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aztek

2020 Democratic presidential candidate

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aztek
20 minutes ago, Katniss said:

You mean eventually? Right? Sometimes it takes a long time to find a job. I was unemployed for nearly a year on one occasion. I'd put applications in everywhere and it didn't matter to me what the job was, but I couldn't get anybody to hire me. Of course a bad economy at the time in the area I lived in probably didn't help either, but I thought there would be at least somebody out there who needed help. That apparently wasn't the case.

that totally depends on your skill, trade, and experience,  demand in your area.  none of which you mentioned, 

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aztek
Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, DieChecker said:

 

We're producing generations of people who are holding out Victim Mentality and making demands of easy work and lots of money.

that mentality does not produce good workers either,  they are pita to work with and often they are let go soon after,  i interview people and if i sense that mentality, i wont hire. then they wonder why they are fired, or why no one hires them, and blame everyone around

Edited by aztek
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DieChecker
On 4/26/2018 at 5:14 PM, Aquila King said:

It's like you're blissfully unaware of the literally trillions of dollars of tax cuts Trump and the Republicans gave to the super rich, or that 0.1% of Americans own more wealth then the other 99.9% combined, or that we've wasted trillions of dollars (if you count interest) in Iraq alone, much less any other wasted military venture.

The money's there, it's just not in your paycheck. It's in the pockets of those scammers you voted for.

The top 1% of Rich in the US own just under 40% of US wealth. Where did you get your numbers? OHHH!!! Made up, right? Trying to prove a point by making stuff up....

Also, actually, the Rich support the GOP and the Dems just about equally... That all of the Rich are GOP is a myth. Dems are reaping the tax break equally with the GOP.

Fig_1presidential_vote.0.png

As to trillions given to the Rich, I suppose it depends on how long of a time span you are talking about. Estimates I've read are about $5 trillion over 10 years. So, about 500 billion per year.

The only thing I will not argue is that the military wasted trillions in adventurism in the Middle East.

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DieChecker
3 minutes ago, aztek said:

that mentality does not produce good workers either,  they are pita to work with and often they are let go soon after,  i interview people and if i sense that mentality, i wont hire. then they wonder why they are fired, or why no one hires them, and blame everyone around

Correct... They blame everyone but themselves. "That manager was a snob..." I think it is more and more prevalent. 

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DieChecker
On 4/24/2018 at 7:13 PM, NicoletteS said:

1000 a month? And you have to live on that as a total income? You can't even get rent that cheap here... so...

Well... Yeah, they'd have to nationalize all apartments. And probably outlaw cars. And probably standardize and control grocery prices... for starters... for the good of all.. Of Course...

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Katniss
Posted (edited)
31 minutes ago, aztek said:

that totally depends on your skill, trade, and experience,  demand in your area.  none of which you mentioned, 

Yeah I had a factory job before I was laid off. I guess that kind of experience didn't qualify to flip hamburgers or work in department stores. But when I think about it now, I think it was mostly due to low demand for workers in my area at the time. I guess every able bodied adult can't be employed all at the same time. There is always going to be a small percentage unemployed at any given time.

Edited by Katniss
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aztek

i had a friend who had telephone tech installer job, one time 1000s of them were laid off in the area, while he was on unemployment he went to trade school and got skills and certificate for hvac repair,  unlike others technicians who were laid off,  and looking for same job, he was looking for both telephone tech, and hvac tech,  his chances of finding a job went up 2x

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Katniss
7 minutes ago, aztek said:

i had a friend who had telephone tech installer job, one time 1000s of them were laid off in the area, while he was on unemployment he went to trade school and got skills and certificate for hvac repair,  unlike others technicians who were laid off,  and looking for same job, he was looking for both telephone tech, and hvac tech,  his chances of finding a job went up 2x

That was a great idea. Made him more competitive in the job market.

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DieChecker
On 4/23/2018 at 1:05 PM, aztek said:

If this was in the US, there would be a uber Liberal Federal Judge who would tell the government that they would have to Continue the program, as those who are on it will not be able to function without it. Probably it would lead to a government shutdown over legislation in Congress.... (see DACA controversy)

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Aquila King
16 hours ago, Krater said:

First off, making pitiful excuses for yourself is not putting anyone in their place. There is always a job available to anyone that really wants to work. Always. Your victim mentality is very telling. Until you become a contributing member of society instead of a leech on it, your opinion on these matters means Jack Squat.

Second, I am not a conservative. Not everyone fits into your little preconceived boxes. :)

Finally, clean up your immature language lest you continue to look like a child throwing a tantrum.

Thankfully I'm strong enough now to take someone chastising me for being abused, but I hope and pray that you never encounter any other abuse victim, because I shudder to think of the psychological harm your hatefulness would cause...

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Tatetopa
On 4/23/2018 at 1:09 PM, aztek said:

why would anyone work then?

There was a story about this once.  Everybody got free food and housing.  The free food was bug protein.  The incentive to work was buying steaks.

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Tatetopa
On 4/23/2018 at 1:12 PM, F3SS said:

I’m telling you right now that in the case of a basic income for all I am going to work less. Someone else can pick up my slack.

i would say that if you are happy with $1000 bucks a month and willing to let other people pick up the slack, you may not be too valuable on your current job with an attitude like that.  I wouldn't hire you to work in my foundry.

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RavenHawk
3 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

There was a story about this once.  Everybody got free food and housing.  The free food was bug protein.  The incentive to work was buying steaks.

Classic Socialism!

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Tatetopa
On 4/24/2018 at 8:00 AM, preacherman76 said:

Its a bad spot, no doubt about it. I think the idea of automation will collapse on its own. You cant take away millions of jobs and think people are still going to buy your products at anywhere near the level they did. What good is automation when no one can afford to buy your products? ETA- Especially if those companies are going to be taxed into oblivion on top of it.

Once enough companies switch over where its actually effecting the market, they will see its a bad idea. To bad we will have to watch it play out though.

Are you going to have a law about that or let the free enterprise system take its course?  If you depend on capitalism, what company would want to give up the automation advantage?

Think about the guy in the freight hauling business.  When AI matures and self driving trucks take over, why will he need drivers.  His trucks will be on the road 24 /7  Nobody calls in sick, quits or has a baby.    He could probably lower his rates and out=compete human operated vehicles.  Why does he care if a bunch of unemployed guys can't buy groceries?

Think about the grocery store manager.  With stocking robots and receiving robots operating all night and self checkers operating all day, he can outcompete the heave labor costs of other stores.  Why does he care about a bunch of unemployed guys who can't buy groceries?  With less overhead, he can sell less and still make more money.

Why does a major stockholder in Ford or GM care if a bunch of unemployed guy cant afford cars?  Robots are cheaper, sales are down profits are up.

If a robot can build multi-story buildings complete with wiring, plumbing, and finishing, why would construction companies care about a bunch of unemployed guys who can't buy groceries?  They are competitive and making lots of money.

I don't think the trend will stop because of good judgement, common sense, or humanitarian concern for our fellow men.  I think it might go all the way to collapse.

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Tatetopa
On 4/24/2018 at 8:04 AM, RavenHawk said:

The only way for humans to build wealth is through a strong work ethic

Does not return on capital increase more quickly than wages increase?  It takes more than string work ethic or people working multiple jobs would be wealthy.  The increases in worth of my 401K have far exceeded increases in salary for the last 20 years, even counting promotions.

Strong work ethic is laudable, but is not enough.  It is a carrot on a very long stick to think it is enough.

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Likely Guy
Just now, Tatetopa said:

Does not return on capital increase more quickly than wages increase?  It takes more than string work ethic or people working multiple jobs would be wealthy.  The increases in worth of my 401K have far exceeded increases in salary for the last 20 years, even counting promotions.

Strong work ethic is laudable, but is not enough.  It is a carrot on a very long stick to think it is enough.

Meanwhile the stick grows while the carrot shrinks.

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Tatetopa
On 4/24/2018 at 9:06 AM, RavenHawk said:

With automation means that others can get into the game and compete.  Nobody will be trying to maintain profit levels by making less.  Profit and motivation is based on greed and self-interest.  That is what drives the whole thing.  It is the Invisible Hand.  This attitude benefits more people.

Can you give an example please? I am having trouble wrapping my head around this.   Raw materials cost money, labor and equipment cost money.  Why would someone not attempt to increase margins rather than increase productivity?  All of the margin increase goes right to the bottom line.  Only a portion of the increased production becomes profit.

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Tatetopa
On 4/24/2018 at 9:29 AM, RavenHawk said:

No doubt they are going to try, but there is nothing that will stop automation.  Socialists keep bringing that up to favor their point, but they don’t take it all the way to its full potential.  It’s not going to take 30 or 40 years for prices to be such that others can get into the game.  Someone may have to make a serious investment for a 3D printer, but once they do and start making some cog that is used in some machine that wears out on a regular basis, it then becomes easier to acquire said cog from the small business to replace the cog in the machine.  That’s innovation.  The corporation, if still in business or still making the machine can’t tool for just the single cog outside of the assembly the cog is in.  But a small company geared for that can do it cheaper.

Raven,even a really good  a 3D printer is less than $50K.  That's not a lot of money, but that is a fraction of the cost to be competitive.  How do you get the design for the cog?  Do you steal it from the company that makes the machine?  It is probably protected intellectual property. The corporation probably has a service department if they make the machine to sell or a maintenance department if they use it and wear out parts.  They have their own 3D printer in the backshop chugging out repair kits.

Do you try to make a living selling it cheaper than they can?  They can price cut you out of business.  The corporation can impose warranty restrictions on their customers to the effect that only corporate produced genuine replacement parts can be used or the machine warranty is void.  Or they can buy parts from you and not pay you for 90 days.

Got any idea how hard it is for a small business to collect from a large corporation?  I do.  Got any idea how often large corporations survey potential competitors and hurt them before they get a foothold?  I do.  I've been on both sides of this equation. 

You need a good business sense and some specialty knowledge to stand a chance making it with a 3D printer or any other robotic application.  You bet it can be done, but it is a lot harder and requires a broader range of skills than working for a living in today's climate.  What you need first is a niche and know how. Come up with a new and unique product and you stand a better chance than grinding out somebody else's gears. Fewer people will have the intelligence and skills set to do this, not more.

Consider your assumption about automation.

A steel company makes steel, a car company makes cars, a medical company makes catheters.  They add automation to their business to reduce cost and increase profit.  They have a developed supply chain, a customer base and a distribution system, and often have to comply with regulations and obtain permits.  Automation is an augmentation to those businesses.  You still need all the rest to compete.

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Tatetopa
On 4/24/2018 at 2:34 PM, aztek said:

people almost never rise by themselves, there is always someone rich behind them making it possible. using their hardship to provoke poor, for  benefits of the rich behind the scene.

Are you including our Founding Fathers in that?

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Tatetopa
On 4/24/2018 at 2:40 PM, Aquila King said:

Yes, they were undoubtedly revolutionary in their thinking for the time, and should be praised for many things, but they were not without some serious faults.

True Aquila, but they were men living in a remarkable age of philosophical thought and turmoil, of ethical and political examination.   Jefferson, Franklin, Adams, and many of the others were polymaths, leading intellects in many fields.  You can bet Aquila that at least Jefferson and Franklin if shown the evidence would have supported both evolution and climate change. They were at least logical thinkers. They admittedly were not perfect and did have some serious flaws, I know that.  I am far from conservative, but in my judgement  they were more remarkable in their time than any current leader claim.

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F3SS
1 hour ago, Tatetopa said:

i would say that if you are happy with $1000 bucks a month and willing to let other people pick up the slack, you may not be too valuable on your current job with an attitude like that.  I wouldn't hire you to work in my foundry.

Didn’t I just say I’d work less? Whatever time it takes me to earn a grand in a month is how much less time I’ll work. 

Thats not really who I am and what I’m all about. It’s just how I see things going in a world where everybody gets $12k a year. 

 

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Tatetopa
1 hour ago, RavenHawk said:

Classic Socialism!

That was the point of the story Ravenhawk, even a free lunch sounds better than it turns out to be.

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Tatetopa
On 4/24/2018 at 10:01 PM, acidhead said:

The most expressed virtuous individual is more than likely the least virtuous.

An individual who seeks to tell you how to live your life according to how they trick you into believing how they live theirs.

They are the least Noble.

There always exists an alternative motive.

So true and well worth remembering believe me.

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Tatetopa
On 4/26/2018 at 6:45 AM, preacherman76 said:

I guess people in Sweden make a lot more money then the average joe around my neck of the woods.

Reconsider that argument. If the people in Sweden make more than the average joe in your neck of the woods then they must be on to something pretty good.

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RavenHawk
22 minutes ago, Tatetopa said:

That was the point of the story Ravenhawk, even a free lunch sounds better than it turns out to be.

But after a little experience and knowledge, one at least begins to catch on.  Or should.  This isn't rocket science.

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