RoofGardener Posted January 19, 2019 #101 Share Posted January 19, 2019 Just to return to Stevewinn's earlier question; once we are out of the EU, presumably none of their regulations will apply to us ? Hence even if this copyright Directive passes, it shouldn't effect Unexplained Mysteries ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saru Posted January 19, 2019 Author #102 Share Posted January 19, 2019 (IP: Staff) · 2 minutes ago, RoofGardener said: Just to return to Stevewinn's earlier question; once we are out of the EU, presumably none of their regulations will apply to us ? Hence even if this copyright Directive passes, it shouldn't effect Unexplained Mysteries ? See this post for my reply to this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoofGardener Posted January 19, 2019 #103 Share Posted January 19, 2019 1 minute ago, Saru said: See this post for my reply to this one. Hmm.... I dunno Saru. I don't see how an EU rule can effect a non-EU nation ? After all, we don't have to follow laws made in the USA or Canada ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saru Posted January 19, 2019 Author #104 Share Posted January 19, 2019 (IP: Staff) · 14 minutes ago, RoofGardener said: Well, anyone linking to a story on - say - the Guardian website could result in Saruman being sued by the Guardian ? In essence, the forum would have to ban external linkage. Not so much linking, but quoting, certainly - nobody would be able to quote from any external website. It gets much worse though when you consider the filtering mechanisms that would be needed to achieve this, the potential for false positives and the almost unimaginable task of removing all potentially violative content from our archive of 6.3 million posts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevewinn Posted January 19, 2019 #105 Share Posted January 19, 2019 3 minutes ago, Saru said: See this post for my reply to this one. This is based on access, so the solution is, block traffic to and from EU member countries. only those who seek access to the EU countries/websites/users need comply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saru Posted January 19, 2019 Author #106 Share Posted January 19, 2019 (IP: Staff) · 2 minutes ago, RoofGardener said: Hmm.... I dunno Saru. I don't see how an EU rule can effect a non-EU nation ? After all, we don't have to follow laws made in the USA or Canada ? In the UK, violations of GDPR and other EU Internet laws are handled by ICO: https://ico.org.uk/ Other countries have their own organisations that deal with these same issues. As I say, many US sites/companies have chosen to simply block access to EU visitors rather than trying to comply with these laws. 1 Top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saru Posted January 19, 2019 Author #107 Share Posted January 19, 2019 (IP: Staff) · 2 minutes ago, stevewinn said: This is based on access, so the solution is, block traffic to and from EU member countries. That doesn't stop someone from posting copyrighted material from an EU source. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoofGardener Posted January 19, 2019 #108 Share Posted January 19, 2019 True. However, I can't fathom that a UK website, featuring a link to a European Union website, can be prosecuted by the EU ? (once we have left the EU). 1 Top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saru Posted January 19, 2019 Author #109 Share Posted January 19, 2019 (IP: Staff) · 2 minutes ago, RoofGardener said: True. However, I can't fathom that a UK website, featuring a link to a European Union website, can be prosecuted by the EU ? (once we have left the EU). Not linking, but quoting material would be a copyright violation. In any case, given that Articles 11 and 13 appear to be on the rocks now, the point is (hopefully) academic at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevewinn Posted January 19, 2019 #110 Share Posted January 19, 2019 6 minutes ago, Saru said: That doesn't stop someone from posting copyrighted material from an EU source. it cant be policed then, and the rule is an ass. classic EU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoofGardener Posted January 19, 2019 #111 Share Posted January 19, 2019 9 minutes ago, Saru said: Not linking, but quoting material would be a copyright violation. In any case, given that Articles 11 and 13 appear to be on the rocks now, the point is (hopefully) academic at this point. Hmm... I got the impression that the Commission was going to attempt to redraft them, and get the Parliament to vote again. And keep on voting until they get it right ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saru Posted January 19, 2019 Author #112 Share Posted January 19, 2019 (IP: Staff) · 4 minutes ago, RoofGardener said: Hmm... I got the impression that the Commission was going to attempt to redraft them, and get the Parliament to vote again. And keep on voting until they get it right ? Yeah but they will never get it to pass as it is now - if it does eventually pass, it will likely be a lot less damaging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoofGardener Posted January 19, 2019 #113 Share Posted January 19, 2019 Just now, Saru said: Yeah but they will never get it to pass as it is now - if it does eventually pass, it will likely be a lot less damaging. Hmm.. I'm not so sanguine about that, Saru. Not at all. Still, at least we have breathing space. 1 Top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozymandias Posted January 19, 2019 #114 Share Posted January 19, 2019 (edited) As I see it there are two fundamental issues here: (1) everyone has a right to be acknowledged for their own work and should be accorded ownership of anything they produce; (2) in our 'alt world' of fake news having a knowledge, and being able to access, the origin or source of information is crucial to our ability to assess its value. Of course there are two sides to this issue and it is not black or white. I would also point out that this vote demonstrates that the EU is not the undemocratic monilith some say it is and to beware those who only support democracy when its decisions are in agreement with theirs. PS - I should add that I don't think it would be fair to require website hosts to be responsible for copyright policing the content uploaded by individuals using that site. Edited January 19, 2019 by Ozymandias Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saru Posted February 9, 2019 Author #115 Share Posted February 9, 2019 (IP: Staff) · I might have known we wouldn't have heard the last of this, it seems France and Germany have been working together to find a way to resurrect the copyright reform and to ensure that articles 11 and 13 become law: https://news.sky.com/story/eu-copyright-reforms-a-step-closer-but-google-warns-they-could-harm-creatives-11632140 On the plus side however, one of the elements of this new deal is: Quote France and Germany resolved their disagreement over whether smaller platforms would have to take down copyrighted material. They agreed the platforms with less than 5 million annual users would not be forced to filter their content. This would seem to exempt UM from implementing content filters, however it's still unclear what full compliance would entail, even for smaller sites. 3 Top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spartan max2 Posted February 9, 2019 #116 Share Posted February 9, 2019 It would be France and Germany lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danydandan Posted February 9, 2019 #117 Share Posted February 9, 2019 2 hours ago, spartan max2 said: It would be France and Germany lol Poland are the ones keeping it going. 1 Top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevewinn Posted February 9, 2019 #118 Share Posted February 9, 2019 7 hours ago, Saru said: I might have known we wouldn't have heard the last of this, it seems France and Germany have been working together to find a way to resurrect the copyright reform and to ensure that articles 11 and 13 become law: https://news.sky.com/story/eu-copyright-reforms-a-step-closer-but-google-warns-they-could-harm-creatives-11632140 On the plus side however, one of the elements of this new deal is: This would seem to exempt UM from implementing content filters, however it's still unclear what full compliance would entail, even for smaller sites. Exempt but for how long? YouTube are running their own campaign against it called https://www.youtube.com/intl/en-GB/saveyourinternet/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevewinn Posted March 26, 2019 #119 Share Posted March 26, 2019 @Saru https://variety.com/2019/music/global/european-parliament-approves-controversial-copyright-directive-eu-1203172499/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saru Posted March 26, 2019 Author #120 Share Posted March 26, 2019 (IP: Staff) · It still has to go through another approval process in a couple of weeks' time, but it's not looking good. 1 2 Top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevewinn Posted March 26, 2019 #121 Share Posted March 26, 2019 21 minutes ago, Saru said: It still has to go through another approval process in a couple of weeks' time, but it's not looking good. The most important question is will UM be able to continue? 1 Top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saru Posted March 26, 2019 Author #122 Share Posted March 26, 2019 (IP: Staff) · 19 minutes ago, stevewinn said: The most important question is will UM be able to continue? Almost certainly, because even in a worst case scenario, our existence does not rely exclusively on European traffic. The trouble with this thing is that, right now, it's just a concept and it's up to different EU countries to implement it as they see fit (over the next 2 years). There's no practical advice on what a site like this needs to do - it's all just open to interpretation right now. Until there are specific, practical directions to follow for compliance, nothing is likely to happen. I would expect at least some restrictions/filtering though, even in a best case scenario. 1 2 Top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Area Posted March 26, 2019 #123 Share Posted March 26, 2019 This is the EU that the millennial generation are so hell bent on keeping the U.K. in. Time to wakey wakey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setton Posted March 26, 2019 #124 Share Posted March 26, 2019 1 hour ago, Grey Area said: This is the EU that the millennial generation are so hell bent on keeping the U.K. in. Time to wakey wakey. This is the EU that the millennial generation are so hell bent on keeping the U.K. in so that we have a say in things like this. This will affect everyone, whether EU members or not. If we'd stayed, maybe we could have stopped this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danydandan Posted March 26, 2019 #125 Share Posted March 26, 2019 5 hours ago, Saru said: It still has to go through another approval process in a couple of weeks' time, but it's not looking good. Italy are planning to veto it. So there is still hope. And our government here is going to take a pounding as a result, so the council members from Ireland may also reject it. 1 Top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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