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XenoFish

God is an Idea

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khol
3 minutes ago, Mr Walker said:

No. I lived as an atheist and a moral secular humanist until i was about 22.

I know what i am talking about

Those without this connection to a god through faith or knowledge  or a priority for a spiritual element in life are those who do NOT understand or  appreciate the difference  Humans are cognitive evolved  to require  both material and spiritual sustenance,  as any psychologist will tell you To be fulfilled and truly happy a human needs to have ALL their needs, both material and psychological, met,

It is a result of evolution on the human mind And it is why, even today, 90% of humans profess a belief in a sense of spirituality, and/ or a power greater than themselves  

WHY treat others as you wish to be treated ? WHY show any respect for the environment ?  the answers are cognitively spiritual or value based in nature because we can think in that way.

Humans do not have innate values They are learned and culturally specific  

This brings us to the begining of the whole idea of god and how it manifested. The true beginning. The early hominid at the dawn of human awareness. Our early ancestors had no way of knowing or understanding there natural world.This sense of self in which it began to experience would have forced the brain to make some form of conclusion to its existance. Without any kind of modern science to go by a creator or creation event would have been a logical direction. How else to explain the earth tremours and lighting bolts.When did actual human cognition occurr?  For the sake of a number lets say 250000 yrs ago.Throughout thousands of generations this belief structure becomes embedded within our pysche and solidifies there for thousands of years. Can you say hard wired? Possibly to a point. With the advent of modern science that wiring is starting fray and short out. Our true place in the cosmos is becoming realized. What you call spirituality is just a remnant feeling of your ancestors distant past

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Piney
1 hour ago, MauriOra said:

He's Right..

There is. Many Many Galaxies, with Inhabitants ..

The PLEIADES is One Such Place..

Mo..xx

Oh, cuzzen. Those stars are too young. They are still in creche. No planets yet.....no children....

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MauriOra
7 minutes ago, Piney said:

Oh, cuzzen. Those stars are too young. They are still in creche. No planets yet.....no children....

Atamarie Kuzn....

Hope Alls Well With You ..

I Respect You and Your Views, ..

Always ...!!!!

However My Kuzz, 

I Know, ..... And They Are There ..

They Have Always Been There ..

I Thankyou though,  for giving Me Your Thoughts...

MauriOra.. xx

Edited by MauriOra
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Illyrius
9 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

Not having a soul does not remove humanity.

I agree, it doesn't. What it does is reducing a humanity to a pile of flesh.

9 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

It is a reason to celebrate diversity and share achievements. Seeing how knowledge changes this world for the better is a driving force that makes one embrace cultural diversity and knowledge.

There is no celebrating of diversity, it is a pure illusion - world is full of wars for money and it is fueled with materialistic greed. In last 30 years only in Africa more people died in wars than in entire WW2. Towns are urban jungles with gangs, full of criminal and insecurity, working force is exploited more than ever in history. What you call knowledge is indoctrination into materialism and greed for money without any respect for nature and totally fragmented, constructed not to enoble the person but to make it a silly little wheel in a mechanism of greedy and empty society full of drugs, immorality and desperation.

10 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

To marvel at how much one can accomplish in this short span of consciousness is something to be grateful for and marvel at, it is a privilege. A reason for celebration and a reason to keep going and strive harder. I don't see anything noble about sitting on your behind proclaiming to have esoteric knowledge that anyone who has so much as looked at history can see is just a bunch of embellished tall tales exaggerated from some ancient survival strategies.

I see very noble society driven with by greed, full of lies and deception.

10 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

I think what you have illustrated is why that path of self enlightenment is nothing more than self delusion. Behaving yourself purely for a reward of immortality strikes me as a very selfish act. 

I think nobody is more delusional than people who think that society we live in is sane to even the least degree.

10 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

A secular view applauds achievement, whereas from what ii am seeing from the posting here is one challenges these ancient ideals things get ugly and resort to insult, which drags everyone down.

A secular view applauds trampling of justice, morality and truth.

11 minutes ago, psyche101 said:

I don't think that is enlightened one little bit, seems rather primitive and overbearing to me. 

Yes. This materialistic society is far from enlightened.

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Piney
14 minutes ago, MauriOra said:

Atamarie Kuzn....

Hope Alls Well With You ..

I Respect You and Your Views, ..

Always ...!!!!

However My Kuzz, 

I Know, ..... And They Are There ..

They Have Always Been There ..

I Thankyou though,  for giving Me Your Thoughts...

MauriOra.. xx

But as spirit not life.

Because spirit is born before life.

You know who I am. I sent word to the Children of the Sea. The grandson of the Traveler and Seeker of the Source. The one the Flyer who Dances Children to the Sun cannot harm. 

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MauriOra
1 minute ago, Piney said:

But as spirit not life.

Because spirit is born before life.

You know who I am. I sent word to the Children of the Sea. The grandson of the Traveler and Seeker of the Source. The one the Flyer who Dances Children to the Sun cannot harm. 

Right ..

Yes, I understand what you are Saying here Kuzn...

And Yes I know Who You Are..

Very Powerful ..

Spirit not Physical.. Yes .. 

There Are Many Beings, of Many Factions, And They are Doing Their Part in the Aid of Humanity..

Super Powerful .. !!!

Crystal Power ..We Had that Here Once.. On the Firmament..

It Got Destroyed .. 

So Now the Humans Must Power Up, to Uplift the Frequency, So They Can Come In ..

Like they Did, In the Ancient Days, Before it turned to Crap ..

Mo..xx

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GoldenWolf
34 minutes ago, Mr. Argon said:

I think nobody is more delusional than people who think that society we live in is sane to even the least degree.

238425_f520.jpg

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Sherapy
7 hours ago, Will Due said:

 

Well when someone tells me that I don't know God, it then usually goes down the road that the spiritual realities that I've experienced are just a figment of my imagination, or that they're illusions.

I always appreciate all the feedback I receive because I sense that those who engage me like this are doing so because they aim to serve, a basic human spiritual predilection. To save me from what they think I don't really know.

They're looking for validation that they're right. So to me, the fact that they're questioning me and others is a valid indication that from within, where I know God dwells, they're being challenged to find something that what the indwelling spirit tells them to do (have faith and trust how they're being led to think) isn't a challenge for me, but for them.

All that they're saying is another way the truth of the realities of God are a validation to me of what I know about how God is experienced by men and women, even when they're not aware of it.

 

 

So are you saying that for you questions validate your faith? 

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Mr Walker
2 hours ago, Mr. Argon said:

True, but this percentage is melting down proportionaly with the level of indoctrination into materialism through media and "education."

Not really.  Indeed the number of believers is growing  because so many Chinese are finding religious freedom after decades of oppression.  The number of people attending church in many western nations  is certainly declining, for many social and demographic  reasons, but the number of believers seems to be staying much the same. 

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Will Due
18 minutes ago, Sherapy said:

So are you saying that for you questions validate your faith? 

 

Not my faith, but the reality of it all. The reality of God. Because I see him in us.

 

 

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Sherapy
5 hours ago, jmccr8 said:

What Will has said is I have faith because it made sense to him. Well I have a car that won't start there are three elements necessary air, fuel, and electricity so one tends to eliminate  what the potential possibilities that it could be. The end is that the car runs and for Will it is that he has faith and the means it what brought him to that end. For my car it may have been a dirty fuel filter that was the source.  Will has not discussed what I am asking him about and you seem to have comprension problems of your own to address before interjecting and compounding the discussion.

jmccr8 

Excellent post, well said.

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Sherapy
1 minute ago, Will Due said:

 

Not my faith, but the reality of it all. The reality of God. Because I see him in us.

 

 

Bear with me, got a couple questions. 

Give me an example, that might be better.

 

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Illyrius
6 minutes ago, Mr Walker said:

Not really.  Indeed the number of believers is growing  because so many Chinese are finding religious freedom after decades of oppression.  The number of people attending church in many western nations  is certainly declining, for many social and demographic  reasons, but the number of believers seems to be staying much the same. 

 

main-qimg-e1c5df21a3fec8e419fce6575197c27c.png

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Mr Walker
2 hours ago, Kismit said:

So the First Norse God decided to sacrifice the First Ice Giant to make it's body the earth, it's bones the Mountains and it's blood the oceans. You believe this exact same origin stoey would be recreated. Even after it was not recreated anywhere else in the world over millenia, other than among the Norsemen. You believe this exact story would still somehow be created.

That is like saying that 100 monkeys with a hundred typewritters would eventually tap out Hamlet.

No that is not what i said The basic story or mythology would be recreated to explain how steel was forged and discovered.   When humans rediscovered steel making the techniques would not be exactly the same, ether.

In the past there were variations in both steel making and mythology but the BASIC  knowledge or understanding in each is connected, because humans ALWAYS impose spiritual beliefs into physical things  (unless of course you are suggesting a modern peoples who only forgot steel making, but have all other modern knowledge and understandings)

The norse have Ragnarok and Valhalla, Christians Armageddon and heaven The flood story is found in almost all ancient cultures.  All the cultures who first made steel swords had a similar story/belief  associated  with the process.  Not identical.  In a cold climate the gods might have been of ice, in other climates of earth or fire or water. God made the first humans out of clay in the christian creation myth.  

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GoldenWolf
7 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

Not my faith, but the reality of it all. The reality of God. Because I see him in us.

 

 

You won't find him in me, willingly.

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Sherapy
3 hours ago, Ultima Weapon said:

What I get from what little time I've had to read your posts so far, is that you arrogantly seek to 'educate' people on your own personal experiences of what you perceive to be 'god', pretending that your epiphanies are greater then the epiphanies of other people, by means of overwhelming them with constant walls of text in every single spiritually-based thread, that serve no purpose but to inflate your already massively enlarged ego, so as to overcompensate for what I would assume to be an otherwise mundane and/or tumultuous life.

Some one correct me if I'm wrong.

Wow, only took you 50 posts to see this.

Welcome to UM.

 

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Will Due
1 minute ago, Sherapy said:

Bear with me, got a couple questions. 

Give me an example, that might be better.

 

 

Well I'll try and pick up where I left off a couple of hours ago.

I see God in everyone who's participating in these conversations. I know that those who are on the other side, those who don't think God is real in the way that I've been trying to describe, think that what they're posting is making the case that God doesn't exist and all that. But I don't see it that way at all. 

I actually see God in those who are on the other side quite clearly. I see God working with them to bring about or evolve a better understanding of him for all.

Perhaps this is how and why all things work for good.

 

 

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cormac mac airt
14 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

Not my faith, but the reality of it all. The reality of God. Because I see him in us.

Which god would that be as there’s plenty of evidence to suggest that the modern Judeo-Christian God, Yahweh, is a merging of the Midianite/Edomite mountain/storm god Yahweh who wasn’t a creator deity to begin with and the Canaanite god El who was. The Israelites/Hebrews/Jews are well known as having taken myths and legends from other cultures and reworking them to serve their own religious agenda. 

cormac

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Sherapy
16 minutes ago, Will Due said:

 

Well I'll try and pick up where I left off a couple of hours ago.

I see God in everyone who's participating in these conversations. I know that those who are on the other side, those who don't think God is real in the way that I've been trying to describe, think that what they're posting is making the case that God doesn't exist and all that. But I don't see it that way at all. 

I actually see God in those who are on the other side quite clearly. I see God working with them to bring about or evolve a better understanding of him for all.

Perhaps this is how and why all things work for good.

 

 

Give examples of the things you see in the posters.

Edited by Sherapy
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Will Due
7 minutes ago, cormac mac airt said:

Which god would that be as there’s plenty of evidence to suggest that the modern Judeo-Christian God, Yahweh, is a merging of the Midianite/Edomite mountain/storm god Yahweh who wasn’t a creator deity to begin with and the Canaanite god El who was. The Israelites/Hebrews/Jews are well known as having taken myths and legends from other cultures and reworking them to serve their own religious agenda. 

cormac

 

You're absolutely right. 

The second post of this thread is mine. I think you might find it interesting regarding the issue you've brought up.

 

 

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Will Due
3 minutes ago, Sherapy said:

Give examples of the things you see ie the posters.

 

Often, if not always, the questions or statements presented to oppose the idea that God isn't real actually support that he is.

What I see is that they're working with him to reveal himself this way. Through being engaged with thinking about him which leads them to adjust their thoughts regarding what things to ask or state. 

 

 

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Mr Walker
2 hours ago, khol said:

This brings us to the begining of the whole idea of god and how it manifested. The true beginning. The early hominid at the dawn of human awareness. Our early ancestors had no way of knowing or understanding there natural world.This sense of self in which it began to experience would have forced the brain to make some form of conclusion to its existance. Without any kind of modern science to go by a creator or creation event would have been a logical direction. How else to explain the earth tremours and lighting bolts.When did actual human cognition occurr?  For the sake of a number lets say 250000 yrs ago.Throughout thousands of generations this belief structure becomes embedded within our pysche and solidifies there for thousands of years. Can you say hard wired? Possibly to a point. With the advent of modern science that wiring is starting fray and short out. Our true place in the cosmos is becoming realized. What you call spirituality is just a remnant feeling of your ancestors distant past

That is how the Idea or constructs of god began it is how every human child begins to construct its own god concepts even before it can speak.

  However you presupposing that real entities  with power  and purpose who are in in contact with human beings do not exist  They do

Good evidence of human self  awareness, to the point where we began to construct beliefs and religious /spiritual concepts only goes back abut 50 -70000 years when a big evolutionary advance in human cognition lead to more sophisticated language skills abstract, symbolic, and conceptual thinking  

It is not a hard wiring of the brain, so much as an abilty of the mind to think in a certain way (like logically only different)  It is a product of advanced self awareness of ourselves and our environment and thus our abilty to seek answers when we don't have data to provide the real answers  

No That won't change. As we get more knowledge there will be less things we need to use that  part of the brain for, but it will always exist, and  as we venture into the unknown of space and new planets, it might resurface more strongly.

  what i call spirituality is what distinguishes us from all other animals The degree of our self aware consciousness.  the abilty to imagine  be creative appreciate beauty and ugliness sonace and dissonance, ask questions, know consequence, understand  the difference between good and evil, life and death, etc.

It is not something which holds us back but allows us to move forward and improve ourselves..  

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Sherapy
Just now, Will Due said:

 

Often, if not always, the questions or statements presented to oppose the idea that God isn't real actually support that he is.

What I see is that they're working with him to reveal himself this way. Through being engaged with thinking about him which leads them to adjust their thoughts regarding what things to ask or state. 

 

 

For example, use me.

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GoldenWolf
1 minute ago, Will Due said:

 

Often, if not always, the questions or statements presented to oppose the idea that God isn't real actually support that he is.

What I see is that they're working with him to reveal himself this way. Through being engaged with thinking about him which leads them to adjust their thoughts regarding what things to ask or state. 

 

 

:huh:

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cormac mac airt

And yet you claim to know the reality of God as you claim to see him in all of us. Sounds rather pretentious and even a bit egotistical on your part IMO. Particularly since you’re effectively claiming to understand the psychological underpinnings of a merged deity that never originally existed in either pantheon. I think not. 

cormac

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