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Critically ill man is former Russian spy


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7 hours ago, Phaeton80 said:


Russia's proposal was a joint GB - Russia investiation, thats the proposal GB has responded to as being 'perverse'. You know, entering into constructive dialog, cooperation in establishing the facts, before any definitive accusations are made (well, tad bit too late for that isnt it)  Thats what I was referring to, not the UN-OPCW variant, which would be parallel to the proposed investiation regardless.

Ducks in a row you say..

'To become well-organized, prepared, and up-to-date.'

Seems to me GB should have had their ducks in a row before defnitively accusing Russia for this crime some weeks ago, directly after the incident happened no less. Also, my whole position in this thread has been none other than demanding these ducks be in a row before doing so. The latest input might - might - constitute as such, hence my eagerness to have access to the substance of said latest claims. This does not take away any thing I have stated in this thread, about the (lacking) process and penalties issued, about the hatchet jobs against people asking rational questions, and against blatant lies being told to the public by British government officials.

I'd much rather we have an Independent report. As we are getting, It seems Russia doesn't want that - Cant you see the fallacy in what Russia proposed.  

Yes Ducks in a row, Russia gets every excuse lined up for every conceivable outcome. - We've seen it with their stance that they will not accept the independent UN report, even before its released.

you'd think a permanent member of the UN and signatory such as Russia would accept the findings and allow UN inspectors into their facilities. The UK invited the the UN team who then took their own samples independently and had access all areas. But then again the UN is in cahoots with the UK and is anti-Russian. :rolleyes:

 

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The most deadly nerve agent ever created, 8 times more deadly than VX, and only available in Russia, and ruthlessly administered by Putin's Ruthless Assassins. 

Glad to see he's getting better. 

SERGEI: I'm not dead!
MORTICIAN: What?
CUSTOMER: Nothing - here's your ninepence.
SERGEI: I'm not dead!
MORTICIAN: Here - he says he's not dead!
CUSTOMER: Yes, he is. The 'Times' said so. March 12th. Front page. Trust me: he's dead.
SERGEI: I'm not!
MORTICIAN: He isn't.
CUSTOMER: Well, he will be soon. It was a Novichok nerve agent. There's no treatment, and no recovery is possible.
SERGEI: It was just the prawns, that's all! I'm getting better!
CUSTOMER: No, you are not. It was 'military grade', 8 times stronger than VX. You were dead in seconds.

http://www.moonofalabama.org/2018/04/a-very-british-farce.html#more

If anyone can't see how absurd it all has been right from the very start you deserve Prime Minister May and her trained Labrador Boris, you really do. 

Edited by Vlad the Mighty
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1 hour ago, Vlad the Mighty said:

The most deadly nerve agent ever created, 8 times more deadly than VX, and only available in Russia, and ruthlessly administered by Putin's Ruthless Assassins

Do you have a link for this, thanks.

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On 3/31/2018 at 9:38 AM, bee said:

To be honest I find the simplistic tweets from the Foreign Office... complete with spooky background music..... chilling and very worrying
that they should put out such things...

And I note how they are linking it to comments about Syria - this was and is a suspicion of mine that this ''''poisoning'''' could be part
of an agenda to soften up the public in preparation for an escalation in Syria where ''''we''' will be involved on the opposite side to
the Syrian Army and therefore in opposition to the Russian army..... and British soldiers may be sent in... in some capacity possibly as ground troops?
in a US lead operation...?

 

Quoting myself because I've just seen this...

Well that didn't take long now did it.........:rolleyes:

also very pertinent to the latest alleged chemical attack... 

 The attack comes a week after US President Donald Trump said he wanted the US presence in Syria to end "very soon".

fancy that eh.... another 'coincidence' ...... it looks like the military have Trump done up like a kipper when it comes
to Syria and the Globalist's determination to remove the Assad Regime and carve up Syria...

link

An alleged chemical attack reportedly killed scores of civilians, including children, in Syria on Saturday, with the US describing the reports as "horrifying".

A Syrian rebel group accused government forces of dropping a barrel bomb containing poisonous chemicals on civilians in eastern Ghouta, with one rescue group reporting more than 150 deaths.

Syrian state media denied government forces had launched any chemical attack and said rebels in the eastern Ghouta town of Douma were in a state of collapse and spreading false news.

On Saturday evening, the US State Department said the reports of mass casualties were "horrifying" and would demand an international response if confirmed, laying some of the blame with Russia.

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12 hours ago, Vlad the Mighty said:

The most deadly nerve agent ever created, 8 times more deadly than VX, and only available in Russia, and ruthlessly administered by Putin's Ruthless Assassins. 

Glad to see he's getting better. 

SERGEI: I'm not dead!
MORTICIAN: What?
CUSTOMER: Nothing - here's your ninepence.
SERGEI: I'm not dead!
MORTICIAN: Here - he says he's not dead!
CUSTOMER: Yes, he is. The 'Times' said so. March 12th. Front page. Trust me: he's dead.
SERGEI: I'm not!
MORTICIAN: He isn't.
CUSTOMER: Well, he will be soon. It was a Novichok nerve agent. There's no treatment, and no recovery is possible.
SERGEI: It was just the prawns, that's all! I'm getting better!
CUSTOMER: No, you are not. It was 'military grade', 8 times stronger than VX. You were dead in seconds.

http://www.moonofalabama.org/2018/04/a-very-british-farce.html#more

If anyone can't see how absurd it all has been right from the very start you deserve Prime Minister May and her trained Labrador Boris, you really do. 

You, probably, never heard about dosage, dear comrade.

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The latest major perception management operation of linking Russia to chemical warfare is personified by the Salisbury '''''incident'''''

Mind you I don't think it has been as successful as the Shadowy Powers That Be would have hoped because
if you read the comments under articles about the Skripal business....there is extreme scepticism and sarcasm about
the whole thing and I would estimate that the majority of the UK public are not buying the BS... but that probably won't stop
the anti Russia propaganda juggernaut continuing with all the main stream (mind control) media on board - :angry:

 

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4 minutes ago, bee said:

 

The latest major perception management operation of linking Russia to chemical warfare is personified by the Salisbury '''''incident'''''

Mind you I don't think it has been as successful as the Shadowy Powers That Be would have hoped because
if you read the comments under articles about the Skripal business....there is extreme scepticism and sarcasm about
the whole thing and I would estimate that the majority of the UK public are not buying the BS... but that probably won't stop
the anti Russia propaganda juggernaut continuing with all the main stream (mind control) media on board - :angry:

 

Neat, more anglophobic rant...

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Just now, bmk1245 said:

Neat, more anglophobic rant...

 

oh hello..... you're back.... 

I think I might have nailed it  ......... ;)

:P

 

 

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and what have we here......said just days before the Salisbury '''''incident'''''

Boris Johnson probably feels all puffed up and important being a major player (in the coming war?)

Preparing the ground like a good boy for British troops to fight and die in Syria  - with May's full backing - 

God help us all - and well done to Jeremy Corbyn for the courage and tenacity to resist the warmongering rhetoric...
 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-43210558

Britain should consider military action against the Syrian regime if there is fresh "incontrovertible" evidence that chemical weapons have been used against civilians, Boris Johnson has said.

The foreign secretary told the BBC he believed the use of illegal weapons should not go unpunished. 

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21 minutes ago, bee said:

 

and what have we here......said just days before the Salisbury '''''incident'''''

Boris Johnson probably feels all puffed up and important being a major player (in the coming war?)

Preparing the ground like a good boy for British troops to fight and die in Syria  - with May's full backing - 

God help us all - and well done to Jeremy Corbyn for the courage and tenacity to resist the warmongering rhetoric...
 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-43210558

 

 

i was thinking the same thing. the U.S. Britain and France in Syria against Russia, Iran and Turkey. but only if the U.S. gets it act together. what are the chances of that happening. so i wouldn't worry if i was you.

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1 hour ago, bee said:

.there is extreme scepticism and sarcasm about
the whole thing and I would estimate that the majority of the UK public are not buying the BS

Setting aside the Russia question, one thing is clear - the British government  including May and particularly that useless idiot Boris - have made a right mess managing the situation. 

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13 hours ago, stevewinn said:

I'd much rather we have an Independent report. As we are getting, It seems Russia doesn't want that - Cant you see the fallacy in what Russia proposed.  

Yes Ducks in a row, Russia gets every excuse lined up for every conceivable outcome. - We've seen it with their stance that they will not accept the independent UN report, even before its released.

you'd think a permanent member of the UN and signatory such as Russia would accept the findings and allow UN inspectors into their facilities. The UK invited the the UN team who then took their own samples independently and had access all areas. But then again the UN is in cahoots with the UK and is anti-Russian. :rolleyes:

 


Thats all fine and well, but let me ask you - because it seems asthough you have been selectively silent about these aspects - the following (and this is meant in al seriousness; I am honestly curious):

- what is your take on the fact your nation has decreed a foreign nation's guilt incl. dishing out penalties well before proven as such - dealing blame to a nation mere days after the event, dishing out
  definitive accusations, you know, before having 'all their ducks in a row'. In effect ignoring the basis of the rule of law, where any accused party is innocent until proven guilty (which doesnt mean 
  'guilty because we have evidene w e will not [yet]disclose');

- what is your reaction to the clearcut lie of dear Boris Johnson concerning supposed categorical proof, claiming Porton Down confirmed this when they in fact did not;

- what is your reaction to the ridiculously infantile and malicious hatchet jobs in your media regarding for instance Jeremy Corbyn, simply for asking inconvenient questions, not falling in line;

- how do you reconcile this man was formally swapped with the Russians 8 years ago being assassinated at this point in time, at this particular location, with this particular method (Russia's signature
  being all over the weapon of choice), to subsequently fail - and fail miserably - in their mission.. does that seem plausible to you and if so, based on what logic;

- how do you see Russia gaining from this act Vs the possible gains this narrative would have to the other side of the table (I can personally see legion pro's for the Brits, a lot of con's for the Russians -
  and the 'warning message' Russian motive doesnt really compute with me - especially if juxtaposed to the pro's GB would receive from this event, it pales in comparison imho);

- in your view, what is the reason Russia is denied access - monitored or else - to Russian national Yulia Skripal; what sort of risk would such allowance possibly pose to the case, the unequivocal
  evidence GB claims to have.


These are some honest questions Id appreciate some honest responses to, I am truely curious as to what you think about these points.

Edited by Phaeton80
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44 minutes ago, Captain Risky said:

i was thinking the same thing. the U.S. Britain and France in Syria against Russia, Iran and Turkey. but only if the U.S. gets it act together. what are the chances of that happening. so i wouldn't worry if i was you.

 

I think the chances of that happening are quite high because Trump has already been boxed in and has IMO been sucessfully
conned into committing to respond to chemical attacks in Syria - which I'm sure has given great hope for the so-called rebels
who have everything to gain by creating a false flag chemical attack and blaming it on Assad - it's worked a treat before and
no reason to suspect it won't again - the scene is set - 

I don't know how Trump is going to control the warmongers loyal to the globalists in the US - he may just have to try and limit
their powers but give them something so he can continue with his domestic policies... this is going to be his toughest test since
coming to office I think.... 

and as we are reminded...... (the military loyal to the Globalist Agenda must have rubbed their hands together with satisfaction of
a job well done when Trump did and said ....).... bolded....

link

Quote

Following a chemical attack last year, the US launched 59 Tomahawk cruise missiles at the air base from which the attacks had originated. 

“No child of God should ever suffer such horror,” Mr Trump said at the time. “It is in the vital national security interest of the United States to prevent and deter the spread and use of deadly chemical weapons.”

 

Heather Nauert, US State Department spokeswoman, said the reports, if confirmed, were "horrifying and demand an immediate response by the international community".

Citing a history of chemical weapons use by the Syrian regime, Ms Nauert said Assad's government and its backer Russia needed to be held accountable and "any further attacks prevented immediately."

"Russia, with its unwavering support for the regime ultimately bears responsibility for these brutal attacks," Ms Nauert said.

Edited by bee
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2 hours ago, bee said:

 

oh hello..... you're back.... 

I think I might have nailed it  ......... ;)

:P

 

 

Nope, not at all. You just proved that you would defend Chikatilo if you would had wet dreams about him...

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1 hour ago, Phaeton80 said:


Thats all fine and well, but let me ask you - because it seems asthough you have been selectively silent about these aspects - the following (and this is meant in al seriousness; I am honestly curious):

- what is your take on the fact your nation has decreed a foreign nation's guilt incl. dishing out penalties well before proven as such - dealing blame to a nation mere days after the event, dishing out
  definitive accusations, you know, before having 'all their ducks in a row'. In effect ignoring the basis of the rule of law, where any accused party is innocent until proven guilty (which doesnt mean 
  'guilty because we have evidene w e will not [yet]disclose');

- what is your reaction to the clearcut lie of dear Boris Johnson concerning supposed categorical proof, claiming Porton Down confirmed this when they in fact did not;

- what is your reaction to the ridiculously infantile and malicious hatchet jobs in your media regarding for instance Jeremy Corbyn, simply for asking inconvenient questions, not falling in line;

- how do you reconcile this man was formally swapped with the Russians 8 years ago being assassinated at this point in time, at this particular location, with this particular method (Russia's signature
  being all over the weapon of choice), to subsequently fail - and fail miserably - in their mission.. does that seem plausible to you and if so, based on what logic;

- how do you see Russia gaining from this act Vs the possible gains this narrative would have to the other side of the table (I can personally see legion pro's for the Brits, a lot of con's for the Russians -
  and the 'warning message' Russian motive doesnt really compute with me - especially if juxtaposed to the pro's GB would receive from this event, it pales in comparison imho);

- in your view, what is the reason Russia is denied access - monitored or else - to Russian national Yulia Skripal; what sort of risk would such allowance possibly pose to the case, the unequivocal
  evidence GB claims to have.


These are some honest questions Id appreciate some honest responses to, I am truely curious as to what you think about these points.

One question: why Russian officials denied existence of Novichyok, huh?!

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3 hours ago, Phaeton80 said:


Thats all fine and well, but let me ask you - because it seems asthough you have been selectively silent about these aspects - the following (and this is meant in al seriousness; I am honestly curious):

- what is your take on the fact your nation has decreed a foreign nation's guilt incl. dishing out penalties well before proven as such - dealing blame to a nation mere days after the event, dishing out
  definitive accusations, you know, before having 'all their ducks in a row'. In effect ignoring the basis of the rule of law, where any accused party is innocent until proven guilty (which doesnt mean 
  'guilty because we have evidene w e will not [yet]disclose');

- what is your reaction to the clearcut lie of dear Boris Johnson concerning supposed categorical proof, claiming Porton Down confirmed this when they in fact did not;

- what is your reaction to the ridiculously infantile and malicious hatchet jobs in your media regarding for instance Jeremy Corbyn, simply for asking inconvenient questions, not falling in line;

- how do you reconcile this man was formally swapped with the Russians 8 years ago being assassinated at this point in time, at this particular location, with this particular method (Russia's signature
  being all over the weapon of choice), to subsequently fail - and fail miserably - in their mission.. does that seem plausible to you and if so, based on what logic;

- how do you see Russia gaining from this act Vs the possible gains this narrative would have to the other side of the table (I can personally see legion pro's for the Brits, a lot of con's for the Russians -
  and the 'warning message' Russian motive doesnt really compute with me - especially if juxtaposed to the pro's GB would receive from this event, it pales in comparison imho);

- in your view, what is the reason Russia is denied access - monitored or else - to Russian national Yulia Skripal; what sort of risk would such allowance possibly pose to the case, the unequivocal
  evidence GB claims to have.


These are some honest questions Id appreciate some honest responses to, I am truely curious as to what you think about these points.

Lets just stick to the facts. I think you need to watch the UN meeting - Especially the British Ambassador as she addresses the points you raise including your Boris Johnson claim.

40mins. for UK Ambassador response.

http://webtv.un.org/meetings-events/watch/security-council-1-the-situation-in-burundi-8223rd-meeting-2-the-attack-in-salisbury-on-4-march-2018-8224th-meeting/5764872226001/?term=

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44 minutes ago, stevewinn said:

Especially the British Ambassador as she addresses the points you raise including your Boris Johnson claim.

40mins. for UK Ambassador response.

while I have said I do believe Russia is directly involved - the ambassadors presentation was light on facts other than saying a lot of people where working on this and we can't tell you more, and it was a type pf Novichyok, and Really she didn't provide a great response to the allegation that Boris mislead the Germans at all. In fact she said what Boris should of said and tried to imply there was no difference in the meaning of the statements. 

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1 hour ago, stevewinn said:

Lets just stick to the facts. I think you need to watch the UN meeting - Especially the British Ambassador as she addresses the points you raise including your Boris Johnson claim.

40mins. for UK Ambassador response.

http://webtv.un.org/meetings-events/watch/security-council-1-the-situation-in-burundi-8223rd-meeting-2-the-attack-in-salisbury-on-4-march-2018-8224th-meeting/5764872226001/?term=


Damn.. I mean, you start off with the uber- ironic 'lets stick to the facts', to subsequently refer to the excessively lacking and rather misleading responses of the UK Ambassador during the UN meeting (as a response to my questions).

I apologize, but I need some time to recover from this Im afraid..

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2 hours ago, Phaeton80 said:


Damn.. I mean, you start off with the uber- ironic 'lets stick to the facts', to subsequently refer to the excessively lacking and rather misleading responses of the UK Ambassador during the UN meeting (as a response to my questions).

I apologize, but I need some time to recover from this Im afraid..

yes please lets stick to the facts, you can do no wrong by following events and proceedings at the UN and those directly released by the UK Govt. what you lack is patience. 

 

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14 hours ago, stevewinn said:

yes please lets stick to the facts, you can do no wrong by following events and proceedings at the UN and those directly released by the UK Govt. what you lack is patience. 

 


If GB would have 'stuck with the facts', they wouldnt have issued definitive blame, even dishing out political penalties, well before the needed facts were established. Thats the whole reason this thread has reached 20 pages of discussion. They didnt have 'all their ducks in a row' when accusing Russia like they did and are. So you lamenting me for thesame, even proclaiming 'what you lack is patience', seems to be of an ironic quality thats hard not to appreciate (facetiously).

Lets just wait for that undisclosed evidence which would make the as of yet used non- evidence for these definitive accusations, legitimate accusations, shall we?

PS. Has anyone heard anything about the claimed Russian laboratory which manufactured this Russian military grade toxin?

 

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Found this to be a rather apt description of the Salisbury narrative..
 

Quote


“Comrade Putin, we have successfully stockpiled novichoks in secret for ten years, and kept them hidden from the OPCW inspectors. We have also trained our agents in secret novichok assassination techniques. The programme has cost hundreds of millions of dollars, but now we are ready. Naturally, the first time we use it we will expose our secret and suffer massive international blowback. So who should be our first target? The head of a foreign intelligence agency? A leading jihadist rebel in Syria? A key nuclear scientist? Even a Head of State?”

“No, Tovarich. There is this old retired guy I know living in Salisbury. We released him from jail years ago…”

“With respect Comrade Putin, are you sure he is the most important target to reveal a programme we have put so much resource into for ten years?”

“Yes. I sit here every day and I cannot concentrate on the affairs of Russia or the World as all the time am thinking of Sergei Skripal. I should never have let him out of jail to spend his life buying lottery tickets and eating in Zizzis. But you must make absolutely certain to kill him.”

“Don’t worry Comrade Putin, we have been training in secret novichok assassination techniques for ten years. We even have an detailed manual explaining our methods. We will spread the novichok on his outside door handle (fiendish laugh).”

“Are you sure comrade? Is there not a danger it will wash off or get diluted?”

“No Comrade Putin, it never rains in England.”
 

That is, genuinely, in every detail the official British government version of what happened in Salisbury, including the ten year programme and the secret assassination manual.

Despite this story being one of the most improbably wild conspiracy theories in human history, it is those who express any doubt at all as to its veracity who are smeared as “conspiracy theorists” or even “traitors”.

Straight from one of the main Russian Stooge's mouthes:
https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/


..Hope we can all have a good chuckle over this, because whatever the case; these are extremely strange times we are living in.

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4 hours ago, Phaeton80 said:


If GB would have 'stuck with the facts', they wouldnt have issued definitive blame, even dishing out political penalties, well before the needed facts were established. Thats the whole reason this thread has reached 20 pages of discussion. They didnt have 'all their ducks in a row' when accusing Russia like they did and are. So you lamenting me for thesame, even proclaiming 'what you lack is patience', seems to be of an ironic quality thats hard not to appreciate (facetiously).

Lets just wait for that undisclosed evidence which would make the as of yet used non- evidence for these definitive accusations, legitimate accusations, shall we?

PS. Has anyone heard anything about the claimed Russian laboratory which manufactured this Russian military grade toxin?

 

The UK authorities have carried out its own investigation analysed the nerve agent used and determined the source of the material used is from the Russian Federation. The UK is well within its right to determine who is responsible and take action. The UK called an emergency meeting at the UN, and invited the UN-OPCW to investigate (independently) with open access to the crime scene and facilities.

The UK is playing this by the rule book, going through all the official channels. Russia on the other hand.

Patience, phaeton. 

 

 

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Saw something earlier in this thread that didn't get addressed, as far as I saw. The lethal dosage of Novichok.

Let's compare it to VX. VX (and all toxic agents) has an LD50 (median lethal dose that kills 50 percent of a test sample). Novichok is said to be 5 - 8 times more lethal than VX. That is, back of the envelope, it will take 5 - 8 times less to reach an equivalent LD50.

So what is the LD50 dosage of VX?

10 mg.

That is a very, very small amount. About 7 times the mass of a mosquito. 

In other words, that means that 50 percent of people exposed to ONE MOSQUITO'S WORTH of Novichok will die. Crazy stuff. Not a large amount.

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Well the verdict is in, and is well... 

Quote

The Organisation for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons did not name the nerve agent as Novichok, but said it agreed with the UK's findings on its identity.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43741140

Just because your eating a croissant doesn’t mean it was made in France!

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Report by the OPCW as been released, and - The international chemical weapons watchdog has confirmed the UK's analysis of the type of nerve agent used in the Russian ex-spy poisoning.  The OPCW said it received information about the medical conditions of the Skripals and Det Sgt Nick Bailey, it collected their blood samples, and it gathered samples from the site in Salisbury.

So the UK was correct that it was Novichok and of a high quality grade. only possible by a top state Scientific Laboratory made by experts. 

Who has this Capability, (Russia)  Who was known to have a Novichok programme? (Russia) Who was targeted with the Nerve Agent (Ex-Russian KGB/FSB Agent) 

But according to the Conspiracy theorists. it wasn't Russia it was someone else, but they cant tell us who.

Edited by stevewinn
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