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XenoFish

God is an Idea

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Kismit

17 posts have been hidden in this thread already. I tend to disagree with Xeno that this thread in itself will create extra work for the Moderating team. I do however believe that poster behaivior will create extra work for the Moderating team.

If you can not post with respect towards eachother and your different views, Don't Post. Read your post before you press send, if it's, rude, snide, or derrogatory, Don't Post It!

If you actually believe you are right it is entirely possible to express that without being nasty or offensive towards a different view.

Thank you Xeno for appreciating the work load required for keeping posters on track. The thread premis offers an opportunity for intelligent discussion. I am choosing to keep it open in the hopes that intelligent discussion takes place.

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Truthseeker007
20 minutes ago, Podo said:

I like the ancient astronaut theory, as well. I just don't think there's enough evidence to prove it, unfortunately.

If you look deep enough you can find some unique evidence of it. But yea not enough evidence to make it a fact. Although some scientists suggest humans may be descendants of alien civilizations and here is one example:

https://www.*** blocked ***/news/science/777627/alien-dna-message-human

P.S.

Link blocked for some reason but if you type in a search page alien DNA found in humans you will find some info.

Edited by Truthseeker007
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Will Due
15 minutes ago, Podo said:

I like the ancient astronaut theory, as well. I just don't think there's enough evidence to prove it, unfortunately.

 

There's a whole lot of info about the Anunnaki in the Urantia Book. 

It's not proof but it is pretty interesting what it says about them.

 

 

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Podo
4 minutes ago, Truthseeker007 said:

If you look deep enough you can find some unique evidence of it. But yea not enough evidence to make it a fact. Although some scientists suggest humans may be descendants of alien civilizations and here is one example:

https://www.*** blocked ***/news/science/777627/alien-dna-message-human

P.S.

Link blocked for some reason but if you type in a search page alien DNA found in humans you will find some info.

Yeah I've read lots about it, and it is very interesting. However, like you said, there's not enough supporting evidence to make it fact. That doesn't mean there isn't enough to make it worth looking at, though. The problem is that many of the DNA arguments are largely discredited in the wider scientific community.

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Truthseeker007
1 minute ago, Podo said:

Yeah I've read lots about it, and it is very interesting. However, like you said, there's not enough supporting evidence to make it fact. That doesn't mean there isn't enough to make it worth looking at, though. The problem is that many of the DNA arguments are largely discredited in the wider scientific community.

Well that is quite interesting that they are discredited but not surprising.

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Noteverythingisaconspiracy
9 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

There's a whole lot of info about the Anunnaki in the Urantia Book.

Sigh. :sleepy:

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XenoFish
21 minutes ago, Kismit said:

17 posts have been hidden in this thread already. I tend to disagree with Xeno that this thread in itself will create extra work for the Moderating team. I do however believe that poster behaivior will create extra work for the Moderating team.

If you can not post with respect towards eachother and your different views, Don't Post. Read your post before you press send, if it's, rude, snide, or derrogatory, Don't Post It!

If you actually believe you are right it is entirely possible to express that without being nasty or offensive towards a different view.

Thank you Xeno for appreciating the work load required for keeping posters on track. The thread premis offers an opportunity for intelligent discussion. I am choosing to keep it open in the hopes that intelligent discussion takes place.

Sorry, but my hopes are not that great. I know how threads like this will end. If you think it's worth it, I can only suggest 10 pages. If it makes it 10 pages without further moderator action it was a good call. If not, then I was right. Now only time will tell. 

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Illyrius
1 hour ago, Podo said:

I'm not sure where my statements are confusing you.

If only there is enough capacity at least not to make any unfounded personal assumptions it would be a real wonder.

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Will Due
18 minutes ago, Podo said:

Yeah I've read lots about it, and it is very interesting. However, like you said, there's not enough supporting evidence to make it fact. That doesn't mean there isn't enough to make it worth looking at, though. The problem is that many of the DNA arguments are largely discredited in the wider scientific community.

 

DNA arguements? I've never heard about that. Can you provide some more info?

 

 

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XenoFish

If you wish to discuss ancient alien gods, why not create a thread about it? 

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XenoFish

I would like to discuss how god is a cultural idea. A tool we created that can and does give meaning to peoples lives in a universe where no default meaning exist. How this idea has grown into what it is now, and how new ideas become the next religion. How this idea of god can be a good and a very bad thing. Depending on the intent behind it's creation. Is that so difficult?

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Sherapy
1 hour ago, Podo said:

God(s) are definitely just ideas, as far as our current body of evidence can reflect. That every culture has the same gods, though, should indicate that there is something common. Everyone has a war god, everyone has a fertility god, everyone has a god of fire, etc. I adhere to the Jungian Archetype argument that these concepts are hard-coded into our brains, and that due to our natural propensity for pattern-recognition we personify the universal concepts into various forms that are then viewed through the lens of culture.

This doesn't mean that these ideas are real, of course; they're merely ideas that play a role in our psychology. It's important for us, as a species, to have heroes, and personified myth figures are easy to relate to and emulate. The problems begin when people start believing that these ideas are talking to them, or commanding them, or generally interacting with them in any way. Nutters, the lot of 'em.

I love this post. I learned something too. Thanks Podo.

 

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Will Due
1 minute ago, XenoFish said:

I would like to discuss how god is a cultural idea. A tool we created that can and does give meaning to peoples lives in a universe where no default meaning exist. How this idea has grown into what it is now, and how new ideas become the next religion. How this idea of god can be a good and a very bad thing. Depending on the intent behind it's creation. Is that so difficult?

 

Not at all. The simple answer is that the God idea or concept evolves. It always has and always will. It sways back and forth, progressing here and waining there, but over all, it grows in a better and better umderstanding of who God is.

Evolution isn't limited to material life and things. Spiritual life and religion also evolves and you can see this in how the various religions have done so throughout history.

This forum is a catalyst for this religious evolution too for example.

 

 

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Truthseeker007
42 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

There's a whole lot of info about the Anunnaki in the Urantia Book. 

It's not proof but it is pretty interesting what it says about them.

 

 

You should be a salesman for that book.:)

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Sherapy
18 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

I would like to discuss how god is a cultural idea. A tool we created that can and does give meaning to peoples lives in a universe where no default meaning exist. How this idea has grown into what it is now, and how new ideas become the next religion. How this idea of god can be a good and a very bad thing. Depending on the intent behind it's creation. Is that so difficult?

This is along the lines of what I think too, that god is a cultural idiom which means many things, depending on who you are talking to.

I think the some  religions are vying to be "right" about their idea of god. 

In Philosophy, god is the idea of infinite perfection which is basically the equivalent of agnosticism.

In Buddhism there is no acknowledged god, same with Athiesm. 

It seems some are seeking validation for their idea of god.

On occasion, once in a blue moon along comes a person who believes their idea of god is real, they got lost in the idea I suppose. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Sherapy
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Truthseeker007
18 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

If you wish to discuss ancient alien gods, why not create a thread about it? 

Wouldn't that be part of the discussion if we are talking about god?

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Will Due
1 minute ago, Sherapy said:

This is along the lines of what I think too, that  god is a cultural idiom which means many things, depending on who you are talking to.

I think the some  religions are vying to be "right" about their idea of god. 

In Philosophy, god is the idea of infinite perfection which is basically the equivalent of agnosticism.

In Buddhism there is no acknowledged god, same with Athiesm. 

It seems some are seeking validation for their idea of god.

On occasion, once in a blue moon along comes a person who believes there idea of god is real, they got lost in the idea I guess. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I have a question about the reality behind an idea.

Is democracy real, or is it only an idea?

 

 

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Truthseeker007
18 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

I would like to discuss how god is a cultural idea. A tool we created that can and does give meaning to peoples lives in a universe where no default meaning exist. How this idea has grown into what it is now, and how new ideas become the next religion. How this idea of god can be a good and a very bad thing. Depending on the intent behind it's creation. Is that so difficult?

Depending on what culture you are from is usually what you will base your idea of what god is.

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Podo
24 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

If you wish to discuss ancient alien gods, why not create a thread about it? 

You're right, it was deraily, sorry Xeno. I can assure you that it wasn't on purpose.

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Will Due

 

The idea of marriage, a relationship, has evolved to a high degree lately.

The idea of marriage is one thing but the reality of it is quite another.

This is also true of the idea about God. As the idea evolves, so does the relationship.

 

 

Edited by Will Due
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Illyrius
35 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

I would like to discuss how god is a cultural idea. A tool we created that can and does give meaning to peoples lives in a universe where no default meaning exist. How this idea has grown into what it is now, and how new ideas become the next religion. How this idea of god can be a good and a very bad thing. Depending on the intent behind it's creation. Is that so difficult?

The idea of god is as ancient as the evolvement of human ego and self consciousness. It is a completely rational and natural idea, since human became aware of himself as separated from his enviroment, and natural question has arisen.. what am I in the Cosmos, and what created the Cosmos?

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Podo
23 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

I would like to discuss how god is a cultural idea. A tool we created that can and does give meaning to peoples lives in a universe where no default meaning exist. How this idea has grown into what it is now, and how new ideas become the next religion. How this idea of god can be a good and a very bad thing. Depending on the intent behind it's creation. Is that so difficult?

Gods seem to me to be something that we created as a form of advanced and abstract pattern-recognition. By personifying various universal concepts and wrapping it in a culturally-appropriate skin, it allows humans to relate to aspects of our existence. Soldiers fight better when they attempt to emulate a perfect, idealized version of the perfect warrior, while farmers strive for the graces of an idealistic growth and farmer deity. The archetypes reinforce what we already believe, based on our culture, and help cement that very culture into tradition and stability.

In her book A Short History of Myth, Karen Armstrong talks about how superstition started very abstract; we worshipped the sky, the rocks, the rain. As culture developed, so did our personifications. The objects of our veneration became much more human and abstract. Gods of rain and lightning and growth came before gods of love, knowledge, and war, for example. It wasn't until much later, after the advent of farming, that gods began to become used for control and domination. This change became possible as farming became more advanced, populations could increase, and social hierarchy came into existence. It was the existence of a ruling class that allowed for gods and myths being employed for control, and not the other way around. I was surprised when I read this, because I would have guessed that the controlling nature of myth would have enabled the establishment of a ruling class, rather than the opposite being true.

I highly recommend A Short History of Myth for everyone interested in this topic.

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XenoFish
11 minutes ago, Podo said:

You're right, it was deraily, sorry Xeno. I can assure you that it wasn't on purpose.

Not really. In a way yes but also no. If you simply believe that there might be a god, and it might have done this or that, but it's really just an assumption you like (anyone not you podo), I see no real problem. It's when you get too serious with such a belief. That you want god to fix everything for you, that in and of itself is a very materialist belief. Then like you mentioned about hearing voices (other than your own inner monologue) that needs serious attention. One thing that I remember from my days as an occultism is that it attracts people with mental health issues, same goes for religious beliefs. People tend to look for some justification for "the spirits talk to me". I get that. And it's not healthy at all. 

15 minutes ago, Truthseeker007 said:

Depending on what culture you are from is usually what you will base your idea of what god is.

Very true but that doesn't mean any of those god's are the right one. We are at a point where no true god can be discussed because we have zero evidence that it does/n't. Atheism, theism, agnosticism, apatheism, they're all assumptions. None of them are true at all, subjectively they can be valid, but 100% authentic, no. Not a single one. 

22 minutes ago, Truthseeker007 said:

Wouldn't that be part of the discussion if we are talking about god?

That would depend on the functionality of that assumption. If you take such an idea too serious you get weird. A lot of people take spiritual concepts too seriously. But to say that we might be the children of some alien race, is just a guess, we don't know. It's a very interesting idea. One that I've thought about over the years, but I'm not going to dedicate my entire life to the concept. Granted it's cool to think about. 

Even hypothetical situation regarding God. What it really is, what it might be, where did it come from? Things like that. Yet the problem I see and I'm guilty as well, is that we get to firm in our individual beliefs. I personally have no problem with the coping god. As in god is a way for people to gain some sense of stability and meaning in their lives. That prayer amounts to organizing one's thoughts and expressing their inner feelings in a healthy way. Sort of venting to your 'divine friend'. I get that. But thinking that god will literally fix your belly ache, no onto at all.

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Sherapy
24 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

The idea of marriage, a relationship, has evolved to a high degree lately.

The idea of marriage is one thing but the reality of it is quite another.

This is also true of the idea about God. As the idea evolves, so does the relationship.

 

 

Will, in a partnership like a marriage it is two real people working for a common goal in a common reality. There is give and take, ups and downs, emotions, interactions, experices we share it is observable too, by anyone.

For you, the idea of god is what? 

 

Edited by Sherapy

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XenoFish
1 minute ago, Podo said:

Gods seem to me to be something that we created as a form of advanced and abstract pattern-recognition. By personifying various universal concepts and wrapping it in a culturally-appropriate skin, it allows humans to relate to aspects of our existence. Soldiers fight better when they attempt to emulate a perfect, idealized version of the perfect warrior, while farmers strive for the graces of an idealistic growth and farmer deity. The archetypes reinforce what we already believe, based on our culture, and help cement that very culture into tradition and stability.

I also see the more polytheistic approach was also a means of gains some form of stability in life. To feel in control of a chaotic system. Make a offering to the harvest god/ess in hopes of having food. Or the huntsman god for a good hunt. Plus these things change peoples perception. The hunter might become acutely aware of their surrounds, the farmer might take note of the weather and see the pattern, know when to plant and harvest at the right time, though they would both believe this to be a blessing from their gods. I can actually see the psychological benefit of such beliefs. Although on the surface they seem quite irrational.

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