Critically ill man is former Russian spy

[Setton]

2 hours ago, RoofGardener said:

Umm.... I think that - by definition - government involvement is ENTIRELY necessary for state-sponsored assassination. Otherwise it wouldn't be state sponsored ? It would be... dunno... crowdfunded or something ?

sorry.... couldn't resist. I'll get back in my box now shall I ? 

Oh god, thats the future isn't it. Crowd funded assassinations and phone voting on who gets killed each week. 

51 minutes ago, Vlad the Mighty said:

 

I really don't give a flying monkey whether Vladimir Putin assassinates traitors, in this country or anywhere at all. Why should it be my concern? Surely that's the  hazard of the job. It's the kind of thing the  CIA does all around the world all the time. 

And the fact that one of our police officers is in hospital as a result? 

What's he, acceptable collateral damage? 

[Space Commander Travis]

12 minutes ago, LV-426 said:

And how do you feel about our own police officers, one of whom is now in a serious condition in hospital?

The police have also confirmed a nerve agent was used:

Russian spy: Nerve agent 'used to try to kill' Sergei Skripal

"A nerve agent was used to try to murder a former Russian spy and his daughter, police have said.

Sergei and Yulia Skripal were found unconscious in Salisbury on Sunday afternoon and remain critically ill.

A police officer who was the first to attend the scene is now in a serious condition in hospital, Assistant Commissioner Mark Rowley, head of Counter Terrorism Policing, said."

what do you want then? Massive military retaliation? 

[RoofGardener]

5 minutes ago, Vlad the Mighty said:

what do you want then? Massive military retaliation? 

Well, a degree of opprobrium might not go amiss ?  

The Russians have this word.... "nekul'turnyy".. which translates as "uncivilised" or "uncultured". Or as the English might say... "Just not DONE, old chap". 

I'm not convinced that this WAS a Russian act. It just seems.... dunno... illogical ? Irrational ? Nekul'turnyy ? 

[LV-426]

14 minutes ago, Vlad the Mighty said:

what do you want then? Massive military retaliation? 

You need to separate the wheat from the chaff, Vlad.

I get where you are coming from with Boris's outburst. I get the ridiculousness of the the tabloids throwing around terms such as "act of war." If there's proven to be a Russian connection though, this is a serious incident.

Even setting aside the criminal element, the Litvinenko case has soured British-Russian relations for years:

Litvinenko Inquiry Another Blow to UK-Russia Relations

I have no idea what the response should be. Certainly not anything military, that's just sensationalism. In many ways, I hope a Russian connection can't be proven, as the options for a response are pretty much limited to pointless tit for tat gestures, or sanctions we can ill afford.

The best thing that could currently happen is that the victims, including our police officer, pull through. People will certainly want answers though.

Edited March 7, 2018 by LV-426

[RoofGardener]

Just a quickie..... 

There is an interesting BBC article on government-sponsored assassination. (in the context of it being done by Her Majesties Government). 

It's just not done. For lots of reasons. Killing terrorists, perhaps. But not political targets. Or spies. 

[Farmer77]

Reading an article on Putin praising Trump and this quote from the KGB veteran seemed rather relevant today:

Quote

"Those who serve us with poison will eventually swallow it and poison themselves," he said.

Putin praises Trump, says U.S. political system 'eating itself'

[hetrodoxly]

2 hours ago, RoofGardener said:

Just a quickie..... 

There is an interesting BBC article on government-sponsored assassination. (in the context of it being done by Her Majesties Government). 

It's just not done. For lots of reasons. Killing terrorists, perhaps. But not political targets. Or spies. 

It would start tit-for-tat assassinations, Russia wouldn't have much trouble killing the prime minister or even the Queen but they know if they did we'd kill Putin, this round of events is Putin saying you're not safe 'we'll kill you if we want' so watch what you say before i win the election, to Russian ex pats, spy's etc.

[Likely Guy]

I'm just glad that I'm not a Russian reporter trying to cover this event.

I wonder what RT has to say...

[bee]

On 3/5/2018 at 8:08 PM, Vlad the Mighty said:

In Salisbury, apparently. Salisbury?! Putin's Fingers of Evil stretch as far as there?! 

 

* Actually Salisbury is not a million miles from Porton Down, the wellknown chemical weapons research facility. Read into that whatever anyone wants to .. 

 

13 hours ago, RoofGardener said:

Well, a degree of opprobrium might not go amiss ?  

The Russians have this word.... "nekul'turnyy".. which translates as "uncivilised" or "uncultured". Or as the English might say... "Just not DONE, old chap". 

I'm not convinced that this WAS a Russian act. It just seems.... dunno... illogical ? Irrational ? Nekul'turnyy ? 

 

I'm very suspicious that this was done by the British to frame the Russians ------ and I'm so sick of the anti Russia propaganda polluting the minds
of everyone... at least trying to...

like I said earlier in the thread - this is all just a little too convenient..

the '''evil Putin / Russia'''' propaganda wasn't working too well in regards to the election meddling accusations floating around 
especially the Trump / Russia collusion nonsense...... all the attempts to trash Putin and Russia and their military activities in Syria  
wasn't getting the desired result either... because the public remember how it was Russia that stepped in to halt the Islamic State
and ISIS sweeping through the whole of Syria and turning it into another Libya..

'''''someone''''' must have figured out that something closer to home had to happen to ramp up the hate and suspicion and get the
peasants all huffing and puffing... and shaking their pitchforks in the direction of Russia and NOT Islamic fundamentalism --- 

It's been a nifty enemy switch.... 

I refuse to be mind controlled into believing that Russia is the enemy - 

 

Edited March 8, 2018 by bee

[Space Commander Travis]

I see that now it's been confirmed to be a Chemical Weapon! A Nerve Agent or something. So now the tabloids can scream "PUTIN ATTACKS BRITAIN WITH CHEMICAL WEAPON!!!". It'll make their week won't it. And it might even give Blustering Boris the glorious justification for Military Retaliation he has been looking for! 

Edited March 8, 2018 by Vlad the Mighty

[GlitterRose]

3 minutes ago, bee said:

 

 

I'm very suspicious that this was done by the British to frame the Russians ------ and I'm so sick of the anti Russia propaganda polluting the minds
of everyone... at least trying to...

like I said earlier in the thread - this is all just a little too convenient..

the '''evil Putin / Russia'''' propaganda wasn't working too well in regards to the election meddling accusations floating around 
especially the Trump / Russia collusion nonsense...... all the attempts to trash Putin and Russia and their military activities in Syria  
wasn't getting the desired result either... because the public remember how it was Russia that stepped in to halt the Islamic State
and ISIS sweeping through the whole of Syria and turning it into another Libya..

'''''someone''''' must have figured out that something closer to home had to happen to ramp up the hate and suspicion and get the
peasants all huffing and puffing... and shaking their pitchforks in the direction of Russia and NOT Islam--- 

It's been a nifty enemy switch.... 

I refuse to be mind controlled into believing that Russia is the enemy - 

 

And I'm really sick of all the Putin apologists.

People he has a beef with have a way of showing up dead. Often from poison. 

This is fairly well-known.

One does not hear this type of thing about the British. 

If...and I say that loosely, because I don't think you really believe this, but...

If...people are honestly believing this...then they are being mind controlled by Russian influences to believe that everyone else under the sun is to blame except Russia. 

If you really think Putin is your friend and he's running a wonderful democracy over there...why not move? 

[bee]

 

The Globalists .... New World Order adherents..... those working towards a Corporate controlled Totalitarian One World Government -

have to gain control of Russia (and America) --- and making Putin and Trump the enemy and target of the pitchfork  pointing is why
we are drowning in anti Trump and anti Putin (and anti Brexit) propaganda... 

they and their foot soldiers know they have to control public perception and this is what they are trying to do -

you have to look at the big picture to understand what's going on...

 

[GlitterRose]

I'm willing to entertain the idea that maybe...maaaaybe...you hate Islam so much that it doesn't even occur to you that you could have another enemy besides ISIS. 

But I'd be really stretching to try and believe that. 

[GlitterRose]

We're drowning in corruption, if you hadn't noticed. 

And your boy is selling us out. 

[bee]

 

Russia apparently is one of the countries most resistant to Globalist Control -- no wonder they are a major target
of the perception managers....

I see this latest political drama as just ramping up the anti Russia propaganda - 

I want Peace with Russia not war....

 

[GlitterRose]

Brexit was pushed by our own oligarchs. They're intending to get something out of it.

There's a club, and unless you're in it...you're not.

Maybe you're in it. 

I don't know. 

[GlitterRose]

Powerful people are trying to rule the world. 

The world.

They're going global with it. 

They're "Globalists" in that sense. 

And the people you're looking to as saviors are some of the worst culprits. 

[bee]

23 minutes ago, ChaosRose said:

And the people you're looking to as saviors are some of the worst culprits. 

 

please don't exaggerate and willfully misrepresent what I am saying -

thank you

 

[Space Commander Travis]

Why on earth have people come into this thread ranting about hating Islam and Brexit? This thread is about neither Islam nor Brexit, unless some people are trying to associate the one with the other, which is tenuous at best, and what either of them have to do with the hysteria about Russia being the global demon is, again, tenuous at best.

[Space Commander Travis]

1 hour ago, ChaosRose said:

We're drowning in corruption, if you hadn't noticed. 

And your boy is selling us out. 

who the heck is 'your boy? Do you mean Trump or Putin? What exactly are you talking about anyway? 

[Space Commander Travis]

1 hour ago, ChaosRose said:

Powerful people are trying to rule the world. 

The world.

They're going global with it. 

They're "Globalists" in that sense. 

And the people you're looking to as saviors are some of the worst culprits. 

have you been drinking strong spirits?  Your last few posts have been barely comprehensible.  

[acute]

We don't know yet, but I suspect that Russians (but not necessarily Putin and his minions) are to blame.

[aztek]

Just now, Vlad the Mighty said:

I don't subscribe to the theory that he's Satan, if that's what you're angling towards. 

what theory do you subscribe to?  hundreds of investigative reporters killed on his watch, reporters who investigated gvmnt corruption,  opposition leaders killed, Nemtsov being the latest, terrorist attacks on residential buildings were done by fsb, not Chechen rebels. those in power have complete control of everything in Russia, his regime allows them do anything they want, almost daily deputats ran over someone, and they always get away, in one case deputat's wife killed 5 years old kid with her car, in his front yard,  the corrupt court found the kid was drunk, and driver was not at fault,  in another case gvmnt official  even made sure entire residential complex has no windows facing his villa. 

 

[RoofGardener]

Well, now the army has been called in. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43344725

In regards Russian involvement; we know SOMEBODY has done it, and somebody with advanced technology and facilities normally associated with a relative handful of advanced nations. This sort of chemical can't be created in the kitchen. 

So our list of suspects is.. what ? The UK, USA, France, Egypt, Iran, North Korea ... oh gosh.. and Russia. 

The USA has no record of using nerve agents to assassinate foreign citizens, not has Egypt or Iran. North Korea has no motive for this act, especially not when Kim is being all friendly and luvvy. The UK wouldn't do it. So that leaves Russia and France. 

Hmmm........ I'm leaning towards France ? Perhaps there IS a "Brexit" tie-in after all ? 

Edited March 9, 2018 by RoofGardener

[Setton]

1 hour ago, RoofGardener said:

Well, now the army has been called in. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43344725

In regards Russian involvement; we know SOMEBODY has done it, and somebody with advanced technology and facilities normally associated with a relative handful of advanced nations. This sort of chemical can't be created in the kitchen. 

So our list of suspects is.. what ? The UK, USA, France, Egypt, Iran, North Korea ... oh gosh.. and Russia. 

The USA has no record of using nerve agents to assassinate foreign citizens, not has Egypt or Iran. North Korea has no motive for this act, especially not when Kim is being all friendly and luvvy. The UK wouldn't do it. So that leaves Russia and France. 

Hmmm........ I'm leaning towards France ? Perhaps there IS a "Brexit" tie-in after all ? 

Well they've been out to get us longer than the Russians