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Farmer77

Trial runs for fascism are in full flow

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Dumbledore the Awesome
2 hours ago, Farmer77 said:

Because its not censorship. Its really that simple. Your post while clearly passionate and efforted is simply wrong minded.  Right wing censorship is not happening. The right wing media and politiocians have however figured out that playing the victim card works really well with them.

You arent railing against censorship you're railing against the free market. 

You're perhaps the best living example of the art of doublethink. Fascists are more dangerous than fundamentalist terrorism; there's no censorship of opinions that don't meet with the approval of Biog Brother; the Leader is a literal fascist who has such a ferocious control over the media that they do nothing but devote the entirety of their time to attacking him and trying to depose him. :unsure: 

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Dumbledore the Awesome
6 minutes ago, Black Red Devil said:

Stay clear, the conspiracy level gauge is about to bust.  I don't know about you but I could never put any of these guys on Ignore.  Missing out on the fun reading their posts on how the left wing globalist establishment is out to get them would be almost criminal.

willingness to listen to opinions that differ from your own is certainly a mark of an open and critical mind . Perhaps one day you might.

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RoofGardener
7 minutes ago, Vlad the Mighty said:

You're perhaps the best living example of the art of doublethink. Fascists are more dangerous than fundamentalist terrorism; there's no censorship of opinions that don't meet with the approval of Biog Brother; the Leader is a literal fascist who has such a ferocious control over the media that they do nothing but devote the entirety of their time to attacking him and trying to depose him. :unsure: 

Ummm... surely under a Fascist regime, the media wouldn't be ALLOWED to attack The Great Leader ? 

As for Fascism vs Islamic Fundamentalism; that's a tricky one, as Islamic Fundamentalism follows many of the phillosophies of Fascism. It's just that the Dear Leader is a supernatural beard in the sky. 

Oh, and for completiion, I guess we should mention Christian fundamentalism. And Hindu fundamentalism. And Jewish Fundamentalism. Let me know when any of them start shooting up malls or letting bombs off, and I'll take them seriously as a threat. 

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Dumbledore the Awesome
1 minute ago, RoofGardener said:

Ummm... surely under a Fascist regime, the media wouldn't be ALLOWED to attack The Great Leader ? 

yes, that's exactly my point. I was using Sarcastic font.

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Farmer77
10 minutes ago, Vlad the Mighty said:

 Fascists are more dangerous than fundamentalist terrorism

What exactly do you mean by that? Are you misquoting me from earlier or are you referring to statistics?

11 minutes ago, Vlad the Mighty said:

there's no censorship of opinions that don't meet with the approval of Biog Brother;

Please tell me amigo, if I write a book and Walmart refuses to sell it is that censorship? 

 

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Farmer77
15 minutes ago, Black Red Devil said:

Stay clear, the conspiracy level gauge is about to bust.  I don't know about you but I could never put any of these guys on Ignore.  Missing out on the fun reading their posts on how the left wing globalist establishment is out to get them would be almost criminal.

Man on any given day I vascillate between injuring myself laughing at their fact free ravings and being terrified that these folks are my neighbors. No way in hell im putting that show on ignore!

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Dumbledore the Awesome
1 minute ago, Farmer77 said:

What exactly do you mean by that? Are you misquoting me from earlier or are you referring to statistics?

Please tell me amigo, if I write a book and Walmart refuses to sell it is that censorship? 

 

(1) as i explained to our friend RG, I was employing Sarcasm there, pointing out that that does seem to be your attitude, as you said only yesterday didn't you. 

(2) you keep saying that. walmart, while certainly dominant in the market, doesn't, so far as has yet been determined, lead a cabal of retail outlets that decide among themselves what products will be sold and which will be frozen out. If you can't see that that's what happens in the media then there really is no arguing with you. :no: 

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Farmer77
Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, Vlad the Mighty said:

you keep saying that. walmart, while certainly dominant in the market, doesn't, so far as has yet been determined, lead a cabal of retail outlets that decide among themselves what products will be sold and which will be frozen out.

What on earth are you talking about? Thats exactly how retailers work. They decide what to sell and what not to sell and as the nations largest retailer they are exactly a cabal of retail outlets. Here is an article detailing them doing exactly what you described

10 Things Walmart Has Yanked Off the Shelf

Quote

2. A Shirt That Read "Someday a Woman Will Be President"

 In 1995 a Miami-area Walmart pulled this shirt from its racks after consumer complaints. The shirt, which featured the character Margaret from Dennis the Menace, ran afoul of "the company's family values," so it went back to the stock rooms. Eventually more reasonable, non-Stone-Age heads prevailed, and the shirt made it back onto the shelves after three months in limbo.

 

Remember we're talking about Jones being removed from Facebook, not the internet. Like Walmart Facebook is huge but also like Walmart Facebook is not the only venue available.

 

 

Edited by Farmer77
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Dumbledore the Awesome
23 hours ago, Farmer77 said:

You are so full of fantastical faux victim garbage  its insane.

Not only are "conservatives" not being persecuted and or censored they're actually being given special treatment:

Why Won’t Twitter Treat White Supremacy Like ISIS? Because It Would Mean Banning Some Republican Politicians Too.

 

You quoted this only yesterday. That surely is at the very least trying to claim that White Supremacistism is an equal danger to ISIS (I know ISIS isn't and never has been any real danger to America, but that's very far from the case in the rest of the world.) 

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Farmer77
Just now, Vlad the Mighty said:

You quoted this only yesterday. That surely is at the very least trying to claim that White Supremacistism is an equal danger to ISIS (I know ISIS isn't and never has been any real danger to America, but that's very far from the case in the rest of the world.) 

Larger danger to Americans than ISIS. That is just cold hard facts. The numbers dont lie, they are fluid though, and I hope you arent islamo focused enough to ignore other real world threats as they appear because Islam was once the biggest threat.

I was just clarifying what you meant by fascism as I didnt recall using that term.

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Dumbledore the Awesome
1 minute ago, Farmer77 said:

What on earth are you talking about? Thats exactly how retailers work. They decide what to sell and what not to sell and as the nations largest retailer they are exactly a cabal of retail outlets. Here is an article detailing them doing exactly what you described

10 Things Walmart Has Yanked Off the Shelf

 

Remember we're talking about Jones being removed from Facebook, not the internet. Like Walmart Facebook is huge but also like Walmart Facebook is not the only venue available.

 

 

you're now arguing against your own argument. You were trying to use that to explain, in some way, that the media don't conspire against right wing opinion. Now you're saying that Walmart do (plot to conspire, that is), so if I can work out your analogy at all, and believe me it isn't easy, if you're comparing Walamart to the national media, if Walmart do conspire then so must the media. 

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Black Red Devil
Posted (edited)
23 minutes ago, Vlad the Mighty said:

willingness to listen to opinions that differ from your own is certainly a mark of an open and critical mind . Perhaps one day you might.

What, believing in conspiracy theories is being open minded is it?  I'd call that gullibility, it seems you perceive it as reality.  Same as big foot, flat earth....Sounds like you're in the wrong forum. 

Edited by Black Red Devil

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Farmer77
Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, Vlad the Mighty said:

you're now arguing against your own argument. You were trying to use that to explain, in some way, that the media don't conspire against right wing opinion. Now you're saying that Walmart do (plot to conspire, that is), so if I can work out your analogy at all, and believe me it isn't easy, if you're comparing Walamart to the national media, if Walmart do conspire then so must the media. 

Yeah this feels like youre intentionally twisting but hey ive got time.

Walmart is one store, Facebook is one store.

The internet is the mall.

Jones wasnt banned from the mall, he was just banned from one store. He is free to build his own store  , or find another store who is willing to allow him to sell his goods .

Its not censorship if ,ya know, nothing is being censored. Hell ill even offer proof that Jones isnt being censored: https://www.infowars.com/

See he has his store. He and his supporters are simply upset because his store isnt as big as Facebook's. They want a tyranny of the minority and are playing the victim card very well in an attempt to get it. 

 

 

Edited by Farmer77

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RoofGardener
2 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

Yeah this feels like youre intentionally twisting but hey ive got time.

Walmart is one store, Facebook is one store.

The internet is the mall.

Jones wasnt banned from the mall, he was just banned from one store. He is free to build his own store  , or find another store who is willing to allow him to sell his goods .

Its not censorship if ,ya know, nothing is being censored. Hell ill even offer proof that Jones isnt being censored: https://www.infowars.com/

See he has his store. He and his supporters are simply upset because his store isnt as big as Facebook's. They want a tyranny of the minority and are playing the victim card very well in an attempt to get it. 

 

 

Hmmm.. I'm not entirely sure about that, @Farmer77

If Walmart discontinues a product because it isn't selling very well, then that is one thing. 

If, on the other hand, it discontinues a product for - for want of a better term - "political" reasons, then that is an entirely different kettle of fish. The store is leveraging its general popularity - and possibly even a dominant position within "The Mall" - in an attempt at social engineering. To influence - or direct - what its customers can read. I find THAT to be sinister. 

Granted, it might refuse to stock books that it regards as anti-social; books that promote violence or sexual excess of some sort. But when it starts to ban books based on political criteria, then I regard that with considerable suspicion.

When organisations like Facebook, Twitter, Amazon, Walmart etc start to adopt a common "political" policy regarding authors with a certain political bent (assuming  said authors are not explicitly promoting violence, racism etc) then it becomes alarming. When Banks and Card Payment Processing companies follow suite, then we are definitely into the realms of political suppression. And that is precisely what seems to be happening at the moment. 

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Black Red Devil
39 minutes ago, Vlad the Mighty said:

You're perhaps the best living example of the art of doublethink. Fascists are more dangerous than fundamentalist terrorism; there's no censorship of opinions that don't meet with the approval of Biog Brother; the Leader is a literal fascist who has such a ferocious control over the media that they do nothing but devote the entirety of their time to attacking him and trying to depose him. :unsure: 

So what's your argument, that Trump isn't as bad as Islamic terrorists?  The thread is about fascism in America and not about who is worse.  The media attack him because he gives them all the ammunition in the world through his tweets, racist remarks and all sorts of other things a leader representing a country of many factions, colors, races etc. shouldn't say.  It's not only what has come out of his mouth but also many in his entourage have been charged for criminal conduct.  Are you like the others on here also claiming him to be a victim of left media because they've had the outrageous hide to highlight clear facts on his past and present conduct?

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Farmer77
1 minute ago, RoofGardener said:

If Walmart discontinues a product because it isn't selling very well, then that is one thing. 

If, on the other hand, it discontinues a product for - for want of a better term - "political" reasons, then that is an entirely different kettle of fish. The store is leveraging its general popularity - and possibly even a dominant position within "The Mall" - in an attempt at social engineering. To influence - or direct - what its customers can read. I find THAT to be sinister. 

I actually posted the exact correlation above. Walmart received complaints about the woman will be president T-shirt so they took it off the shelf. Same thing here. Facebook not only received complaints but risked losing advertising dollars over the extremist garbage.

Its capitalism and everyone loves the free market until their products arent the most popular. Im really sorry for you and "conservatives" (I guess) but racism and conspiracy theories around dead children simply arent the most popular things out there.

Anyone who cares to prove me wrong is free to go out and create their own version of Facebook, Twitter Instragram ETC and see how profitable it is and that is proof that censorship isnt happening.

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Dumbledore the Awesome

 

7 minutes ago, Black Red Devil said:

So what's your argument, that Trump isn't as bad as Islamic terrorists?  The thread is about fascism in America and not about who is worse.  The media attack him because he gives them all the ammunition in the world through his tweets, racist remarks and all sorts of other things a leader representing a country of many factions, colors, races etc. shouldn't say.  It's not only what has come out of his mouth but also many in his entourage have been charged for criminal conduct.  Are you like the others on here also claiming him to be a victim of left media because they've had the outrageous hide to highlight clear facts on his past and present conduct?

They're quite right to do so in many ways. But the argument of this thread is as you say, about fascism. Just saying that he rants on about all sorts of things and that some people whose opinions you may not like may believe that there's a conspiracy to suppress them is hardly proof of facism. 

What do any of his entourage have to do with fascism? What have they been charged with? Various fairly trivial legal niceties, wasn't it. I mean, you may believe all the silly stuff about Putin, but what does that have to do with fascism? Anything at all? If this thread has shown one thing , it's that people have no clue what fascism is and just use it as shorthand for "he's a nasty man who I don't like". :mellow: 

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Farmer77
Just now, Vlad the Mighty said:

What do any of his entourage have to do with fascism? What have they been charged with? Various fairly trivial legal niceties, wasn't it. I mean, you may believe all the silly stuff about Putin, but what does that have to do with fascism? Anything at all? If this thread has shown one thing , it's that people have no clue what fascism is and just use it as shorthand for "he's a nasty man who I don't like". :mellow: 

Actually If you read the OP the thing this thread has shown is threads rarely stay about the OP. The article in the OP itself really was about fascism.

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Dumbledore the Awesome
53 minutes ago, Farmer77 said:

Actually If you read the OP the thing this thread has shown is threads rarely stay about the OP. The article in the OP itself really was about fascism.

well, how very true. But surely the opening article itself showed that they really had no idea what fascism is either. Here,since Wiki is our friend, is the definition of it, as may have been quoted before: 

Fascism (/ˈfæʃɪzəm/) is a form of radical, right-wing, authoritarian ultranationalism,[1][2][3][4] characterized by dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition, and strong regimentation of society and of the economy,[5] which came to prominence in early 20th-century Europe.[6]

Now how much of that really fits the description of the Big Orange Fellow? 

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Black Red Devil
53 minutes ago, Vlad the Mighty said:

 

They're quite right to do so in many ways. But the argument of this thread is as you say, about fascism. Just saying that he rants on about all sorts of things and that some people whose opinions you may not like may believe that there's a conspiracy to suppress them is hardly proof of facism. 

What do any of his entourage have to do with fascism? What have they been charged with? Various fairly trivial legal niceties, wasn't it. I mean, you may believe all the silly stuff about Putin, but what does that have to do with fascism? Anything at all? If this thread has shown one thing , it's that people have no clue what fascism is and just use it as shorthand for "he's a nasty man who I don't like". :mellow: 

No the entourage part is related to the fact you're claiming the media is attacking his Presidency and I'm just giving examples why.  I think you're confusing yourself or deliberately pulling a straw man.

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Farmer77
1 minute ago, Vlad the Mighty said:

Now how much of that really fits the description of the Big Orange Fellow? 

The OP was really focused on the treatment of the children being separated and the steps from there to get to fascism and as the title states its about "trial runs for fascism" not "fascism is here"

 

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Black Red Devil

I don't think there can be any such things as total fascism or communism in western society anymore.  Trial runs? Not sure, but adaptation of some of the criteria's of both political systems yes!

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Uncle Sam
Posted (edited)
On 5/6/2019 at 4:10 AM, Vlad the Mighty said:

well, how very true. But surely the opening article itself showed that they really had no idea what fascism is either. Here,since Wiki is our friend, is the definition of it, as may have been quoted before: 

Fascism (/ˈfæʃɪzəm/) is a form of radical, right-wing, authoritarian ultranationalism,[1][2][3][4] characterized by dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition, and strong regimentation of society and of the economy,[5] which came to prominence in early 20th-century Europe.[6]

Now how much of that really fits the description of the Big Orange Fellow? 

If I remember correctly, fascism can appear on both left-wing and right-wing. It is an Ultranationalist Authoritarian in the most basic sense. With the internet political suppression of a political party and the erosion of our freedoms, how they act in nature, they feel very much like Digital Totalitarians in nature. Totalitarian is a group that controls everything and monopolizes political power. Might as well consider the internet a nation-state because they seem to don't abide by any nation's rule of law.

Definition of Totalitarian:

  • 1aof or relating to centralized control by an autocratic leader or hierarchyAUTHORITARIANDICTATORIAL especiallyDESPOTIC
  • bof or relating to a political regime based on subordination of the individual to the state and strict control of all aspects of the life and productive capacity of the nation especially by coercive measures (such as censorship and terrorism)
  • 2aadvocating or characteristic of totalitarianism
  • bcompletely regulated by the state especially as an aid to national mobilization in an emergency
  • cexercising autocratic powers

Source: Definition of Totalitarian

Totalitarian regimes are different from other authoritarian ones. The latter denotes a state in which the single power holder – an individual "dictator", a committee or a junta or an otherwise small group of the political elite – monopolizes political power.

Source: Totalitarians vs. Authoritarians


Definition of Fascism

  • 1: often capitalizeda political philosophy, movement, or regime (such as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition
  • 2a tendency toward or actual exercise of strong autocratic or dictatorial control early instances of army fascism and brutality— J. W. Aldridge

Source: Definition of Fascism

Note: Don't use Wikipedia as your source of information Vlad, because it can be altered and changed. People constantly trying to change the definitions on Wikipedia to help them win arguments, which is actually misleading people. I am starting to consider Wikipedia to be a source of misinformation. Try to find official definitions that are on websites that can't be changed by anyone with a bent. This website is good: https://www.merriam-webster.com/Merriam Webster does post their sources and can't be edited by outside influencers or third parties.

Edited by Uncle Sam

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Farmer77

ICE Detainee Deaths Were Preventable: Document

Quote

The deaths of multiple Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) detainees were preventable, according to internal agency documents obtained by The Young Turks. One ICE official told TYT the problem is “systemic.”

“IHSC [ICE’s Health Services Corps] is severely dysfunctional and unfortunately preventable harm and death to detainees has occurred,” an ICE supervisor notified Matthew Albence, then Acting Deputy Director of ICE, in a memo dated December 3, 2018.

ICE did not respond to multiple requests for comment from TYT.

Albence touched off controversy last year when he likened ICE detention centers to “summer camp.”

Several ICE whistleblowers have come forward alleging misconduct by the agency in recent months. In May, Ellen Gallagher, a former senior policy advisor at ICE’s parent agency, DHS, told NBC News that she had seen ICE “brutalize” detainees with solitary confinement for minor infractions. Documents obtained by the International Consortium of Investigative Journalists and shared with several news outlets detailed ICE’s widespread use of solitary confinement.

Last June, when ICE whistleblower James Schwab was doing an interview with CBS News at his home in San Francisco, DHS agents interrupted the interview, demanding to speak with him. Schwab had alleged “false” and “misleading” statements made by ICE under the Trump administration.

The memo obtained by TYT, bearing the subject line “Urgent Matter,” was written by a supervisor at ICE’s IHSC. It details over a dozen cases in which ICE allegedly failed to provide its detainees with proper medical care, including two which resulted in fatalities.

 

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Farmer77

 

Quote

Migrant children who were torn from their parents by Trump administration policies faced one more horrific experience before being reunited with their families last summer, according to a NBC News report. On a boiling Texas day last July, 37 kids boarded vans for what they were told would be a 30-minute ride—but one was stuck on board for 39 hours. Most of the children, who were all between 5 and 12 years old at the time, spent at least 23 hours in the vehicles. “The children were initially taken into the facility, but were then returned to the van as the facility was still working on paperwork,” explained Andrew Carter, a regional director for BCFS Heath and Human Services, a government contractor and nonprofit responsible for the children. “The children were brought back in later in the evening, but returned to the vans because it was too cold in the facility and they were still not ready to be processed in.” An Immigration and Customs Enforcement spokesperson said the incident was “unusual,” adding: “These children have all been reunited with their parents and since then, no child has spent more than a few hours waiting to be reunited with their parents.”

 

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