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rashore

Real Magic by Dean Radin

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rashore
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Dean Radin, Ph.D., has pursued the most mind-boggling fringes of science — ESP, telepathy, and other wonders — earnestly and with excellence for decades. He is the chief scientist at the Institute of Noetic Sciences (link is external) (IONS) in Petaluma, CA, a next-level research and educational organization founded by the late astronaut Dr. Edgar Mitchell. Dr. Radin also worked on the United States government's top-secret psychic espionage program, known as Stargate. 

His new book, Real Magic (link is external) (Harmony, April 10), is a triumph of an open mind over limitations. As his publisher points out, what was magic 2,000 years ago is scientific fact today. No less than Brian Josephson, Nobel Laureate in Physics and Emeritus Professor of Physics, University of Cambridge, calls it, "A thought-provoking book. The author makes a convincing case for the reality and significance of magic.”

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/sensorium/201803/real-magic

Dr. Dean Radin Brings Real Magic to the Psi Lab: http://skeptiko.com/dean-radin-brings-real-magic-to-the-psi-lab-377/

 

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XenoFish

It'll never end.

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Piney

Noetic sciences......yay

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XenoFish

I really should write a book on magick.:lol:

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Piney
Just now, XenoFish said:

I really should write a book on magick.:lol:

It would sell, no kidding! :tu:

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XenoFish
2 minutes ago, Piney said:

It would sell, no kidding! :tu:

I just need Oprah to endorse it. Fill it with the same recycled stuff as every "get something for nothing" book out there.

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rashore

Lol, kind of figured you two would get enjoyment out of this topic. I hope others do as well.

And Xeno.. I think it would make for an interesting read indeed if you wrote up your knowledge in book form.

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Piney
44 minutes ago, XenoFish said:

I just need Oprah to endorse it. Fill it with the same recycled stuff as every "get something for nothing" book out there.

If Oprah endorsed the head of the KKK who wrote a fictional biography of himself, she would endorse anybody.

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Clockwork_Spirit
Posted (edited)

Dean Radin is a great mind, a research scientist. Skeptics have a tendency to underestimate him because of his interests in fringe topics.

Edited by Clockwork_Spirit

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XenoFish
On 4/12/2018 at 12:25 PM, rashore said:

Lol, kind of figured you two would get enjoyment out of this topic. I hope others do as well.

And Xeno.. I think it would make for an interesting read indeed if you wrote up your knowledge in book form.

There wouldn't be much to it. Other than the stuff I already post for free. 

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ChrLzs
On 4/15/2018 at 2:56 PM, Clockwork_Spirit said:

Dean Radin is a great mind, a research scientist. Skeptics have a tendency to underestimate him because of his interests in fringe topics.

May I ask which of his studies/papers best shows his great mind?   I don't mean an entire book - let's focus on an actual example of his work, and let's look at how it stands up.  I've only looked at one in detail.. and it didn't stand up at all.

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psyche101
14 minutes ago, ChrLzs said:

May I ask which of his studies/papers best shows his great mind?   I don't mean an entire book - let's focus on an actual example of his work, and let's look at how it stands up.  I've only looked at one in detail.. and it didn't stand up at all.

I was going to ask the same thing. As far as I know the best work all his research has culminated in is Men Who Stare at Goats 

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ChaosRose
7 hours ago, psyche101 said:

I was going to ask the same thing. As far as I know the best work all his research has culminated in is Men Who Stare at Goats 

That was a fun read.

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ChrLzs

Clockwork Spirit, are you not returning to discuss Dean Radin's actual work?  I promise to be as polite as is possible...

If you are nervous about picking his 'best' work, (and that nervousness would be quite sensible), I'd suggest you might want to take a look here, for some examples that you might wish to avoid...

http://www.skepticforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=22973

Yes, it's a skeptics page, but it actually goes through some of these 'studies' (none of which have made it into credible journals, and that's not because of 'unfair' rejection..), and note that aside from the procedural/methodology issues -even in what might be claimed as the most supportive studies - the effects are barely beyond random.  The studies make no claim of 'proof', instead suggesting that further more rigorous studies are needed.  On the very few occasions such studies are done, they show either less (or no) statistical significance.  Dare I suggest that as you apply proper controls, the cheating (some of which is not deliberate) stops.

 

Note that I shall be returning to continue the Rupert Sheldrake book review thread shortly:

https://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum/topic/313864-review-sheldrakes-dogs-who-know-when/

- as Radin is often mentioned in conjunction with Sheldrake, interested readers are invited to join in....

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psyche101
13 hours ago, ChaosRose said:

That was a fun read.

And a good movie :)

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Clockwork_Spirit
4 hours ago, ChrLzs said:

Clockwork Spirit, are you not returning to discuss Dean Radin's actual work?  I promise to be as polite as is possible...

If you are nervous about picking his 'best' work, (and that nervousness would be quite sensible), I'd suggest you might want to take a look here, for some examples that you might wish to avoid...

We have been there. I know Dean Radin to be an incredibly intelligent man, from having read most of his books and listened to some of his lectures. I don't need your approval. He has published many papers on parapsychological studies, even if I pick one and post it here, you are going to dismiss it no matter what. You have made up your mind and nothing is going to change that. So what is the point of engaging in such a futile exercise, pray?

Edited by Clockwork_Spirit

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ChrLzs
1 hour ago, Clockwork_Spirit said:

We have been there. I know Dean Radin to be an incredibly intelligent man

And that should be good enough, no matter what the quality of his work?

Quote

 from having read most of his books and listened to some of his lectures.

If you have expertise in the field, eg of proper testing methodology, you should then be able to pick a really good example of his work.

If you DON'T have that expertise (and there's no shame in that), then that would explain why you would be (wisely) unwilling to do so.  But if you don't have expertise, then there is rather less reason to just take your word that he's a genius....

So, I'd suggest you pick that proverbial best example of his work, or wear the rather obvious inference. I'll be happy to pick one if you refuse, but then don't complain if my choice turns out to be a really bad example...

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I don't need your approval.

This isn't about approval - this is a discussion forum, one where we look at the facts and evidence and how it was gathered.  If in doing so we find faults, then you are welcome to pick holes in our complaints and point out where we go wrong.  If you or your fellow Radin fans can't.. then would you not agree that it is probably Radin who went wrong..?

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He has published many papers on parapsychological studies

Then just cite one of his best - one that shows significant statistical evidence for any sort of 'real magic' or paranormal abilities on the basis of properly collected and documented data.  Look, I'm not even asking that it be published by a credible journal - I'm happy to go through it with you in detail and point out the concerns, no matter what the source.  Can I possibly be fairer than that?  Shouldn't you be relishing the chance to show how I'm wrong and Radin's right?  There are some quite simple concepts involved here, concepts that are designed to ensure that studies are done fairly, logically, and that the possibility of cheating is eliminated or at least minimised.  I'll explain them as we go, so you can dispute them if you can..  Now if Radin didn't follow those concepts, then wouldn't you agree that he might just be suckering the gullible (and or himself?)?  Perhaps walking in the steps of J.B. Rhine?  (Shall I elaborate?)

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even if I pick one and post it here, you are going to dismiss it no matter what.

Don't tell me in advance what I'm going to do from your fantasy land... I'm going to go through it in detail with a fine tooth comb and explain in simple terms where the errors are, if any.  If you can't argue those errors away, then it seems to me to be clear that it's *you* that has the 'dismissive' approach...  The word hypocrisy springs to mind...

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You have made up your mind and nothing is going to change that. So what is the point of engaging in such a futile exercise, pray?

Re-read my previous paragraph - over and over until you understand it.  If I'm the one willing to examine the study in detail (one of your choosing), and yet you are running for the hills refusing to engage in discussion, then who is it that has made up their mind, pray?

 

 

Added PS, I note everything old is new again...

https://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum/topic/293088-the-james-randi-1m-challenge-terminated/?do=findComment&comment=5809350

At least, back then, Truthseeker aka Clockwork Spirit was right that Radin wasn't the subject of the thread.  But here, he is...

Edited by ChrLzs
meny spelun erers
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