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Sir Smoke aLot

US state promotion of White Helmets

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Sir Smoke aLot
Posted (edited)

I've just found this video, it's from 25th of February ( at least that's when it was published ) and not sure if personally Venessa Beeley is responsible for this Youtube channel but she is one of most honorable journalists who did a lot to spread truth from Aleppo and from other regions in Syria. Especially for disclosing White Helmets members for who they really are.

What we can see here is state promotion of one particular viewpoint. I guess that is why we can see repeated tries of fabricating stories by using the same instruments and logic, even tho it was proven to be false on many occasions.

'' ... I am not supposed to encourage people to go see things or do some things but i do not care i am going to break that rule BECAUSE I THINK... '' Heather Nauert.

Making history, must feel proud.

 

 [edit] to add two videos related to white helmets source

And most recent, made on same recipe :

Russian propaganda or information worth of our attention?

Edited by Sir Smoke aLot
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Dark_Grey

Creepy..

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and then
5 hours ago, Dark_Grey said:

Creepy..

So, the bodies weren't real, either?  IF this turns out to be accurate, at least no one was killed in the strikes that flowed from the evidence.  Aeschylus certainly had it right, all those years ago.

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GlitterRose

I think we have to remember this...

Syrians appearing on state television or on channels associated with the Assad government are not able to speak freely. The government exerts tight control over all information broadcast about the war, including interviews with civilians, who can be coerced and threatened with arrest if they criticize the government.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/06/world/middleeast/omran-daqneesh-syria-aleppo.html

I think they're making him say this stuff. After all, his 10 year-old son was killed in the same attack. And it was either Assad forces or Russian air strikes.

Yet he's not saying a thing about that. 

 

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Clockwork_Spirit
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, ChaosRose said:

I think we have to remember this...

Syrians appearing on state television or on channels associated with the Assad government are not able to speak freely. The government exerts tight control over all information broadcast about the war, including interviews with civilians, who can be coerced and threatened with arrest if they criticize the government.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/06/world/middleeast/omran-daqneesh-syria-aleppo.html

I think they're making him say this stuff. After all, his 10 year-old son was killed in the same attack. And it was either Assad forces or Russian air strikes.

Yet he's not saying a thing about that. 

 

What would be the point for the Assad government to launch a chemical attack and then go to great lenght to try to cover it up? Wouldn't that defeat the entire purpose of spreading fear and terror among the whole population? What seems clear now is that children are being used in propagandist videos by anti-Assad opposition groups. That much has been exposed by some serious journalistic work. As we speak, every journalists who have set foot in Douma and medical facilities to investigate the claims of a chemical attack have not found a shred of evidence. In fact, it's the contrary...

Edited by Clockwork_Spirit

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Sir Smoke aLot
8 hours ago, and then said:

So, the bodies weren't real, either?

Maybe they were real, after 7 years of terrible war they had bodies everywhere :( But it was proven that White Helmets produce videos and fabricate claims.

I do not disregard the possibility that militants did actually use chemicals in order to get foreign help, at some point in all these years. Stashes of chemicals were found by SAA on few occasions. But there is no evidence for that either.

One thing i fear now is that, in order to stop Syria wining the war, ground invasion is possibility. Only by doing so would the evidence be buried. But i hope it won't come to that after almost 8 years of war... If Syrian people didn't like their government it would be over in the first year, as it was done in Iraq, Libya etc.

8 hours ago, and then said:

at least no one was killed in the strikes that flowed from the evidence

At least something positive. 

 

7 hours ago, ChaosRose said:

Syrians appearing on state television or on channels associated with the Assad government are not able to speak freely. The government exerts tight control over all information broadcast about the war, including interviews with civilians, who can be coerced and threatened with arrest if they criticize the government.

If Americans can walk and talk freely even just after the attacks than i am not sure why Syrians would have to shut their mouth, so to say.

And even in 2012, there were BBC reporters and look how Syrians reacted :

NY Times story just doesn't hold weight.

It was possibility of course but when i calculate all reports such narrative just can't be sustained. If we accuse Syrian government of repression and of terrorizing it's own people why would we support armed militants then? In state affairs there has to be at least some order which can't be said for so called 'peaceful rebels'.

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Sir Smoke aLot

As for credible sources, here is what Eva Barlet has to say, after having spent years in Syria. At 13:19 there is question made by one of MSM (?) journalist, very interesting.

It's old story.

Worth mention and watch is everything which Venesa Beeley has to say and when did the MSM provide counter arguments and better narrative when compared to what these, mostly independent, journalists do. They risked lives on the ground in Syria, MSM 'risks' integrity in their warm chairs elsewhere.

When did MSM made some public report or discussion? Which was not based on fabricated stories. Where are awards for Eva and Venessa? Their awards are loosing their jobs and sacrificing their carriers for the truth.

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GlitterRose
9 hours ago, Clockwork_Spirit said:

What would be the point for the Assad government to launch a chemical attack and then go to great lenght to try to cover it up? Wouldn't that defeat the entire purpose of spreading fear and terror among the whole population? What seems clear now is that children are being used in propagandist videos by anti-Assad opposition groups. That much has been exposed by some serious journalistic work. As we speak, every journalists who have set foot in Douma and medical facilities to investigate the claims of a chemical attack have not found a shred of evidence. In fact, it's the contrary...

He looked terrible to the world when everyone saw what happened to that boy. 

So he tries to make the world think it was all a hoax. 

It's complete bs, but you're buying it. 

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GlitterRose
Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Sir Smoke aLot said:

Maybe they were real, after 7 years of terrible war they had bodies everywhere :( But it was proven that White Helmets produce videos and fabricate claims.

I do not disregard the possibility that militants did actually use chemicals in order to get foreign help, at some point in all these years. Stashes of chemicals were found by SAA on few occasions. But there is no evidence for that either.

One thing i fear now is that, in order to stop Syria wining the war, ground invasion is possibility. Only by doing so would the evidence be buried. But i hope it won't come to that after almost 8 years of war... If Syrian people didn't like their government it would be over in the first year, as it was done in Iraq, Libya etc.

At least something positive. 

 

If Americans can walk and talk freely even just after the attacks than i am not sure why Syrians would have to shut their mouth, so to say.

And even in 2012, there were BBC reporters and look how Syrians reacted :

NY Times story just doesn't hold weight.

It was possibility of course but when i calculate all reports such narrative just can't be sustained. If we accuse Syrian government of repression and of terrorizing it's own people why would we support armed militants then? In state affairs there has to be at least some order which can't be said for so called 'peaceful rebels'.

It's just like how some people manage to actually believe that Putin has an 87% approval rating, when people get shot in front of the Kremlin for opposing him.

Why would anybody believe that?

Unless they didn't actually believe it, and they had an agenda to just spread this disinfo. 

Edited by ChaosRose

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GlitterRose

Why isn't he talking about the fact that his 10 year old died in the same attack, that was done by Syrian forces or Russia?

Do you think you'd actually support someone responsible for the death of your son?

They probably threatened the little guy. 

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Sir Smoke aLot
51 minutes ago, ChaosRose said:

It's just like how some people manage to actually believe that Putin has an 87% approval rating, when people get shot in front of the Kremlin for opposing him.

My guess is that it's Soviet era leftover, in a way. Many people see Russia a bit through what KGB was doing in Soviet era :) Since Putin has history in KGB it ain't hard to link those murders to him but, again, no evidence.

Many people in power would love some concrete evidence against Russia and against Putin and if there was evidence it would be known. It's like story about NASA and Moon landing, since so many people had to be involved in the project and many contractors too, if Armstrong didn't land on the Moon we would know by now.

I find it hard to believe.

54 minutes ago, ChaosRose said:

Why isn't he talking about the fact that his 10 year old died in the same attack, that was done by Syrian forces or Russia?

It is fair question. Since they were under oppressive militant rule their lives were on the edge all of the time and since those militants did (and continue to) use Syrians as human shields, terrible things do happen. Actually i wonder how there was no larger loss of lives, especially when government started actions to liberate many areas in Syria. Don't you think that we would see hundreds of bodies all around? It would be enough to get public support to start larger operations against Syria. But there were no mass graves nor massacres as a result of government actions.

In Damascus, at one occasion, 137 people died as a result of militant shelling from mortars from within Eastern Ghouta. In MSM those victims were reported as ''137 government supporters dead''. That's when i realized that whole narrative is wrong.

Why i believe the story is because hundreds of thousands of internally displaced people have returned to government held areas and Omran's family is living in Aleppo since it was liberated. Don't you think that his family, if they blame government for their loss, would be living in Aleppo still to this day?

I do not think so.

1 hour ago, ChaosRose said:

They probably threatened the little guy. 

As i said above, little kid was abused and threatened by militants every day until SAA liberated those areas.

I am sorry but i can never be a voice for people like these on this link.

If it took some collateral damage to liberate those people it was price that had to be payed. After all, collateral damage is beloved term by many.

So, in short, i feel that what we discuss right now is about which side has the right to abuse civilians. I can not be dragged into that and SAA has never caged anyone.

These are freed people from terrorist jails :

And here we see other part from Eastern Ghouta with army lines of SAA walking through town :

I might be wrong but i see humanity in these, rather than in videos of caged people. 

Sorry for longer post but it's difficult to make a point with so much disinformation around. I use Syriana Analysis as source, there are other sources too.

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Sir Smoke aLot

@ChaosRose i also have question, don't you find it weird that Hollywood gave Oscar to White Helmets and that now US state department is publicly (contrary to American values) asking for support and is giving support for those who follow White Helmets?

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GlitterRose

Why is it contrary to American values to support a humanitarian group?

I don't believe all this crazy propaganda you're posting, obviously.

There are humanitarian groups who are on the ground, who have done plenty of investigations about all of this stuff.

I believe them over Assad, because it's ridiculous not to. 

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GlitterRose

And I believe this poor man is only saying this stuff because he's forced to.

Because he already lost one son and probably had his other son threatened. 

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Clockwork_Spirit
Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, ChaosRose said:

There are humanitarian groups who are on the ground, who have done plenty of investigations about all of this stuff.

I believe them over Assad, because it's ridiculous not to. 

I personally wouldn't trust the White Helmets, an organization with known ties to jihadist groups.

https://www.activistpost.com/2017/11/i-visited-east-aleppo-there-is-no-doubt-nusra-and-white-helmets-are-the-same-organization.html

 

Edited by Clockwork_Spirit

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