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bigjim36

Why do people believe the bible?

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Habitat
1 hour ago, danydandan said:

You can say what you 'meant' all you like, your history of ostentatiousness is always going to follow you around, unfortunately for you. 

I don't believe anything you say about your person or personal life anymore, and I'm not the only one. So stick to the opinions and stop with the anecdotes. Or not I couldn't care less, the only ability you have is to off-topic every thread by adding extraordinary claims or unsupported anecdotal nonsense. You know that these claims elicit a certain response and you revel in these responses. Then cry foul when someone questions your delusions of grandeur.

Still can't see you were blinded by your  previous judgements of him ? What he said was completely harmless.

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danydandan
14 minutes ago, Habitat said:

Still can't see you were blinded by your  previous judgements of him ? What he said was completely harmless.

Yeah of course my opinion is coloured by his past antics that's what everyone does, he has build a persona, built upon ostentatiousness, delusions of grandeur and waffling. Therefore everything he says has that tinge to me. 

Put this way, Habitat do you in your life know someone who is a liar? If said person, known to be a liar, told you a story would their history not colour your opinion of this story? Or would you just believe it without question? 

Would you go to the same car dealership that ripped you off, again to get another car? 

You might do, who knows, but you'd be a fool if you did. People do not change. Like my past comments colour your opinion of me and thus my future comments too,.

Edited by danydandan
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Habitat
4 minutes ago, danydandan said:

Yeah of course my opinion is coloured by his past antics that's what everyone does, he has build a persona, built upon ostentatiousness, delusions of grandeur and waffling. Therefore everything he says has that tinge to me. 

Put this way, Habitat do you in your life know someone who is a liar? If said person, known to be a liar, told you a story would their history not colour your opinion of this story? Or would you just believe it without question? 

Would you go to the same car dealership that ripped you off? 

You might do, who knows, but you'd be a fool if you did. People do not change.

I'm not sure what the "lies" you've catalogued are, but if you are that annoyed, you can always just ignore him.

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danydandan
4 minutes ago, Habitat said:

I'm not sure what the "lies" you've catalogued are, but if you are that annoyed, you can always just ignore him.

I'm not calling him a liar, I am asking you if a persons past comments colour your opinion of them?  If they do then they colour how you interpret their comments now and in the future. 

If no, then I can't help you.

Edited by danydandan
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Habitat
1 minute ago, danydandan said:

I'm not calling him a liar, I asking you if a persons past comments colour your opinion of them? 

If I know I've been deceived, of course I don't have a good opinion ! But it isn't the end of the world, considering nothing of great importance is at stake.

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danydandan
11 minutes ago, Habitat said:

If I know I've been deceived, of course I don't have a good opinion ! But it isn't the end of the world, considering nothing of great importance is at stake.

I agree nothing is at stake.

But do not agree that I'm entitled to my opinion based on past comments made by MrWalker? 

Specifically the grandiose claims of intellectual abilities? 

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Habitat
2 minutes ago, danydandan said:

I agree nothing is at stake.

But do not agree that I'm entitled to my opinion based on past comments made by MrWalker? 

Specifically the grandiose claims of intellectual abilities? 

He does write pretty well, in a fashion that is generally easy to read, but I can't read long tracts I'm not really interested in. I am perplexed that people get upset about him, though, he seems benign enough to me, I must be missing the zingers hidden in those walls of text !

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danydandan
16 minutes ago, Habitat said:

He does write pretty well, in a fashion that is generally easy to read, but I can't read long tracts I'm not really interested in. I am perplexed that people get upset about him, though, he seems benign enough to me, I must be missing the zingers hidden in those walls of text !

He claims to be an English teacher once upon a time, he makes so many grammatical errors it erodes any plausibility of this claim. Of course secondary English teachers aren't infallible but the amount if errors speaks volumes. 

We once had a private debate on the definition of the word fact, I emailed Oxford English dictionary for their definition, he rejected it as it didn't agree with him. But anyways.

Getting upset about his claims or opinions is rather silly, but doesn't mean others, myself or you can't question them and ask for some sort of substantial evidence to justify his claim. He then gets upset (yeah the guy who claims not to feel negative emotions gets upset) when he can't produce any evidence and cries foul when he is called out on it or when is anecdotal evidence isn't universally accepted.

Edit: He might seem benign, but he isn't. This website is great for providing checks and balances to discussion. If everyone just ignored his claims all the time, I'd suspect he disappear. Generally I don't read his comments unless he is replying to me or someone else, as he is on the ole ignore list. If I see something that I feel needs addressing I'll comment on it. Like the ignorance he has on the topic of Catholicism Canon Law. 

Edited by danydandan
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Habitat

Well, it does seem rather comical at times, the way he gets a rise out of people, and I don't think he has that intention.

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danydandan
1 minute ago, Habitat said:

Well, it does seem rather comical at times, the way he gets a rise out of people, and I don't think he has that intention.

He either is a complete idiot, or he knows what elicits a certain response and he posts comments to rise such responses. He has been here for ten years or more doing the same thing over and over again. Guess he doesn't learn.

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Habitat
12 minutes ago, danydandan said:

He either is a complete idiot, or he knows what elicits a certain response and he posts comments to rise such responses. He has been here for ten years or more doing the same thing over and over again. Guess he doesn't learn.

Don't know, he isn't responsible for the reactions of others entirely, or even largely, but it continues to amuse that he has devout "anti-adherents" !

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psyche101
7 hours ago, Habitat said:

As I say,  another grub to join a team of grubs, idly accusing me of lying. Guess on, grub.

No guessing about it. The posts asking you to prove otherwise are still there. 

So.... Still better ain't it old fella ;)

 

 

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danydandan
7 minutes ago, Habitat said:

Don't know, he isn't responsible for the reactions of others entirely, or even largely, but it continues to amuse that he has devout "anti-adherents" !

That's true, more the fool us who respond in personal attacks. 

I'm at odds whether calling him ostentatious is a personal attack, considering he thinks being modest is abhorrent.

Edited by danydandan
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Habitat
28 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

The posts asking you to prove otherwise are still there.

Prove what ?

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Stubbly_Dooright

 Hey guys!? :st

 Despite my lurking, and my reading this thread, probably up to this point, a question just occurred to me. 

  Has the question been answered, why do people believe in the Bible? I can’t tell, and can’t remember, if the question was answered throughout this 65 page thread.

 Maybe, I might have remembered some people say they believe  parts of the Bible, and some believe all of it. The big question for me is, has anyone admitted to believing all of the Bible? 

And, how do they do that honestly? This question came to me from my memory of a couple books like the one where the Author lived biblically for a year.

 I had not read that book, but based on the synopsis it look like how the author proved how you really can’t do that honestly. So it makes me wonder, who does believe all of it and do they live it? And the ones who believe parts of it, how do they feel about believing And living in what they believe?

 This makes me think about that, as well as I read various posters thoughts and understanding of what the Bible says. And also makes me wonder, those who live what they believe, do they see the conundrum of it?

 

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Jodie.Lynne
6 minutes ago, Stubbly_Dooright said:

Has the question been answered, why do people believe in the Bible?

Nope. It turned into a "my ego is bigger than yours" discussion.

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eight bits
25 minutes ago, Stubbly_Dooright said:

 Maybe, I might have remembered some people say they believe  parts of the Bible, and some believe all of it. The big question for me is, has anyone admitted to believing all of the Bible? 

Not yet, but we have one active poster who believes another book that "complements" the Bible.

27 minutes ago, Stubbly_Dooright said:

 I had not read that book, but based on the synopsis it look like how the author proved how you really can’t do that honestly.

Actually, I haven't read that book etiher, but from your description of it, Paul was saying that almost 2000 years ago.

22 minutes ago, Jodie.Lynne said:

Nope. It turned into a "my ego is bigger than yours" discussion.

We are apes. Size matters.

 

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Will Due

 

Only believe God.

He let's you know what's true in life, what's true that's written in books, what's true about what people tell you, and most importantly, what's true about how others and especially you live your life.

Only believe God.

 

 

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029b10
8 minutes ago, Will Due said:

Only believe God.

Since it is written that he who comes to God must believe he is, then how did you come to God that you only believe God?

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DieChecker
45 minutes ago, Stubbly_Dooright said:

 Hey guys!? :st

 Despite my lurking, and my reading this thread, probably up to this point, a question just occurred to me. 

  Has the question been answered, why do people believe in the Bible? I can’t tell, and can’t remember, if the question was answered throughout this 65 page thread.

 Maybe, I might have remembered some people say they believe  parts of the Bible, and some believe all of it. The big question for me is, has anyone admitted to believing all of the Bible? 

And, how do they do that honestly? This question came to me from my memory of a couple books like the one where the Author lived biblically for a year.

 I had not read that book, but based on the synopsis it look like how the author proved how you really can’t do that honestly. So it makes me wonder, who does believe all of it and do they live it? And the ones who believe parts of it, how do they feel about believing And living in what they believe?

 This makes me think about that, as well as I read various posters thoughts and understanding of what the Bible says. And also makes me wonder, those who live what they believe, do they see the conundrum of it?

 

I think it depends. Does one have to follow all the rules, or only those as your denomination says are required? There are lots of ways of reading what Paul wrote which allow for a Christian to live just about whatever life they want. As long as they believe the most base tenets.

Do I believe the Bible? I believe that those who wrote it down believed it was true, and historical. And to believe in God is to believe in the supernatural, and thus that the many miraculous things did happen.

But belief in a religion comes from a want to believe and personal experience, not from the pages of any book. A book can give reasons to believe, but the person has to want to believe or not. 

I believe in Christianity, because of what I have seen it do in people, and in my own life. And this is why I would promote it. But, experiences vary, and so I understand that others hate Christianity due to their own experiences. 

People believe in the Bible because they believe it has helped them. And, IMHO, this is true. Many, many people has been helped by the Bible.

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zacharybdecker
On 1/5/2018 at 9:03 AM, bigjim36 said:

Why do some people believe the bible is literal? As in everything that is mentioned in the bible literally happened. We know that's not the case, science has proven that the earth is over 6000 years old, that adam and eve never existed, that dinosaurs existed and noahs ark did not, etc etc. Yet when challenged the best they can come up with is it's scripture. It's baffling and annoying, by all means have faith but do not believe the bible is anything other than bronze age fairy tales written by man. 

 

I think I have a rather interesting perspective on this. I was raised Christian and converted to Atheism at 16. I was an individual who took an early interest in philosophy at 13 years old. By the time I was 18 I had developed 18/18 on the iq score for analytical ability. I would deductively argue I am one of the smartest people in the world at this particular aspect of the IQ test due to just applying myself at problem solving since 13. Since 16 I have a various changes in ideas on an extreme level due to refusing not to keep an open mind. My theory is that if I am as open minded as I can be without doing something stupid (And continue to apply myself obviously) eventually my mind/brain will naturally find truth naturally on its own. Well even though I've been really indecisive over the years there is a basis of my ideas that has continued to maintain itself and is growing ever so more. I also use a lot of experimental medicine that has granted me a-lot of insight on these issues as well. They are known as performance enhancers in particular nootropics.

So in answer you your question the reason people are fundamentalist as you describe actually isn't a one size fits all shoe. I go to church for a periods of time, the reasons in no particular order:

1. I practice spirituality for therapeutic purposes but don't believe a word of it. I have a "sense of God" and understand different perspectives on religion deductively without believing them sincerely. Though sometimes I perspective take to an extreme.

2. I go for philosophical purposes. I do love wisdom and there is no such thing as useless idea.

Anyhow these are the reasons I can list off hand for being a fundamentalist:

 

1. People believe it most often for psycho-therapeutic reasons. Lying to yourself can offer great a psychologically induced sense of security. Believing in God for a period of time made me healthier and happier when I was younger and more ignorant. I just said, believed, and almost did a-lot of screwed up things.

2. A much smaller group of people who are much more educated than masses and are usually the leaders and clergy of the religious organizations believe it because they have been biasedly and narrowly focused on certain forms of studying to promote their ideas because of reason number 1. I have many debates with religious scholars and the reason they believe what they think is because for every time they consider Athiesm, science, other perpsectives, etc...they consider their own ideas and promote themselves that much ever more. They act like their open minded and use certain psychological techniques to avoid the truth such as subconsciously desiring their "truth" thus tricking themselves into believing what they want. 

 

2A. If you debate with enough groups of people and reason long enough you will discover that while logic exists and is therefore the taking it is entirely possible to justify any good or bad behavior. You can associate the feeling of sound reason and just ideology with anything. Psychology is a little **** sometimes.

3. Some people really fall for the pseudo-scientific ideas being created by the #2.

To be clear I also go to UU church and have discussed much with muslims, bhuddists, and pagans. I am not one sided.

 

 

 

Edited by zacharybdecker
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Will Due
52 minutes ago, 029b10 said:

Since it is written that he who comes to God must believe he is, then how did you come to God that you only believe God?

 

By recognition. 

 

 

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danydandan
20 minutes ago, zacharybdecker said:

1. People believe it most often for psycho-therapeutic reasons. Lying to yourself can offer great a psychologically induced sense of security. Believing in God for a period of time made me healthier and happier when I was younger and more ignorant. I just said, believed, and almost did a-lot of screwed up things.

2. A much smaller group of people who are much more educated than masses and are usually the leaders and clergy of the religious organizations believe it because they have been biasedly and narrowly focused on certain forms of studying to promote their ideas because of reason number 1. I have many debates with religious scholars and the reason they believe what they think is because for every time they consider Athiesm, science, other perpsectives, etc...they consider their own ideas and promote themselves that much ever more. They act like their open minded and use certain psychological techniques to avoid the truth such as subconsciously desiring their "truth" thus tricking themselves into believing what they want. 

 

2A. If you debate with enough groups of people and reason long enough you will discover that while logic exists and is therefore the taking it is entirely possible to justify any good or bad behavior. You can associate the feeling of sound reason and just ideology with anything. Psychology is a little **** sometimes.

3. Some people really fall for the pseudo-scientific ideas being created by the #2.

So Ignorance, Us vs them mentality and a logical loop. Pretty sure it's considerably more complex than that, in my opinion.

Welcome to UM by the way.

What is a UU Church?

Edited by danydandan

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eight bits
36 minutes ago, danydandan said:

What is a UU Church?

Unitarian Universalist. Two very liberal historically-descended-from-Protestantism churches merged some time ago in the US. It's non-creedal, welcomes all beliefs including "none," and has a political reputation somewhere in Bernie Sanders' brand of social democracy, maybe a tad to his left. It's searchable if you want details.

ETA: Welcome aboard Zachary

Edited by eight bits
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zacharybdecker
32 minutes ago, danydandan said:

So Ignorance, Us vs them mentality and a logical loop. Pretty sure it's considerably more complex than that, in my opinion.

Welcome to UM by the way.

What is a UU Church?

Dandydandan, 

UU church is universal Unitarian church. Just to let you know if you actually read my post and quoted it fully your statement would make zero sense. I've gone to church numerous times, I study theology on and off again. I just don't agree with you. I literally understand the Christian perspective and the Atheist perspective simultaneously. I can tell you what the Christian perspective is and what stands for logically while maintaining my ideas. That is almost the opposite of us vs. them. It sounds like your vaguely labeling.

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