Jump to content
Join the Unexplained Mysteries community today! It's free and setting up an account only takes a moment.
- Sign In or Create Account -

Donald Trump nominated for Nobel Peace Prize


Still Waters

Recommended Posts

8 hours ago, Farmer77 said:

"Its not the act of picking your nose that defines what kind of human you are, its what you do afterwards that does".  

That is somehow both incredibly dumb and poetically brilliant at the same time. :lol:

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, TomasaurusREKT said:

But I forgot, according to modern liberals, if you're a white male you're automatically born racist...

I'm a white male, have been a member of the modern progressive/liberal movement for years now, yet have genuinely never been accused of racism. (well, there are some conservatives who've called me 'racist against white people' for merely pointing out the statistical fact of white privilege and whatnot, but otherwise, nope)

Statistically speaking, the majority of Bernie Sanders supporters (the most liberal and progressive wing of the democratic party) are overwhelmingly white males. Bernie Sanders is a white male, and was even arrested in the 60's for protesting against segregation. If you want to make the argument that liberals and progressives 'just hate white males', then you're gonna have to explain why so many of us in the movement are white males.

No, we don't hate white males. We hate the genuine racism of some white males, and have a habit of calling them out on it.

  • Confused 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

If Trump can pull this-off, I have no problem in agreeing to a Nobel Peace Prize.

Time will tell, I guess, it's still way early.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Since Obama's name has already come up numerous times, has any other president dropped more than 26,171 bombs during their two terms? Not even the warmonger Bush dropped that many.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-president-barack-obama-bomb-map-drone-wars-strikes-20000-pakistan-middle-east-afghanistan-a7534851.html

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/u-s-bombed-iraq-syria-pakistan-afghanistan-libya-yemen-somalia-n704636

Yup, Obama won that Nobel "Peace" Prize.

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 hours ago, TomasaurusREKT said:

I knew if find some idiot comments against Trump. MSM has made the weak minded who can't think for themselves really hate the guy. It's pathetic actually. I do have a few friends who are liberal-sh who actually like what Trump had been accomplishing. I don't mind left leaning people when they're actually intelligent enough to think for themselves...

Please, give the man some credit. He doesn't need any help making people hate him. 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

36 minutes ago, Setton said:

Please, give the man some credit. He doesn't need any help making people hate him. 

I'm a hardcore Bernie Sanders supporter, but I understand why people hate him. I think they're woefully misinformed and misguided in their hatred for Bernie, but I can at least somewhat understand the mentality behind their hatred for him.

So it's a rather huge slap in the face IMO when certain Trump supporters act like they have absolutely no clue why anyone would despise Trump, or they blame all the hatred of him on 'the media' or whatnot.

You'd think they could at least admit that their own candidate who they support has said and done a lot of things to legitimately tick off a lot of people.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

52 minutes ago, Michelle said:

Since Obama's name has already come up numerous times, has any other president dropped more than 26,171 bombs during their two terms? Not even the warmonger Bush dropped that many.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-president-barack-obama-bomb-map-drone-wars-strikes-20000-pakistan-middle-east-afghanistan-a7534851.html

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/u-s-bombed-iraq-syria-pakistan-afghanistan-libya-yemen-somalia-n704636

Yup, Obama won that Nobel "Peace" Prize.

I'm hoping it stays that way, but looks like so far Trump might beat that record.

http://www.newsweek.com/trump-era-record-number-bombs-dropped-middle-east-667505

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, Michelle said:

Since Obama's name has already come up numerous times, has any other president dropped more than 26,171 bombs during their two terms? Not even the warmonger Bush dropped that many.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-president-barack-obama-bomb-map-drone-wars-strikes-20000-pakistan-middle-east-afghanistan-a7534851.html

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/u-s-bombed-iraq-syria-pakistan-afghanistan-libya-yemen-somalia-n704636

Yup, Obama won that Nobel "Peace" Prize.

FDR, in one term from 1941-1945, dropped more than 26,171 bombs (I think around 3.4 million).

Then we have Johnson and Nixon in the Vietnam war. Not sure of the number but over 7 million tons is a lot of bombs.

Of course no President actually drops bombs, at least the TNT kind. :P

  • Like 2
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 hours ago, Aquila King said:

I'm a hardcore Bernie Sanders supporter, but I understand why people hate him. I think they're woefully misinformed and misguided in their hatred for Bernie, but I can at least somewhat understand the mentality behind their hatred for him.

So it's a rather huge slap in the face IMO when certain Trump supporters act like they have absolutely no clue why anyone would despise Trump, or they blame all the hatred of him on 'the media' or whatnot.

You'd think they could at least admit that their own candidate who they support has said and done a lot of things to legitimately tick off a lot of people.

Bernie Sanders, an man that admires Venezuela, who wants to enact the same policies that brought that nation to ruin. If you think waiting in-line days just for toilet paper is paradise, do please vote for the same policies that caused that and I will fight you to the bitter end.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, Uncle Sam said:

Bernie Sanders, an man that admires Venezuela, who wants to enact the same policies that brought that nation to ruin. If you think waiting in-line days just for toilet paper is paradise, do please vote for the same policies that caused that and I will fight you to the bitter end.

I'm getting tired of having to debunk the same ol' talking points over and over again that you people keep spewing out like a broken record.

https://extranewsfeed.com/socialism-but-look-at-venezuela-debunking-anti-socialist-propaganda-w-actual-logic-de587c1a299a

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, Bama13 said:

FDR, in one term from 1941-1945, dropped more than 26,171 bombs (I think around 3.4 million).

Then we have Johnson and Nixon in the Vietnam war. Not sure of the number but over 7 million tons is a lot of bombs.

Of course no President actually drops bombs, at least the TNT kind. :P

I meant while we weren't actually at war. :P

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Quote

In 1992, Zimbabwe — a capitalist country — watched as its manufacturing output dropped by half, dragging real wages with it. After cutting social spending, privatizing public infrastructure, & opening their markets to foreign capital, Zimbabwe’s inflation skyrocketed while growth stagnated. By ’98, their economy went into free fall & their currency devalued by over 80%. By 2002, 60–70% were under the poverty line, life expectancy dropped to 37 years, interest rates ran at 70%, & millions could no longer afford to eat.

According to the reactionaries’ own argument, capitalism must also be considered a bad economic idea since the logic also applies to Zimbabwe’s economic crisis, as you can see below:

1*01C9_hMwfriui2FihspE8Q.jpeg

If the reasoning is correct , we could make the same argument against capitalism using the great depression in Argentina from 1998–2002. Or the the United States after the “Roarin’ Twenties” when stocks crashed by 90%, production fell by half, 1/4th were unemployed, & 50% of children underfed, while those in Appalachia were so hungry that folks had to stop them from chewing their own hands.

Even if their argument was correct, the reactionary logic still puts the two modes of production on equal footing — which means the whole thing is pretty much useless. As they say — those who live in a glass house shouldn’t throw stones.

https://extranewsfeed.com/socialism-but-look-at-venezuela-debunking-anti-socialist-propaganda-w-actual-logic-de587c1a299a

My favorite excerpt from the link above ^

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

40 minutes ago, Aquila King said:

I'm getting tired of having to debunk the same ol' talking points over and over again that you people keep spewing out like a broken record.

https://extranewsfeed.com/socialism-but-look-at-venezuela-debunking-anti-socialist-propaganda-w-actual-logic-de587c1a299a

That link is completely and utterly worthless for proving anything.  Basically all it says is that Zimbabwe failed, along with mentioning a few other economic hiccups, so capitalism should be counted as a failure too an trying to tie the idea of socialism with flight by arguing both are good ideas and that socialism shouldn't be abandoned just caused it failed just like how the early proto-planes weren't abandoned due to early failures.

Besides from the massive logical fallacies it has in its assumption that socialism is a good idea, it completely ignores what caused the Zimbabwe economy to collapse.  Never mentions how the Zimbabwe government confiscated the farms from the white farmers by force and violence to redistribute to the black population who had no farming knowledge or experience which caused a host of problems and how the Zimbabwe government's plan for fighting inflation was to just print more money and create a situation of hyperinflation that completely gutted and destroyed their economy.  

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 minutes ago, DarkHunter said:

That link is completely and utterly worthless for proving anything.  Basically all it says is that Zimbabwe failed, along with mentioning a few other economic hiccups, so capitalism should be counted as a failure too an trying to tie the idea of socialism with flight by arguing both are good ideas and that socialism shouldn't be abandoned just caused it failed just like how the early proto-planes weren't abandoned due to early failures.

Besides from the massive logical fallacies it has in its assumption that socialism is a good idea, it completely ignores what caused the Zimbabwe economy to collapse.  Never mentions how the Zimbabwe government confiscated the farms from the white farmers by force and violence to redistribute to the black population who had no farming knowledge or experience which caused a host of problems and how the Zimbabwe government's plan for fighting inflation was to just print more money and create a situation of hyperinflation that completely gutted and destroyed their economy.  

That's just a bunch of meaningless excuses while ignoring what I have told you over and over again to be my actual position.

All I want is to expand existing programs here in the US. That's literally it. Medicare for all instead of some, public education through college instead of just through high school, raise the minimum wage to be a living wage, etc. You conservatives keep acting like I'm out to turn the nation into a Communist state or some s**t when literally all I'm in support of is the s**t I just listed.

I only want to expand upon the s**t we already have, not totally re-write our entire system for Christ's sake. I'm really not in favor of some radical ideology here.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

37 minutes ago, Aquila King said:

That's just a bunch of meaningless excuses while ignoring what I have told you over and over again to be my actual position.

All I want is to expand existing programs here in the US. That's literally it. Medicare for all instead of some, public education through college instead of just through high school, raise the minimum wage to be a living wage, etc. You conservatives keep acting like I'm out to turn the nation into a Communist state or some s**t when literally all I'm in support of is the s**t I just listed.

I only want to expand upon the s**t we already have, not totally re-write our entire system for Christ's sake. I'm really not in favor of some radical ideology here.

You're the one who posted the link that tried to praise socialism and was using logical fallacies and leaving out important information to try to defend socialism and bash capitalism.

I'm busy currently and dont have the time to go through each in detail.

Expanding Medicare does nothing to resolve the underlying problems in America's current medical care and would make the problems significantly worse.  There are also some other serious implications that would come with that, mostly the negative side effects of government controlled medical care which the left always ignore.

Free college, besides needing a rework that would drastically change college enrollment to match European colleges that exclude large parts of the population from ever attending college, completely ignores the fact that government is why college is so expensive now.  Before government backed student loans were created college was much more affordable so a strong argument can be made that it would be better to remove government further then expanding it.

Raising the minimum wage creates a price floor and inefficiencies in the market by reducing the amount of jobs available and increasing the amount of people looking for jobs.  Instead of trying to use the government to force increase in pay, in arguably the most inefficient way possible, it would be better to just create a better work environment where companies are competing more.

Ultimately your ideas are in general just bad, inefficient, feel good ideas that don't work or address the problem they are suppose to but due tend to be popular among certain segments of society who normally don't understand what effects they would have.

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 hours ago, Aquila King said:

I'm getting tired of having to debunk the same ol' talking points over and over again that you people keep spewing out like a broken record.

Using Venezuela as an example of a failed political system is just lazy. 

 

 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, DarkHunter said:

Expanding Medicare does nothing to resolve the underlying problems in America's current medical care and would make the problems significantly worse.  There are also some other serious implications that would come with that, mostly the negative side effects of government controlled medical care which the left always ignore.

How does it make the problems worse? The largest problem with our medical system is access to medical care. The high cost of medicare is a direct result of people spending their entire lives avoiding health maintenance until they reach 65 at which point they have multiple comorbid conditions which are exponentially more expensive to deal with than they would have been had they been addressed a decade prior. 

While it may seem counterintuitive expanding medicare is actually the fiscally conservative thing to do. Not to mention the effect that could have on national defense. 

11 hours ago, DarkHunter said:

Free college, besides needing a rework that would drastically change college enrollment to match European colleges that exclude large parts of the population from ever attending college, completely ignores the fact that government is why college is so expensive now.  Before government backed student loans were created college was much more affordable so a strong argument can be made that it would be better to remove government further then expanding it.

Student loans aren't the problem. A lack of consumer protections is. Why the hell we've become so brainwashed that we believe putting up a massive financial barrier to education is acceptable is completely beyond me. 

11 hours ago, DarkHunter said:

Raising the minimum wage creates a price floor and inefficiencies in the market by reducing the amount of jobs available and increasing the amount of people looking for jobs.  Instead of trying to use the government to force increase in pay, in arguably the most inefficient way possible, it would be better to just create a better work environment where companies are competing more.

I am seeing this locally. The min wage was raised without any protections built in so companies have simply raised all their rates since. Hell even rent has gone up as a result - which, at least in my case,  obviously has zero to do with the min. wage. 

So again the problem isn't the raising of min wage its the mindset that says company profits are the most important issue. 

11 hours ago, DarkHunter said:

Ultimately your ideas are in general just bad, inefficient, feel good ideas that don't work or address the problem they are suppose to but due tend to be popular among certain segments of society who normally don't understand what effects they would have.

Sure they could work, you are simply lazy and brainwashed to believe what our corporate overlords want us to. 

Edited by Farmer77
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think the Nobel Peace Price has become a bit of a joke. I don't think it is given to the right person(s), for example to give it to Obama before he had accomplished anything yet was not right I think. I think this is sad, I would like it to remain a prestigeous price. I think they should change the people in the commitee that appoints the winner.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 6/14/2018 at 3:35 PM, Farmer77 said:

People who cheat on their spouses are garbage, people who lie are garbage, people who are racist are garbage.  

No MSM Needed. 

Then JFK was garbage.

Harte

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

26 minutes ago, Harte said:

Then JFK was garbage.

Harte

Pretty much. I don't, wont , cant trust someone who cheats on their spouse, who constantly lies or is racist. Thats not even just a political statement, just an extension of my personal life. 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

IOW, you can't trust a politician.

Also, the sky is actually blue.

Harte

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Farmer77 said:

How does it make the problems worse? The largest problem with our medical system is access to medical care. The high cost of medicare is a direct result of people spending their entire lives avoiding health maintenance until they reach 65 at which point they have multiple comorbid conditions which are exponentially more expensive to deal with than they would have been had they been addressed a decade prior. 

While it may seem counterintuitive expanding medicare is actually the fiscally conservative thing to do. Not to mention the effect that could have on national defense. 

Student loans aren't the problem. A lack of consumer protections is. Why the hell we've become so brainwashed that we believe putting up a massive financial barrier to education is acceptable is completely beyond me. 

I am seeing this locally. The min wage was raised without any protections built in so companies have simply raised all their rates since. Hell even rent has gone up as a result - which, at least in my case,  obviously has zero to do with the min. wage. 

So again the problem isn't the raising of min wage its the mindset that says company profits are the most important issue. 

Sure they could work, you are simply lazy and brainwashed to believe what our corporate overlords want us to. 

How does expanding Medicare to the entire population solve the problem that drug companies are over charging Americans by insane amounts.  For example epipens cost about $608 dollars in America while only $69 in the UK.  All expanding it would do is increase the profit margins of the drug companies who would now be selling to more people and probably at a higher cost cause the government would be paying and can afford higher cost then an individual.  Also how does expanding Medicare solve the byzantine method of how hospital cost are determined.  Currently in America hospitals don't have a set price for anything and instead everything is negotiated.  Basically a hospital will sit down with someone from the insurance company and say some procedure will cost X and X is a very large number, the insurance company will say they will only pay Y which is a very small number.  Eventually the two come to an agreement at Z which is between the two cost each side originally wanted.  But the hospital is negotiating with multiple insurers, all with different levels of negotiating strength so Z will be different for different insurers.  If someone comes in without insurance the hospital has to charge them at X or it will severely hurt their negotiations with the insurance companies.  Unlike insurance companies that have an interest in getting the lowest price possible to maximize their profit the government doesn't care and will pay anything in general.  There are other problems also but those are two of the bigger ones.

What financial protection should we put it, do we limit how much colleges are allowed to charge in tuition or do we just let the government pay for everything.  Ultimately there is always going to be a barrier to higher education, in America its cost which intelligent students can get around almost always by scholarships and grants while in Europe it's by difficult entrance exams that keep large segments of the population from attending.  This whole free college for everyone is not realistically feasible, there will always be a barrier of some type as their should be.

In 1958 is when government backed student loans began but those were extremely limited to only engineering, science, or education majors but in 1965 the government backed student loans were expanded to basically everyone.  Using the University of Pennsylvania as an example since it's easy to find this information, in 1950 for an undergrad tuition, room and board, and general fees would cost $1,315 while in 1960 it cost $2,350 and in 1970 it cost $3,800 and after this point tuition starts increasing rapidly.  By 1975 the cost was $5,390, by 1980 it was between $7,242 and $8,052.  By 1990 it cost $17,044, by 2000 it was $32,996, by 2010 it was $51,944, and now it is $65,470.  After 1965, when federally backed student loans were expanded, the cost of college started doubling about every 10 years.

So for minimum wage increases you want protections built in that will limit how much people can charge, that is a great way to destroy an economy.  The simple fact is that minimum wage does create a price floor that create inefficiencies in the market place and will push companies to more extensive automation quicker.  I do like how you have essentially said it doesn't work but if we could just change human nature it could.  It is funny how people tend to forget a raise in the minimum wage is a reduction in pay to everyone else.

The petty insult at the end was a nice touch, even if poorly done, but you seem so caught up in trying to be whatever you want to call it, moral/wise/intelligent/forward thinking/whatever term you are trying to be but largely aren't that you never stopped for a moment and actually thought about what you are actually suggesting and its impact, which ironically makes you just as brainwashed as you are accusing me of but to the other side.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, DarkHunter said:

How does expanding Medicare to the entire population solve the problem that drug companies are over charging Americans by insane amounts. 

You're right. We need to get our act together and demand better pricing. Acting as a 300million person monolith will give us leverage to do so. 

2 minutes ago, DarkHunter said:

Also how does expanding Medicare solve the byzantine method of how hospital cost are determined. 

 

3 minutes ago, DarkHunter said:

Currently in America hospitals don't have a set price for anything and instead everything is negotiated.  Basically a hospital will sit down with someone from the insurance company and say some procedure will cost X and X is a very large number, the insurance company will say they will only pay Y which is a very small number.  Eventually the two come to an agreement at Z which is between the two cost each side originally wanted.  But the hospital is negotiating with multiple insurers, all with different levels of negotiating strength so Z will be different for different insurers.  If someone comes in without insurance the hospital has to charge them at X or it will severely hurt their negotiations with the insurance companies.  Unlike insurance companies that have an interest in getting the lowest price possible to maximize their profit the government doesn't care and will pay anything in general.  There are other problems also but those are two of the bigger ones.

This is actually something I am often involved in often professionally. 

Medicare has set rates, they don't play that game. 

4 minutes ago, DarkHunter said:

What financial protection should we put it, do we limit how much colleges are allowed to charge in tuition or do we just let the government pay for everything. 

Both actually. 

4 minutes ago, DarkHunter said:

Ultimately there is always going to be a barrier to higher education, in America its cost which intelligent students can get around almost always by scholarships and grants while in Europe it's by difficult entrance exams that keep large segments of the population from attending.  This whole free college for everyone is not realistically feasible, there will always be a barrier of some type as their should be.

I agree there should be a barrier, that barrier should have nothing to do with finances though. We certainly shouldn't be punishing our population with crushing debt because they are trying to become productive members of our society. 

5 minutes ago, DarkHunter said:

So for minimum wage increases you want protections built in that will limit how much people can charge, that is a great way to destroy an economy. 

Im personally OK with some growing pains as we realign our economy to focus on benefitting main street and not wall street.  The middle class is rapidly evaporating and we are losing what truly made this nation great. 

7 minutes ago, DarkHunter said:

I do like how you have essentially said it doesn't work but if we could just change human nature it could. 

Not change human nature, change our corporatist mindset. 

8 minutes ago, DarkHunter said:

It is funny how people tend to forget a raise in the minimum wage is a reduction in pay to everyone else.

I think the problem is in how many "everyone else" there is, and there will be in the near future. 

9 minutes ago, DarkHunter said:

The petty insult at the end was a nice touch, even if poorly done, 

Oh I was just responding to your condescending and dismissive attitude. 

9 minutes ago, DarkHunter said:

but you seem so caught up in trying to be whatever you want to call it, moral/wise/intelligent/forward thinking/whatever term you are trying to be but largely aren't that you never stopped for a moment and actually thought about what you are actually suggesting and its impact, which ironically makes you just as brainwashed as you are accusing me of but to the other side.

No im a man who has had to deal with suffering and sacrifice and I understand the value in going through some pain in an effort to make things better. 

We know factually that our nation operates as an oligarchy, we know that the middle class has evaporated, we know that corporations have our elected officials ears and not us. 

We can do better. 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 hours ago, DarkHunter said:

Ultimately your ideas are in general just bad, inefficient, feel good ideas that don't work or address the problem they are suppose to but due tend to be popular among certain segments of society who normally don't understand what effects they would have.

Meanwhile in the rest of the developed world....

  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Setton said:

Meanwhile in the rest of the developed world....

That pretty much sums up everything now doesn't it?

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.