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LV-426

Critically ill man is former Russian spy

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acute
10 hours ago, Setton said:

Well they've been out to get us longer than the Russians :D

Didn't we have a 99-years war with Russia?

;)

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bee
20 hours ago, RoofGardener said:

Well, now the army has been called in. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43344725

In regards Russian involvement; we know SOMEBODY has done it, and somebody with advanced technology and facilities normally associated with a relative handful of advanced nations. This sort of chemical can't be created in the kitchen. 

So our list of suspects is.. what ? The UK, USA, France, Egypt, Iran, North Korea ... oh gosh.. and Russia. 

The USA has no record of using nerve agents to assassinate foreign citizens, not has Egypt or Iran. North Korea has no motive for this act, especially not when Kim is being all friendly and luvvy. The UK wouldn't do it. So that leaves Russia and France. 

Hmmm........ I'm leaning towards France ? Perhaps there IS a "Brexit" tie-in after all ? 

 

Why wouldn't the UK do it.... ?

Motive means and opportunity....

Motive --- the military want more money and Russia is always the convenient reason why

Means --- Porton Down not very far away -jeeez  they could even have used the 'victims' as guinea pigs for a new biological weapon - *

Opportunity ---- Porton Down close enough to get it all done with minimal risk and planning -
 

 https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/spy-mystery-rare-poison-may-be-traced-to-single-lab-skripal-putin-poison-bzhtwrwlw

The nerve agent used against the Russian ex-spy and his daughter was an exceptionally rare poison that is likely to be linked to a single laboratory or factory, experts said last night.

Porton Down, the government’s defence laboratory in Wiltshire, is one of the only facilities in the world capable of identifying the source of the toxin used.
 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

That would be handy wouldn't it....if they were involved in a covert experiment with human guinea pigs.... and framing Russia would
be a '''killing two birds with one stone'''' kind of thing -  

Aaaanyway --- not saying this is definitely what happened.... but I don't see how you can just say... 'the UK wouldn't do it'

I think The UK is more than capable of doing it --- politically and practically...

Perhaps the Russian 'spy' was a double or triple agent who pushed his luck and so was chosen for this 'operation'... ?

(3 birds with one stone? )

 

Edited by bee

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RoofGardener
9 minutes ago, bee said:

...........Aaaanyway --- not saying this is definitely what happened.... but I don't see how you can just say... 'the UK wouldn't do it'
 

What an extraordinary statement. :unsure2:

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ExpandMyMind
On 07/03/2018 at 6:29 PM, Vlad the Mighty said:

what do you want then? Massive military retaliation? 

I think assassinating one of their oligarchs would be a rather equitable response. A message needs to be sent, regardless. How can we let any foreign country kill our citizens with impunity. Putin already did similar with Litvenko.

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RabidMongoose

So what do we know?

The `assassination attempt` (if it was that) has been botched because if it was done correctly then they would both already be dead. The fact the nerve agent was consumed at home and didnt effect them until hours later says to be this isn't Russia trying to pop off an ex-spy leaking information or embarrassing details.

It seems to me more like a statement - look what we can do, next time you wont be so lucky so you best shut up.

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RoofGardener

What do we know indeed ? 

Theresa May stood up in the House of Commons thisafternoon and flatly accused the Russians of involvement. She identified the poison used, describing it as a 'Military Grade nerve toxin', and stating that it was of  a known Russian design. 

She has given the Russian ambassador until Wednesday morning to explain how this happened, after which she will make a further statement to the House. 

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RabidMongoose
5 minutes ago, RoofGardener said:

What do we know indeed ? 

Theresa May stood up in the House of Commons thisafternoon and flatly accused the Russians of involvement. She identified the poison used, describing it as a 'Military Grade nerve toxin', and stating that it was of  a known Russian design. 

She has given the Russian ambassador until Wednesday morning to explain how this happened, after which she will make a further statement to the House. 

When they identify who did it I hope the UK Government has got the balls to assassinate him inside Russia using a chemical only we produce.

Edited by RabidMongoose
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LV-426
1 minute ago, RabidMongoose said:

When they identify who did it I hope the UK Government has got the balls to assassinate him inside Russia using a chemical only we produce.

I hope not.

We can hardly criticize another nation if we employ the same tactics, and I certainly wouldn't want to risk civilian lives in the way they have.

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LV-426

It's probably an obvious thing to say as well, but it's worth pointing out that if this is state-sponsored by Russia, the blame should squarely be placed on Putin and his cronies - both at home and abroad - not the Russian people as a whole.

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LV-426
32 minutes ago, RoofGardener said:

What do we know indeed ? 

Theresa May stood up in the House of Commons thisafternoon and flatly accused the Russians of involvement. She identified the poison used, describing it as a 'Military Grade nerve toxin', and stating that it was of  a known Russian design. 

She has given the Russian ambassador until Wednesday morning to explain how this happened, after which she will make a further statement to the House. 

Link for the story:

Russian spy: Highly likely Moscow behind attack, says Theresa May

"Former spy Sergei Skripal and his daughter were poisoned by a military-grade nerve agent of a type developed by Russia, Theresa May has told MPs.

The PM said the government concluded it was "highly likely" Russia was responsible for the Salisbury attack.

The Foreign Office summoned Russia's ambassador to provide an explanation.

Mrs May said if there is no "credible response" by the end of Tuesday, the UK would conclude there has been an "unlawful use of force" by Moscow."

 

"What are Novichok agents?

The name Novichok means "newcomer" in Russian, and applies to a group of advanced nerve agents developed in secret by the Soviet Union in the 1970s and 1980s.

One of the chemicals - called A-230 - is reportedly five to eight times more toxic than VX nerve agent, which can kill a person within minutes.

A number of variants of this chemical have been manufactured, and one of them was reportedly approved for use by the Russian military as a chemical weapon."

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RoofGardener
58 minutes ago, RabidMongoose said:

When they identify who did it I hope the UK Government has got the balls to assassinate him inside Russia using a chemical only we produce.

Umm... I think that would limit us to ... dunno.. Worcester sauce, Branston Pickle and Marmite ? 

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Farmer77
4 minutes ago, RoofGardener said:

Umm... I think that would limit us to ... dunno.. Worcester sauce, Branston Pickle and Marmite ? 

Nahhh that English mustard is some powerful stuff 

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RoofGardener
17 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

Nahhh that English mustard is some powerful stuff 

Hmm... Mustard Gas ? Hadn't thought of that.:ph34r:

Edited by RoofGardener
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hetrodoxly
2 hours ago, RoofGardener said:

Worcester sauce, Branston Pickle and Marmite ?

Together! do you think that's safe? it might cause a black hole or even a a rip in the fabric of time.

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ExpandMyMind
4 hours ago, RoofGardener said:

What do we know indeed ? 

Theresa May stood up in the House of Commons thisafternoon and flatly accused the Russians of involvement. She identified the poison used, describing it as a 'Military Grade nerve toxin', and stating that it was of  a known Russian design. 

She has given the Russian ambassador until Wednesday morning to explain how this happened, after which she will make a further statement to the House. 

It's at its basic level a chemical weapon attack on the UK.

This was a statement by Putin, who had no intention of hiding the act. If all he wanted was the guy dead, he could have arranged multiple, more suitable methods. This was a **** you to the UK and the West. I suspect because he knows the White House will do nothing about it - they have flat out refused to even mention Russia in relation to this attack.

Strange days we live in.

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A rather obscure Bassoon

After her statement to the House, Putin is just going to brush this off in the same way he did with the US indictments.At the end of the day if Putin just brushes her off then what exactly can she do?

It would almost be Laughable if not for the two victims on the receiving end and who is to say it was the Putin.The nerve agent could most likely be acquired by anyone.

 

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Mr.United_Nations
12 hours ago, A rather obscure Bassoon said:

After her statement to the House, Putin is just going to brush this off in the same way he did with the US indictments.At the end of the day if Putin just brushes her off then what exactly can she do?

It would almost be Laughable if not for the two victims on the receiving end and who is to say it was the Putin.The nerve agent could most likely be acquired by anyone.

 

How? Tell me who can make an agent where it' complicated to make and the funds? 

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ExpandMyMind
25 minutes ago, Mr.United_Nations said:

How? Tell me who can make an agent where it' complicated to make and the funds? 

The only other possibility that I can think of, if it wasn't Putin and Russia officially, is that one or more of the Russian oligarchs did this using their resources and connections. The ex-spy allegedly worked with Steele on the Trump dossier, and a lot of shady stuff regarding those oligarchs was revealed. It's not inconcievable that they might have wanted to send a reverberating message to any other potential collaborators.

But Putin would have the exact same motive and desire, so it was probably his decision.

Edited by ExpandMyMind
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LV-426
36 minutes ago, ExpandMyMind said:

The only other possibility that I can think of, if it wasn't Putin and Russia officially, is that one or more of the Russian oligarchs did this using their resources and connections. The ex-spy allegedly worked with Steele on the Trump dossier, and a lot of shady stuff regarding those oligarchs was revealed. It's not inconcievable that they might have wanted to send a reverberating message to any other potential collaborators.

But Putin would have the exact same motive and desire, so it was probably his decision.

He must have had a hand in it.

This is a military-grade chemical nerve agent. It's not something that can be produced in any old lab.

Even if the assassination attempt wasn't directly approved by Putin, he must certainly have known to whom the agent was supplied and its intended purpose.

Personally, I'd like to see as much detail as possible made public within security limits, so the world can judge for themselves on the evidence.

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RAyMO
19 minutes ago, LV-426 said:

Even if the assassination attempt wasn't directly approved by Putin

I admit I don't follow Russia, but I don't believe anybody with any sort of  connection to the Russian govt would act on foreign soil, without, the direct authority from Putin.

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LV-426

Pretty much says it all...

Britain using spy illness to demonise Moscow, says Litvinenko murder suspect

"Andrei Lugovoi, Russian MP, attacks intelligence agencies over Sergei Skripal’s suspected poisoning

Andrei Lugovoi, one of the prime suspects in the murder of Alexander Litvinenko, has suggested that the apparent poisoning of a Russian spy in Salisbury is part of a British campaign to demonise Moscow.

“I don’t rule out that this is another provocation by British intelligence agencies,” said Lugovoi, a pro-Kremlin MP and former FSB spy agency officer."

 

For those preferring the notion that our own government had a hand in this, who is the more likely candidate?

A man such as Andrei Lugovoi?

Or Theresa May, sat plotting dastardly deeds at No. 10 in her leopard print kitten heels...

Edited by LV-426
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Mr.United_Nations
1 hour ago, ExpandMyMind said:

The only other possibility that I can think of, if it wasn't Putin and Russia officially, is that one or more of the Russian oligarchs did this using their resources and connections. The ex-spy allegedly worked with Steele on the Trump dossier, and a lot of shady stuff regarding those oligarchs was revealed. It's not inconcievable that they might have wanted to send a reverberating message to any other potential collaborators.

But Putin would have the exact same motive and desire, so it was probably his decision.

True, even if he had no clue there.must of been someone in the Russian government

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Setton
3 hours ago, LV-426 said:

Pretty much says it all...

Britain using spy illness to demonise Moscow, says Litvinenko murder suspect

"Andrei Lugovoi, Russian MP, attacks intelligence agencies over Sergei Skripal’s suspected poisoning

Andrei Lugovoi, one of the prime suspects in the murder of Alexander Litvinenko, has suggested that the apparent poisoning of a Russian spy in Salisbury is part of a British campaign to demonise Moscow.

“I don’t rule out that this is another provocation by British intelligence agencies,” said Lugovoi, a pro-Kremlin MP and former FSB spy agency officer."

 

For those preferring the notion that our own government had a hand in this, who is the more likely candidate?

A man such as Andrei Lugovoi?

Or Theresa May, sat plotting dastardly deeds at No. 10 in her leopard print kitten heels...

Seems legit.

While, Theresa May does have the look of a bond villain, I think last year's election demonstrates her capacity for dastardly plots :P

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A rather obscure Bassoon
7 hours ago, Mr.United_Nations said:

How? Tell me who can make an agent where it' complicated to make and the funds? 

North Korea may be, who knows how much deadly material the regime sells through the back door.Just saying though.

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A rather obscure Bassoon
On 12/03/2018 at 3:20 PM, LV-426 said:

Link for the story:

Russian spy: Highly likely Moscow behind attack, says Theresa May

"Former spy Sergei Skripal and his daughter were poisoned by a military-grade nerve agent of a type developed by Russia, Theresa May has told MPs.

The PM said the government concluded it was "highly likely" Russia was responsible for the Salisbury attack.

The Foreign Office summoned Russia's ambassador to provide an explanation.

Mrs May said if there is no "credible response" by the end of Tuesday, the UK would conclude there has been an "unlawful use of force" by Moscow."

 

"What are Novichok agents?

The name Novichok means "newcomer" in Russian, and applies to a group of advanced nerve agents developed in secret by the Soviet Union in the 1970s and 1980s.

One of the chemicals - called A-230 - is reportedly five to eight times more toxic than VX nerve agent, which can kill a person within minutes.

A number of variants of this chemical have been manufactured, and one of them was reportedly approved for use by the Russian military as a chemical weapon."

Who gave her the intel, the same Agency that said Saddam had WMD'S. Oh and by the way who is going to stand up when Putin squares up not May and her cabinet.

Edited by A rather obscure Bassoon
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