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Man fined £800 after filming dog's 'Nazi salutes'


OverSword
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My dog has been known to sit and raise a paw in what approximates such a salute.  She has not been trained to do so. Something a lot of dogs do naturally I think.  If I put a picture on line of her doing that because I wanted to show a friend how she begs would I get fined too, I wonder.  I never saw the image of the dog involved in the case mentioned so perhaps there was more to it than first appears.

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11 minutes ago, .ZZ. said:

Well, at least that is money he won't be able to spend on more piercings, or that ear lobe hole or what ever it's called. :ph34r:

So disgusting.......I have to admit that Banksy ink on his arm is pretty sweet though 

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9 minutes ago, Susanc241 said:

My dog has been known to sit and raise a paw in what approximates such a salute.  She has not been trained to do so. Something a lot of dogs do naturally I think.  If I put a picture on line of her doing that because I wanted to show a friend how she begs would I get fined too, I wonder.  I never saw the image of the dog involved in the case mentioned so perhaps there was more to it than first appears.

It's a bit more involved than that.  If you read the article he does indeed say some really offensive things besides simply having the dog throw a salute.  And yet still, did anyone suffer any actual harm?  Was there a victim involved here?  Not in my mind.  Now were I Jewish I may take very much offense to this and yet it's only my feelings that are harmed and mainly because I chose to allow them to be harmed rather than just blowing it off as a low class moron making an idiot out of himself.

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1 hour ago, OverSword said:

rather than just blowing it off as a low class moron making an idiot out of himself.

The way we Indians do? Because you can still "legally" mock us.? :lol:

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4 minutes ago, Piney said:

The way we Indians do? Because you can still "legally" mock us.? :lol:

As long as you don't say anything about white christian males we're good brother :tu:

Edited by OverSword
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5 hours ago, OverSword said:

Fight back UK, this is insanity and sets a dangerous precedence for your rights in the future.

The problem is OS, there's no real way to fight back.

The current government, the Conservatives, are the lesser of the evils when it comes to political correctness. The Labour Party and the Liberal Democrats - who haven't got the backing to be in power - are waaay worse. This is why right-wing politics is on the rise across the West.

You know yourself from problems in The States just how rampant political correctness/extreme liberalism/extreme leftism is. At least you have your Constituation over there as some protection. Here, short of a full on revolution, you pretty much just get on with your own life and silently shake your head as the next ridiculous story hits the headlines.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again; it won't end well. Somewhere down the line our kids are going to pay the price for letting the vocal minority rule the roost.

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41 minutes ago, LV-426 said:

The problem is OS, there's no real way to fight back.

I get it but it never hurts to write your representative expressing concern with something.  I use to do it every time the patriot act came up for renewal.  Haven't done it in a few years though.

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I really give no **** about some Nazi dude having to pay a fine for his hate speech.

 

Fining Meechan £800, the sheriff told him: "The centrepiece of your video consists of you repeating the phrase 'Gas the Jews' over and over again as a command to a dog which then reacts.

"You use the command Sieg Heil, having trained the dog to raise its paw in response and the video shows a clip of a Nuremberg rally and a flashing image of Hitler with strident music. You say the video was only intended as a joke to upset your girlfriend, whose dog you used, and nothing more.

"On the whole evidence..I found it proved that the video you posted, using a public communications network, was grossly offensive and contained menacing, anti-Semitic and racist material."

That sure sounds like hate speech to me. 

Pay the fine, Nazi scum, and be glad it isn't higher.

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11 hours ago, OverSword said:

I get it but it never hurts to write your representative expressing concern with something.  I use to do it every time the patriot act came up for renewal.  Haven't done it in a few years though.

Twenty or so years ago, I had the energy and motivation maybe.

These days, I just try to find enjoyment in life where I can; music, sci-fi, etc. Plus letting off a little steam on UM of course :lol:

It's getting older I guess. When you're young, you think you can change the world. In time you realize you're just along for the ride, unless perhaps you're plentiful in wealth and influence.

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7 hours ago, ChaosRose said:

I really give no **** about some Nazi dude having to pay a fine for his hate speech.

 

Fining Meechan £800, the sheriff told him: "The centrepiece of your video consists of you repeating the phrase 'Gas the Jews' over and over again as a command to a dog which then reacts.

"You use the command Sieg Heil, having trained the dog to raise its paw in response and the video shows a clip of a Nuremberg rally and a flashing image of Hitler with strident music. You say the video was only intended as a joke to upset your girlfriend, whose dog you used, and nothing more.

"On the whole evidence..I found it proved that the video you posted, using a public communications network, was grossly offensive and contained menacing, anti-Semitic and racist material."

That sure sounds like hate speech to me. 

Pay the fine, Nazi scum, and be glad it isn't higher.

This guy isn't a Nazi CR, not even close. The only thing he's guilty of is having a tasteless sense of humour.

What kind of world are we going to create if we criminalize poor taste?

When laws are applied so flippantly, it also undermines work against those who genuinely do spread hate and incite violence.

To be honest, I've seen far more genuine anti-Semitism in rallies in The States, and that is accepted as a Constitutional right under freedom of speech. As abhorrent as it can be, I prefer your system, where people's opinions can be aired, and they can be openly challenged on their views.

Edited by LV-426
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The guy doesn't live here, though. He lives where it's illegal to sieg heil and say gas the Jews, and he knows it.

So he pays the fine.

And I don't feel sorry for him. 

BTW, how do you know he's not a Nazi?

He sure sounds like a Nazi. 

If he wanted to prank his gf, then he shows her when she gets home. He doesn't put it on youtube.

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  • The title was changed to Man fined £800 after filming dog's 'Nazi salutes'
2 hours ago, ChaosRose said:

The guy doesn't live here, though. He lives where it's illegal to sieg heil and say gas the Jews, and he knows it.

Isn't that the whole point of this thread? Highlighting the madness in criminalizing words, and labelling anything as "hate crime" regardless of intent?

OS started this topic from an American perspective, so it's only fair to to ask how an American would feel should freedom of speech/expression be criminalized, when there is clearly no intent to incite violence, etc.

 

2 hours ago, ChaosRose said:

And I don't feel sorry for him.

I don't particularly feel sorry for him. It was in poor taste.

Although I read and watch a lot of documentaries on the events of WWII, I often turn off when it comes to atrocities such as those commited at Auschwitz. They're just too abhorrent to contemplate.

I do seriously worry about the slippery slope of criminalizing everything that people find offensive though. Why has society become so thin-skinned that it turns to hysterics when someone crosses a line in taste?

What comes next? Banning edgy comedians, burning books with controvercial topics?

 

2 hours ago, ChaosRose said:

BTW, how do you know he's not a Nazi?

I don't, in the same manner I don't know he isn't a serial killer.

I can only go from the information that has been presented in this widely covered story, which suggests he's just a joker with a crass sense of humour.

If he were truly trying to promote Nazi propaganda, he'd likely be a lot more serious and focused in presenting anti-Semitic views.

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Well, you could find yourself in the same situation we are, where propaganda rules the day and no one knows what to believe anymore.

That's not a great place to be.

I'd say it'd be great if we could kick Alex Jones off the air. 

It would do the country a service.

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It's the same kind of thing that happened with Pizzagate.

Oh...Alex Jones is an "entertainer" when it suits him. 

I'm sure he was just kidding when he pointed the finger at innocent people and tried to say they were child molesters.

And then the pizza place got shot up. 

You can't call for people to gas the Jews, even if that's somehow funny to you.

Someone will try to do it. 

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Alot of British people have died by Nazi and the German war machine. Its disrespectful to do it

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46 minutes ago, Mr.United_Nations said:

Alot of British people have died by Nazi and the German war machine. Its disrespectful to do it

I find that sort of attitude dangerous and offensive. 

A lot of British people have died by the Nazi war machine... in order to have the right of free speech

A lot of British people died resisting Soviet aggression during the Cold War. Are you happy for all discussion or representation of Communism to be banned in the UK ? Even representation in jest ? Would you be REALLY happy with that, Mr United_Nations ? 

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1 hour ago, RoofGardener said:

A lot of British people have died by the Nazi war machine... in order to have the right of free speech

A lot of British people died resisting Soviet aggression during the Cold War. Are you happy for all discussion or representation of Communism to be banned in the UK ? Even representation in jest ? Would you be REALLY happy with that, Mr United_Nations ? 

1.  This is not a discussion about communist oppression, if he had dressed his dog up as a commissar and sat it on a wall then maybe we would have that conversation.

2.  This has nothing to do with freedom of speech, if he had raised the subject of the holocaust as a serious subject, whatever his stance, then his freedom of speech would be protected.

This was a joke, at the expense of one of the worst atrocities in the history of modern man. He wasn’t making any valid points.

Discuss it, argue it, but for gods sake treat the subject with the respect it is due!

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Anyone actually seen the video? It's hilarious.

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8 minutes ago, Grey Area said:

1.  This is not a discussion about communist oppression, if he had dressed his dog up as a commissar and sat it on a wall then maybe we would have that conversation.

......

I was using that as a simile. The point is that to criminalise this act is incredibly dangerous. 

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11 minutes ago, RoofGardener said:

I was using that as a simile. The point is that to criminalise this act is incredibly dangerous. 

And if he had been fined for trying to start an objective conversation about gasing Jews that would be different.

As it stands, an £800 fine for a hate crime charge is getting off lightly, a slap on the wrist.  

What’s dangerous is not knowing if this guy is genuinely ignorant or indeed supportive of anti Semitism.

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On 25/04/2018 at 4:05 AM, ChaosRose said:

I really give no **** about some Nazi dude having to pay a fine for his hate speech.

 

Fining Meechan £800, the sheriff told him: "The centrepiece of your video consists of you repeating the phrase 'Gas the Jews' over and over again as a command to a dog which then reacts.

"You use the command Sieg Heil, having trained the dog to raise its paw in response and the video shows a clip of a Nuremberg rally and a flashing image of Hitler with strident music. You say the video was only intended as a joke to upset your girlfriend, whose dog you used, and nothing more.

"On the whole evidence..I found it proved that the video you posted, using a public communications network, was grossly offensive and contained menacing, anti-Semitic and racist material."

That sure sounds like hate speech to me. 

Pay the fine, Nazi scum, and be glad it isn't higher.

As he's a Corbyn supporter and anti semitism is endemic in the Labour party this should send a clear message though personally i think it was a joke.

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