to their own political prejudices and misinform by sensationalising and manipulating the facts.

Edited by Ozymandias
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What is the problem with European Countries that want a European army having one  - eventually. Might be a good counter balance to other forces internationally.

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2 hours ago, bee said:

I'm sorry but if you think Ireland can stop the creation of an EU army I think you are mistaken -

You are right, they can't - but they don't have to join it or finance it either.

If it went to a referendum in Ireland and I, as an Irish citizen was allowed to vote - I would vote in favour of joining - even though that runs counter to the countries historical neutrality

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44 minutes ago, RAyMO said:

What is the problem with European Countries that want a European army having one  - eventually. Might be a good counter balance to other forces internationally.

I thoroughly get that the UK wants out of the EU. What I object to is it's being painted as some kind of malignant undemocratic empire-in-waiting, if it is not already being described as such.

What I think is happening is that the tiny majority of Brexit supporters are engaged in a media war to persuade the Remainers to come over to their camp but the battle-lines have hardened. Instead of reasoned persuasion it's naked propaganda and people of a less critical bent are allowing their emotion to tip the balance for them, especially if they feel the system has been less than kind to them.

Edited by Ozymandias

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3 hours ago, Ozymandias said:

 Thiis new agreement between 23 of the 27 is about pooling procurement budgets for military resources.

1

So creating a joint EU Military then. This has nothing to do with Brexit propaganda, you're right about the fake new though.  The fact that plans for a joint EU military had been denied time after time by the EU and the vast majority of MSM. Yet here we are with 85% of the EU members signing a treaty designed to integrate military funding, weapons development, and deployment of European defenses. Not to mention the budget of  5 billion euros to start.

Edited by likwidlite
added budget text
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4 hours ago, likwidlite said:

So creating a joint EU Military then. This has nothing to do with Brexit propaganda, you're right about the fake new though.  The fact that plans for a joint EU military had been denied time after time by the EU and the vast majority of MSM. Yet here we are with 85% of the EU members signing a treaty designed to integrate military funding, weapons development, and deployment of European defenses. Not to mention the budget of  5 billion euros to start.

And it is a logical and good idea.

In decades to come it may even end up with a military to match the USA. The Balance of Power is changing Europe needs to be properly positioned on its own terms.

Edited by RAyMO

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As a German I have to say that I`m (again) highly astonished about some comments here as I cannot comprehend the reasons why plans and actions by the German government and/or the EU automatically lead to comments related to the Germany of 1933-45. I think that people who do so have no idea about todays Germany and its todays values especially related to peace, human rights and social aspects. Its too often ignored, intentional or just by stupidity, that the current German level is miles above the level, e.g., of a country that claims for itself to be the land of freedom, but which does not prohibit the use of nazi signs like the swastika and SS runes in public and allow domestic nazi freaks to make lots of money with books, DVDs and lectures about the "Holocaust denial".

Shame on you, ignoramuses.

Edited by toast
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Why does the EU have to go down this route of integrated military funding, weapons development, and deployment of European defences when all this is currently possible under NATO. 

Its clear the EU craves, needs all the powers of a single state. A single currency, A central bank and A single military. The urgency for the latter was highlighted by the failed foreign policy and expansion into Ukraine. when EU soft power came up against Russian soft power, a tug-of-war ensued and was only ended when Russian military hard power rolled in. The EU had no answer and had to rely on NATO to bolster the boarders and so Europe's defence.

The EU is on a march to becoming a Federation. if it wants to acquire a single EU army along the way then it will achieve it. - none of the vassal states which are members of the EU are going to stop that march, those countries are at the behest of whatever the powers decide.

 

 

 

 

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It astonished you that only days after Remembrance Sunday the EU announced it is making major strides to create a united military, even after years of denying it, and that some people may be wary of certain countries being at the helm of a massive military complex. Then have the audacity to call them ignoramuses. 

Edit. Just to add. I've read through the thread twice now and the only mention of Germany during the war was you. 

Edited by likwidlite

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31 minutes ago, likwidlite said:

Edit. Just to add. I've read through the thread twice now and the only mention of Germany during the war was you. 

To be fair I think you may need a third read:

20 hours ago, Rinna said:

Germany finally gets to control Europe, third time is a charm!

 

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12 minutes ago, likwidlite said:

It astonished you that only days after Remembrance Sunday the EU announced it is making major strides to create a united military, even after years of denying it, and that some people may be wary of certain countries being at the helm of a massive military complex. Then have the audacity to call them ignoramuses. 

To connect an announcement of an idea with a past day of remembrance is a little paranoid and smells like numerology. But dont get me wrong here, I have no disrespect for the british day of remembrance, on the contrary.

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7 minutes ago, Grey Area said:

To be fair I think you may need a third read:

Exactly. And take a look on post #10:

10 hours ago, spud the mackem said:

This won't happen because there are to many arguments as to which country will be top dog, I can't see France letting Germany be uber alles, and some countries have long memories about what happened to them in WW 2. 

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11 hours ago, Ozymandias said:

:D So entertaining! Don't you people know that under the Lisbon Treaty the creation of a unified EU army requires UNANIMOUS agreement of all member states. Ireland is not, and will not be, joining any such army. Thiis new agreement between 23 of the 27 is about pooling procurement budgets for military resources.

History suggests you wiII  do as you are toId, however many referendums it takes :(

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