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Raptor Witness

Theories Abound in New Novichok Poisoning

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Raptor Witness

Theories Abound in New Novichok Poisoning -  NY Times, 7-5-2018 ..... Link

Quote

Mr. Rowley, who has his own apartment in Amesbury, is a “skip diver,” according to people who knew him, going into big trash-hauling bins to find usable items.

“I think they touched something whilst rummaging and were contaminated like that,” said Kyesha Guest, a friend of the couple. She guessed that “Charlie had been skip diving and touched it, and then touched Dawn.”

Interesting that both would be poisoned, but the effects were hours apart.

A poison that is practically infectious is a serious matter.

 

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Gromdor

Read an article that said they might have picked up a vial or needle that was contaminated because of their "lifestyle"

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-44727191

 

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Raptor Witness

I’d be curious to know what the odds are that we will have another poisoning from this substance in the UK.

 My guess is, there will be more, because I am suspicious about the official report of this being just an accident. I think that is to prevent panic.

Russia should have been labeled a state sponsor of terror, immediately after the first incident Involving this material, but the fearful West is too foolish to see that.

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shehar39

this throws into question whether or not Russia was really responsible for the first attack.. since this incident happened within a 14 minute drive from a facility that researches this substance

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Raptor Witness
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, shehar39 said:

this throws into question whether or not Russia was really responsible for the first attack.. since this incident happened within a 14 minute drive from a facility that researches this substance

A Russian defector was more valuable to the Brits. alive. A diversion could be the motive for the second incident, but it would seem a bit sloppy for a Russian operation. Anyone who watched "The Americans," a great television series, would understand this. These folks are not sloppy about much of anything.

I think this was a test of the UK government, who likely have angered Moscow for the recent extension of sanctions for another six months.

EU Officially Extends Russia Sanctions Through January 2019 - Europe Sun 7-6-2018

Make no mistake, this hits key Russians hard, and this could be the real underlying motive for the use of a nerve agent on British soil. Putin's inner circle are now blocked from dealing with London's banking industry.

It was Putin, after all, who forced Syrian President Assad to remove most of his chemical weapons stockpiles, the precursor's of which were sold to the Syrian regime by German companies. I've always thought that Putin considered Crimea his payment for this assistance. Now we see the pay back, for not accepting the mafia bosses payment.

If I'm right, then this won't be the last poisoning we see in the UK, and possibly elsewhere in Europe.  Putin knows that the Europeans are spineless, and have no  desire to do much, besides protest and impose sanctions.

Perhaps Donald Trump could wear special gloves when he visits Putin in the coming two weeks, and slip him a taste of his own bad medicine when they shake hands, or who knows, perhaps Putin might do Donald Trump in, by slipping him something via hand shake.

Edited by Raptor Witness

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Raptor Witness
Posted (edited)

Wiltshire nerve agent poisonings: TIMELINE of key events after TWO new Novichok cases - Express 7-5-2018

According to this video report, Dawn Sturgess was transported to the hospital at approximately 10:30 A.M., and Charlie Rowley was transported at around 3:30 PM.

That's a remarkable 5 hour spread, which is quite different than the first incident, where the man and his daughter were found on a park bench together, unconscious.

The latest reports also reveal that the substance was found on the hands of the second pair of victims, which is identical to the first couple, I assume, since they found it on the door knob of their home.

The question then becomes, is the substance first on the door knob, or on the hand that touches the door knob?

I suspect that this is either a dose related delay, or more likely, the second couple simply touched the same object with the poison, at different times.

Edited by Raptor Witness

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Raptor Witness

One important element related to the poisoning in this case, are the necessary concentrations on the skin.

Novichok is widely reported to be approximately 5 to 8 times more lethal then VX, and VX is reportedly lethal at approximately 10 mg on the skin. - https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/VX_(nerve_agent)

What this means is that if as little as 2 mg is absorbed through the skin Novichok is potentially lethal. It is also  specifically designed to be an area denial weapon, which means it’s lasting in the environment. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Area_denial_weapon

 This definitely makes the chance of accidental exposure, more likely, and the potential as a weapon of terror, far greater than perhaps anything we’ve seen, ever.

Using the binary components, similar to what we saw used on Kim Jong Un’s brother, a terrorist could relative easily handle these weapons.

I was somewhat shocked to find that simply using elemental sulfur, as one of the binary precursors, could result in the immediate production and release of VX on the face.

 If you scattered a few pounds of this stuff around a city, especially on items that are regularly touched by human beings, you could create a pandemic that would easily overwhelm the health system, creating complete and utter chaos. Hence, we see the potential rise of the super predator terrorist. For this reason, I think we should treat any leader of any nation who has already used such substances, as a threat to the entire global community, worthy of unusual tactics of elimination. 

If we are being tested, and I suspect that we are, then any sign of weakness, invites a true disaster.

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Raptor Witness
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A bus that Ms Sturgess and Mr Rowley used to travel from Salisbury to his home in Amesbury the night before they collapsed has also tested negative for novichok. - Independent - Link

Interesting ...

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The Caspian Hare

https://www.yahoo.com/news/uk-police-small-bottle-containing-novichok-nerve-agent-164409615.html

Quote

London (AFP) - British police said Friday they have found a "small bottle" containing the Soviet-made nerve agent Novichok in the home of one of two Britons who fell ill from the substance last month.

 

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Raptor Witness

Pollen on bottle which contained Novichok that killed mother 'could prove it was used by Russian agents - Daily Mail 15 July 2018

Quote

One source working alongside the police has told The Mail on Sunday the couple almost certainly found it in Queen Elizabeth Gardens – a popular tourist destination with views of Salisbury Cathedral.

The gardens are a five-minute walk from a bench in the Maltings shopping centre where the Skripals collapsed four months ago.

The question now is, did they find the original vial of poison by accident, or was this bottle discarded on purpose to cause another calamity?  As I've said before, this seems a bit sloppy for the Russians.

I hope they find evidence that the vial contains pollen from Russia, because it would seem to me enough proof to nail Putin for an international crime, and have him arrested if he leaves Russia.

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Raptor Witness
Posted (edited)

The plot thickens ....

Amesbury: Novichok found in perfume bottle, says victim's brother - BBC 7-16-2018

Quote

The nerve agent that poisoned two people in Amesbury was contained in a perfume bottle, the brother of one of the victims has said.

Matthew Rowley said his brother Charlie, who is seriously ill in hospital, told him he had picked up the perfume bottle.

So the guess is, Rowley probably picked it up, and then gave it to her, and she used it on herself; is the latest, greatest, theory.

The question still remains, if he found it, and picked it up, and she handled it, why did she get sick 5 hours earlier than him, and then die, unless .... it was dose related, and she got a full dose on her skin, whereas he did not.

This helps explain the delay in the police finding the container, because they might have thought it was her perfume bottle.

If it was in a spray bottle, then this is what could have been used on the previous victim's doorknob.

I wonder if perhaps the Skripal's were being followed, after touching their door knob, to see if they became incapacitated, and then when the poisoner saw them pass out on the park bench, he threw the bottle away in the area of the park.

Edited by Raptor Witness

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