US Tariffs on Steel, Aluminium

[toast]

56 minutes ago, keithisco said:

Harley sales globally have been in decline for 4 years, so I think it was inevitable that they would look to reduce the cost of production.

 

Read the article:

Quote

Harley-Davidson plans to shift the production of some of its bikes out of the US in response to Europe’s new tariffs on motorcycle imports.

In a stock market filing, the company said the EU’s reaction to Donald Trump’s steel tariffs, which will add $2,200 (£1,657) to the average cost of a motorcycle exported from the US to Europe, will result in up to $100m of extra charges over the next couple of years.

 

Quote

I am surprised at the EU escalating the trade dispute instead of reciprocating by putting tariffs on just US Steel and Aluminium. Clearly just a political sideswipe from the Commission...again.

Counter taxes are not subject to the items as it would not make any sense. Counter taxes are calculated to balance.

 

[stevewinn]

9 minutes ago, toast said:

 

Read the article:

 

Counter taxes are not subject to the items as it would not make any sense. Counter taxes are calculated to balance.

 

Trump targets Steel and aluminium, now talking about cars 20%. Germany is the target. Trump not happy with unfair advantage of German economy undervalued. 

[CrimsonKing]

People in the US don't want those overpriced junkers anymore anyway...enjoy EU  

[keithisco]

28 minutes ago, toast said:

 

Read the article:

 

Counter taxes are not subject to the items as it would not make any sense. Counter taxes are calculated to balance.

 

I read the article...Imports of HD will be hit with Tariffs wherever they are made, and they are most definitely NOT being made in Europe. At most HD say it MAY move some production out of the USA. What is a "Counter Tax", if you mean a retaliatory tax then these have most certainly been chosen to hurt strong Republican voting areas which makes them a Political Tax. I also note that it is the UK that will be disproportionately effected by the Bourbon tax because we import more than twice as much as any other EU Nation, and in fact is Bourbons biggest Export market.  So there you go, a Political attack on Mr Trump and a Punishment Tax on the UK for daring to leave the EU. 

Edited June 25, 2018 by keithisco

[toast]

3 minutes ago, stevewinn said:

Trump targets Steel and aluminium, now talking about cars 20%. Germany is the target. Trump not happy with unfair advantage of German economy undervalued. 

Yeah, Germany is his new target but for the reason that "Great America" cannot deliver high quality products to Germany as Germany delivers to the US. He is blind for the real cause of that deficit. If he would be smart, which he isn't, he would think about how to change that situation with positive long-term effects to the US economy. Do you remember when Japanese cars came to Europe in the 70s/80s? Look what lemons they produced then and look where they are today,

Just to increase import duties/taxes is a very stupid and simple attempt for a change, but it reflects his economical skills and his IQ77 brain.

[keithisco]

1 minute ago, toast said:

Yeah, Germany is his new target but for the reason that "Great America" cannot deliver high quality products to Germany as Germany delivers to the US. He is blind for the real cause of that deficit. If he would be smart, which he isn't, he would think about how to change that situation with positive long-term effects to the US economy. Do you remember when Japanese cars came to Europe in the 70s/80s? Look what lemons they produced then and look where they are today,

Just to increase import duties/taxes is a very stupid and simple attempt for a change, but it reflects his economical skills and his IQ77 brain.

No...he is targeting Germany for having an unfair advantage in Trade by being able to charge less for vehicles than they would normally cost if Germany actually had its own currency. The Euro is hugely undervalued wrt German economy which gives Germany that unfair advantage.

Mr Trump is actually a very smart person for understanding that, and even smarter for keeping his election pledges.

There is no way can the EU can compete in a Trade War with the USA and instead of coming to an agreed limitation on Steel and Aluminium exports to US like other nations have, the EU chose an idiotic, self-harming Trade War. That makes the EU Commission the stupid ones. I am so glad that we are leaving this corrupted Institution

[toast]

12 minutes ago, keithisco said:

What is a "Counter Tax", if you mean a retaliatory tax then these have most certainly been chosen to hurt strong Republican voting areas which makes them a Political Tax.

If so, its brilliant, isn't it? But yes, its political, the whole story is political. And, it became dirty, because of the clown at 1600PENN.

Quote

I also note that it is the UK that will be disproportionately effected by the Bourbon tax because we import more than twice as much as any other EU Nation, and in fact is Bourbons biggest Export market.  So there you go, a Political attack on Mr Trump and a Punishment Tax on the UK for daring to leave the EU. 

I agree that the Bourbon tax will be a problem for all Britons who need at least one bottle of Bourbon a day.

[toast]

4 minutes ago, keithisco said:

Mr Trump is actually a very smart person

Priceless!

 

[keithisco]

3 minutes ago, toast said:

If so, its brilliant, isn't it? But yes, its political, the whole story is political. And, it became dirty, because of the clown at 1600PENN.

I agree that the Bourbon tax will be a problem for all Britons who need at least one bottle of Bourbon a day.

Really mature Toast...as once again you run out of arguments

Edited June 25, 2018 by keithisco

[stevewinn]

6 minutes ago, toast said:

Yeah, Germany is his new target but for the reason that "Great America" cannot deliver high quality products to Germany as Germany delivers to the US. He is blind for the real cause of that deficit. If he would be smart, which he isn't, he would think about how to change that situation with positive long-term effects to the US economy. Do you remember when Japanese cars came to Europe in the 70s/80s? Look what lemons they produced then and look where they are today,

Just to increase import duties/taxes is a very stupid and simple attempt for a change, but it reflects his economical skills and his IQ77 brain.

Mr Trump asks how it is that the US has a massive trade deficit and Germany and China have massive trade surpluses. He points out that the US has many fine companies with great technology and great skill levels . He thinks the terms of trade are unfair, and need amending.

If Germany still had the Deutschmark, and not today’s Euro, much of its manufacturing capacity would have had to relocate elsewhere in Europe or the far east (China) for economic reasons. The Eurozone, is not to provide Germany with an artifically undervalued currency in order to boost that country's manufacturing. Trump as questioned this situation due to Americas trade deficit. 

 

[toast]

2 minutes ago, keithisco said:

Really mature Toast...as once again you run out of arguments

I have to admit that I`m getting more and more tired to try to argument with people who support #45 because their argumentation is as confuse as their masters one. Your example with the Bourbon is a very good one as it is absurd. Why should I care how much you have to pay for Bourbon? Why? Is that an issue for you?

[toast]

4 minutes ago, stevewinn said:

Mr Trump asks how it is that the US has a massive trade deficit and Germany and China have massive trade surpluses. He points out that the US has many fine companies with great technology and great skill levels . He thinks the terms of trade are unfair, and need amending.

Of course there a fine companies in the US as well but that's not the issue and the Euro isnt an issue neither. Lets take my favorite example, cars. US (family) cars a quite cheap here compared to German cars but there is only little sales here. For what reasons do you think people prefer to by a 2 year old BMW/VW/Mercedes instead of a new US car for the same price? Because of the quality. Thats the problem over there, caused by bad management decisions the past and by, compared to other countries, low qualified blue collar workers.

[stevewinn]

27 minutes ago, toast said:

Of course there a fine companies in the US as well but that's not the issue and the Euro isnt an issue neither. Lets take my favorite example, cars. US (family) cars a quite cheap here compared to German cars but there is only little sales here. For what reasons do you think people prefer to by a 2 year old BMW/VW/Mercedes instead of a new US car for the same price? Because of the quality. Thats the problem over there, caused by bad management decisions the past and by, compared to other countries, low qualified blue collar workers.

You want to talk about cars. But this is not the problem. The problem is the trade deficit as a whole. Which is compounded by the Euro and undervaluing of the German economy. 

I don't want to get sidetracked by the car sector as that's besides the point. 

If you want to talk about cars. Then let's mention the scandal with VW, a company lieing to its customers to gain a unfair advantage and sales which takes away sales from others. Thus prevents and lowers profit and investment of its competitors. 

When thinking of America cars. I'd say reason for low sales of American cars in Europe is the size, to large for the European Market. Not reliability. The10% tariff by the EU doesn't help either. 

One only as to look at JD powers. The Koreans and Japanese manufacturers are leading the way. BMW and AUDI come bottom. 

The two top selling cars in the UK are Ford. Focus and Fiesta. Both manufactured in Europe. By American company European arm. So its not like they don't know how to make reliable cars. 

Edited June 25, 2018 by stevewinn

[RoofGardener]

6 minutes ago, stevewinn said:

You want to talk about cars. But this is not the problem. The problem is the trade deficit as a whole. Which is compounded by the Euro and undervaluing of the German economy. 

I don't want to get sidetracked by the car sector as that's besides the point. 

If you want to talk about cars. Then let's mention the scandal with VW, a company lieing to its customers to gain a unfair advantage and sales which takes away sales from others. Thus prevents and lowers profit and investment of its competitors. 

When thinking of America cars. I'd say reason for low sales of American cars in Europe is the size, to large for the European Market. Not reliability. The10% tariff by the EU doesn't help either. 

One only as to look at JD powers. The Koreans and Japanese manufacturers are leading the way. BMW and AUDI come bottom. 

The two top selling cars in the UK are Ford. Focus and Fiesta. Both manufactured in Europe. By American company European arm. So its not like they don't know how to make reliable cars. 

I disagree. 

The aircon on my American car (Vauxhall Corsa) has broken down, as has the washer pump. And those after only 15 years of use, and 140,000 miles on the clock. 

Call that reliable ? Pfffft ! 

 

Edited June 25, 2018 by RoofGardener

[.ZZ.]

36 minutes ago, toast said:

Of course there a fine companies in the US as well but that's not the issue and the Euro isnt an issue neither. Lets take my favorite example, cars. US (family) cars a quite cheap here compared to German cars but there is only little sales here. For what reasons do you think people prefer to by a 2 year old BMW/VW/Mercedes instead of a new US car for the same price? Because of the quality. Thats the problem over there, caused by bad management decisions the past and by, compared to other countries, low qualified blue collar workers.

Low qualified? WTH makes you say that?

You sound just like some snooty Benz owner we have over here.

[Helen of Annoy]

18 hours ago, RoofGardener said:

I disagree. 

The aircon on my American car (Vauxhall Corsa) has broken down, as has the washer pump. And those after only 15 years of use, and 140,000 miles on the clock. 

Call that reliable ? Pfffft ! 

 

Just wanted to say how much I'm emotionally attached to my ancient Opel Corsa. 

If she was a Ford, she'd be recycled by now. Twice. 

 

  

[toast]

18 hours ago, stevewinn said:

You want to talk about cars. But this is not the problem. The problem is the trade deficit as a whole. Which is compounded by the Euro and undervaluing of the German economy.

Cars are a factor of the trade deficit so it is, for others, a part of the problem.

Quote

I don't want to get sidetracked by the car sector as that's besides the point. I

Its a part of the point discussed.

Quote

f you want to talk about cars. Then let's mention the scandal with VW, a company lieing to its customers to gain a unfair advantage and sales which takes away sales from others. Thus prevents and lowers profit and investment of its competitors. 

I fully agree with you that Diesel-Gate was the biggest mess in our industrial history. And I blame the responsible politicians for that the buyers of the related cars dont get the compensation they deserve, like VW customers in the US. We dont have the option for class action lawsuits yet but a new law will come into effect on 01NOV this year and I hope that VW will be forced to pay the bill for their fraud.

Quote

When thinking of America cars. I'd say reason for low sales of American cars in Europe is the size, to large for the European Market. Not reliability. The10% tariff by the EU doesn't help either. 

No it isnt the size as there are a lot of US cars with to German middle class cars comparable size.

Quote

 The two top selling cars in the UK are Ford. Focus and Fiesta. Both manufactured in Europe. By American company European arm. So its not like they don't know how to make reliable cars. 

Yeah, both build in Europe. And I think its not about if the Americans can build cars or not, its about they dont want to /have to because it seems that US customers are willing to eat the &hit offered over there.

Edited June 26, 2018 by toast

[toast]

18 hours ago, .ZZ. said:

Low qualified? WTH makes you say that?

You sound just like some snooty Benz owner we have over here.

No, I`m not a bad guy!

[aztek]

Just now, toast said:

Of course there a fine companies in the US as well but that's not the issue and the Euro isnt an issue neither. Lets take my favorite example, cars. US (family) cars a quite cheap here compared to German cars but there is only little sales here. For what reasons do you think people prefer to by a 2 year old BMW/VW/Mercedes instead of a new US car for the same price? Because of the quality. Thats the problem over there, caused by bad management decisions the past and by, compared to other countries, low qualified blue collar workers.

yes, i have to agree somewhat, UAW is the reason. they do not allow to fire, lazy incompetent workers, among other things

as far as quality, well, i used to fix cars, they all have issues, including bmw and mb, actually more so, than honda or a hyundai, and i owned\leased all of them, nothing is a bigger bottomless pit than 10 years old benz, or a beemer. some genius at mb came up with an idea of bio degradable wires. as far as reliability german cars are no better than "crappy" American. one thing germans have on their side, is quality of dealer service, and i do not mean VW, 

no benz or beemer come even close to lexus\acura reliability, and when it comes to resale value they suck big time

 

Edited June 26, 2018 by aztek

[keithisco]

20 hours ago, toast said:

Of course there a fine companies in the US as well but that's not the issue and the Euro isnt an issue neither. Lets take my favorite example, cars. US (family) cars a quite cheap here compared to German cars but there is only little sales here. For what reasons do you think people prefer to by a 2 year old BMW/VW/Mercedes instead of a new US car for the same price? Because of the quality. Thats the problem over there, caused by bad management decisions the past and by, compared to other countries, low qualified blue collar workers.

Cars from the USA ARE overpriced due to EU Tariffs on them:

Quote

Current Barriers to Transatlantic Trade: US motor vehicle exporters face EU tariffs averaging 8.0 percent, including tariffs of 10.0 percent on finished vehicles and 3.0 percent to 4.5 percent on most parts, in addition to a variety of non-tariff measures (NTMs) that further restrict access to the EU market. The estimated cost of the NTMs is the equivalent of a 25.5 percent tariff on US motor vehicle exports.

Soirce: UK Gov

Only 2.5% US Tariffs imposed on EU Cars. This is clearly unfair and needs to be levelled

Edited June 26, 2018 by keithisco

[stevewinn]

2 hours ago, toast said:

Cars are a factor of the trade deficit so it is, for others, a part of the problem.

Its a part of the point discussed.

I fully agree with you that Diesel-Gate was the biggest mess in our industrial history. And I blame the responsible politicians for that the buyers of the related cars dont get the compensation they deserve, like VW customers in the US. We dont have the option for class action lawsuits yet but a new law will come into effect on 01NOV this year and I hope that VW will be forced to pay the bill for their fraud.

No it isnt the size as there are a lot of US cars with to German middle class cars comparable size.

Yeah, both build in Europe. And I think its not about if the Americans can build cars or not, its about they dont want to /have to because it seems that US customers are willing to eat the &hit offered over there.

The fallacy of German reliability is laid bare. Your world Cup team sums it up at the moment. 

 

[toast]

1 minute ago, stevewinn said:

Your world Cup team sums it up at the moment. 

They can go to hell! I`m crossing my fingers for Denmark.

[stevewinn]

13 minutes ago, toast said:

They can go to hell! I`m crossing my fingers for Denmark.

I have mine crossed for Croatia they've been playing well. Top of the group as well. Should beat Iceland tonight.

But we all know England are going to win it anyway. 

Edited June 26, 2018 by stevewinn