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Possible Thunderbird Sighting in NW Iowa


gocubsgo20

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Hi there,

I'm a 23 year old, first-year medical student and have been meaning to share my experience two years ago for awhile now, but haven't had the time. Well, I'm on break now and figured what the heck, might as well. Anyways, I'll tell my story and hopefully someone can help me make a bit of sense of it.

Two years ago, during late July in Okoboji, IA, I saw what I believed to be two thunderbirds. I've always had a fascination with cryptozoology, but up until then I never had any field experience to talk about. Anyways, it was around 2:00-3:00 pm in the afternoon and I was laying on the back of a boat on the lake looking up at the sky. I noticed two incredibly large birds flying, and observed them glide through the sky at an astounding height. I have no good way to estimate the height, but it was higher than a two passenger plane that often flies around the lake. I alerted my GF's father and he too was dumbfounded at the size of these birds. We stared in awe for a few seconds when he remembered that he keeps a set of binoculars on the boat and quickly grabbed them. We took turns looking at the birds and I've NEVER seen any bird like this. It looked similar to a condor, but was ALL black. There wasn't a light spot on these birds. They glided through the air and didn't once flap their wings. These birds were absolutely massive, I've seen condors, eagles, and turkey vultures before, but these were easily 2-3 size those other birds. The next day, around the same time, we saw another two birds flying in the exact direction as the day before. I have no way of knowing if these two birds were the same as the original birds, but they looked identical. 

Anyways, I thought I would share this and see what other people think of it. I wish I took an ornithology class in college, but my expertise lies with humans. I'm more than willing to answer any specific questions anyone has. Thanks for reading!

Edited by gocubsgo20
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My cousin in eastern Iowa says he saw a black bird that stood as tall as the tractor he was driving. He'd never heard of Thunderbirds until I showed him a thread here on UM after he told me of his incident. And a few years ago, there was an alleged sighting in the Ames area.

 

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1 hour ago, gocubsgo20 said:

I'm more than willing to answer any specific questions anyone has. Thanks for reading!

Don't take this as an attack it isn't, it's a fair question based on your background as you've chosen to volunteer it.

You say you're a first year medical student, but you're 23, so that means you've almost certainly got some significant science based qualification already, so why is it that any of the necessary critical and analytical skills that you must have developed to get where you say you are completely absent from your post? 

Edited by oldrover
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2 minutes ago, oldrover said:

Don't take this as an attack it isn't, it's a fair question based on your background as you've chosen to volunteer it.

You say you're a first year medical student, but you're 23, so that means you've almost certainly got some significant science based qualification already, so why is it that any of the necessary critical and analytical skills that you must have developed to get where you say you are completely absent from your post? 

I'm not well versed in zoology, let alone cryptozoology. I'm not sure what analytical skills I could've employed given I have zero background in ornithology. I chose to use outside resources i.e. this forum to share my story and let others with potentially more knowledge on thunderbirds analyze the sighting. I assure you, I am a first-year medical student and you are correct in saying that I have highly developed critical and analytical skills. However, I'm also wise not to analyze things and situations of which I have little knowledge on. To do that would've been very ignorant of me. 

 

I could've done research on thunderbirds and birds, but, as you can imagine, my time is spread thin with other subjects. This leads back to my original point, I posted on this forum for others to use their expertise in a critical and analytical way. Maybe that's not the way things are typically done around here, and if that's the case I apologize. But, I clearly stated in my post that I was looking for help. This indicates that I have little knowledge on the situation. I chose to include my background as a way to "verify" that I'm a clear thinker and logical person.

 

Now, if you have any insight on thunderbirds, I would love to hear what you know and have to share. But, if you chose to reply simply to point that I failed to critically analyze my sighting, then politely leave the thread. 

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2 hours ago, gocubsgo20 said:

These birds were absolutely massive, I've seen condors, eagles, and turkey vultures before, but these were easily 2-3 size those other birds.

Since there are just over 200 condors in the wild, where have you seen a condor before?

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4 minutes ago, Likely Guy said:

Since there are just over 200 condors in the wild, where have you seen a condor before?

Zoo actually. Not the same as the wild, but I remember it well enough.

 

Edit: after rereading my original post, I should've included that. Thanks for setting that straight. The bird I saw, though, looked nothing like the condor I saw in the zoo, specifically the head. This bird's head didn't look (excuse my ignorance if this is incorrect terminology) bald like the condors. Plus, it's beak was huge in comparison to a condors. 

Edited by gocubsgo20
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1 hour ago, simplybill said:

My cousin in eastern Iowa says he saw a black bird that stood as tall as the tractor he was driving. He'd never heard of Thunderbirds until I showed him a thread here on UM after he told me of his incident. And a few years ago, there was an alleged sighting in the Ames area.

 

Interesting, thanks for sharing. Have you or anyone you know done any digging into thunderbirds?

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6 minutes ago, gocubsgo20 said:

Interesting, thanks for sharing. Have you or anyone you know done any digging into thunderbirds?

There's a thread here on UM that started two or three years ago, but I don't remember the title of the thread. I'll look for it.

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3 minutes ago, gocubsgo20 said:

Now, if you have any insight on thunderbirds, I would love to hear what you know and have to share. But, if you chose to reply simply to point that I failed to critically analyze my sighting, then politely leave the thread. 

Hi gocubsgo20, and thanks for you're reply. I'm going to start though by pointing out that as you've chosen to tell us about your level of education, to as you say demonstrate 'that I'm a clear thinker and logical person'. if what you say contradicts that, which your post has, it makes mine a valid observation to make. So, instead of politely leaving the thread, I'll instead politely point out why such lapses cast serious doubt on the veracity of what you're saying. And you don't get to ask people to leave threads here. 

As yours is a post based on a personal experience, rather than a request for information on the subject in general, before going into the thunderbird and whether such an animal does or even could exist, it's first more important to take a look at your account as you presented it, to see if there's any need to go that far. 

You've said, 

2 hours ago, gocubsgo20 said:

it was around 2:00-3:00 pm in the afternoon and I was laying on the back of a boat on the lake looking up at the sky. I noticed two incredibly large birds flying, and observed them glide through the sky at an astounding height. I have no good way to estimate the height, but it was higher than a two passenger plane that often flies around the lake.

You, given your background, must realise that this isn't a convincing statement. Breaking it down, you say you were lying on your back on a boat in a lake looking up into the sky, so presumably, there were no cues visible to help you judge either height or distance. And you admit that you had no way of estimating height, yet you say that the birds were 'incredibly large', even though any estimate of size would be completely dependent on distance. Do you see where my problem is yet? You then go on to say that they were higher than the 'two passenger plane' which flies over the lake, again do you see why this is problematic, how could you possibly know this? Your estimate of the plane's height is based solely on the size it appears to be when you view it. Or am I missing something? Do you have some other way of estimating altitude? If so please say as it'd be very helpful. 

2 hours ago, gocubsgo20 said:

I alerted my GF's father and he too was dumbfounded at the size of these birds. We stared in awe for a few seconds when he remembered that he keeps a set of binoculars on the boat and quickly grabbed them. We took turns looking at the birds and I've NEVER seen any bird like this. It looked similar to a condor, but was ALL black. There wasn't a light spot on these birds. 

Again, there are flaws here in identifying these as exceptionally large birds. For a start one of the most important considerations would be what the light conditions were at the time of the sighting? That'll have affected the colour the animals appeared. So there's no way of knowing whether your impression of their being all black was correct or not, so we can't exclude any similar species based on this. The binoculars are also an issue, what sort were they, were they focused properly?  You see binoculars are not just a universal way of suddenly seeing distant objects closely. 

Thing is, none of the objections above are based on ornithology, cryptozoology, or zoology, they're basic and very elementary questions anyone with a scientific background would naturally ask themselves. I hope you can see now why I feel it necessary to question whether you're version of you're background is born out in your account. 

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gocubsgo20 - the search function doesn't seem to be working. However, I scrolled through the cryptozoology topics and found one topic about the alleged pteranodon photo from the civil war, but nothing specifically about the bird you describe.

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3 minutes ago, oldrover said:

Hi gocubsgo20, and thanks for you're reply. I'm going to start though by pointing out that as you've chosen to tell us about your level of education, to as you say demonstrate 'that I'm a clear thinker and logical person'. if what you say contradicts that, which your post has, it makes mine a valid observation to make. So, instead of politely leaving the thread, I'll instead politely point out why such lapses cast serious doubt on the veracity of what you're saying. And you don't get to ask people to leave threads here. 

As yours is a post based on a personal experience, rather than a request for information on the subject in general, before going into the thunderbird and whether such an animal does or even could exist, it's first more important to take a look at your account as you presented it, to see if there's any need to go that far. 

You've said, 

You, given your background, must realise that this isn't a convincing statement. Breaking it down, you say you were lying on your back on a boat in a lake looking up into the sky, so presumably, there were no cues visible to help you judge either height or distance. And you admit that you had no way of estimating height, yet you say that the birds were 'incredibly large', even though any estimate of size would be completely dependent on distance. Do you see where my problem is yet? You then go on to say that they were higher than the 'two passenger plane' which flies over the lake, again do you see why this is problematic, how could you possibly know this? Your estimate of the plane's height is based solely on the size it appears to be when you view it. Or am I missing something? Do you have some other way of estimating altitude? If so please say as it'd be very helpful. 

Again, there are flaws here in identifying these as exceptionally large birds. For a start one of the most important considerations would be what the light conditions were at the time of the sighting? That'll have affected the colour the animals appeared. So there's no way of knowing whether your impression of their being all black was correct or not, so we can't exclude any similar species based on this. The binoculars are also an issue, what sort were they, were they focused properly?  You see binoculars are not just a universal way of suddenly seeing distant objects closely. 

Thing is, none of the objections above are based on ornithology, cryptozoology, or zoology, they're basic and very elementary questions anyone with a scientific background would naturally ask themselves. I hope you can see now why I feel it necessary to question whether you're version of you're background is born out in your account. 

I get the feeling that you're here to prove your own knowledge is greater than mine, and that's okay, but I'm here asking a simple question. I appreciate you talking me through the scientific inquiry process, though, it's refreshing. You see, I felt disrespected after your original post. This is why I asked you to leave the thread. I came here with no knowledge on the subject, only a story of a sighting. You didn't question my sighting, instead you questioned my intelligence. That is a disrespectful thing to do. I'll repeat it, I'm ignorant with respect to all this (ornithology, cryptozoology) and was genuinely hoping for some insight, not for someone to insult my intelligence. I do, however, appreciate you pointing out some of the flaws in my original post. That is something I can actually respond to and have a discussion about. Why not start the thread that way? Why not say 'hello, I have a few questions..' and jump right into said questions? 

 

I've seen other birds in the area before, from a similar vantage point. None flew as high as these, yet these looked much larger at a higher altitude. Some of the other birds I've seen in the area were eagles and turkey vultures, but these birds flew at a much higher altitude than the previous birds I've seen. I have no way of quantifying any of this to appease you, so I'm not sure what other evidence is commonly used. 

 

With respect to the plane, the plane was flying around the lake at the exact moment I was watching the birds fly. I could tell that the birds were at a much higher altitude as the plane flew what seemed to be a couple hundred feet below them. 

 

The sun was bright that day with no clouds in the sky. The binoculars were an old goodwill pair, but I can assure you they were focused properly. The binoculars allowed me to view of the coloration of the bird. It was absolutely all black, not a different color to it. As an aside, you'll have to forgive my ignorance with binoculars. I'm much better versed in microscopy and the microbial world. 

 

I can assure you I've asked myself many of the same questions before. But, I have no way of quantifying anything and was unsure how to present my topic. I hope we can engage in useful discussion from here on out. 

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57 minutes ago, gocubsgo20 said:

Zoo actually. Not the same as the wild, but I remember it well enough.

 

Edit: after rereading my original post, I should've included that. Thanks for setting that straight. The bird I saw, though, looked nothing like the condor I saw in the zoo, specifically the head. This bird's head didn't look (excuse my ignorance if this is incorrect terminology) bald like the condors. Plus, it's beak was huge in comparison to a condors. 

Flying higher than a 2 passenger plane you see there....You could make out the head of these birds through binoculars?

What make of binoculars, and what power?....And no tripod? Pretty good at stabilizing them on a boat, let alone land, to see the head of a birds details. ( not sure that is even possible honestly)
 

Edited by Sakari
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56 minutes ago, gocubsgo20 said:

I can assure you I've asked myself many of the same questions before. But, I have no way of quantifying anything and was unsure how to present my topic. I hope we can engage in useful discussion from here on out. 

Of course, but I'm not trying to prove my knowledge is greater than yours, nor to insult your intelligence.  I do raise valid objections when I see them though.

I respect the fact that you say you have no knowledge of this subject, so don't take anything I say amiss, it's not meant that way. Speaking purely from a biological perspective; of the three types of bird you mention above, excluding the eagle for which there are too many different sized species, the turkey vulture has about a six foot wingspan, and the both species of condor have about a ten foot wingspan, so any bird two to three times larger than this are between the largest living flying bird's wingspan to greatly exceding the size of any known flying bird in the fossil record. The largest being an albatross like bird from the Oligocene with a wingspan of about 24' and a condor like bird from the Miocene with around a 20' span. And those are probably at the upper limit for a flying bird, note that's specifically bird. There have been much larger Pterosaurs but they used different mechanisms to get airbourne, probably.

The only close candidate for your estimate is the Condor, which might be around twice the size of a turkey vulture your smallest estimate, but whuch are incredibly rare and I don't think woukd likely have been in Iowa. Otherwise there's nothing known that could approach your size estimates. But yet there are the stories of the thunderbirds. Huge flying animals, described very differently across the many accounts, and which leave no trace, and are very rarely seen. 

So, as someone who's entering into a life of evidence based practise what seems like the most likely explanation to you? That there's a huge unkown species in the skies of the U.S, or that like I think you've done, and I might add  know I've done, people just aren't very good at making objective and accurate measurements of distant objects without any supporting visual cues and little previous experience of what they're seeing to help them make sense of it and interpret it accurately. We are though very good at convincing ourselves we can't be mistaken. As I say I've certainly fallen into this trap. Estimating the size of flying objects is notoriously difficult, and it's in these errors that the thunderbirds can be found. 

Edited by oldrover
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This is the reported sighting in Iowa in 2013:

http://whatliesbeyond.boards.net/thread/212/thunderbird-sighting-iowa

Even though my instincts tell me that most crypto sightings are likely misidentifications, after hearing my cousin’s story I now take an interest in alleged thunderbird sightings. He was obviously reluctant to talk about it (fearing ridicule), and that made his story more credible for me. He’d never heard of ‘thunderbirds’ until I told him that his description matched those I’ve read here on UM and other places. He appeared relieved to learn of other alleged sightings.

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10 hours ago, gocubsgo20 said:

Two years ago, during late July in Okoboji, IA, I saw what I believed to be two thunderbirds. I've always had a fascination with cryptozoology,

and this is 'why' you see them-- end of strangeness, imo 

Edited by Dejarma
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One of the few cryptids I can still believe in. I originally joined um 11 years ago because I had seen the infamous thunderbird photo and wanted to know if more had seen it or not, to my surprise it was an urban legend, and since that day in the library, I’ve never seen the same photo. Interesting account. I understand the speculation in height but if op spent a lot of time on boats, you learn to gauge distance fairly well (as in below the clouds, above planes, I know it’s not 100% without references but you learn to get pretty close). 

 

Going over twice I’m not sure of though. That suggests a regular flight path. And only you’ve seen them? 

 

I’d recommend going back and watching the skies for a bit, maybe you’ll catch something amazing, maybe you’ll realize it was a condor. After 2 years whatever it is could easily be gone but you never know. 

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10 minutes ago, Cryptid_Control said:

One of the few cryptids I can still believe in. I originally joined um 11 years ago because I had seen the infamous thunderbird photo and wanted to know if more had seen it or not, to my surprise it was an urban legend, and since that day in the library, I’ve never seen the same photo.

Ive become convinced the famous thunderbird photo is a victim of 'the mandela affect' 

 

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We have Bald Eagles and other large birds here in Northern Oregon and I see them pretty regularly. It is amazing how BIG an eagle looks when it is flying. You'd swear they have a 12 foot wingspan and could grab up a steer. 

I'm not saying that a monster bird wasn't seen, but I know that birds appear bigger in the sky, where the distances are so much harder to figure out clearly. 

Edited by DieChecker
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3 hours ago, Farmer77 said:

Ive become convinced the famous thunderbird photo is a victim of 'the mandela affect' 

 

Is that the one with the confederate soldiers?

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8 minutes ago, Sir Wearer of Hats said:

Is that the one with the confederate soldiers?

Off the top of my head I want to say it was just 5 or 6 'cowboys' standing in front of a barn with the bird nailed to the side of it and the bird's wings stretched out covering nearly the entire building. It absolutely could have been soldiers though, its a vague memory for me (shocker LOL) 

 

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Some of the popular alleged thunderbird photos.

Image result for crypto thunderbirdImage result for crypto thunderbirdImage result for crypto thunderbird

Edited by simplybill
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