US Government shutdown begins

[Wickian]

1 hour ago, F3SS said:

That was a funny exchange. Those two were talking like they have a long history. I’m reading thinking I don’t recognize either and they don’t have a 100 posts between them. 

Anyways, I can’t wait for the Democrats to kick off their mid term campaigns. They prioritize the exact opposite of what the country needs. They put Americans second and fuel the country with identity politics and racism.

Their platform is consideration for American citizens comes second, anti-white, anti-prosperity, racism soft and blatant, high taxes and deceit. Sadly, they’ll still pull in millions of votes across the board.

For the last decade or more almost all the Democrats have campaigned for is identity politics.  I have no idea how good or bad the D's will do this election, though they have more to lose than the R's.

[Agent0range]

1 hour ago, preacherman76 said:

Though I will say this, to blame Trump for this is absolutely ridiculous. The dems literally are demanding Trump commit political suicide, and legalize 800,000 new democrat voters. He would lose half (at least) of his base.

What's really funny is watching how the wind changes direction so fast in Washington. It was just 5 years ago Shoomy called republicans terrorists for shutting down the government. Even went as far as to say something like 'imagine democrats shut the government down over illegal immigration. The budget is too important, and we would never do that' lol

And what's Trump's stance on DACA?  This is the man who said he wanted a "bill of love" on DACA.  House and Senate Republicans want a DACA deal.  Don't sit there and act like this is strictly a Democrat issue, because that can't be farther from the truth.  And now Republicans want to tout CHIP?  Democrats have been pushing for a deal for months, and now all of the sudden Republicans want to sound like they are the champion for free healtchare for those who can't afford it?  Why do they do it?  Because they know there supporters will believe anything that are fed.  Case in point, just read this thread.

[Agent0range]

1 hour ago, F3SS said:

I caught Beck for a brief minute yesterday and he kept repeating the core issue of a shut down.

Non-essential services.

NON-essential services.

NON-ESSENTIAL services.

NON-ESSENTIAL SERVICES!

If they're not essential do we even need them?  

DOD employees who repair the military's equipment?  Non-essential.  The guy who plows the parking lot at the VA hospital, so disabled Veterans can receive their care.  Non-essential.  The person processing your tax return in 5 days...non-essential.  So, I don't know...do we need them?

[preacherman76]

15 minutes ago, Agent0range said:

And what's Trump's stance on DACA?  This is the man who said he wanted a "bill of love" on DACA.  House and Senate Republicans want a DACA deal.  Don't sit there and act like this is strictly a Democrat issue, because that can't be farther from the truth.  And now Republicans want to tout CHIP?  Democrats have been pushing for a deal for months, and now all of the sudden Republicans want to sound like they are the champion for free healtchare for those who can't afford it?  Why do they do it?  Because they know there supporters will believe anything that are fed.  Case in point, just read this thread.

Democrats don't want a deal with DACA. If it was so this would have been long over with long before Trump got in. 0bama had a opportunity to settle this issue when he had the majority years ago. They don't want any deal, cause it would include real boarder security. The illegal vote is imperative to dems voting block.

Trump has said he is more then willing to make a deal on DACA, but not without way more boarder security. Dems want not only to make these 800,000 people legal, they want them to have the right to bring their entire families alone with them.

Dems want everything while giving nothing. Considering the vast majority of people in this country want boarder security, Trump would be committing political suicide making any deal that doesn't include boarder security.  Asking someone to lose their base, the people who put him there, isn't a deal at all. This is a Shoomy shut down,  and the dems are gonna pay for it in November.

[Agent0range]

1 minute ago, preacherman76 said:

Democrats don't want a deal with DACA. If it was so this would have been long over with long before Trump got in. 0bama had a opportunity to settle this issue when he had the majority years ago. They don't want any deal, cause it would include real boarder security. The illegal vote is imperative to dems voting block.

Trump has said he is more then willing to make a deal on DACA, but not without way more boarder security. Dems want not only to make these 800,000 people legal, they want them to have the right to bring their entire families alone with them.

Dems want everything while giving nothing. Considering the vast majority of people in this country want boarder security, Trump would be committing political suicide making any deal that doesn't include boarder security.  Asking someone to lose their base, the people who put him there, isn't a deal at all. This is a Shoomy shut down,  and the dems are gonna pay for it in November.

Trump had a cute little televised press conference in which he stated that he would support whatever the people in the room put on his desk.  A bipartisan agreement was reached, a bill was sent to his desk, and he didn't sign it.  Mitch McConnell publicly stated that negotiations would be much easier if anyone really knew what Trump wanted.  Trump once tweeted, while in office, that we need a good government shutdown.  Schumer was in Trumps office, even offered a wall, and Trump went off the rails...as usual.  They can try to pin this on the democrats all they want..but people who know the difference between boarder and border know better.

[preacherman76]

22 minutes ago, Agent0range said:

DOD employees who repair the military's equipment?  Non-essential.  The guy who plows the parking lot at the VA hospital, so disabled Veterans can receive their care.  Non-essential.  The person processing your tax return in 5 days...non-essential.  So, I don't know...do we need them?

Well you can thank the dems for believing illegals are more important then you. Especially knowing they could make a deal on DACA right now. Truth is they don't want to make a deal, cause it would make all the other illegals set in stone illegal, and it would stop the massive influx of illegals who have been draining our welfare system for decades.

[preacherman76]

10 minutes ago, Agent0range said:

Trump had a cute little televised press conference in which he stated that he would support whatever the people in the room put on his desk.  A bipartisan agreement was reached, a bill was sent to his desk, and he didn't sign it.  Mitch McConnell publicly stated that negotiations would be much easier if anyone really knew what Trump wanted.  Trump once tweeted, while in office, that we need a good government shutdown.  Schumer was in Trumps office, even offered a wall, and Trump went off the rails...as usual.  They can try to pin this on the democrats all they want..but people who know the difference between boarder and border know better.

LOL right. Give us everything while we give you nothing is hardly a bipartisan agreement. Their idea of bipartisan is we will fund the government in return for your political death. Shoomy did not offer a wall.

I agree with the Shoomy of 5 years ago. The guy who said doing exactly what he is doing right now would be inconceivable.

This is 100% on the dems. The house passed a bill that left all this irrelevant crap for later. The dems could end all this right now, and lose absolutely nothing. Then fight for what they want on another day. Trump is willing to put aside everything he wanted that has nothing to do with the budget. Its the Dems who refuse to see this as two separate issues.  

[.ZZ.]

It's real easy to dismiss this shutdown unless it directly affects you.

If my veteran's pension is delayed it's on Schumer, not Trump. The military is being held hostage and used for political blackmail.

Illegal aliens getting protection and amnesty is more important to Dems.

Edited January 20, 2018 by .ZZ.

[F3SS]

2 hours ago, Agent0range said:

DOD employees who repair the military's equipment?  Non-essential.  The guy who plows the parking lot at the VA hospital, so disabled Veterans can receive their care.  Non-essential.  The person processing your tax return in 5 days...non-essential.  So, I don't know...do we need them?

I didn’t agree whole heartily that nonessential is a concrete term though in some cases is probably is. 

I heard yesterday that during Obama’s shut down, current headline “he weaponized it”, he made sure to halt all services to make a political point and create fear. What I heard was that many of these agencies have what they referred to as forward funds iirc. Basically rainy day budgets to use in events like this so that certain things can go on. Things like you bring up. Now Trump will supposedly make sure they use these funds and continue as many operations as possible whereas Obama wanted to spite republicans and make people suffer unnecessarily. Sounds likely to me.

[Agent0range]

2 minutes ago, F3SS said:

I didn’t agree whole heartily that nonessential is a concrete term though in some cases is probably is. 

I heard yesterday that during Obama’s shut down, current headline “he weaponized it”, he made sure to halt all services to make a political point and create fear. What I heard was that many of these agencies have what they referred to as forward funds iirc. Basically rainy day budgets to use in events like this so that certain things can go on. Things like you bring up. Now Trump will supposedly make sure they use these funds and continue as many operations as possible whereas Obama wanted to spite republicans and make people suffer unnecessarily. Sounds likely to me.

That is absolutely not true about forward funds.  When I go to work on Monday, I will be working for free.  The President can authorize backpay for emergency essential personnel who worked through the shutdown, but I certainly won't hold my breath for that.

[F3SS]

I really don’t know. I don’t have the time to dig into everything and just share what I hear on the fly. Still though, this one belongs to the dems. They’re so adamant about nevertrump that they can’t bring themselves to do anything productive or even partially selfless. Trump was specific about what he wanted out of this. He’s only been crowing about it since 2015. Wall funds.

Edited January 20, 2018 by F3SS

[Lilly]

In my opinion funding the government shouldn't have anything to do with the problem of amnesty for illegal DACA immigrants. It would be better to keep these issues separate. The Democrats are blaming Trump of course, but they know full well it takes 60 votes for the funding (and the Republicans don't have them). Therefore, when the Democrats try to place all the blame on Trump they're not being truthful because they are the ones refusing to vote for government funding. 

[Agent0range]

2 minutes ago, Lilly said:

In my opinion funding the government shouldn't have anything to do with the problem of amnesty for illegal DACA immigrants. It would be better to keep these issues separate. The Democrats are blaming Trump of course, but they know full well it takes 60 votes for the funding (and the Republicans don't have them). Therefore, when the Democrats try to place all the blame on Trump they're not being truthful because they are the ones refusing to vote for government funding. 

Just give me a yes or no answer on these 2 questions.

1.  Did Trump call for action on DACA, requesting a "bill of love"?

2.  Did Trump say he would sign any bipartisan bill that was put on his desk, going as far as saying "my view is your view" and "I will take the heat"?

[Lilly]

3. Did Trump say it was ok to refuse funding the government in order to force DACA passage without any Democratic concessions? 

And I don't have to answer questions when I'm just stating my personal opinion. 

[RAyMO]

2 hours ago, preacherman76 said:

Democrats don't want a deal with DACA

There was a dem / Rep deal put to the President in good faith based on his public announcements that he would sign whatever bipartisan deal was brought to him. His word was worth nothing - he refused to sign the bipartisan deal - that is why you are in the mess you are in now, no other reason. At the public meeting the linkage between the bipartisan DACA deal and the close down was clear for all to see.

As for funding for the military - its protected spending is it not - so close down wont affect it - but i presume there is some debate about increasing the budget for the military - why - your spending dwarfs every other countries already - what are you looking for more for - expecting to fight extraterrestrials or something.

[SHaYap]

Sparky forgot he said he's the Boss ... oh wait ...

~

[F3SS]

All it would have taken to prevent the shut down was a measles 9 or 10 Democrats voting yes. http://www.cnn.com/2018/01/20/politics/senate-vote-government-shutdown/index.html

it was most certainly Democrats who decided to do this.

Edited January 20, 2018 by F3SS

[Uncle Sam]

 

[RavenHawk]

13 hours ago, RAyMO said:

At that meeting it was clearly put toTrump that it needed 3 to tango in this instance the President the Dems and the Reps - he the President stated on 3 occasions at least - that if they brought him a bipartisan bill he would sign it.

They did, he didn't. 

No, they didn’t.  They knew what he wanted.  What the American people wanted.  And they basically brought him something that legalized the status quo.  They took advantage of the President.  They betrayed the public trust.

[Uncle Sam]

25 minutes ago, RavenHawk said:

No, they didn’t.  They knew what he wanted.  What the American people wanted.  And they basically brought him something that legalized the status quo.  They took advantage of the President.  They betrayed the public trust.

Here is what the Democrats are doing, Shaking down United States of America.
 

 

[Agent0range]

1 hour ago, RavenHawk said:

No, they didn’t.  They knew what he wanted.  What the American people wanted.  And they basically brought him something that legalized the status quo.  They took advantage of the President.  They betrayed the public trust.

Really?  According to old Mitch, no one knew what he wanted.  They knew what he said.  People can sit here and cry about DACA all they want, but one thing he did say he wanted, was a deal on DACA.  A Republican House, Senate, and Presidency, and it's the democrats fault.  The silver lining is, the only people that believe that BS is his uneducated base.  Donald Trump had some choice words about who was to blame for the government shutdown in 2013.  

Quote

Trump spoke to “Fox & Friends” in 2013 and was asked who would be fired during a government shutdown, as shown in a clip posted by "Morning Joe."

 

“Well, if you say who gets fired it always has to be the top,” Trump said. “I mean, problems start from the top and they have to get solved from the top and the president’s the leader. And he’s got to get everybody in a room and he’s got to lead.”

He said that further down in history, “when they talk about the government shutdown, they’re going to be talking about the president of the United States, who the president was at that time.”

“They’re not going to be talking about who was the head of the House, the head the Senate, who’s running things in Washington,” Trump said.

“So I really think the pressure is on the president,” he added.

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/369756-trumps-comments-blaming-obama-for-2013-government-shutdown-resurface

[+and-then]

15 hours ago, RAyMO said:

I watched the entire 50 odd minutes of the Trump arranged public DEM / Rep meeting on Daca / Border Security / immigration. Such much **** licking in one meeting but never-mind.

At that meeting it was clearly put toTrump that it needed 3 to tango in this instance the President the Dems and the Reps - he the President stated on 3 occasions at least - that if they brought him a bipartisan bill he would sign it.

They did, he didn't. 

2

They did?  They did what?  There was no Bill.  They did not agree to pass anything out of the Senate.  There was nothing for him to reject.  

[Uncle Sam]

24 minutes ago, Agent0range said:

Really?  According to old Mitch, no one knew what he wanted.  They knew what he said.  People can sit here and cry about DACA all they want, but one thing he did say he wanted, was a deal on DACA.  A Republican House, Senate, and Presidency, and it's the democrats fault.  The silver lining is, the only people that believe that BS is his uneducated base.  Donald Trump had some choice words about who was to blame for the government shutdown in 2013.  

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/369756-trumps-comments-blaming-obama-for-2013-government-shutdown-resurface

The spending bill had nothing to do with DACA at all. DACA isn't even in the spending bill at all. Democrats are filibustering the bill when DACA isn't even in it. They are using this as a way to force Republicans to approve DACA. They are basically holding our nation hostage!

Edited January 20, 2018 by Uncle Sam

[Paranormal Panther]

12 hours ago, preacherman76 said:

So let me get this right, the Dems are willing to hurt a lot of people, for people who are here illegally. Trump backed off the wall, but Dems wont give an inch. Cant wait to see how this turns out for them. lol

Let's see how much Democrats love illegal immigrants when they vote for GOP candidates. Pelosi would buy the bricks for the Wall.

[+and-then]

8 hours ago, Agent0range said:

They can try to pin this on the democrats all they want..but people who know the difference between boarder and border know better.

I've been here a few years, I've lost my temper a few times and had to apologise but the one thing I've not seen tolerated by the Mods, consistently, is sniping at other's spelling or grammar.  This statement was RUDE.