City Kicks God Out Of Meetings

[XenoFish]

3 minutes ago, third_eye said:

Oh go fly that kite like old Ben ...

~

Title	Benjamin Franklin Drawing Electricity from the Sky
Object type	Painting
Date	circa 1816

~

• wiki link

I can't use child labor to help me get electrocuted. That's illegal. Midgets maybe......

[XenoFish]

4 minutes ago, and then said:

So is mine but I also recognize that history proves one thing in an endless, repetitive loop.  We are unable to work together for more than short periods of time before some element decides to crush, subjugate and control the "others" who just won't "cooperate" with a better plan.  It is who and what we ARE and until we finally prove this to ourselves by coming right up to the edge of annihilation, we won't be willing to change as a species.  That's not my hope, that's just the reality as I see it.  Frankly, I prefer yours.

If you keep talking like that people are going to think you're a pessimist. 

[+Not A Rockstar]

4 minutes ago, and then said:

So is mine but I also recognize that history proves one thing in an endless, repetitive loop.  We are unable to work together for more than short periods of time before some element decides to crush, subjugate and control the "others" who just won't "cooperate" with a better plan.  It is who and what we ARE and until we finally prove this to ourselves by coming right up to the edge of annihilation, we won't be willing to change as a species.  That's not my hope, that's just the reality as I see it.  Frankly, I prefer yours.

I very recently realized my ideas about Christianity revolved around a far too humanized deity and woke up. The readjustment has breathed new life into my hope. Anyway, I believe we will move toward better ground and after a lot of thrashing around we will come out ahead. 

[Piney]

One of the reasons Woodbury is really tolerant of the rights of others because of my now deceased older sister Sondra Ball. She was the first Native head of a Friends (Quaker) Quarter and she was centered in Woodbury. When gay marriage was illegal she was preforming them right at the Woodbury Friends Meeting and sent a letter to Christie telling him to eff off. 

[SHaYap]

8 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

I can't use child labor to help me get electrocuted. That's illegal. Midgets maybe......

Ahhh .. .feeling better already I see

~

[XenoFish]

3 minutes ago, third_eye said:

Ahhh .. .feeling better already I see

~

You know lightening and midgets. It's weird and don't judge.

[XenoFish]

It's that whole separation of church and state. I can't see the dividing line.

[+and-then]

36 minutes ago, Not A Rockstar said:

I believe we will move toward better ground and after a lot of thrashing around we will come out ahead. 

I agree...that's exactly what the Revelation of St John was all about.  It tells the story of that "thrashing around" and how humanity comes out ahead afterward.  

[jmccr8]

1 hour ago, Not A Rockstar said:

ok per the University of Delaware he only sired one kid out of wedlock before his marriage. 

http://www1.udel.edu/PR/UDaily/2005/mar/franklin061605.html

It was research I tell you.

jmccr8

[Mr Walker]

12 hours ago, BorizBadinov said:

Now people just need to realize there doesn't need to be a moment of silence either. Get the business done and then head to church or Netflix or whatever after. You can adhere to your own moral values without any scripture quote precursor. If you really need to pray get there 5 mins early. 

However, if you are in govt of some sort,  even a school council,  You cant simply apply your own moral values.  You are representing many people with many different values and moralities Personally i think every meeting should begin with something that reminds the  attendees of their role,   duties,and responsibility, and the expectation of probity and honesty which is expected of office bearers at any level.  

[Stubbly_Dooright]

21 hours ago, Piney said:

YAY!!!!

http://www.nj.com/gloucester-county/index.ssf/2018/03/in_bid_to_become_more_inclusive_city_scraps_invoca.html#incart_most_shared-south

This was supported by the Quakers of the Salem Quarter. One of them a former councilman and a friend of mine.

If I was still living in NJ, I would be saying yay too!   Though, I was living in Burlington County. *shrugs* 

But, interesting enough, I always thought there were all kinds of people, religions and none, that lived here, considering how small and thin the state was. But, it was also in this state, I was at the receiving end of quite a few pushy religious people too. (Which, I have talked about on here.  ) Anyways, those in the articles talking about it's good for inclusion and such, well........ yes, I feel that it definitely is.   Politics is for politics, which means everyone included. It's not the place for religion, since there would be the line of what religion trumps over others and none, and vice versa. 

19 hours ago, and then said:

but I think the outward expression of faith through works and community is critical to our society as well.

Doing things through works and community can be done, without a particular faith. I'm not arguing that works and community is not important to society, but the idea that a faith 100 percent inspires it, doesn't seem to be the case for me. And which faith is doing that? And which faith doesn't do that? Are all the faiths the same, and do that? There might be some universal ideal with a lot of them, but to the letter of it? Who gets the pick to say which has what is for the good, and which does not? And what faith is picked, is everything about that faith proving to inspire good? Do you omit some of it, that it doesn't? 

19 hours ago, and then said:

Whether people like it or not, there is a clear correspondence between the loosening of public morals and the decay of our culture and institutions.

I'm curious of where you get your sources from. Do you have links? 

19 hours ago, and then said:

Attribute that degradation to whatever you like but the correlation is clearly supported. 

By who? ( I would really love to see links ) 

20 hours ago, and then said:

One need not believe in the same God to respect others but in this particular nation, we DID begin with faith in God and it shaped our path for many decades. 

Along with shaping the path for slavery, lack of rights for women, other races, and other religions, and Atheists, 

20 hours ago, and then said:

The thing is, God doesn't even have to be real for this effect to be real. 

Which even you saying  here, there doesn't have to be a God then. It could be anything, that could inspire a shared morality, right? 

Quote

It is the sense of shared morality that such belief endowed that is now missing.

I'm curious to what that is, you are talking about. 

I remember, being on a military base in Jersey, during 9/11. Everyone, on the base, off the base, all over, got together to help out. I remember, in the mall that I worked, when my store closed for a couple hours to honor those who died, I went into the religious chapel there, (the only mall I knew that had one) and despite telling them I'm secular, opened their arms to let me sit and think. I remember people all over helping others, and there wasn't one particular religion being represented saying to do this. It was the actual empathy that everyone had that inspired them. What ever faith that was there in particular individuals, it was just inside of them, and so when one helps another, it was because they said they wanted to. Not because they said, their belief told them to do. Plus, it seems more personal when someone does it, because they want to, not because something told them to do it. 

I always felt, when someone does something to do it and just get it done, it doesn't get done right. 

If it's missing, I don't see it in these very situations. 

15 hours ago, Farmer77 said:

16 hours ago, Not A Rockstar said:

LMAO. Was this before or after his alleged b****** kids were birthed

Well you'll notice his schedule did not say "pray to gawd" but "address powerful goodness" ....despite the mythology our founders didn't walk in lockstep when it came to religion - which I'm sure you probably know but considering the increased hyperbole about America "turning from god" its worth mentioning 

I just don't get, or understand, or see it on the same lines of 'kicking God out' of it. Kicking God out, means he was there, literally, in the first place. I know, some will say, but he is. Ok, I get that. But, that is talking on the level of subjectivity, and there will be the subjective thinking by others, that he's not and reasoning evident by sight, ( or the lack there of ) 

If one is going to say, 'they're kicking God out of this' can also be said of 'kicking Allah out of it', 'kicking the Goddess out of it', 'kicking Thor out of it', 'kicking the force out of it', 'kicking the Flying Spaghetti Monster' out of it', and so on, and so on. ...... now that I think about it, maybe that's a good thing, the kicking out of, because if not, that's one packed room!!!   If God is suppose to be allowed in, so is all the rest. Like I believe the article says, they want everyone to feel included, and looking at subjective beliefs and their attributes is favoring some over others, and that is not inclusion. 

The way I see it, if someone talks about kicking someone out, it should be someone everyone can see being kicked out. 

 

[Stubbly_Dooright]

15 hours ago, Piney said:

One of the reasons Woodbury is really tolerant of the rights of others because of my now deceased older sister Sondra Ball. She was the first Native head of a Friends (Quaker) Quarter and she was centered in Woodbury. When gay marriage was illegal she was preforming them right at the Woodbury Friends Meeting and sent a letter to Christie telling him to eff off. 

Makes me wonder, if it was good to have left years before he was gov. When we first got to NJ, when it came to the gov and the name Christie, it was in the first name.  

15 hours ago, XenoFish said:

15 hours ago, third_eye said:

Ahhh .. .feeling better already I see

~

You know lightening and midgets. It's weird and don't judge.

  That's my boy!   

 

[Piney]

47 minutes ago, Stubbly_Dooright said:

When we first got to NJ, when it came to the gov and the name Christie, it was in the first name.  

I liked her and met her during equine events several times.  She was good to the Pine Barrens. The New Jersey Democrats aren't.

[Stubbly_Dooright]

22 minutes ago, Piney said:

1 hour ago, Stubbly_Dooright said:

When we first got to NJ, when it came to the gov and the name Christie, it was in the first name.  

I liked her and met her during equine events several times.  She was good to the Pine Barrens. The New Jersey Democrats aren't.

I never personally met her, but I and my family were on one military base taking advantage of it's offerings (Ok, we were go carting  ) and I remember there was something going on there too, (an event I guess) and she was there walking along with a group of people. This was like 20 to 30 feet away, so I only saw her from a distance. 

I think she is a good bit tall. 

But yeah, I liked her too, and felt she was a good gov. 

 

Edited March 27, 2018 by Stubbly_Dooright
For some reason, my puter did not like the number 3.