Ice on mars?

[Leiael79]

Just posting a weird thing I found searching Google Mars ( google earth) Looks like a giant ice slab in a crater. What do you guys think?  Location: 73.5964456917, 2.61441480541

[Weitter Duckss]

Ice on Mars is of CO2.

If the temperature in the crater is lower than the sublimation of CO2 -78.5 ° C, it is realistic to expect CO2 ice.
If you were thinking of H2O, just forget it.

[badeskov]

On 2/17/2018 at 6:59 AM, Weitter Duckss said:

Ice on Mars is of CO2.

If the temperature in the crater is lower than the sublimation of CO2 -78.5 ° C, it is realistic to expect CO2 ice.
If you were thinking of H2O, just forget it.

What? There is plenty of water ice on Mars, both underground and on the surface. 

https://news.nationalgeographic.com/2018/01/mars-buried-water-ice-subsurface-geology-astronauts-science/

http://m.esa.int/Our_Activities/Space_Science/Mars_Express/Water_ice_in_crater_at_Martian_north_pole

Why would you think otherwise?

Cheers,

Badeskov

[ShadowSot]

45 minutes ago, badeskov said:

What? There is plenty of water ice on Mars, both underground and on the surface. 

https://news.nationalgeographic.com/2018/01/mars-buried-water-ice-subsurface-geology-astronauts-science/

http://m.esa.int/Our_Activities/Space_Science/Mars_Express/Water_ice_in_crater_at_Martian_north_pole

Why would you think otherwise?

Cheers,

Badeskov

Wouldn't this (OP) be more likely to be sand? 

[badeskov]

1 minute ago, ShadowSot said:

Wouldn't this (OP) be more likely to be sand? 

It certainly could be, hard to tell as I only have the image posted and only seen on my phone.  I was planning on looking at Google Mars today, but other tasks intervened. 

Thus, I was merely pointing out that there *is* water ice on Mars. I should have been more clear.

Cheers,

Badeskov

[ShadowSot]

1 minute ago, badeskov said:

It certainly could be, hard to tell as I only have the image posted and only seen on my phone.  I was planning on looking at Google Mars today, but other tasks intervened. 

Thus, I was merely pointing out that there *is* water ice on Mars. I should have been more clear.

Cheers,

Badeskov

Oh I know, I was asking because you're the astronomy nerd. And I haven't ran into you lately.

[badeskov]

10 hours ago, ShadowSot said:

Oh I know, I was asking because you're the astronomy nerd. And I haven't ran into you lately.

Oh, I appreciate the kind words, although I am hardly the most savvy in that area on these forums  Real life has kinda taken over for a while with work and a 10 year old daughter that needs play dates, goes to piano lessons, girl scouts (now I have tried manning a girl scout cookie sale booth as well - who would have thunk it), etc. You get the drift 

Cheers,
Badeskov

[+Hammerclaw]

More than five million cubic kilometers of water ice has been identified on Mars, on or below the surface. While it's not impossible, what's in that crater is more probably frozen CO2 as water ice sublimates rather quickly in Mars' thin atmosphere. 

[bison]

Sand dunes are often found at the bottoms of craters on Mars. These light-colored features do not appear to be flattish ice deposits, but rounded hummocks; shadowed on the bottoms, and in bright Sunlight at the tops. The color is not white, but pale yellow. Probably sand dunes.

Edited April 2, 2018 by bison
corrected spelling

[tmcom]

On 2/14/2018 at 11:09 PM, Leiael79 said:

Just posting a weird thing I found searching Google Mars ( google earth) Looks like a giant ice slab in a crater. What do you guys think?  Location: 73.5964456917, 2.61441480541

Overwhelming evidence that there is water flowing on Mars, and sure we can say that it is all saline,.....

We can also say that every time Hubble is pointed at Mars, it malfunctions.....!

Edited April 15, 2018 by tmcom

[ShadowSot]

12 hours ago, tmcom said:

Overwhelming evidence that there is water flowing on Mars, and sure we can say that it is all saline,.....

 

 

Yeah, nasa certainly hasn't made press announcements about possible water on the surface or the presence of water ice in the past. No sirree Bobby. Never a word about that at all. 

Quote

 

We can also say that every time Hubble is pointed at Mars, it malfunctions.....!

Hubble's resolution isn't good for something as close as Mars. 

[tmcom]

11 hours ago, ShadowSot said:

Yeah, nasa certainly hasn't made press announcements about possible water on the surface or the presence of water ice in the past. No sirree Bobby. Never a word about that at all. 

 

Arrm, they have actually.

https://www.nasa.gov/press-release/nasa-confirms-evidence-that-liquid-water-flows-on-today-s-mars

Oh, l know pretty p**weak, compared with it getting bogged in some, (current rover) but still they did wrestle with what is left of their consciences, and said something.

PS l probably made a spelling mistake if anyone wants to condemn me to the pits of hell?

Edited April 16, 2018 by tmcom

[ShadowSot]

19 minutes ago, tmcom said:

Arrm, they have actually.

https://www.nasa.gov/press-release/nasa-confirms-evidence-that-liquid-water-flows-on-today-s-mars

Oh, l know pretty p**weak, compared with it getting bogged in some, (current rover) but still they did wrestle with what is left of their consciences, and said something.

PS l probably make a spelling mistake if anyone wants to condemn me to the pits of hell?

Yeahp. That's my point. They've been looking for water in the surface and announced the signs of it for decades. Solid hints of it are enough to get a press release for us science nerds. 

 And your statement about Hubble is simply wrong. Check out its specs, Mars is too close and small for it to visualize. 

Your photographs are just showing you are looking at things and not keeping the pm frame of reference in mind to what you're looking at, or have a small pool of references to compare them too. 

[tmcom]

16 minutes ago, ShadowSot said:

Yeahp. That's my point. They've been looking for water in the surface and announced the signs of it for decades. Solid hints of it are enough to get a press release for us science nerds. 

 And your statement about Hubble is simply wrong. Check out its specs, Mars is too close and small for it to visualize. 

Your photographs are just showing you are looking at things and not keeping the pm frame of reference in mind to what you're looking at, or have a small pool of references to compare them too. 

Too close and small?

All l know is what it keeps showing, (Hubble) isn't in line with established,...how can l put this....mass media warm and fuzzy data.

 

[ShadowSot]

11 minutes ago, tmcom said:

Too close and small?

All l know is what it keeps showing, (Hubble) isn't in line with established,...how can l put this....mass media warm and fuzzy data.

 

Hubble is geared for extreme long distance viewing, not nearby planets. It can image planets but not the sort of view you'd get from an orbiter or lander, or even earth based telescopes. 

You're not going to get detailed images from Hubble or the Moon or Mars. Do you think that's where this image came from? 

And if you are claiming this is a cover up by NASA or ESA or CSA, then why are all raw images released to the public un the first place? 

[tmcom]

29 minutes ago, ShadowSot said:

Hubble is geared for extreme long distance viewing, not nearby planets. It can image planets but not the sort of view you'd get from an orbiter or lander, or even earth based telescopes. 

You're not going to get detailed images from Hubble or the Moon or Mars. Do you think that's where this image came from? 

And if you are claiming this is a cover up by NASA or ESA or CSA, then why are all raw images released to the public un the first place? 

I know that Hubble didn't take this.

[ShadowSot]

4 minutes ago, tmcom said:

I know that Hubble didn't take this.

Great. So you also know that NASA is cleverly hiding these images by making them public? Knowing a few planetary geeks, the possibility comes to mind that many hundreds of people pour over each burst of data as it comes through, just regular nerds doing nerd things. What do they make of these images? 

 

What's the context? Not single, cropped, isolated, color inverted images 

And that James Wallace, despite his claims, is not listed as doing any work with Pixar or James Cameron? 

 As for Hubble, since you bring it up, what's the weird stuff you mention? 

[ShadowSot]

On 4/2/2018 at 1:01 PM, badeskov said:

Oh, I appreciate the kind words, although I am hardly the most savvy in that area on these forums  Real life has kinda taken over for a while with work and a 10 year old daughter that needs play dates, goes to piano lessons, girl scouts (now I have tried manning a girl scout cookie sale booth as well - who would have thunk it), etc. You get the drift 

Cheers,
Badeskov

Sorry for the late reply, but that's good to hear. 

[badeskov]

5 hours ago, ShadowSot said:

Sorry for the late reply, but that's good to hear. 

It's fun, but I certainly truly enjoy still discussing here at UM when I have the opportunity. Unfortunately for me, if I can't go all in and not leave a discussion hanging I try not to engage. And it is tough to find time for these days (takes a lot of research normally). So I am currently grappling for the low hanging fruit just to stay engaged 

Cheers,
Badeskov 

[johncbdg]

Mars Express water discovery reopens intriguing questions for future Martian Exploration

https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2018/07/mars-water-discovery-martian-exploration/

Not just ice water and there may be life still there.

[Waspie_Dwarf]

1 hour ago, johncbdg said:

Mars Express water discovery reopens intriguing questions for future Martian Exploration

https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2018/07/mars-water-discovery-martian-exploration/

Not just ice water and there may be life still there.

Yes, but no water anywhere on the surface and only one, highly salty, tiny lake (12 miles by 0.9 miles) deep under the south polar ice cap.

[johncbdg]

3 hours ago, Waspie_Dwarf said:

Yes, but no water anywhere on the surface and only one, highly salty, tiny lake (12 miles by 0.9 miles) deep under the south polar ice cap.

Friend and look what lives under out ice miles down,there will have been life there and it could still be there but for now hold on to the dream we are the only life anywhere it will end soon that thinking.

[Waspie_Dwarf]

20 minutes ago, johncbdg said:

Friend and look what lives under out ice miles down,there will have been life there and it could still be there but for now hold on to the dream we are the only life anywhere it will end soon that thinking.

Yes, but on a planet that has a surface is overwhelmingly habitable for life, not on a planet where the ONLY liquid water is a tiny, lake several kilometres down.

[johncbdg]

1 minute ago, Waspie_Dwarf said:

Yes, but on a planet that has a surface is overwhelmingly habitable for life, not on a planet where the ONLY liquid water is a tiny, lake several kilometres down.

We have a lake here many kilometers down and it has life in it in many ways if it was shut off it may or could still have life forms in it.

[Waspie_Dwarf]

5 minutes ago, johncbdg said:

We have a lake here many kilometers down and it has life in it in many ways if it was shut off it may or could still have life forms in it.

I'm not saying life in that lake is impossible but from a previous post you made you clearly do not understand the circumstances of this lake, when in a topic on whether Mars' soil was too dry to sustain life you made a post which implies, falsely, that is not the case because of this discovery:

It seems, from your post, unlikely that you have fully read the article that you are quoting or the article you were disputing. I am simply trying to point you in the right direction and prevent you jumping to more conclusions based on misunderstanding and/or misrepresenting the facts.

The reality is that Mars lost most of it's water tens of millions years ago. How likely is it that a lake formed under permanently shifting ice that small could be that old? How likely is it that a lake that small could sustain life for tens of millions of years?

Could life have existed on Mars in the past? Absolutely.

Could it still exist there? It's possible but unlikely?

Does this discovery make life more likely? In isolation probably not. If more such discoveries are made, if such lakes are common, maybe.

Does it make the detection of life on Mars more likely? Absolutely not... not in the short term anyway. At 1.5 km down it will be a long time before we are capable of digging that deep on Mars.